Transgender

[Gralin]

Discussion continuing in Part 2 found here

Transgender - Part 2

Please be aware that the tolerance of anti-trans language on BF is at an all-time low. Jokes and insults that are trans-related, as well as anti-trans and bigoted rhetoric will be met with infractions, threadbans etc as required. It's a sensitive (and important) topic, so behave like...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Chief]

Liberals don't seem to give a **** about women at all. They are sacrificing their well being for the sake of diversity

View attachment 351531

Doesn't seem like a "liberal" thing to do.


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[quotemokc]

I fail to see what effect it has upon anyone else how a person chooses to describe themselves.

"If you are wondering, reasonably, why any of this might be relevant to Americans, you might note that legislation very similar to Bill C-16 has already been passed in New York City.

Authorities there now fine citizens up to $250,000 for the novel crime of “mis-gendering” — referring to people by any words other than their pronouns of choice (including newly constructed words such as zie/hir, ey/em/eir and co)."

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-bl...-prof-defied-sjw-on-gender-pronouns-and-has-a

 

[Gough]

Sometimes you need to kick good manners into people.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

Sometimes you need to kick good manners into people.

How many people have you assaulted good manners into?

 

[quotemokc]

Sometimes you need to kick good manners into people.

In the true sense of fascism

 

[Gough]

What I mean is I would imagine this is there for specific repeat offenders. It's common manners to use the pronoun of choice for a person, and if you're going to consistently transgress you might need a little help getting your head around it, and being $200k out of pocket might go a long way to doing that.

 

[quotemokc]

What I mean is I would imagine this is there for specific repeat offenders. It's common manners to use the pronoun of choice for a person, and if you're going to consistently transgress you might need a little help getting your head around it, and being $200k out of pocket might go a long way to doing that.

So if a person visually appeared to be a male but wanted to be referred to as ze but I kept calling them a he I should be fined $200k???

 

[Taylor]

Even if comprehensive studies found part of the brain wired differently in people with non straight sexualities or non binary gender identity I don't think I would care.

There are many personality features that if able to be medically brought into line with some decided standard I would choose to be 'fixed' before the gender identity ones.

Being lazy, being mentally lazy, being willfully ignorant etc

 

[CM86]

You can't discuss gay marriage without also discussing bigamy, polygamy, incest, paedophilia, beastiality...
You can't support one, but not the others...
Hypocrisy of 'the left'...

Same shit, different day.

 

[igon value]

You can't discuss gay marriage without also discussing bigamy, polygamy, incest, paedophilia, beastiality...
You can't support one, but not the others...
Hypocrisy of 'the left'...

Same shit, different day.

I think you're in the wrong thread.

 

[igon value]

What I mean is I would imagine this is there for specific repeat offenders. It's common manners to use the pronoun of choice for a person, and if you're going to consistently transgress you might need a little help getting your head around it, and being $200k out of pocket might go a long way to doing that.

Lol. Fining people six figure sums for bad manners, you would have made a great Victorian era moraliser.

 

[igon value]

And thus some posters here, living in the progressive zeitgeist, have automatically segued from transgender to feminism/slavery/homosexuality etc etc. Because all these topics are rolled up into one now, are highly political (because to the hard Left everything is political) and leveraged as part of the "progressive" strategy to disenfranchise the populace from its core Western cultural values.

I imagine you would like this article.

https://areomagazine.com/2017/03/27...-west-postmodernism-and-its-impact-explained/

As an aside, it's not the left in total. There are left wing writers who abhor the identity politics debate - in this thread I have linked to Adolph Reed, the Women's Liberation Front, and the author of the above. There are others like Camille Paglia and Laura Kipnis (who had a good article in NY Mag about the regressive and conservative forces now found in the progressive left).

It's sort of funny that the identity politics side of the debate gets called 'the left'. A recent study by Brookings showed that those universities and colleges that protested speakers and tried to have them uninvited (in red) were predominantly those of the wealthy elite.

The author of that study also has an interesting sounding book out this year.

I struggle to call these people 'the left'. Their high social class, their privileged forms of education, and their likely elite wealth separate them from traditional leftist struggles. Instead, they look like a privileged class constantly redefining the terms of civility and discourse in their own interests, to the detriment of the majority, in fact almost aimed to keep the average person out.

What it looks like, is that of a clerical caste telling the lay people how they're all sinners and they must repent.

 

[ABSOLUTE MADMAN]

You can't discuss gay marriage without also discussing bigamy, polygamy, incest, paedophilia, beastiality...
You can't support one, but not the others...
Hypocrisy of 'the left'...

Same shit, different day.

Another clear strawman compared to the pure logic some of us are spitting in this thread.

 

[ABSOLUTE MADMAN]

I would not give you the oxygen.
Seriously.

Yet you took time to post your little whibge because you know you are in a debate you cannot win without either looking like a hypocrite or taking a non mainstream position that would open you to mocking.

Is fun watching a few squirm in this thread.

 

[Geelong_Sicko]

why though?

i agree with the above poster regarding the timeline of acceptance for people different to the standard.

homosexuals are widely accepted (by everyone aside from a boomer-cowing government)

acceptance of transsexuals is on the rise.

one high profile woman identifying as transracial and has been hung drawn and quartered for it, mostly by progressives trumping an individual's rights to self identify in the case of gender and sexual identity.

will it acceptance of racial fluidity grow over time?

who does identifying as a different race hurt?

