Moved Thread Why does Richmond get destroyed by the umpires every week ?

[Danw0w]

Do you realise how infantile.you sound quoting 12 year old membership slogans like it is the height of comedy?

It is pretty funny. Tell your club to stop embarrassing itself.

 

[dean33]

They also hold off the ball a lot all across the ground to stop forwards leading.

I noticed this in the Freo v Richmond game where I was watching live as you can’t see this on TV.

I think Richmond are very disciplined and they have trained these two things as a tactic rather than umpires having a vendetta against them. It means you lose the free kick count but they must have data that it is worth it.

I do not classify this in the same basket as training to drawing free kicks. That just seems dirty.

Its not the free kicks we give away its the free kicks we don't get. The amount of times the umpire will pay high or HTB to the opposition on not the identical thing to Richmond is staggering. And it doesn't matter if we are away like last week in Perth, or home with majority of support like last night. Its not a conspiracy but it is truly frustrating for us supporters. I even had saints fans last night telling me we were getting reamed.

 

[Danw0w]

I don't care so much about giving away free kicks. It's the ones we dont get that piss me off.

Thread title should be: Why do clubs infringe less against Richmond?

 

[Bianconeri]

You know a team is hard done by when even we get a good run with the umpires against them, that doesn't happen very often.

Does any supporter actually believe the get a fair run by the umpires?

I reckon fans of all teams will say no.

 

[Romeoh1]

I particularly liked the bent-over Saint ramming his head into the upright and stationary Richmond player last night and winning the free kick.

Yep that one’s annoying but it happens pretty well every game, probably more than once.

 

[Romeoh1]

Does any supporter actually believe the get a fair run by the umpires?

I reckon fans of all teams will say no.

Exactly.

 

[Purple Suit]

Its not the free kicks we give away its the free kicks we don't get. The amount of times the umpire will pay high or HTB to the opposition on not the identical thing to Richmond is staggering. And it doesn't matter if we are away like last week in Perth, or home with majority of support like last night. Its not a conspiracy but it is truly frustrating for us supporters. I even had saints fans last night telling me we were getting reamed.

I wonder if it’s due to the stretching of the rules all the time that the umpires are less likely to give you one and not even aware they are doing it.

A bit like the mouthy small forward gets bugger all or how Sandilands never got frees as he was a giant so it was like umpires thought it was already unfair like a Dads vs kids game.

 

[banzai]

We do play undisciplined, so I understand a higher frees against tally. But when you watch other games like today and see how easy is to get a free kick for minimal contact, how do we only get 1 freekick in so many quarters? I mean Saints and Freo don't give away one free kick a quarter in other games, do they just choose to play ultra disciplined against us?

 

[Roby]

Wrong board.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Prolonged success will breed entitlement

You’d know all about that at Freo!

 

[nut]

It’s not the free kicks we give away….. it’s the free kicks we don’t get !!!!! It’s bullshit

I have no doubt the umpires are instructed to favour the team we play… numbers don’t lie.

 

[9Nine]

I agree with a comment I read on the Richmond board last night, we looked like we were scared to tackle there for awhile (we were saying the exact same thing at home), so I would say it's some of the ones we give away also. But the one we get killed by the most in my opinion is the holding the ball, Balta tucks the ball under his arm it gets knocked out in a tackle and it's holding the ball, as it should be, same thing happens us and umpire uses his discretion to call play on.

 

[Danw0w]

Does any supporter actually believe the get a fair run by the umpires?

I reckon fans of all teams will say no.

I wonder if fans of all teams have the stats to back it up

 

[Bianconeri]

I wonder if fans of all teams have the stats to back it up

The free kick count hardly proves anything

 

[Danw0w]

The free kick count hardly proves anything

How so?

 

[Bianconeri]

How so?

It’s contextless, for all I know the other team is just more disciplined and doesn’t infringe as much.

If you had a stat on missed free kicks that would paint a better picture.

 

[Danw0w]

It’s contextless, for all I know the other team is just more disciplined and doesn’t infringe as much.

If you had a stat on missed free kicks that would paint a better picture.

Every single team in the competition infringes less against us than they do on average. But I guess they just play more disciplined than normal?

 

[Bianconeri]

Every single team in the competition infringes less against us than they do on average. But I guess they just play more disciplined than normal?

Your teams behaviour must be the common denominator then

 

[Area51]

I think you as a team are very disciplined and play on the edge.

My observation is that your game plan (which has evolved over time but still has lots of common elements) involves:

• aggressive tackling
• aggressive field position play - moving the ball forward, scrambling and knocking it forward, etc.
• encouraging risks such as running with the football from stoppages, fend offs, long kicks forward to a contest, as long as these help gain field.position
• slightly smaller but more mobile KP and intercept players
• big bollocking rucks (rather than precision tappers)

All of the above contribute to giving away free kicks

Why don't you get paid them? The opposite. The perfect Richmond goal seems to be high pressure in the forward 50, followed by an intercept mark and turnover, quick recovery and then a small forward running in from 10m out. Or alternatively, a long kick to Riewoldt who spoils in a 1 on 2, then the cavalry arrives, swarms forward and Martin snaps a goal from 30 out. These patterns generate very few free kicks.

Very rarely do you just bomb.it to a 1-1 contest (and thus get marking contest frees). Rarely do your mids sling it around by hand to get the perfect kick set up (and thus get frees from.opposition tackles). Rarely does your ruckman get bowled over by a bigger body, wtc.

On top of that, tackles are rarely rewarded generally. Combine 'no prior' with 'knocked out in the tackle', add a dose of 'ok he swung around 3x and dropped it but he at least tried to handball' and the number of HTB actually paid is low for the whole league.

As a complete contrast, Carlton typically play slow mids, sling the ball around by hand at stoppages, including going backwards, kick long to big/dominant key forwards 96 times per game in 1-1 situations, deprioritide field position in favour of 'safex kicks and play smaller/mobile rucks. And typically win the free kick count while losing the game

So Richmond lose the free kick count every week... but won 3 premierships and even as you reload/rebuild managed to make finals last year and look set to give it a crack in 2023 too. I would just be satisfied with that...

Thanks for being one of the very few oppo posters who has demonstrated the ability to understand the question being asked and having a genuine attempt at answering it.

 

[MAXIMUM GRUNDAGE]

Because of Steve Hocking

 

[ElectricG]

It’s contextless, for all I know the other team is just more disciplined and doesn’t infringe as much.

If you had a stat on missed free kicks that would paint a better picture.

One thing that always p155ed me off about the ump’s treatment of Port (not so much this year) is how they would give us an absolute rogering in Q1 and firmly establish that our players are allowed to compete physically. Then throughout the remainder of the game we would gradually claw back the number of frees once the game is iced, allowing the oppo fans to say “free kicks were equal”

 

[tigland]

It’s contextless, for all I know the other team is just more disciplined and doesn’t infringe as much.

If you had a stat on missed free kicks that would paint a better picture.

Roksman posted this on the Richmond thread. He doesn't look at missed free kicks, but has completed a statistical analysis of how much more "disciplined" other teams are against Richmond compared to other matches they play. It's exactly the gripe we have.

 

[beema limapep]

Right hey? So why are nearly all teams so magically disciplined against Richmond and suddenly give away only half the free picks they usually do compared to other teams?

 

[Danw0w]

Your teams behaviour must be the common denominator then

Our team's behaviour makes the opposition infringe less?

 

[Bianconeri]

Our team's behaviour makes the opposition infringe less?

It’s what your stats seem to support