Time To Cut The Dead Wood

[lou73]

There are to many players in the team at the moment who are simply not good enough. Could not believe they played Cain Ackalnd last night, don't understand why they they recruited Pheifier. Hadley is to slow. They keep playing Bentick, Carrazzo might be harsh but he just doesn't hurt you with his disposal and Scotland I never rated him.

Brett Ratten has to get his match ups right. Jarrod Waite is not a CHB. FFS play Waite, Kreuzer up forward and rotate Hampson and Cloke in the ruck and play O Hailpin at CHB or Hartlett

The Carlton team

Browne, Jamison, Thornton

Bower , Hartlett, Walker

Simpson, Stevens, Russell

Gibbs, Waite, Fisher

Betts, Fev, Kreuzer

Cloke, Judd, Murphy

inter, Hampson, Grigg, O Hailpin, Edwards

 

[Mike_blues]

bit hard whe hartlett nd walker are injured
and im guessing your one of those people that as soon as we lose , you bad the shit outta players that played poorly
u obviously havnt watched scotland over the last 5 years... hes probably been our 3rd or so best player since 04 and was very good last nite

 

[Sam The Doc]

have to persist with the current set up.

 

[Bomba Sheldon]

have to persist with the current set up.

But only play those who you want there next year e.g. dont play Ackland, Saddington and the like.

 

[lou73]

bit hard whe hartlett nd walker are injured
and im guessing your one of those people that as soon as we lose , you bad the shit outta players that played poorly
u obviously havnt watched scotland over the last 5 years... hes probably been our 3rd or so best player since 04 and was very good last nite

Not bagging the players i blame the people who are in charge and they keep selecting players who won't be in our next premiership side.

 

[Funkalicous]

Wiggins -> Out
O'hAilpin -> Out
Ackland -> Hung
Grigg -> Not ready. Out

 

[celtic_pride]

Hmm I thought Grigg actually played allright last night, think he's worth persisting with ..

Right now we're getting killed out of the ruck/clearances area, and make no mistake, we haven't got a hope in hell of beating Freo next week ...

We gotta sell the bloody grandstand to lure Warnock to Carlton, we won't come close to making the finals until we finally get a decent ruck-set up ..
(BTW Cloke is good as only a back-up Ruck IMHO, and Kruezer and Hammer need more time) Ackland is just a spaz.

 

[Sam The Doc]

we dont have the depth to cover our injuries...thats why we cant beat any half decent sides..we are not playing players cos we want to but because we have to..

 

[btdg]

What replacements could we get for any of those players if we got rid of them? If we dropped Scotland and played Armfield every week as soon as we lost our first game there would be 55 'Armfield is crap and should be delisted' threads on bigfooty. Same if we played Aisake over Ackland.

Fact is, we don't have a great list right now - we have some good pieces and some young guys with potential, but we're a middle-to-low tier team. And remember, thats an improvement over the last 3 years, where we were a bottom of the ladder team. Lets just enjoy watching someone else be the whipping boys, appreciate that the Scotlands et al may not be superstars but they do their best, and look forward to the wins we know are coming. At least this year we'll play out the season and should end up with 7-10 wins.

 

[blues4flag]

I agree with Grigg - thought he was good. Not that I noticed him, surprised he got the ball as much as he did, but that's a good thing, as when I do notice him out there, is when he's got the ball and has no idea what to do with it. Watching the replay on Foxsports this morning, I thought it was one of his better games.

 

[lou73]

What replacements could we get for any of those players if we got rid of them? If we dropped Scotland and played Armfield every week as soon as we lost our first game there would be 55 'Armfield is crap and should be delisted' threads on bigfooty. Same if we played Aisake over Ackland.

Fact is, we don't have a great list right now - we have some good pieces and some young guys with potential, but we're a middle-to-low tier team. And remember, thats an improvement over the last 3 years, where we were a bottom of the ladder team. Lets just enjoy watching someone else be the whipping boys, appreciate that the Scotlands et al may not be superstars but they do their best, and look forward to the wins we know are coming. At least this year we'll play out the season and should end up with 7-10 wins.

I don't care about losing its the match ups,team selections,recruiting and that arrogant Carlton mentality that gives me the s----.

 

[btdg]

I don't care about losing its the match ups,team selections,recruiting and that arrogant Carlton mentality that gives me the s----.

You talk about getting match-ups right, then suggest playing Hartlett at CHB. On Jonathon Brown! Plus, the team you listed contains several players who are currently injured. How exactly does Cloke play in the ruck right now?

As for recruiting; we got Ackland and Pfeifer through the PSD, Bentick and Carazzo were rookies, and Hadley and Scotland came as trades for low draft picks. Thats a pretty good haul to be honest; the PSD has been empty for years, anything off the rookie list is good, and Scotland had more touches than anyone yesterday.

