Roast Umpiring: Corruption or Incompetence, or both

[Schulzenfest]

We didn't get a single goal from a free kick whereas St Kilda had 4 goals directly from free kicks; not sure how many were set-up through frees down the field but given the closeness of the game those 24 gimme points made the difference keeping us from getting a good lead and precious momentum/morale heading into the 4th quarter.

The only reason it wasn't 6 goals directly from free kicks is because King and Parker missed set shots.

 

[Interstater]

- rules are open to interpretation
- umpires are wired up
- league has major sponsors/advertisers in the gambling industry

what could go wrong...

 

[Duck Farmer]

We already do this in pack marks.

Yeah, the rule is even more arbitrary. Both players can clunk it in a pack mark and one will be paid but if post-match forensics discovers 3 molecules of Kade Simpson's DNA on the ball it's play on Colquhoun. Our rules are a joke. There's three teams out there influencing the game but you can't talk about one because officially they don't exist.

 

[PepeSilvia]

A kicking in danger free is only paid when the boot contacts part of the other players body. It never contacted Jonas, it contacted the ball. Potentially dangerous isn't a free.

The rule may have changed in the last 10 years but it definitely used to include provision for attempting to kick the ball in a manner likely to cause injury.

Here's the rule as it's written. Perhaps Membrey wasn't kicking forcefully enough for it to be deemed likely to cause injury, but there were a handful of other very obvious ones missed last night.

 

[HighBudget]

Seriously why is it such a big ask to have the umpires be fair for all teams? We’ve had to put up with shit umpiring for way too long, it never gets better! This is a professional league and we have to put up with this Amateur crap. It’s also to the detriment of footy in general, this amateur stuff would no doubt turn the younger generation off of footy, I mean it’s starting to turn me off of it TBH

 

[Duck Farmer]

Seriously why is it such a big ask to have the umpires be fair for all teams?

It's because we give them license to interpret the rules to suit the prevailing narrative.

It's like if Mitch Starc knocked over middle stump with a beautiful inswinging yorker on the first ball of the Boxing Day test to packed MCG but overstepped the mark by a couple of mil and the ICC gave the umps their chance to shine by allowing them to interpret it as a fair delivery so as not to ruin the sense of theatre.

tl;dr - Billy Bowden should've been an AFL ump.

 

[ExpectToWin]

Can we bring in a rule that once the umpire has blown his whistle, Play On cannot be called.

 

[Janus]

Rucci: "I'm sure the windows in the (coaches') box didn't hide the crowd noise. Were you just as vocal inside about some of the decisions the umpires were making?"

Hinkley: (Pause) "I'm not an umpire basher at all but gee..." (Pause) "Gee that was a...an interesting game. I think the challenge with the umpiring is...I'll say this: the challenge with the umpiring is that it should not change from week to week. That's confusing. For the players, for the umpires. The umpires walk off there tonight and they got a howling. Now that's not their...not all their...no all their fault, most of it. The game shouldn't get adjusted from week to week. The rules are the rules, they don't need to change. We just need to umpire them consistently. Like I want my team to play consistently. You can't tell me that coaches talking about the umpiring, or Gil talking about the umpiring, or me talking about the umpiring trying to make an adjustment...that doesn't work, that's not the way the game should be...and for umpires to have a week to week focus? Their week to week focus shouldn't change from round one to round...whatever we play. Because their focus should be to umpire the rules as they are written. And umpire them that way. And then everyone will become really clear with what to expect. There is absolutely no doubt that it's more confusing today than it has ever been."

Other Reporter: "Is that down a little bit to Alastair Clarkson when he came out and said some stuff around holding the ball? Do you think that's really shifted and created that confusion now?"

Hinkley: "I don't know exactly, but as I said I think the umpiring should be left to be umpired by the umpires, and it should be a...I don't see the rules changing. I don't understand that. We play the game every week, we should play with the same rules every week. I don't know that we need to make adjustments. We shouldn't behave as though there is something that needs to be fixed every week when it comes to umpiring or playing the game. We should just let it play."

