News Warnock Nominates Carlton

[krusher]

How is retaining pick 24 a win for you, unless you draft a star at pick 24? If you retain pick 24 and Warnock ends up being a better player than whoever you take at 24 you have lost.

Melbourne are still in the mix. If you guys offer a crap deal Warnock will agree to a trade to the Demons because he knows that if a deal isn't done he'll end up at Melbourne anyway and he'll be stuck in limbo until the PSD in December. He has also said that he and his manager will ensure that Fremantle get a reasonable deal.

Let's say hypothetically all Carlton are offering is pick 24 with a few hours left in trade week. Fremantle will go to Melbourne and say look, Carlton are only offering pick 24, how about you trade us pick 19? Melbourne will say no thanks we'll take him in the PSD for nothing. Fremantle will say no, either offer pick 19 or we'll reluctantly take 24 from the Blues. Melbourne will then realise that he's easily worth pick 19 and put it on the table, then you guys have to better that offer which you will considering there is a 200 game big man on the tabe (injuries permitting).

Pick 24 and another pick in the late 20's (or an equivalent player) is a fair deal. You retain pick 6 and everyone's happy.







But Connolly, Schwab and Icke, the clowns that traded away all our picks, aren't at the club anymore.

you freakin dreamin lad - if my aunty had balls....

the facts are that he has chosen carlton - he doesnt have to agree to be traded to melb so pick 19 is irrelevant -

he will be a blue and i can see him being our clark keating - the september specialist

 

[DamianBis]

Warnock is worth alot more than just pick 24 I think he is potentially more promising than Kruz (who I think looks a star)

As a ruckman? yes.

Around the ground? no way.

 

[Big Red is back]

As a ruckman? yes.

Around the ground? no way.

Agreed.

If we get Warnock for just pick 24 it would be an amazing result. Ask yourself what you would expect for Kruz

 

[AndyWalkersGirl]

Would prefer to see if we can draft players for players in stead of a top 30 pick. Just with the future of the draft looking at giving priority to QLD and NSW teams, I think we should try to hold onto our picks.

Hopefully Blackwell and Benjamin would be sufficient for Fremantle.

Just as an aside, where do people see Fisher in our team?

If we have Kruezer/Cloke in the forward line with Fev, Betts, and small crumbers such as Walker and Houlihan, where on earth is there a spot in our 22 for Fisher? I just can't find a spot for him.

Same as Hartlett. Hopefully he makes a spot on our list.

 

[RPCB]

I think it's incredibly unfair that AFL regulations stipulate all Fremantle trades must be weighted against them.

Does it really? No, im not joking i'am serious.

You know afteral:

Freo receive: Trent Croad, Luke McPharlin

Hawthorn receive: pick 1 (Luke Hodge), 20, 36 (Sam Mitchell)

Two years later:

Freo receive: pick 10 (Ryley Dunn 5 games in 4 years)

Hawthorn receive: Trent Croad

You'd think that they would've learned from stuff-up to stuff-up but considering they made the 2001 trade about 5 years after they traded Andew McLeod for Chris Groom you knew that they wouldnt learn.

Its unfortunate for Freo that they dont hand out premierships for trade ****ups.

 

[OZBomb]

Just as an aside, where do people see Fisher in our team?

If we have Kruezer/Cloke in the forward line with Fev, Betts, and small crumbers such as Walker and Houlihan, where on earth is there a spot in our 22 for Fisher? I just can't find a spot for him.

He'll be in the same situation as Bentick and Blackwell have been this year now that we have midfield depth, he'll play VFL more than half the time when we have our best team on the park. Cloke has gone past him this year as a forward option and Cloke is a much bigger frame and is still developing at 23. Whether he wants to stick around as a depth player or pull his finger out and seriously work on some deficences he's had for many years now, will be up to him.

 

[DIG]

Those throwing pick 10 into the mix are probably dreaming. Crows almost certainly won't trade it.

http://news.realfooty.com.au/sport/crows-first-pick-off-limits-20080912-4fee.html

 

[OZBomb]

Those throwing pick 10 into the mix are probably dreaming. Crows almost certainly won't trade it.

http://news.realfooty.com.au/sport/crows-first-pick-off-limits-20080912-4fee.html

Moving Pick 10 to pick 6 hardly violates this policy, which is what was the suggested scenario earlier.

 

[Silvagnis]

Dean Cox was a rookie selection. Aaron Sandilands was a rookie selection. Josh Frasier was pick 1.

Once your drafted its all about how you develop.

Warnock > Hampson, even your club thinks so, otherwise why would they trade for him?

