Religion Why I Am A Catholic

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MightyFighting said:
I'm saying it didn't exist until the Great Schism of 1054.
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It was one true and apostolic up until then mate! Catholic means universal - up to the Schism it really was universal in Christendom anyway.
 

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evo said:
Stanhope is killer in my opinion. One of the best.

I don't know how contra can say atheists are humorless (maybe it was a mistype?)They certainly make some of the best comedians, in my experience.
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It was another shoot the messenger unthinking post from me. Athiests are funnier as a rule than believers - other than Dick who takes himself way to seriously
 
MightyFighting said:
Pfft, "universal law". Catholicism is the realm of the bishop of Rome. It therefore begain when he first declared himself supreme ruler.
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But that's what Catholic (to me anyway) means, the law which applies to all, the dominion of God and the right of His Law over his possessions. Such a notion was established by Jesus, Jesus laid down this concept, and he simply gave the keys to Peter (and then Paul got involved). It's doubtful whether Jesus really cared for a central papacy, as the saying goes, the people are the church. All Catholicism is is that God's law reigns over everyone as everyone is part of God. Catholic=universal.

It's why Catholics struggle with pluralism and tolerance (in my experience fwiw). They struggle to understand why someone would reject God's Law, and so try to assist the heathens/infidels in the mindset that they are simply misguided and will be corrected, when someone rejects the law, since the Law is absolute and universal, there's no acceptance. Afterall, if a law is absolute and universal, it cannot be questioned on any ground, by anyone. This is why Catholics unlike some other groups don't leave out anyone for religious devotion. Whether this body is the Vatican? I'm not convinced, there's no evidence to suggest that Jesus would recognize the Vatican or any official body as the provider of the Law, in his eyes it seems anyone who sees the truth in all it's "glory" (cough, splutter) is worthy of leading the Catholic creed.

That's just my 2c. But the notion of Catholic by the notion of the bible is more accurate, Jesus said he was a man for all people, it seems like it's just him saying God isn't just for the Jews, not saying ruling isn't just for Rome.
 
I'll give you an example, saying Catholicism is the rulership of Rome is like saying democracy is the operations and debates between parliament, yes officially democracy is played out there, but it can and does expand into a wider social context. The problem with Catholics is they fail to understand that some people just aren't interested.
 

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You're confusing some airy and ildefined notion of a "universal" law (which is a fiction) with the actual Roman Catholic church (which is a real thing). I'm only discussing the timeframe of real things.

The church cannot claim to have existed before its beginning. No amount of words and invented heritage will overcome that simple fact.
 
MightyFighting said:
You're confusing some airy and ildefined notion of a "universal" law (which is a fiction) with the actual Roman Catholic church (which is a real thing). I'm only discussing the timeframe of real things.

The church cannot claim to have existed before its beginning. No amount of words and invented heritage will overcome that simple fact.
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It doesn't matter if it's fiction, the catholics live as it is true and have done so prior to 1054. You don't need a clergy and hierarchy to have a church, all a church is is a building which people meet for religious services, it can take any form and carry anyone. I'd suggest Jesus' informal teachings were closer to his idea of the church than some Vatican building. Again, it's like saying democracy started only when parliaments formed, bulltwat.
 
Richo83 said:
It doesn't matter if it's fiction, the catholics live as it is true and have done so prior to 1054. You don't need a clergy and hierarchy to have a church, all a church is is a building which people meet for religious services, it can take any form and carry anyone. I'd suggest Jesus' informal teachings were closer to his idea of the church than some Vatican building. Again, it's like saying democracy started only when parliaments formed, bulltwat.
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This is ridiculous, Jesus appointed Peter as the first Pope and established the Church when he said 'you are the rock upon which I build my Church' and Peter appointed his successor and so on, the Church and 'catholic' is one and the same. You are confusing the concept of the Church being universal, you seem to think that if someone disagrees with the Church then that disagreement would somehow be included in the realm of the word 'universe', that's not what Jesus said, he said repent, he did not say sin against me and I will forgive you anyway. He said repent, because somethings are wrong, and cannot be right. This is why the Church has the right to try and gain salvation for all of mankind.
 
Linga, if you're going to talk out of your arse, why do you expect me to engage in an argument with me?

I never said Jesus said run free think whatever you think, I said that Catholic means universal and you don't have to be a member of the clergy to be part of the church, the church is the people and the Law is upheld by them. Jesus wasn't a member of any hierarchy and neither was his followers (or Peter). I was just merely reacting to MF's restrictive view that Catholicism the notion and the creed only existed post-1054 with the establishment of Rome, which is historically and theologically incorrect.
 
linga_is_no1 said:
This is ridiculous, Jesus appointed Peter as the first Pope and established the Church when he said 'you are the rock upon which I build my Church' and Peter appointed his successor and so on, the Church and 'catholic' is one and the same. You are confusing the concept of the Church being universal, you seem to think that if someone disagrees with the Church then that disagreement would somehow be included in the realm of the word 'universe', that's not what Jesus said, he said repent, he did not say sin against me and I will forgive you anyway. He said repent, because somethings are wrong, and cannot be right. This is why the Church has the right to try and gain salvation for all of mankind.
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So, in fact, Peter wasn't appointed pope, but was accused of being a rock. This is a gross overestimation of Peter's sentience. Once again, the ignorant Jewish peasant got it wrong. Are you a 'rock' too, KevinPussy, or is that attributing too much awareness to you as well?

BTW, did Jesus continue to deny Joseph's paternity post-mortem? One would have thought, seeing he was given a second chance, he would have taken some trouble to make peace with his long-denied father.

Also, the reason you are a catholic, and evidence from your own keyboard indicates you are just that, and that alone, is that you are singularly lacking in any sense of being on this planet. Your existence is wasted on you.
 
skilts said:
So, in fact, Peter wasn't appointed pope, but was accused of being a rock. This is a gross overestimation of Peter's sentience. Once again, the ignorant Jewish peasant got it wrong. Are you a 'rock' too, KevinPussy, or is that attributing too much awareness to you as well?

BTW, did Jesus continue to deny Joseph's paternity post-mortem? One would have thought, seeing he was given a second chance, he would have taken some trouble to make peace with his long-denied father.

Also, the reason you are a catholic, and evidence from your own keyboard indicates you are just that, and that alone, is that you are singularly lacking in any sense of being on this planet. Your existence is wasted on you.
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Ha! :D:thumbsu:
 
Chief said:
Yowzah! Ease up old fella.
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Quite so. I got a bit carried away there. He's not a rock, he's not a catholic, he doesn't have too much awareness and his existence is not wasted on him, it's wasted on us.
 
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