And team selections? Who could we have played against Brisbane that would have made a difference. We needed Ackland to provide a mature body in the ruck; you can't just throw Kreuzer and Hampson against big ruckmen week in week out and expect them to stay fit. Carazzo was basically BOG in our last match (a win in Perth), and Scotland was our leading possession getter yesterday. Bentick leads the team in tackles, Pfeifer wasn't playing. Maybe you have a case with Hadley, but who replaces him?

Just bitching after a loss is stupid. We'd won 3 of 4 coming into that match, showed significant signs of improvement this year, and lost by 5 goals to a finals-bound team who match up very well against us. Get some perspective.

 

[Jimthegreat]

You talk about getting match-ups right, then suggest playing Hartlett at CHB. On Jonathon Brown! Plus, the team you listed contains several players who are currently injured. How exactly does Cloke play in the ruck right now?

As for recruiting; we got Ackland and Pfeifer through the PSD, Bentick and Carazzo were rookies, and Hadley and Scotland came as trades for low draft picks. Thats a pretty good haul to be honest; the PSD has been empty for years, anything off the rookie list is good, and Scotland had more touches than anyone yesterday.

And team selections? Who could we have played against Brisbane that would have made a difference. We needed Ackland to provide a mature body in the ruck; you can't just throw Kreuzer and Hampson against big ruckmen week in week out and expect them to stay fit. Carazzo was basically BOG in our last match (a win in Perth), and Scotland was our leading possession getter yesterday. Bentick leads the team in tackles, Pfeifer wasn't playing. Maybe you have a case with Hadley, but who replaces him?

Just bitching after a loss is stupid. We'd won 3 of 4 coming into that match, showed significant signs of improvement this year, and lost by 5 goals to a finals-bound team who match up very well against us. Get some perspective.

How refreshing is it to read a sensible post after a loss.

One usually gets stupid kneejerk reactions after stupid kneejerk reactions.

 

[Blue Dimension]

Wiggins -> Out
O'hAilpin -> Out
Ackland -> Hung
Grigg -> Not ready. Out

Agree completely. Especially with Grigg.

Only one i might say maybe not is O'hAilpin - he will have to fill that backline spot until Thornton comes back.

He's terrible up forward, but does a solid job down back - only had 3 goals kicked on him while he was on brown...admittedly Waite was dropping back but did hold up well in one on ones.

 

[lou73]

You talk about getting match-ups right, then suggest playing Hartlett at CHB. On Jonathon Brown! Plus, the team you listed contains several players who are currently injured. How exactly does Cloke play in the ruck right now?

As for recruiting; we got Ackland and Pfeifer through the PSD, Bentick and Carazzo were rookies, and Hadley and Scotland came as trades for low draft picks. Thats a pretty good haul to be honest; the PSD has been empty for years, anything off the rookie list is good, and Scotland had more touches than anyone yesterday.

And team selections? Who could we have played against Brisbane that would have made a difference. We needed Ackland to provide a mature body in the ruck; you can't just throw Kreuzer and Hampson against big ruckmen week in week out and expect them to stay fit. Carazzo was basically BOG in our last match (a win in Perth), and Scotland was our leading possession getter yesterday. Bentick leads the team in tackles, Pfeifer wasn't playing. Maybe you have a case with Hadley, but who replaces him?

Just bitching after a loss is stupid. We'd won 3 of 4 coming into that match, showed significant signs of improvement this year, and lost by 5 goals to a finals-bound team who match up very well against us. Get some perspective.

Your delusional like most Carlton supporters

 

[mikeythemoocow]

I reckon Carazzo needs to go(traded if possible). He gets heaps of it but doesnt use it well and alot of the time seems to just hold play up when he gets it and lets the opposition zone back.
Haddley has been great in the clinches but I would like to see Gibbs eventually move into that role

I dont rate scotland either. Fair enought he gives a bit of run out off the HBF but Bower and Waite can do that while still really being part of the defensive set up. If at seasons end we could get anything for him trade wise I'd take it.

Waite at CHB is a long term option and a good one for lead up CHF's like Rievold etc but not for a John Brown. The defence also needs time to gel together, like a year or so with players playing there constantly not being moved around so as to learn each others game. Forward lines can be put together quick and can be infulenced by individual play alot while defence is a unit which has to grow together.

 

[btdg]

Your delusional like most Carlton supporters

Right. So you suggest we start the injured Adam Hartlett at CHB on Jonathon Brown (or looking forward to next week, Pavlich), as well as the injured Cloke and Walker, and I'm delusional?