This is about as scathing on the umpiring as you'll ever hear from Hinkley. He was pissed off.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Rucci: "I'm sure the windows in the (coaches') box didn't hide the crowd noise. Were you just as vocal inside about some of the decisions the umpires were making?"

Hinkley: (Pause) "I'm not an umpire basher at all but gee..." (Pause) "Gee that was a...an interesting game. I think the challenge with the umpiring is...I'll say this: the challenge with the umpiring is that it should not change from week to week. That's confusing. For the players, for the umpires. The umpires walk off there tonight and they got a howling. Now that's not their...not all their...no all their fault, most of it. The game shouldn't get adjusted from week to week. The rules are the rules, they don't need to change. We just need to umpire them consistently. Like I want my team to play consistently. You can't tell me that coaches talking about the umpiring, or Gil talking about the umpiring, or me talking about the umpiring trying to make an adjustment...that doesn't work, that's not the way the game should be...and for umpires to have a week to week focus? Their week to week focus shouldn't change from round one to round...whatever we play. Because their focus should be to umpire the rules as they are written. And umpire them that way. And then everyone will become really clear with what to expect. There is absolutely no doubt that it's more confusing today than it has ever been."

Other Reporter: "Is that down a little bit to Alastair Clarkson when he came out and said some stuff around holding the ball? Do you think that's really shifted and created that confusion now?"

Hinkley: "I don't know exactly, but as I said I think the umpiring should be left to be umpired by the umpires, and it should be a...I don't see the rules changing. I don't understand that. We play the game every week, we should play with the same rules every week. I don't know that we need to make adjustments. We shouldn't behave as though there is something that needs to be fixed every week when it comes to umpiring or playing the game. We should just let it play."

This is about as scathing on the umpiring as you'll ever hear from Hinkley. He was pissed off.

Yes he sure was

 

[FishingRick04]

That holding the man 50m penalty well I’ve never seen.

it was garbage that is delivered frequently in our home games, especially against Vic sides, halting our momentum and slowing our game play down.

I’m sure that aids our home reckon only being average.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

9 news replayed the decision paid against Ladhams when the Saints player slid into his legs. It was even worse than I remembered.

And the one when he had front position in the boundary throw in contest at half back, Marshall grabbed his arm and umpire #12 paid Marshall the free.

 

[El_Scorcho]

Yeah that sliding into the legs non-free with Ladhams was horrendous, they could use it in the training package it was that textbook.

 

[Forward Flank]

9 news replayed the decision paid against Ladhams when the Saints player slid into his legs. It was even worse than I remembered.

And the one when he had front position in the boundary throw in contest at half back, Marshall grabbed his arm and umpire #12 paid Marshall the free.

Kornes did an entire segment on the shitful umpiring decisions against us on the Sunday Footy Show this morning.

 

[philreich]

Seriously why is it such a big ask to have the umpires be fair for all teams? We’ve had to put up with sh*t umpiring for way too long, it never gets better! This is a professional league and we have to put up with this Amateur crap. It’s also to the detriment of footy in general, this amateur stuff would no doubt turn the younger generation off of footy, I mean it’s starting to turn me off of it TBH

And on the rare occasions when a few decisions go our way, the TV commentators are quick to pounce on each call and say, "Gee Port was lucky there."

 

[Launchpad McQuack]

And on the rare occasions when a few decisions go our way, the TV commentators are quick to pounce on each call and say, "Gee Port was lucky there."

Going on history they aren't exactly wrong about that though.

 

[Spadge]

I was so amped to go to the footy last night. Its been nearly a year since we've been able to go
I was like a kid on christmas day

The blatant cheating and our terrible performance made me remember just how much i really started hating going to the footy last year

 

[El_Scorcho]

So I had some time to kill and I wanted to test my theory that most of the frees seemed to be in our defensive half. Like the whistle just disappeared when we were attacking and then came out in force when St Kilda were in their forward half.

