Why is SA footy so much better than WA now?

[Bjo187]

Off the back of winning the national championships, several standout seasons upcoming at under-18 level, and the significant infrastructure investment driven by Gather Round, South Australia has, in my view, become the strongest football state in the country right now, particularly on a per-capita basis.

What’s especially striking is how consistently strong the SANFL and South Australian talent pathways remain, despite the state’s relatively small population. By contrast, Western Australia, with a much larger population and two extremely wealthy AFL clubs, has seen its WAFL and underage development systems fall away dramatically in recent years.

Why is this? I've always thought both states are about as strong as one another? Does WA need to invest in a comparable, centralised high-performance facility to lift what has become a fairly ordinary development pipeline? and more importantly, what's the answer to get what should be the games second biggest footy state (fallen behind Qld for participation now) back to being an AFL powerhouse?

SANFL opens Australian-First $25M High Performance Centre - SANFL

sanfl.com.au

 

[Giant YoYo]

Glad you created a thread about this as footy in WA appears anaemic at best.

It's not in a good state at all

 

[PowerfulPies2023]

Eagles flag was 7 years ago. Crows last was 27 years ago. PORTS was 21 years ago.

Dockers played finals in 22 and 25. Eagles from 2015 to 2020. SA needs to do more.

 

[Bjo187]

Eagles flag was 7 years ago. Crows last was 27 years ago. PORTS was 21 years ago.

Dockers played finals in 22 and 25. Eagles from 2015 to 2020. SA needs to do more.

You do realise there is a whole football ecosystem under the AFL clubs in each state right? WA have produced barely any first round talent the past few years, which is really poor and affects the strength of the talent pool nationally.

 

[PowerfulPies2023]

You do realise there is a whole football ecosystem under the AFL clubs in each state right? WA have produced barely any first round talent the past few years, which is really poor and affects the strength of the talent pool nationally.

No. Just no. Adelaide played its first finals in 8 years this season and went out in straight sets. Port have been good but choke. Prelims in 20, 21, 24 and semis in 2023. I don't care about first rounders it's what the clubs success on the field that speaks. And as I pointed out, SA haven't did a whole lot more in recent times tbh. Port didn't play finals again. If it's like this for another 5 years then yeah OK. But ATM neither SA side has really produced.

Still to be determined.

 

[Giant YoYo]

No. Just no. Adelaide played its first finals in 8 years this season and went out in straight sets. Port have been good but choke. Prelims in 20, 21, 24 and semis in 2023. I don't care about first rounders it's what the clubs success on the field that speaks. And as I pointed out, SA haven't did a whole lot more in recent times tbh. Port didn't play finals again. If it's like this for another 5 years then yeah OK. But ATM neither SA side has really produced.

Still to be determined.

Are you okay? Your response has nothing to do with anything.

 

[glengowan]

SA's decision to purchase Footy Park back in the 1970's has held it in good stead financially. It allowed the state to hold out on AFL entry longer than WA through the 80's (player retention scheme) and after selling Football Park & the two AFL licences in 2014, has given it the money to eliminate debt and invest in it's development program in the current day. It still benefits from the strength of the two SA AFL clubs via a return from the SMA of Adelaide Oval.

So while WA is the larger state and has been growing exponentially in population and prosperity compared to SA, the SANFL has always had the financial resources compared to the WAFL. The passion of the SA footy public is also something else. I definitely think Gather Round has injected back some passion/self belief back in to football in SA, with both Port and Crows only briefly giving half the state, at any one time, anything to get excited about over the last 20 years.

Both the SANFL and the WAFL clubs have managed to survive over this time. Whether they continue to do so remains to be seen. When once upon a time every Crows/Power/Eagles/Dockers supporter had a state league club connection, that is less so now with the AFL Reserves teams and time passing by. These competitions are seen more so for development than representing a broader based community striving for a premiership. If these clubs/competitions break down, what does that do to football in a broader sense?

There's also been a decline in country footy, thanks to demographics, technology and more recreational options. The AFL can't take its eye off the heart and soul areas of footy - which is the country areas of VIC, SA and WA.

In terms of which state is better? What better place than on the field to decide that, with home grown talent? I believe SA has won the last 4 State of Origin clashes, the last one being 1998. WA last beat SA in 1991. Hopefully we get another chance to see these two great football states clash again.

 

[Cmarsh]

SANFL opens $25m High Performance Centre at West Lakes

South Australian football has received a major boost with the official opening of the new SANFL High Performance Centre at the revitalised Footy Park Precinct in West Lakes.

www.austadiums.com

 

[bzparkes]

You do realise there is a whole football ecosystem under the AFL clubs in each state right? WA have produced barely any first round talent the past few years, which is really poor and affects the strength of the talent pool nationally.