Some people have limits to what they currently understand and tolerate. Even leftists. Even liberals. As identity becomes more an issue set by the individual and less by the surrounding society we are going to see all manner of tolerance limits being reached and then breached by different people.

Because tolerance currently is set by the individual, and ongoing attempts to shape it at the societal level are opposed. Some of us hold dear to ourselves the ability to set our own tolerances as individuals while demanding identity is set at the societal level. Others the complete reverse.

Sooner or later things are gonna get that fluid that viewpoints will meld and merge. Gender. Race. With the passage of time it's all going to matter a lot less than we think it does.

 

[Chief]

What I want to know is: is there a gender pronoun that is more male than "Mr"?

Having just spent 13 hours riding the bucking bronco of kidney stone pain, without even crying very much, I think I deserve it.

If there isn't one, I think we need to invent it.

"Super-he" or "Se"? "Kad" for "Kick-ass dude"?


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[TheWoodenSlug]

What I want to know is: is there a gender pronoun that is more male than "Mr"?

Having just spent 13 hours riding the bucking bronco of kidney stone pain, without even crying very much, I think I deserve it.

If there isn't one, I think we need to invent it.

"Super-he" or "Se"? "Kad" for "Kick-ass dude"?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Now that you've made your preferred pronoun known, you really should start banning anyone that refuses to refer to you as Se Chief. Or at least fine them a few hundred grand.

 

[deltablues]

I imagine you would like this article.

https://areomagazine.com/2017/03/27...-west-postmodernism-and-its-impact-explained/

As an aside, it's not the left in total. There are left wing writers who abhor the identity politics debate - in this thread I have linked to Adolph Reed, the Women's Liberation Front, and the author of the above. There are others like Camille Paglia and Laura Kipnis (who had a good article in NY Mag about the regressive and conservative forces now found in the progressive left).

It's sort of funny that the identity politics side of the debate gets called 'the left'. A recent study by Brookings showed that those universities and colleges that protested speakers and tried to have them uninvited (in red) were predominantly those of the wealthy elite.

The author of that study also has an interesting sounding book out this year,

I struggle to call these people 'the left'. Their high social class, their privileged forms of education, and their likely elite wealth separate them from traditional leftist struggles. Instead, they look like a privileged class constantly redefining the terms of civility and discourse in their own interests, to the detriment of the majority, in fact almost aimed to keep the average person out.

What it looks like, is that of a clerical caste telling the lay people how they're all sinners and they must repent.

Indeed. And in some threads in the SRP forum PM was discussed at some length, and where I posted the following (among others) on this topic:

Post-modernism is just another label for cultural Marxist (i.e. the extreme Left) deconstruction and its leitmotiv Hegelian dialectics,with its pernicious theories of, for example, cultural relativity.

Post-modernism seeks to re-define the concept of Western culture (and only Western culture). Its
proponents argue that culture is encoded in language that must change with the material conditions - thus as the social environment changes, so too then must the language "constructs". They argue that each era has a language structure which determines the questions that people can ask and the answers they can receive. And as conditions change historically so do the mental tropes, thereby from a new perspective (i.e. the activists' very subjective on-a-mission perspective) rendering the weltanschauung and literature of the past age an affront and ripe for revisionism.

The methodology follows Derrida's belief that if one breaks apart the so-called hidden hierarchies in language terms, one can open up a "lacuna" in understanding and free the mind of the reader/critic, baby. Problem is that there are no lacunae - it is in fact a device to re-write or leverage history to fit contemporary agendas. Hence, for example, the current black armband view of Western history pushed by the leftists in the education industry.This re-writing of history is also in accordance with Michel Foucault's New Historicism theory, where modern "narratives" are sought to be imposed upon the literature/history of past ages. One basic example (linguistic-wise and history-wise) of this mindset is the charming phrase - old dead white men.

It is all part of the culture wars waged by the soldiers of the Left, of which gender/race/identity politics are some of the weapons of choice. And it is a worry to those who value and wish to preserve Western culture and its institutions, particularly freedom of speech.

 

[Gough]

For a mob who so loudly proclaimed identity politics to be dead, and buried upon the election of the orange sex offender, you guys are playing it pretty hard at the moment.

 

[checkraiseulite]

keep sniping at the margins

 

[deltablues]

For a mob who so loudly proclaimed identity politics to be dead, and buried upon the election of the orange sex offender, you guys are playing it pretty hard at the moment.

Cute deflection, but can you actually debate any of the issues in play, or are you just chasing the truck?

PS Identity politics is all the Dems have left (no pun intended) after having suffered their worst losses across the board since 1928.

 

[Gough]

So when the Trump administration is going after trans people, or the Turnbull government is denying people the right to marry the person they love, there's nothing to see here, but the moment they fightback it's the dreaded identity politics in play. See how this looks?

 

[deltablues]

So when the Trump administration is going after trans people, or the Turnbull government is denying people the right to marry the person they love, there's nothing to see here, but the moment they fightback it's the dreaded identity politics in play. See how this looks?

It sure looks like you are chasing the truck, because you are not addressing the underlying issues. You default to facile partisan politics.

And your comment on Trump is predicated on the same inherent assumption made in the question < How often do you beat your wife each week?>.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

Some people have such short memories. The Turnbull government is denying gay people the chance to marry but it was okay when Gillard's government did the same.

 

[Gough]

Some people have such short memories. The Turnbull government is denying gay people the chance to marry but it was okay when Gillard's government did the same.

It most certainly wasn't, it was a stain on her legacy, whatever ham fisted excuse she used to justify her opposition.