What might have been-1993

[afc9798]

Was chatting with a mate last night and he brought up an interesting piece of revisionism about days past. The whole conversation was along the lines of what would the AFC look like now if we had won the premiership in 1993. Many good judges believe that we were only a coaching move away from getting into the GF and that we would have run over a clearly tired out Carlton side.

My belief is that Port Adelaide would have struggled to get any foothold on the market at all. This would be due to the loyalty and memories that a premiership produces and then there would have been 4 more years of consolidating the market position. The team, had it won and not imploded, would have gone on to be a dominant force (we were good enough) and maybe would have even won another flag. Some things to ponder:
1. Would the second licence still have gone to Port, would someone else have got it, or would there have been a second licence at all?

2. What shape would the SANFL be in if we only had one licence or if the Norwood/Sturt option got up etc.

3. Would a club with such quick success, have attracted higher calibre players over the years as a result?

4. Who would be coaching the club today, had we won back in 1993?

I know this is all hypothetical, but thought you might find it an interesting topic to put your thoughts into, ,if not get stuffed

 

[bringbackbucky]

5. What would have happened if Port got the first licence as it deserved and was promised by the AFL? Would the crows even exist or would a real club (Norwood / Centrals etc) have gotten second bite of the cherry...

 

[Cap]

5. What would have happened if Port got the first licence as it deserved and was promised by the AFL? Would the crows even exist or would a real club (Norwood / Centrals etc) have gotten second bite of the cherry...

how does ******** off you tool sound ?

i say never ponder these questions again

 

[Gets!]

Please don't bring up 1993, it brings back many an empty memory.

 

[afc9798]

5. What would have happened if Port got the first licence as it deserved and was promised by the AFL? Would the crows even exist or would a real club (Norwood / Centrals etc) have gotten second bite of the cherry...

Good question, but your use of the word deserved, is a joke. You don't deserve anything if you try to screw the very organisation that provided you with your platform for success. Now, do you want to contribute or play the Powerkop/Captain Ebert game. If it's the latter p.ss off.

 

[afc9798]

how does ******** off you tool sound ?

i say never ponder these questions again

Pondering the past is what happens in the absence of anything more exciting before the teams for this week are finalised.

 

[PrideOf]

1. Would the second licence still have gone to Port, would someone else have got it, or would there have been a second licence at all?

Yes it would have gone to Port, they were basically promised it the minute we went in.

2. What shape would the SANFL be in if we only had one licence or if the Norwood/Sturt option got up etc.

Probably the same as now. A second tier comp with players trying their hardest to be drafted.

3. Would a club with such quick success, have attracted higher calibre players over the years as a result?

I think it would have been harder. The Vic clubs made it hard for all non-Victorian clubs to come in, we would have heard some enormous bleating about the AFL needing to step in to stop a monster being built, particularly with another monster called West Coast already dominant.

4. Who would be coaching the club today, had we won back in 1993?

Dunno, but if we'd been strong, we'd probably only be on our third coach at the moment, rather than our fifth. I can tell you who wouldn't have been coaching much longer and that would be one K Sheedy.

I know this is all hypothetical, but thought you might find it an interesting topic to put your thoughts into, ,if not get stuffed

Nah, it's all good. Good to hypothesise every now and then.

5. What would have happened if Port got the first licence as it deserved and was promised by the AFL? Would the crows even exist or would a real club (Norwood / Centrals etc) have gotten second bite of the cherry...

Not hard to see where the complex started is it?

 

[captain ebert]

My belief is that Port Adelaide would have struggled to get any foothold on the market at all. This would be due to the loyalty and memories that a premiership produces and then there would have been 4 more years of consolidating the market position.

you wouldnt have won over any port supporters, regardless.

since you didnt win in 93, are you feeling as though some of those that were barracking for you then have since jumped ships, kinda allowing port to consolidate a market position? surely not....

1. Would the second licence still have gone to Port, would someone else have got it, or would there have been a second licence at all?

yes, of course it would still have gone to port.

did port only get the second licence because you didnt win the flag in 93?

 

[bringbackbucky]

how does ******** off you tool sound ?

i say never ponder these questions again

im surprised by your aggresiveness given Norwood seem to be the club that lost out most in this whole debacle. At least Port finally took their rightful place in the Premier competition as the Premier team - meanwhile Norwood is left languishing as an SANFL footballing and financial basket case.

Now lets talk more about 1993. I have always wondered exactly what Sheedy must have said at that half time break. Conversely, Graham has admitted many times that he did way too much back slapping in the crows rooms during that break...

 

[Toots Hibbert]

Good question, but your use of the word deserved, is a joke. You don't deserve anything if you try to screw the very organisation that provided you with your platform for success. Now, do you want to contribute or play the Powerkop/Captain Ebert game. If it's the latter p.ss off.

When it was Port Adelaide which was approached by the AFL to join up, when Port Adelaide were the ones who negotiated a deal, and when those who were hell bent on staying out of the AFL then used some tricky legal manouvres to stop Port from entering then I'd say that the use of the word "deserved" is well justified.

