Play Nice USA President Donald Trump -Game On

[ArjenTheGreat]

And when you have no home to return to because it's been shelled to oblivion, half your family is dead and you can't return for fear of being next, I'm sure you would be understanding of the Aussie's wanting to maintain their quarter acre paradise.

I love you and all that mate, but jeepers.

It's not our fault, not our problem.

All the neighbouring countries who speak their language, respect they same *ed religious beliefs etc etc have said * off, why can't we?

Why should they become our $250m problem?

We already have enough unemployment, homeless, social disintegration, lawlessness, issues with housing affordability.

We have a heart, we let many thousands settle here, but enough is enough, at some point we have to to protect our way off life and our kids' futures.

 

[Devington]

Again on the news we hear that 3 Africans bash a 45 year old lady for being white, but your all right we must keep letting these ppl in we need to help them, some of you ppl should pull your heads out of your arses and just have a good look at what's happening to Australia

Christ almighty mate.

Please learn how to make a reasoned argument. I don't like to put people down, but I'm pretty sure it's you who needs to pull your head out of your arse.

What type of responses are you expecting to a post like this? You don't change people's hearts and minds by going off half cocked and insulting people, with half baked and non sourced evidence and the manners and literacy of an unruly 8 year old.

 

[Devington]

I love you and all that mate, but jeepers.

It's not our fault, not our problem.

All the neighbouring countries who speak their language, respect they same ******ed religious beliefs etc etc have said **** off, why can't we?

Why should they become our $250m problem?

We already have enough unemployment, homeless, social disintegration, lawlessness, issues with housing affordability.

We have a heart, we let many thousands settle here, but enough is enough, at some point we have to to protect our way off life and our kids' futures.

There are arguments that some (or a lot) of it is our fault, and that we have a moral responsibility to help. There are also arguments that even if it isn't our fault we have a moral responsibility to help.

I agree with your sentiments about us having our own problems, and I think most western countries need to turn inwards to a degree, but I also think that we can't just turn our backs to the international stage.

 

[Popeye10]

Christ almighty mate.

Please learn how to make a reasoned argument. I don't like to put people down, but I'm pretty sure it's you who needs to pull your head out of your arse.

What type of responses are you expecting to a post like this? You don't change people's hearts and minds by going off half cocked and insulting people, with half baked and non sourced evidence and the manners and literacy of an unruly 8 year old.

I don't insult anybody on here I'm the one that gets insulted here becouse I got a different view on things, you know by the ppl who want the worlds refugees to come here. By the way what is wrong with Trump looking after America first, I don't understand why ppl are upset about that.

 

[Le Grille]

I don't insult anybody on here I'm the one that gets insulted here becouse I got a different view on things, you know by the ppl who want the worlds refugees to come here. By the way what is wrong with Trump looking after America first, I don't understand why ppl are upset about that.

No, you get insulted because you state ****ed opinions.

You're willing to tar a whole race of people because of one act, I suppose I should hate aussies cos a bloke glassed another at a pub. Violent *heads are violent *heads regardless of race.

Put forth a reasoned argument, maybe we will listen


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[astrovic]

I felt the need for extra mayo on top, so please let me indulge in unsubstantiated opinion for shock value....ha.

Truth i suspect is a watered down view of what i said. On this, assuming Trump refuses to take them what would you do with these people?

Mate the first thing I want is for this issue to stop being a political football and be about asylum seekers.

I want offshore processing to end. It is wrong.

I want mandatory detention to be as humane and as short as possible. Weeks, not years. When you get here and seek asylum, you're either in or out, no sitting in some pacific island jail for years with no rights, no future and no hope. That's inhumane.

I want Australia to process it's own asylum seekers without having to shop them around to other countries. That's just handballing the problem.

I want a short, simple legal process for appeals. The current one is insanely bureaucratic, expensive and resource and time consuming. I want it to be consistent and fair but final. I accept that it will create sob stories, hard luck cases and unfair outcomes on occasions. Not everyone can win.

I want clear, strict but generous quotas so that literally when we are full, you can * off. Harsh but true.

I want a powerful international marketing campaign that makes it clear that asylum seekers who lie, cheat, bullshit, destroy paperwork or are latent terrorists ain't getting in. And for that to be enforced in reality. I want other countries - especially Indonesia - to accept that if asylum seekers come via their country and do any of these things, they can take them back. We have more than enough asylum seekers doing the right thing to have to put with up those doing the wrong thing. Enough of the corruption.

I want our government to seriously fund welfare, support services, integration services, education services etc etc. The current situation is pissweak and leads to successful asylum seekers just falling in a hole when they get here.

I want Australia to be a world leader in asylum seeker policy - we have the land, the resources and the first world economy to absorb more than our fair share - and want us to use that moral high horse to beat the s**t out of other first world countries to do the right thing too.

In other words I want it done properly and fairly, and it ain't.

And yeah I know what I'm asking for is a pink unicorn.