Why would WCE or Freo spend money developing kids they don't get access to? They'll just use it on their own academy prospects instead.

AFL won't take any action because they want the WAFC to give up the licences for both clubs, which they won't do as they're their cash cows.

The AFL, as a supposed 'not for profit' organisation should be injecting really money into development in WA like they do Vic and the Northern states.

Until then, WA pathways will just keep plodding along, with the occasional higher end prospect coming out of the academies, although there are a couple of non-tied rucks(Walsh/Van Rooyen) that project as top talent in upcoming drafts.

Maybe if we beg the AFL, we can get them added to our academies like Port did with Cochrane?

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Eagles flag was 7 years ago. Crows last was 27 years ago. PORTS was 21 years ago.

Dockers played finals in 22 and 25. Eagles from 2015 to 2020. SA needs to do more.

Clearly SA clubs need academy rules like the Northern states.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Why would WCE or Freo spend money developing kids they don't get access to? They'll just use it on their own academy prospects instead.

AFL won't take any action because they want the WAFC to give up the licences for both clubs, which they won't do as they're their cash cows.

The AFL, as a supposed 'not for profit' organisation should be injecting really money into development in WA like they do Vic and the Northern states.

Until then, WA pathways will just keep plodding along, with the occasional higher end prospect coming out of the academies, although there are a couple of non-tied rucks(Walsh/Van Rooyen) that project as top talent in upcoming drafts.

Maybe if we beg the AFL, we can get them added to our academies like Port did with Cochrane?

If WA & SA clubs had 1st access to 2 players each draft, then there would be more of an incentive...

 

[Philhawk]

Why would WCE or Freo spend money developing kids they don't get access to? They'll just use it on their own academy prospects instead.

AFL won't take any action because they want the WAFC to give up the licences for both clubs, which they won't do as they're their cash cows.

The AFL, as a supposed 'not for profit' organisation should be injecting really money into development in WA like they do Vic and the Northern states.

Until then, WA pathways will just keep plodding along, with the occasional higher end prospect coming out of the academies, although there are a couple of non-tied rucks(Walsh/Van Rooyen) that project as top talent in upcoming drafts.

Maybe if we beg the AFL, we can get them added to our academies like Port did with Cochrane?

Well said.

The current situation is farcical. Why would WA invest in local juniors they have no access to, while Qld and NSW kids are gifted to their local clubs?

 

[Philhawk]

If WA & SA clubs had 1st access to 2 players each draft, then there would be more of an incentive...

I agree in principle, but I disagree in terms of how compromised and idiotic the draft keeps becoming.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

I agree in principle, but I disagree in terms of how compromised and idiotic the draft keeps becoming.

Perhaps every team can have 1st access to maximum of 2 players in their zone each draft so there is an incentive to develop local talent... with the new tightened bidding rules. Helps clubs have a higher proportion of local talent in their squad.

 

[Bjo187]

Why would WCE or Freo spend money developing kids they don't get access to? They'll just use it on their own academy prospects instead.

AFL won't take any action because they want the WAFC to give up the licences for both clubs, which they won't do as they're their cash cows.

The AFL, as a supposed 'not for profit' organisation should be injecting really money into development in WA like they do Vic and the Northern states.

Until then, WA pathways will just keep plodding along, with the occasional higher end prospect coming out of the academies, although there are a couple of non-tied rucks(Walsh/Van Rooyen) that project as top talent in upcoming drafts.

Maybe if we beg the AFL, we can get them added to our academies like Port did with Cochrane?

The AFL do give the WAFC money, but it's only 3 mill a year or so. They would do a lot better job than the WAFC are doing if they had control, or more so, they couldn't do much worse.

I think having a footy fan as premier helps too, look at Malinaskus compared to Cook who has given 100 mill to the NRL ("not one dollar will go to the NRL", was his pre election claim), whilst trying to lowball the WAFC on funding. Having a state academy centre like the SANFL have just gotten would make a massive difference in WA and should be something they should try to get funding for.

As to the other claims that SA and WA need incentive to produce talent, they have the nga's the same as the Victorian clubs, the difference is though SA are producing heaps of under age (non NGA) talent, WA are producing barely anything of a high level talent in the past 5 years.

 

[bzparkes]

The AFL do give the WAFC money, but it's only 3 mill a year or so. They would do a lot better job than the WAFC are doing if they had control, or more so, they couldn't do much worse.

I think having a footy fan as premier helps too, look at Malinaskus compared to Cook who has given 100 mill to the NRL ("not one dollar will go to the NRL", was his pre election claim), whilst trying to lowball the WAFC on funding. Having a state academy centre like the SANFL have just gotten would make a massive difference in WA and should be something they should try to get funding for.