Point is some of the ridiculous suggestions here are laughable, 3rd or 4th rounders aren't going to cut it.

Even a 2nd rounder isn't enough. His value sits somewhere between your 1st rounder and your 2nd rounder.

I have been accused of being unrealistic, trades i've put forward:

1. Warnock + pick 21 = Pick 6 + Armfield.

2. Carlton lose: pick 6 + pick 24, gain: Warnock + pick 10.

3. 2x 2nd rounders

4. 2nd, 3rd and 4th round selection.

Substitute Hampson into the above trades in Warnock's place. Put the shoe on the other foot. Remember that Warnock has shown a hell of a lot more. I do realise Hampson has only had 2 seasons where Warnock has had 3. At the end of his 2nd season Warnock was leading the ruck and doing well.

IMO number 3 will be most likely, or number 4.

Hampson has nothing to do with Carlton chasing Warnock.

It's all about depth.

Warnock didn't have a freak such as Kreuzer for competition in his second year.

 

[Bluebear]

Substitute Hampson into the above trades in Warnock's place. Put the shoe on the other foot. Remember that Warnock has shown a hell of a lot more. I do realise Hampson has only had 2 seasons where Warnock has had 3. At the end of his 2nd season Warnock was leading the ruck and doing well.

So if Cloke and Kreuzer were injured and Hampson was "leading" our ruck, would that elevate him in your mind?

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?tid1=9&pid1=1648&tid2=4&pid2=1735

The over-statement of what Warnock has actually done, and the inability to seperate that from the "potential" he shows is growing on this board by the day.

Staggerring.

Yes.....he is ahead of Hampson. He is a year older and has played 9 more games......and has probably been playing AFL for a lot longer (Hampson a recent convert).........in my mind he should be further ahead, not only just.

 

[celtic_pride]

For everyone's info, Robbie Warnock right now would be very similar in his development to Jeff White when he left Freo in 1997, and White had a decent career with the Dees, so I think we should all be very optimistic ..

 

[rgauci]

Hampson has nothing to do with Carlton chasing Warnock.

It's all about depth.

Warnock didn't have a freak such as Kreuzer for competition in his second year.

Reading comprehension 101.

Never said Hampson had anything to do with Carlton chasing Warnock. Just pointing out, if the shoe was on the other foot. Would you be giving up Hampson for 3rd or 4th rounders, i think not.

And thats despite Hampson showing less than Warnock.

 

[celtic_pride]

I would honestly do a straight swap Browne for Warnock (no draft picks) if that is what Freo were asking .. (I generally think the more draft picks you hang on to, the more trades/bargaining chips you can amass, the better)

Also btw the Dees fans aren't handling the news at Demonlogy very well

http://demonology.midnight.net.au/

 

[Bluebear]

Also btw the Dees fans aren't handling the news at Demonlogy very well
http://demonology.midnight.net.au/

I Can't understand how the Powerpoint presentation and young guns in suits didn't swing him though .We'll have to try something Bolder in future . Cars & Hookers maybe .......

Some of them showing a sense of humour about it......but mostly its very bitter.

 

[rgauci]

So if Cloke and Kreuzer were injured and Hampson was "leading" our ruck, would that elevate him in your mind?

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?tid1=9&pid1=1648&tid2=4&pid2=1735

The over-statement of what Warnock has actually done, and the inability to seperate that from the "potential" he shows is growing on this board by the day.

Staggerring.

Yes.....he is ahead of Hampson. He is a year older and has played 9 more games......and has probably been playing AFL for a lot longer (Hampson a recent convert).........in my mind he should be further ahead, not only just.

Hampson has been playing AFL for less time. Farren Ray was a soccer convert in his mid teens. Not sure whether thats a positive or negative. Marty Clarke is a success story. Setanta success, The other O'Hailpin, fail. Its a bit hit and miss with these type of footballers.

Warnock wasn't physically ready to lead the ruck in 2007. Yet he did it. And did it very well. Often beating more experienced pairs. His best game was against Carlton, 16 possessions and 16 hitouts. IMO he's still not physically mature enough to lead a ruck. But he seems to think otherwise.

Warnock by form, would of surpassed Cloke in 2007 as the lead ruck. Or at least be sharing the duties 50/50.

If Hampson had showed this season he is capable of leading a ruck, i don't think Carlton would be bothering chasing Warnock. If he had shown the capability of leading a ruck, he would be on par with Warnock in terms of development...but he hasn't.