 

[Devington]

I don't insult anybody on here I'm the one that gets insulted here becouse I got a different view on things, you know by the ppl who want the worlds refugees to come here. By the way what is wrong with Trump looking after America first, I don't understand why ppl are upset about that.

"some of you ppl should pull your heads out of your arses"

That's insulting.

And yes, I know you get insulted to. It borders on bullying often, and I don't particularly like it. As loathe as I am to use this rationale though, you do often ask for it and not just because of your opinion. Your posting style often leaves a lot to be desired, and it's exacerbated by how you seem, and I don't want to be too offensive, to be a low information voter.

As for what is wrong with Trump looking after America first? Not that much, if that was the be all and end all. But there are the actual actions, as well as rhetoric, tone, and language that is used to also be taken into account. As well as the simple fact that as cheesy as it is, we're all different. Different personalities, beliefs, values, even realities. I'm sure there are plenty of people that also wouldn't understand why you would be upset (I am assuming here) if Clinton won.

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

There are arguments that some (or a lot) of it is our fault, and that we have a moral responsibility to help. There are also arguments that even if it isn't our fault we have a moral responsibility to help.

I agree with your sentiments about us having our own problems, and I think most western countries need to turn inwards to a degree, but I also think that we can't just turn our backs to the international stage.

Ye olde Western Guilt trip.

How's Germany going?
France?
Britain?

Spent much time in towns like Halifax or Leeds?


Everyone wants these people to be safe, have food and shelter, but not at our nations expense for the next 30 years.

Using historical data as a reference.

1250 refugees.

30% will never work. Ever.

So on that 30% alone is 400x$350pwx52x30
= 218,400,000.

Adjusted for inflation and fact these numbers don't include their kids, baby boomer welfare, cost of housing the 10%+ who will end up in jail.

Factor in the cost of doing it, not to mention the intangible social costs when they begin to feel disaffected as they will, it is a resounding no from me.

 

[Devington]

Ye olde Western Guilt trip.

How's Germany going?
France?
Britain?

Spent much time in towns like Halifax or Leeds?


Everyone wants these people to be safe, have food and shelter, but not at our nations expense for the next 30 years.

Using historical data as a reference.

1250 refugees.

30% will never work. Ever.

So on that 30% alone is 400x$350pwx52x30
= 218,400,000.

Adjusted for inflation and fact these numbers don't include their kids, baby boomer welfare, cost of housing the 10%+ who will end up in jail.

Factor in the cost of doing it, not to mention the intangible social costs when they begin to feel disaffected as they will, it is a resounding no from me.

I probably more agree than disagree, Arjen. Still, I think the other arguments are valid as well. I think that we do have a moral burden because of our complicity in (some of) their suffering, which would be culturally detrimental to dismiss or underplay too heavily. But I also think that our own countries, cultures, and peoples need to come first, and necessarily so.

Someone mentioned that a chain is only as strong as its weakest link. I agree. But there are a shitload of weak links right now, and we're one of the stronger ones. If we try to maintain the integrity of the whole chain too much, and try too hard to strengthen some of the weaker links, or take on too much of that link's burden, then we risk weakening our own link. That's bad for both us and the chain.

I think we need to focus on our link's strength first and foremost. Stop ******* around directly and indirectly damaging the other links. And also stop pretending we're unbreakable. We're vulnerable right now, and our refugee and immigration policies are only a small (but, yes, significant) part of that.

I don't know what exactly the 'correct' or 'best' or 'least worst' solution to this all is. I'm just hoping that by being honest about it and encouraging others to be as well that we stumble upon a good enough solution that doesn't snap our link in half.

 

[Gasometer]

Fake news flash.

Don didn't hang up on Mal.

BFF

 

[Tas]

In case you are unsure of your fate as a liberal who supports Antifa:

 

[Saintly35]

. By the way what is wrong with Trump looking after America first, I don't understand why ppl are upset about that.

You'll generally be shouted down here whenever you don't fall into line with the popular vote, just the way it is.

I have no idea why people are upset with Trump doing his job either, I'm sure if roles were reversed we'd be wanting to protect our borders better also.

 

[Tas]

 

[LuvtheKangas]

You'll generally be shouted down here whenever you don't fall into line with the popular vote, just the way it is.

I have no idea why people are upset with Trump doing his job either, I'm sure if roles were reversed we'd be wanting to protect our borders better also.

No, you get shouted down when you post ignorant, closed-minded and bigoted statements. And when you are happy to support mistreatment of a group of people just because you don't personally identify with them, whilst giving off the strong vibe that you would scream blue murder if others treated you in the same way. Roles reversed ...

It's not black and white, of course, but sweeping statements never provide the solution.

I'm not 'upset' with Trump per se, but the man is dangerous and unfortunately the US voters (and especially, non-voters) have inadvertently made the world a more dangerous place.

 

[Saintly35]

It's all speculation so far. Let him do his job and assess after that.