Instead of attacking the team you supposedly support, and other posters who have more intelligence than you, why not explain exactly what changes you would make. What match-ups do you disagree with? What team selections do you disagree with? What recruiting do you disagree with? Explain how you'd do it differently.

 

[mac25]

There are to many players in the team at the moment who are simply not good enough. Could not believe they played Cain Ackalnd last night, don't understand why they they recruited Pheifier. Hadley is to slow. They keep playing Bentick, Carrazzo might be harsh but he just doesn't hurt you with his disposal and Scotland I never rated him.

Brett Ratten has to get his match ups right. Jarrod Waite is not a CHB. FFS play Waite, Kreuzer up forward and rotate Hampson and Cloke in the ruck and play O Hailpin at CHB or Hartlett

The Carlton team

Browne, Jamison, Thornton

Bower , Hartlett, Walker

Simpson, Stevens, Russell

Gibbs, Waite, Fisher

Betts, Fev, Kreuzer

Cloke, Judd, Murphy

inter, Hampson, Grigg, O Hailpin, Edwards

l do not see how Hartlett can be considered again at senior level until he proves over a period of time that his body can stand up to this level, otherwise we run the risk of being a player short with his constant injury problems.

You can only play the players who are available and you have named three players two of whom are still four to six weeks away from returning.
Scotland has been a very good playerfor us he is very much a receiver but 70% of players out there are exactly that, he again would be a automatic selection in our team, l don't see our list is that strong that he is not in our best 22 easily.

 

[lou73]

Right. So you suggest we start the injured Adam Hartlett at CHB on Jonathon Brown (or looking forward to next week, Pavlich), as well as the injured Cloke and Walker, and I'm delusional?

Instead of attacking the team you supposedly support, and other posters who have more intelligence than you, why not explain exactly what changes you would make. What match-ups do you disagree with? What team selections do you disagree with? What recruiting do you disagree with? Explain how you'd do it differently.

When we have full list why not rotate Cloke and Hampson in the ruck and let Kreuzer and Waite play up forward as twin towers but that won't happen Ratten is stubborn. Brad Fisher is struggling as the 2nd forward he needs support and why not develop Hartlett or O Hailpin as a CHB. We don't have a CHF or a CHB. We were in the same postion as Hawthorn 4 years ago and look where they are with fantastic recruiting.

 

[serenityNow]

Wiggins -> Out
O'hAilpin -> Out
Ackland -> Out
Carrazzo -> Out

I dont see these guys as long term.

Injuries have forced our hand to play guys that we might not have other wise played ie.Ackland.
The 4 of them wont be in our side this time next year.

Hartlett is close very close to gone...........gotta get his body right and stay injury free.

 

[RAPPA]

Blame our crap drafting over the past 5 years where we persisted in trading valuable picks for discarded hacks. Remember 2003 where we picked up Brett Johnson, David Clarke, Daniel Harford, Digby Morrell, David Teague and others. Add in Mick Martyn in 2002 which still bemuses me. Draft picks which could've been used to draft youngsters, who, although not all would not have made it, at least a few would've been ready made players by now, having notched up 65-100 games.
Also, we relied on the notion of building a key midflield and completely neglected our ruck division and backline. And when we had backmen (eg Massie, Livingston, Beaumont - YES i know they weren't great but still, they were better than some of the players we have now) we either traded them or delisted them.
I wish we didn't axe Whtinall - he could hold down CHB and provide stability as well as teach our up and coming players a thing or two.
BUT we have to work with what we've got and at the moment it is clear that we have to go into the 2008 draft with an intention to find KP backmen
In terms of who gets culled at season's end, a list of names I'd throw up would be Ackland, Saddington & Wiggins (just doesn't do enough INO and wouldn't get a game in another side). Setanta will be given one more year, while Bentdick, Grigg, Jackson, Russell and Bannister will be under the microscope.

 

[Korn]

Trade Simpson, I reckon he's the type of player that will never grow big enough.

 

[iRemember87]

"2008 is a Foundation Year" - quote Brett Ratten, Dec 2007

Accept it or move on to another sport.

 

[mikeythemoocow]

Trade Simpson, I reckon he's the type of player that will never grow big enough.

I really like Simpson, but....


He might be a player that we could perhaps uses to get a high pick from this new Gold Coast team. I'm not saying activly shop him or anyone else about but if the right deal was offered we would have to think about it. Maybe for one of our smaller runners with a bit of experience they might hold a fair bit of currence to any new team coming into the competion and we could persivably cover it better and look to address our KPP stocks.

 

[The Cranium]

Wiggins -> Out
O'hAilpin -> Out
Ackland -> Hung
Grigg -> Not ready. Out

Is there something your not telling us here.....