I think Carlton realise they have got the midfield sorted, will be close to the best in the league in a couple of seasons. Some very talented youngsters in the backline who will mature into a solid unit. Any forward line containing Fev is good enough.

The ruck, despite recruiting talented youngsters in Kreuzer and Hampson, isn't in line with the rest. Ruckman always take years to hit their straps. Usually mid 20's before they are really competitive. Kreuzer is a unique talent. But he's the perfect foil to a lead ruckman. He shouldn't lead a ruck.

You'd hate for Carlton to be chasing a premiership over the next 3 years to fall over in the GF or prelim because their rucks weren't upto standard. Look at the Saints. Should of easily won a premiership in the last 5 years. They lost a prelim because Jason Ball did as he pleased tapping the ball to Nick Davis in the last quarter.

Everywhere else on the field is sorted or developing well. You have the opportunity to complete the package by trading this season. IMO a 2nd rounder won't cut it. Or you can rely on Hampson to make the grade. If you think Hampson will definately lead a premiership ruck division in 2-4 seasons. Stick with him, if you have your doubts. You may need to trade.

What your club chooses to offer Hinges on the above. If Hampson has truly got what it takes, a 2nd rounder may be all you offer. After all you could get Jeff White for a year and wait until Hampson matures. I'm sure he'd be a good tutor too and help Hampson's development.

But if your club doesn't think Hampson will make it. Then you'll have to offer better than a 2nd rounder.

 

[Alpha1]

Too many people on BF saying we will give #6, we are not going to give #6 for Warnock, I think #24 will get it done.

 

[thylacine60]

Some of them showing a sense of humour about it......but mostly its very bitter.

werribeedemon Posted on Fri 12/09/08 08:08:33 Member #
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totally agee with carltank and visy im still waiting to see "i followed melbourne as a kid but i play for caltank captain" judd to break down

Nice.

 

[RPCB]

werribeedemon Posted on Fri 12/09/08 08:08:33 Member #
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totally agee with carltank and visy im still waiting to see "i followed melbourne as a kid but i play for caltank captain" judd to break down

Nice.

I just finished reading that thread on Demonology. Bitter much?

Graham GauntPosted on Fri 12/09/08 05:13:06 Member #
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At least we will not be held to ransom.

Bugger him, bugger them and just all sit back and wait until the Prik does a Knee reco before we go phew!

That is just pathetic. Robbie chose us over Melbourne for a reason, we have a future and i dont mean just in terms of football either. Melbourne might cease to exist in a few year time.

 

[thylacine60]

I just finished reading that thread on Demonology. Bitter much?

Graham GauntPosted on Fri 12/09/08 05:13:06 Member #
Date joined
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1011


At least we will not be held to ransom.

Bugger him, bugger them and just all sit back and wait until the Prik does a Knee reco before we go phew!

That is just pathetic. Robbie chose us over Melbourne for a reason, we have a future and i dont mean just in terms of football either. Melbourne might cease to exist in a few year time.

If ever a club was being saved from relocation by its name.........

 

[RPCB]

If ever a club was being saved from relocation by its name.........

Good point.

 

[Blue Dawn]

werribeedemon Posted on Fri 12/09/08 08:08:33 Member #
Date joined
Posts
2103
10/10/2006
36

totally agee with carltank and visy im still waiting to see "i followed melbourne as a kid but i play for caltank captain" judd to break down

Nice.

Bitter little f@#kers aren't they - all five of them!

 

[thylacine60]

They take it hard. I looked but couldn't find the "Kill Barassi" thread from the 60's. Hope their new development comes with enough off-cuts for a nice, strong bridge.

 

[blueboy152]

Was just watching some video of warnock when we played them over there last year. And he would be a real handy player for us if we get him, He is really just a better example of what hampson could be, tall, mobile, very good jump....He will be feeding juddy,stevo and murph for a long time!!! And his kicking is really good for a big guy
Get the deal done blue boys

 

[Blue Dawn]

Dean Cox was a rookie selection. Aaron Sandilands was a rookie selection. Josh Frasier was pick 1.

Once your drafted its all about how you develop.

Warnock > Hampson, even your club thinks so, otherwise why would they trade for him?

Point is some of the ridiculous suggestions here are laughable, 3rd or 4th rounders aren't going to cut it.

Even a 2nd rounder isn't enough. His value sits somewhere between your 1st rounder and your 2nd rounder.

I have been accused of being unrealistic, trades i've put forward:

1. Warnock + pick 21 = Pick 6 + Armfield.

2. Carlton lose: pick 6 + pick 24, gain: Warnock + pick 10.

3. 2x 2nd rounders

4. 2nd, 3rd and 4th round selection.