It may be that he takes America (and the world) backwards, but all the outrage over him making decisions is pretty stupid to be honest.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

It's all speculation so far. Let him do his job and assess after that.

It may be that he takes America (and the world) backwards, but all the outrage over him making decisions is pretty stupid to be honest.

I've mainly stayed out of this thread for that reason (wait and see). Also because of the fact that the alternative to Trump may have been just as bad, possibly worse, and at best, not much better.

But I think it's now safe to say that those of us who were worried about the negative impact of Trump on the rest of the world have had their worries validated in the past 3 weeks.

Given the US' position and influence over the rest of the world, this election was always a lose-lose for the majority. We're living in a volatile period in world history and we can't do anything about it. If there are still humans in 200 years, then they will have the advantage of learning from this period in history.

 

[Saintly35]

Nah, nothing he's done since he's been in office is near as hysterically bad as the media tries to suggest (successfully on many people).

Of course Clinton would have been worse. She is a disgrace, at least Trump is trying to do the right thing (of which success or otherwise will be determined in time).

I have no issue with implementing US border protection. If anything he could have gone harder but chose not to.

 

[Saintly35]

There are arguments that some (or a lot) of it is our fault, and that we have a moral responsibility to help. There are also arguments that even if it isn't our fault we have a moral responsibility to help.

I agree with your sentiments about us having our own problems, and I think most western countries need to turn inwards to a degree, but I also think that we can't just turn our backs to the international stage.

What is this moral responsibility you speak of? Sounds more like goodwill than legal or sensible obligation, of which we are already very generous.

Also why is this "moral responsibility" more important for outsiders than the responsibility to look after Australian citizens first and foremost?

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Nah, nothing he's done since he's been in office is near as hysterically bad as the media tries to suggest (successfully on many people).

Of course Clinton would have been worse. She is a disgrace, at least Trump is trying to do the right thing (of which success or otherwise will be determined in time).

I have no issue with implementing US border protection. If anything he could have gone harder but chose not to.

As usual, you push your opinion as fact.

Many, me included, do not think he is trying to do the right thing, except within the framework of his own personal prejudices. Many of us also believe that he has started ominously and we don't need the media's overreaction to enable us to draw this conclusion independently.

Border protection is something most nations rightly treat as high priority. It is, and has been for decades if not centuries, something that is difficult to successfully implement. Building a wall along the Mexican border will offer some but nowhere near full border protection, and the cost would significantly outweigh the benefit. And there is simply no basis for his claim that Mexico would pay - no moral, legal or economic justification - so surely he shouldn't be applauded for saying this.

As an aside, I'm sure you'd think it was pretty s**t if you had Muslim relatives that need to get to the US for work or family reasons.

 

[Saintly35]

My giving of an opinion is fact? Ha.....ok. The vast majority of this thread is opinion yet you claim mine as fact because it doesn't fit the anti-Trump agenda.

I couldn't care less about my relatives if they were stuck in that situation. They haven't been executed, it's just a temporary and overdue policy regarding border protection.

In any case they should blame their psycho brethren rather than the country trying to be responsible in who they take in.

 

[Thewlis Dish]

Only just saw this thread, saw Saintly had the last post, and just assumed he would be mounting the rapidly diminishing "pro-Trump" argument.

 

[Firestarter]

It's one thing to say he's just following through on his promises but when those promises are poorly thought through that's another.

But hey, as long as he's doing what he said he would, right? Right?

 

[Saintly35]

Only just saw this thread, saw Saintly had the last post, and just assumed he would be mounting the rapidly diminishing "pro-Trump" argument.

Ha.....

I'm not pro-Trump at all. I'm just not automatically against him based on media propoganda.

I'd rather let him do his job and assess after that, than blindly take the bait of a biased media like many, probably you also, do.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Ha.....

I'm not pro-Trump at all. I'm just not automatically against him based on media propoganda.

I'd rather let him do his job and assess after that, than blindly take the bait of a biased media like many, probably you also, do.

You keep sniping people about being misled by biased or hysterical media. Are you just completely ignorant of the possibility that some are able to make an independent assessment of the facts they see in front of them?

 

[ArjenTheGreat]

Only just saw this thread, saw Saintly had the last post, and just assumed he would be mounting the rapidly diminishing "pro-Trump" argument.

And when your daughter or wife is raped by some Syrian refugee who doesn't know any better, we'll still feel sorry you, I promise.

You can be anti terror and anti refugee despots in conjunction with being neutral to medium pro Trump.

People just aren't that intelligent and able to compartmentalise their lives and lack critical thinking and comprehension skills.

What an overreaction, I would have 5-10 conversations a week that other people would find uncomfortable. I love them. I love being told to * off.

As for these refugees, they should be settled into houses of the people who want them. I would happily let in the Lankans, Pakistani and those from Bangers but others from countries we are actively at war with, it's lunacy to let them in, no matter what their struggle may be. So Iraq and Syria are a no from me, Iran is a 50/50, I would toss the cricket bat... Flats they go, roofs they get a roof.