Keep in mind we had 36 Inside 50s to their 41, so they didn't dominate the forward entries.

There were 15-21 free kicks St Kilda's way.

St Kilda had 5 frees inside their attacking 50 to our 0.
St Kilda had 12 frees and 2 50m penalties in their attacking half to our 6 attacking half frees and 0 50m penalties.
St Kilda kicked 4 goals from frees to our 0.

To simplify it, St Kilda are always kicking to the left of the map.

Here is a breakdown of what the frees were, i've mainly left my opinion of the free kick out of it, because i'm not trying to argue that specific frees weren't there, i'm trying to argue that the whistle came out a lot more in advantageous positions for the Saints. I've also named the Port player involved for the most part, whether they got the free or gave it away. Saints frees in red, ours in black.

1. Q1 2.17 – Ruck free, Ladhams holds Marshall – GOAL
2. Q1 3.48 – Clurey deliberate out of bounds – King kicks it across the face for no score
3. Q1 7.29 – Holding – ruck infringement, Ladhams
4. Q1 9.35 – Blocking/Holding after the kick – Jonas – 50 immediately paid
5. Q1 14.48 – High in the marking contest - Clurey
6. Q1 15.27 – Jonas holding in the marking contest – Parker shanks it for no score
7. Q1 16.39 – Push out in a marking contest – Wines
8. Q1 17.34 – High in a marking contest – Ladhams
9. Q1 19.30 – Holding in a marking contest – Marshall marked the ball anyway
10. Q1 21.41 – Throw – we take the advantage
11. Q1 23.56 – Amon taken high after a centre bounce
12. Q1 24.11 – HTB Ebert

13. Q2 2.59 – HTB Ebert
14. Q2 4.58 – HTB Houston
15. Q2 5.31 – Ruck free, holding – Ladhams
16. Q2 9.58 – HTB Westhoff
17. Q2 15.46 – Ryder held by Jonas – GOAL
18. Q2 23.00 – SPP throw – 50 because DBJ kicks it as the whistle blows – GOAL

19. Q3 2.20 - Front on contact/arm chop – Ebert
20. Q3 3.16 – High tackle, I think against Houston
21. Q3 6.55 – High tackle by Gray after a mark wasn't paid not 15.
22. Q3 9.16 – Holding, pull of the jumper – SPP
23. Q3 9.50 – Holding in a ruck contest – Ladhams
24. Q3 12.31 – Ruck infringement – Ladhams
25. Q3 1301 – High tackle at a stoppage for Ryder
26. Q3 13.58 – Holding the man after Mayes tackled Parker who fumbled the ball – advantage paid, GOAL
27. Q3 18.01 – HTB Marshall
28. Q3 22.58 – The deliberate against Westhoff
29. Q3 23.32 – Push in a marking contest – Georgiadis
30. Q3 24.31 – Deliberate against Jones

31. Q4 2.29 – High tackle, directly after Ladhams was slid into
32. Q4 8.11 – Holding after Westhoff drags a player to the ground who drops the ball in the tackle ffs
33. Q4 11.44 – Ruck infringement which just wasn't there in any way shape or form against Ladhams
34. Q4 14.01 – Holding against Butters after he drags a Saints player to ground after they drop the ball
35. Q4 21.58 – Ruck infringement against Ladhams
36. Q4 25.18 – Push in the back - Boak

 

[JohnHinckleyJr]

So I had some time to kill and I wanted to test my theory that most of the frees seemed to be in our defensive half. Like the whistle just disappeared when we were attacking and then came out in force when St Kilda were in their forward half.

Keep in mind we had 36 Inside 50s to their 41, so they didn't dominate the forward entries.

There were 15-21 free kicks St Kilda's way.