Don't talk about Port trying to screw the SANFL. The once mighty comp is now a shadow of it's former self and the process was started with the creation of the AFC. Latterly it's the AFC which screwed Glenelg by taking it's coach.

You are talking about what ifs. Why can't other scenarios be explored? IMO it would be great if Norwood could field a team in the AFL either by becoming a third SA team or by taking over the Crows licence.

 

[captain ebert]

Now lets talk more about 1993. I have always wondered exactly what Sheedy must have said at that half time break. Conversely, Graham has admitted many times that he did way too much back slapping in the crows rooms during that break...

AFC wrote the book on choking.

 

[afc9798]

im surprised by your aggresiveness given Norwood seem to be the club that lost out most in this whole debacle. At least Port finally took their rightful place in the Premier competition as the Premier team - meanwhile Norwood is left languishing as an SANFL footballing and financial basket case.

Now lets talk more about 1993. I have always wondered exactly what Sheedy must have said at that half time break. Conversely, Graham has admitted many times that he did way too much back slapping in the crows rooms during that break...

Don't get too carried away by calling others "financial basketcases" etc. as Port may be asset rich, but you are cash poor. The only good of assets can come when you sell them, or use them as collateral to borrow against. Incidentally, I believe there is some fairly complicated ownership/clause issues regarding Alberton, that make it not as attractive as you would think in asset terms.

As for 93,: I had G.Cornes host an awards night for my business a few years back and I asked him that very question. His response was that the mistake they made was not setting their goal higher. In other words, simply by making the finals, they had already achieved the goal. They had never spoken about winning the grand final as a team and he believes that this is what let them down. The way we played in that last half, it makes sense to me.

By the way, are you sick of your new job already Bucky? It's obviously not keeping you too busy

 

[Leaping Lindner]

When it was Port Adelaide which was approached by the AFL to join up, when Port Adelaide were the one's who negotiated a deal, and when those who were hell bent on staying out of the AFL then used some tricky legal manouvres to stop Port from entering then I'd say that the use of the word "deserved" is well justified.

Don't talk about Port trying to screw the SANFL. The once mighty comp is now a shadow of it's former self and the process was started with the creation of the AFC. Latterly it's the AFC which screwed Glenelg by taking it's coach.

You are talking about what ifs. Why can't other scenarios be explored? IMO it would be great if Norwood could field a team in the AFL either by becoming a third SA team or by taking over the Crows licence.

Reckon you might find the "process" started with Bruce Webber and Port Adelaide. Still, you remember history the way you want to remember it, and the rest of it can remember it the way it actually happened!

 

[Gets!]

AFC wrote the book on choking.

You are very cool.

 

[bringbackbucky]

By the way, are you sick of your new job already Bucky? It's obviously not keeping you too busy

Not sick of it yet mate but it is in the Government remember - im not allowed to work too hard or i make everyone around me look incompetent!

 

[Fergus]

When it was Port Adelaide which was approached by the AFL to join up, when Port Adelaide were the one's who negotiated a deal, and when those who were hell bent on staying out of the AFL then used some tricky legal manouvres to stop Port from entering then I'd say that the use of the word "deserved" is well justified.

Don't talk about Port trying to screw the SANFL. The once mighty comp is now a shadow of it's former self and the process was started with the creation of the AFC. Latterly it's the AFC which screwed Glenelg by taking it's coach.

You are talking about what ifs. Why can't other scenarios be explored? IMO it would be great if Norwood could field a team in the AFL either by becoming a third SA team or by taking over the Crows licence.

Port were conned by the AFL into going behind the SANFL's back and breaking the agreement that was signed by all SANFL clubs. The AFL didn't really care about who went in from SA, they just wanted a team in there. All Port did by jumping the gun was basically jack up the price in terms of licence fees. Being conned by the AFL does not justify the use of the word "deserved".

 

[- PC -]

. Many good judges believe that we were only a coaching move away from getting into the GF and that we would have run over a clearly tired out Carlton side.

That move was taking Hodges off IMO, leave Hodges on and Essendon have 2 quality forwards to worry about, take him off and pressure eases and let the spare backman run upfield as a link.

My belief is that Port Adelaide would have struggled to get any foothold on th e market at all.

I dont know if that would be true, the one thing Port had in its favour was always its SANFL fan base, the largest in SA and one which would have provided 40,000 at each game and oh yeh , whatever happened to their fans?

The team, had it won and not imploded, would have gone on to be a dominant force (we were good enough) and maybe would have even won another flag. Some things to ponder:

I actually think the egos at play would have imploded anyway, but in a different direction.

1. Would the second licence still have gone to Port, would someone else have got it, or would there have been a second licence at all?

Yes and yes, as posted Port were promised it , this was done to keep it under SANFL control and not as a stand alone club. This also had the effect of keeping Port Magpies in the SANFL

2. What shape would the SANFL be in if we only had one licence or if the Norwood/Sturt option got up etc.

If we still had one side , I think the SANFL would be in a stronger position, as people would go every second week to a SANFL match.