Substitute Hampson into the above trades in Warnock's place. Put the shoe on the other foot. Remember that Warnock has shown a hell of a lot more. I do realise Hampson has only had 2 seasons where Warnock has had 3. At the end of his 2nd season Warnock was leading the ruck and doing well.

IMO number 3 will be most likely, or number 4.

Wouldn't be so absolute in your opinion my friend. Freo have invested pick 42 and 3 years development into Warnock and Carlton #17 and 2 years into Hampson. Warnock's ahead at the moment, as he should be, but Hammo could still be a freak with his awesome athleticism make no mistake.

The question is would we take a 2nd rounder rather than SFA next year from GC if Hammo said he wanted out? We'd gesticulate, we'd procrastinate, we'd obfuscate, we'd argue til we're blue in the face, we'd hold out til the bitter end on Thursday in trade week ...... then, as we can't force him elsewhere against his will, we'd take it - simple as that. Game over!

 

[Bluebear]

Hampson has been playing AFL for less time. Farren Ray was a soccer convert in his mid teens. Not sure whether thats a positive or negative. Marty Clarke is a success story. Setanta success, The other O'Hailpin, fail. Its a bit hit and miss with these type of footballers.

Ray I don't know lots about, but isn't exactly setting the world on fire, and rumours are he is out at the Dogs.
Clarke plyed a sport so similar to AFL it isn't funny - hardly comparable
Setanta is probably not a bad comparison, playing one game in his first year and 11 in his second year. I'd say after two years they are probably about the same.

So what?

Warnock wasn't physically ready to lead the ruck in 2007. Yet he did it. And did it very well. Often beating more experienced pairs. His best game was against Carlton, 16 possessions and 16 hitouts. IMO he's still not physically mature enough to lead a ruck. But he seems to think otherwise.

Warnock was first ruck for rounds 13, 16 and from 18 on last year.
I think your memory could do with some jogging.

Round 13 vs Carlton - 16 hitouts, Ackland 15/ O'hAilpin 12.......maybe a win?
Round 16 vs Crows - 8 hitouts (Gilmore 9), Hudson 33.
Round 18 vs WCE - 11 h/o, Cox 27
Round 19 vs Dons - 8 h/o, Hille 18/Laycock 12
Round 20 vs Saints - 11 h/o, Blake 15/Clarke 15
Round 21 vs Dees - 9 h/o, White 26/Jamar 18
Round 22 vs Port - 10 h/o, Lade 25/Brogan 14

Just beat each of the Blues rucks, but help me out......I can't see another "win" in any of those games whre he has even "arguably" beaten any combination.

Warnock by form, would of surpassed Cloke in 2007 as the lead ruck. Or at least be sharing the duties 50/50.

Cam is two years older so the comparison is unfair to some degree.......
http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?tid1=9&pid1=1648&tid2=4&pid2=1329

but I'd say based on these numbers you're wrong.........again.

If Hampson had showed this season he is capable of leading a ruck, i don't think Carlton would be bothering chasing Warnock. If he had shown the capability of leading a ruck, he would be on par with Warnock in terms of development...but he hasn't.

Hampson is a year behind......but which of these figure show he isn't "on a par" with a taller more experienced ruck, who has been the first ruck, rather than Hampson who has been third ruck?
At worst Warnock has been second ruck this year, yet his average h/o per game is no better than Hampsons who gets limited time due to Cloke and Kreuzer being ahead.

I think Warnock is ahead of Hampson, but not by as much as you make out.

Everywhere else on the field is sorted or developing well. You have the opportunity to complete the package by trading this season. IMO a 2nd rounder won't cut it. Or you can rely on Hampson to make the grade. If you think Hampson will definately lead a premiership ruck division in 2-4 seasons. Stick with him, if you have your doubts. You may need to trade.

You assume that the only reason we would look at Warnock is because we have doubt about Hampson.

Not true.
Why would we not develop all three.
Experience tells you that one of your key rucks once they hit their late 20's will be carrying injuries.........you have quality to fill the role.

Maybe we train up all three and in a couple of years time trade Hampson back to the GC17 crew for some of those early picks no-one else will get.

Maybe Kreuzer develops more as a forward.........Kosi/Goodes tye player......then we have plenty of room for Warnock AND Hampson to ruck.

The FACT is Warnock is being massively over hyped (as per your own assessment of his "beating more experienced combinations" in 2007), and is no way worth a first round pick, and will struggle to be first ruck next year for the whole year. Cloke will still have his work to do.