St Kilda had 5 frees inside their attacking 50 to our 0.
St Kilda had 12 frees and 2 50m penalties in their attacking half to our 6 attacking half frees and 0 50m penalties.
St Kilda kicked 4 goals from frees to our 0.

To simplify it, St Kilda are always kicking to the left of the map.

Here is a breakdown of what the frees were, i've mainly left my opinion of the free kick out of it, because i'm not trying to argue that specific frees weren't there, i'm trying to argue that the whistle came out a lot more in advantageous positions for the Saints. I've also named the Port player involved for the most part, whether they got the free or gave it away. Saints frees in red, ours in black.

1. Q1 2.17 – Ruck free, Ladhams holds Marshall – GOAL
2. Q1 3.48 – Clurey deliberate out of bounds – King kicks it across the face for no score
3. Q1 7.29 – Holding – ruck infringement, Ladhams
4. Q1 9.35 – Blocking/Holding after the kick – Jonas – 50 immediately paid
5. Q1 14.48 – High in the marking contest - Clurey
6. Q1 15.27 – Jonas holding in the marking contest – Parker shanks it for no score
7. Q1 16.39 – Push out in a marking contest – Wines
8. Q1 17.34 – High in a marking contest – Ladhams
9. Q1 19.30 – Holding in a marking contest – Marshall marked the ball anyway
10. Q1 21.41 – Throw – we take the advantage
11. Q1 23.56 – Amon taken high after a centre bounce
12. Q1 24.11 – HTB Ebert

13. Q2 2.59 – HTB Ebert
14. Q2 4.58 – HTB Houston
15. Q2 5.31 – Ruck free, holding – Ladhams
16. Q2 9.58 – HTB Westhoff
17. Q2 15.46 – Ryder held by Jonas – GOAL
18. Q2 23.00 – SPP throw – 50 because DBJ kicks it as the whistle blows – GOAL

19. Q3 2.20 - Front on contact/arm chop – Ebert
20. Q3 3.16 – High tackle, I think against Houston
21. Q3 6.55 – High tackle by Gray after a mark wasn't paid not 15.
22. Q3 9.16 – Holding, pull of the jumper – SPP
23. Q3 9.50 – Holding in a ruck contest – Ladhams
24. Q3 12.31 – Ruck infringement – Ladhams
25. Q3 1301 – High tackle at a stoppage for Ryder
26. Q3 13.58 – Holding the man after Mayes tackled Parker who fumbled the ball – advantage paid, GOAL
27. Q3 18.01 – HTB Marshall
28. Q3 22.58 – The deliberate against Westhoff
29. Q3 23.32 – Push in a marking contest – Georgiadis
30. Q3 24.31 – Deliberate against Jones

31. Q4 2.29 – High tackle, directly after Ladhams was slid into
32. Q4 8.11 – Holding after Westhoff drags a player to the ground who drops the ball in the tackle ffs
33. Q4 11.44 – Ruck infringement which just wasn't there in any way shape or form against Ladhams
34. Q4 14.01 – Holding against Butters after he drags a Saints player to ground after they drop the ball
35. Q4 21.58 – Ruck infringement against Ladhams
36. Q4 25.18 – Push in the back - Boak

That's just proof how ****ed the system is

 

[Duck Farmer]

So I had some time to kill and I wanted to test my theory that most of the frees seemed to be in our defensive half. Like the whistle just disappeared when we were attacking and then came out in force when St Kilda were in their forward half.

Keep in mind we had 36 Inside 50s to their 41, so they didn't dominate the forward entries.

There were 15-21 free kicks St Kilda's way.

St Kilda had 5 frees inside their attacking 50 to our 0.
St Kilda had 12 frees and 2 50m penalties in their attacking half to our 6 attacking half frees and 0 50m penalties.
St Kilda kicked 4 goals from frees to our 0.

To simplify it, St Kilda are always kicking to the left of the map.