3. Would a club with such quick success, have attracted higher calibre players over the years as a result?

Being positioned in Adelaide and not WA, we would have attracted more,and maybe Kernahan may have been persuaded to move home.

4. Who would be coaching the club today, had we won back in 1993?

Cornes would have coached till 1997, with McDermott taking over in 98. McShawmott would have had his 2 years in the sun and then asked to move on.Then who knows? Sheedy?

I know this is all hypothetical, but thought you might find it an interesting topic to put your thoughts into, ,if not get stuffed

Its fun. Thanks

 

[Toots Hibbert]

Reckon you might find the "process" started with Bruce Webber and Port Adelaide. Still, you remember history the way you want to remember it, and the rest of it can remember it the way it actually happened!

Do you always ignore the first paragraph?

 

[afc9798]

When it was Port Adelaide which was approached by the AFL to join up, when Port Adelaide were the one's who negotiated a deal, and when those who were hell bent on staying out of the AFL then used some tricky legal manouvres to stop Port from entering then I'd say that the use of the word "deserved" is well justified.

Don't talk about Port trying to screw the SANFL. The once mighty comp is now a shadow of it's former self and the process was started with the creation of the AFC. Latterly it's the AFC which screwed Glenelg by taking it's coach.

You are talking about what ifs. Why can't other scenarios be explored? IMO it would be great if Norwood could field a team in the AFL either by becoming a third SA team or by taking over the Crows licence.

Start your own thread then and take Eggbert with you. Your misuse of the true history surprises me Toots, as I didn't think you were one to blatantly manipulate the truth as you have.

Port entered into discussions after voting against entering a team in the AFL. They lied, deceived and manipulated the SANFL, but weren't smart enough to get away from it (read outmanouvered). It's not surprising when you look at the clown that was supposedly handling the negotiations. You were outsmarted by the VFL and the SANFL. Simple.

I didn't put this thread up to go over the same old ground.

As for the Norwood argument, I don't think the SANFL would be any healthier with Port and Norwood in the comp. as they would still be drawing players away and they would be the main game. It's an interesting thought though, as who would have got the loyalty of the two from the other club's supporters. I would have gone to Norwood, but not all would do that.

 

[captain ebert]

I would have gone to Norwood,

bandwagoner.

 

[Crowked]

1. Would the second licence still have gone to Port, would someone else have got it, or would there have been a second licence at all?

Yep, The VFL used Port to force the SANFL to commit to competing in their comp and so were always going to be backed by the VFL and rewarded with the second license when the time came. Also, having created the Crows, the only real option for the SANFL was Port, no other club would/could have the rivalry we have today.

2. What shape would the SANFL be in if we only had one licence or if the Norwood/Sturt option got up etc.?

I dont think it would matter. The SANFL was always going to deteriorate into its current form, whether it was one or two teams, no matter who the teams were.

3. Would a club with such quick success, have attracted higher calibre players over the years as a result?

Maybe one or two. I dont think it would have made much difference though. Most players who have declined to come to Adelaide have said its the city/lifestyle, lack of action, ect., not just success or lack of it.

4. Who would be coaching the club today, had we won back in 1993?

We'll never know. Once you change one event in history it changes every event that came after it. Maybe we could have won another, maybe we wouldnt have won 97 or 98. There are unlimited theorectical possibilities.

 

[afc9798]

bandwagoner.

At least I still support my SANFL club every week unless the games clash. I buy a membership for both teams and contribute sponsorship money to various club events. What do you do for the good of football?......I thought so.

 

[Crowked]

AFC wrote the book on choking.

More proof Port dummies cant read hey?

 

[Toots Hibbert]

Start your own thread then and take Eggbert with you. Your misuse of the true history surprises me Toots, as I didn't think you were one to blatantly manipulate the truth as you have.

Port entered into discussions after voting against entering a team in the AFL. They lied, deceived and manipulated the SANFL, but weren't smart enough to get away from it (read outmanouvered). It's not surprising when you look at the clown that was supposedly handling the negotiations. You were outsmarted by the VFL and the SANFL. Simple.

I didn't put this thread up to go over the same old ground.

As for the Norwood argument, I don't think the SANFL would be any healthier with Port and Norwood in the comp. as they would still be drawing players away and they would be the main game. It's an interesting thought though, as who would have got the loyalty of the two from the other club's supporters. I would have gone to Norwood, but not all would do that.

I'm not suggesting it would be any healthier, I'm just suggesting that it would be great that the heritage of another of SA football's heavyweights were in the AFL and for the rivalry with Port to be continued.

I don't want to go over old ground either, there are legitimate arguments either way, that's life! I was simply pointing out that to hold the view that Port deserved a spot is a legitimate viewpoint and not trolling. It is a relevant consideration in your discussion as indicated by the fact that you were the first to mention Port.

 

[dA Crow]

AFC wrote the book on choking.

Why the hell are you still allowed to post on this board? you are an idiot, GO AWAY!