Here is a breakdown of what the frees were, i've mainly left my opinion of the free kick out of it, because i'm not trying to argue that specific frees weren't there, i'm trying to argue that the whistle came out a lot more in advantageous positions for the Saints. I've also named the Port player involved for the most part, whether they got the free or gave it away. Saints frees in red, ours in black.

1. Q1 2.17 – Ruck free, Ladhams holds Marshall – GOAL
2. Q1 3.48 – Clurey deliberate out of bounds – King kicks it across the face for no score
3. Q1 7.29 – Holding – ruck infringement, Ladhams
4. Q1 9.35 – Blocking/Holding after the kick – Jonas – 50 immediately paid
5. Q1 14.48 – High in the marking contest - Clurey
6. Q1 15.27 – Jonas holding in the marking contest – Parker shanks it for no score
7. Q1 16.39 – Push out in a marking contest – Wines
8. Q1 17.34 – High in a marking contest – Ladhams
9. Q1 19.30 – Holding in a marking contest – Marshall marked the ball anyway
10. Q1 21.41 – Throw – we take the advantage
11. Q1 23.56 – Amon taken high after a centre bounce
12. Q1 24.11 – HTB Ebert

13. Q2 2.59 – HTB Ebert
14. Q2 4.58 – HTB Houston
15. Q2 5.31 – Ruck free, holding – Ladhams
16. Q2 9.58 – HTB Westhoff
17. Q2 15.46 – Ryder held by Jonas – GOAL
18. Q2 23.00 – SPP throw – 50 because DBJ kicks it as the whistle blows – GOAL

19. Q3 2.20 - Front on contact/arm chop – Ebert
20. Q3 3.16 – High tackle, I think against Houston
21. Q3 6.55 – High tackle by Gray after a mark wasn't paid not 15.
22. Q3 9.16 – Holding, pull of the jumper – SPP
23. Q3 9.50 – Holding in a ruck contest – Ladhams
24. Q3 12.31 – Ruck infringement – Ladhams
25. Q3 1301 – High tackle at a stoppage for Ryder
26. Q3 13.58 – Holding the man after Mayes tackled Parker who fumbled the ball – advantage paid, GOAL
27. Q3 18.01 – HTB Marshall
28. Q3 22.58 – The deliberate against Westhoff
29. Q3 23.32 – Push in a marking contest – Georgiadis
30. Q3 24.31 – Deliberate against Jones

31. Q4 2.29 – High tackle, directly after Ladhams was slid into
32. Q4 8.11 – Holding after Westhoff drags a player to the ground who drops the ball in the tackle ffs
33. Q4 11.44 – Ruck infringement which just wasn't there in any way shape or form against Ladhams
34. Q4 14.01 – Holding against Butters after he drags a Saints player to ground after they drop the ball
35. Q4 21.58 – Ruck infringement against Ladhams
36. Q4 25.18 – Push in the back - Boak

So the Saints got 5 frees inside to F50 plus a 50 metre which brought them inside the 50m arc leading to 4 goals and Port got zilch. Seems legit.

You should send this to Kornes.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Lol f king amazing, so Kane saying AFL considering sanctioning Ken for his comments.

 

[LFC2010]

So I had some time to kill and I wanted to test my theory that most of the frees seemed to be in our defensive half. Like the whistle just disappeared when we were attacking and then came out in force when St Kilda were in their forward half.

Keep in mind we had 36 Inside 50s to their 41, so they didn't dominate the forward entries.

There were 15-21 free kicks St Kilda's way.

St Kilda had 5 frees inside their attacking 50 to our 0.
St Kilda had 12 frees and 2 50m penalties in their attacking half to our 6 attacking half frees and 0 50m penalties.
St Kilda kicked 4 goals from frees to our 0.

To simplify it, St Kilda are always kicking to the left of the map.

Here is a breakdown of what the frees were, i've mainly left my opinion of the free kick out of it, because i'm not trying to argue that specific frees weren't there, i'm trying to argue that the whistle came out a lot more in advantageous positions for the Saints. I've also named the Port player involved for the most part, whether they got the free or gave it away. Saints frees in red, ours in black.

1. Q1 2.17 – Ruck free, Ladhams holds Marshall – GOAL
2. Q1 3.48 – Clurey deliberate out of bounds – King kicks it across the face for no score
3. Q1 7.29 – Holding – ruck infringement, Ladhams
4. Q1 9.35 – Blocking/Holding after the kick – Jonas – 50 immediately paid
5. Q1 14.48 – High in the marking contest - Clurey
6. Q1 15.27 – Jonas holding in the marking contest – Parker shanks it for no score
7. Q1 16.39 – Push out in a marking contest – Wines
8. Q1 17.34 – High in a marking contest – Ladhams
9. Q1 19.30 – Holding in a marking contest – Marshall marked the ball anyway
10. Q1 21.41 – Throw – we take the advantage
11. Q1 23.56 – Amon taken high after a centre bounce
12. Q1 24.11 – HTB Ebert

13. Q2 2.59 – HTB Ebert
14. Q2 4.58 – HTB Houston
15. Q2 5.31 – Ruck free, holding – Ladhams
16. Q2 9.58 – HTB Westhoff
17. Q2 15.46 – Ryder held by Jonas – GOAL
18. Q2 23.00 – SPP throw – 50 because DBJ kicks it as the whistle blows – GOAL

19. Q3 2.20 - Front on contact/arm chop – Ebert
20. Q3 3.16 – High tackle, I think against Houston
21. Q3 6.55 – High tackle by Gray after a mark wasn't paid not 15.
22. Q3 9.16 – Holding, pull of the jumper – SPP
23. Q3 9.50 – Holding in a ruck contest – Ladhams
24. Q3 12.31 – Ruck infringement – Ladhams
25. Q3 1301 – High tackle at a stoppage for Ryder
26. Q3 13.58 – Holding the man after Mayes tackled Parker who fumbled the ball – advantage paid, GOAL
27. Q3 18.01 – HTB Marshall
28. Q3 22.58 – The deliberate against Westhoff
29. Q3 23.32 – Push in a marking contest – Georgiadis
30. Q3 24.31 – Deliberate against Jones

31. Q4 2.29 – High tackle, directly after Ladhams was slid into
32. Q4 8.11 – Holding after Westhoff drags a player to the ground who drops the ball in the tackle ffs
33. Q4 11.44 – Ruck infringement which just wasn't there in any way shape or form against Ladhams
34. Q4 14.01 – Holding against Butters after he drags a Saints player to ground after they drop the ball
35. Q4 21.58 – Ruck infringement against Ladhams
36. Q4 25.18 – Push in the back - Boak

put this on the main board and wait for the comments.

 

[LFC2010]

Lol f king amazing, so Kane saying AFL considering sanctioning Ken for his comments.

LOL, hardly surprising though isn't it. still glad he said what he did

Vic coach's cry about umpires, nothing but apologies and get the over corrections.
Interstate coach's do the same, FINES.. and will probably get reamed harder thursday night.

nothing but a rabies infected VFL comp #VICBIAS

 

[Capital Power]

Can we bring in a rule that once the umpire has blown his whistle, Play On cannot be called.

Whilst this makes sense I think what we really need is a moratorium on rule changes, and umpires being reviewed on their implementation of the rule already there.

There's too many excuses for one-sided umpiring. We start measuring performance and allocating umpires accordingly, then we level it out a bit

Can our stats gurus comment on how often we get certain umpires? We seem to be on the receiving end of serial campaigners quite often.

 

[backtozero]

Wow. Know your place Port!

Clarkson, Scott, Ratten etc carry on.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Ken's comments were the best thing he's said in 5 years. If anything, my only issue is that he didn't go hard enough.

I'll chip in a few bucks to cover his fine (and then I'll chip in a few more bucks to pay out his contract and sack him, but that's unrelated).