As to the other claims that SA and WA need incentive to produce talent, they have the nga's the same as the Victorian clubs, the difference is though SA are producing heaps of under age (non NGA) talent, WA are producing barely anything of a high level talent in the past 5 years.

Yep because the northern clubs get about $40 million annually(collectively) to develop young talent and, like you said, the WAFC gets SFA and they also have 2 competitions to run(WAFL and Colts).

The AFL also significantly contributes to the CTL, whereas West Coast and Freo are expected to pretty much foot the bill for junior pathways in WA.

They're better off just spending on their own academies and attracting players taken later in the draft back to WA, if they're any good.

I personally think the AFL should manage junior pathways in all states and the academies scrapped completely. I doubt talented kids would give up an opportunity to move interstate from QLD/NSW just because they had a lesser chance at ending up at one of those clubs.

 

[JackFlash]

WA needs some changes and pronto, they are flagging badly. This state of origin match in February could be disastrous as i cannot see them getting within 100 points of Victoria and that's bad for the game. Western Australian football is in a dreadful state of affairs.

 

[Bjo187]

Yep because the northern clubs get about $40 million annually(collectively) to develop young talent and, like you said, the WAFC gets SFA and they also have 2 competitions to run(WAFL and Colts).

The AFL also significantly contributes to the CTL, whereas West Coast and Freo are expected to pretty much foot the bill for junior pathways in WA.

They're better off just spending on their own academies and attracting players taken later in the draft back to WA, if they're any good.

I personally think the AFL should manage junior pathways in all states and the academies scrapped completely. I doubt talented kids would give up an opportunity to move interstate from QLD/NSW just because they had a lesser chance at ending up at one of those clubs.

Yeah I don't think that you cut off something that's working really well though to accommodate for other things that aren't working well. Qld in particular is killing it in talent development, which is good for the game overall.

It's more about finding ways to cultivate talent production in WA to a higher standard. SA seem to be able to do it with a smaller population and I assume similar funding from AFL hq? The WAFC could do worse than to talk to the SANFL on how they have successfully managed their operations.

 

[Underdog]

WA needs some changes and pronto, they are flagging badly. This state of origin match in February could be disastrous as i cannot see them getting within 100 points of Victoria and that's bad for the game. Western Australian football is in a dreadful state of affairs.

From what I'm hearing, the resources to support junior community football in 2026 are being gutted. It's going to get worse I think...

 

[bzparkes]

Yeah I don't think that you cut off something that's working really well though to accommodate for other things that aren't working well. Qld in particular is killing it in talent development, which is good for the game overall.

It's more about finding ways to cultivate talent production in WA to a higher standard. SA seem to be able to do it with a smaller population and I assume similar funding from AFL hq? The WAFC could do worse than to talk to the SANFL on how they have successfully managed their operations.

A point of difference here is that the SANFL don't own the licences for the Crows and the Power. Both clubs run as independent entities.

Unfortunately for WCE and Freo(depending on how you look at it), the WAFC owns the licence to both clubs, which has supposedly been a bone of contention between the WAFC and AFL for a long time.

 

[Bjo187]

A point of difference here is that the SANFL don't own the licences for the Crows and the Power. Both clubs run as independent entities.

Unfortunately for WCE and Freo(depending on how you look at it), the WAFC owns the licence to both clubs, which has supposedly been a bone of contention between the WAFC and AFL for a long time.

Shouldn't that be an advantage though, because those clubs are forced to tip in money to the WAFC annually? Unless you're saying the AFL give less to WA footy because they haven't handed over the licences, which could be true I dunno.

 

[bzparkes]

Shouldn't that be an advantage though, because those clubs are forced to tip in money to the WAFC annually? Unless you're saying the AFL give less to WA footy because they haven't handed over the licences, which could be true I dunno.

WA teams are at the bottom of the AFL distribution ladder. On top of that they're expected to fund the junior development pathways despite having no access to players from those same pathways.

Why even bother?

 

[Underdog]

AFL 2025: WA football, staff members made redundant, financial imbalances, West Coast, Fremantle

Something is very wrong here.

sportnation.nz

"WA Football last week made nine employees redundant across a range of areas of its operations.

These redundancies were not based on merit or a lack of it – they were not based on performance or a lack of it. They were not based on a need to overhaul or re-structure the organization because it could run more efficiently.

They were based on a need because of a lack of funding – and that lack of funding raises serious questions about the Royalty model WA footy has in place with its AFL clubs West Coast and Fremantle."

"WA Footy owns the licences of the two clubs and under current arrangements cannot extract enough from them to properly fund its community, grass roots and talent development operations. This is something that needs to be talked about and quickly. We need to start with a new royalty arrangement that delivers bang for buck. And we need to ask the AFL why – if the Queensland system has gone past WA – they continue to throw money hand over fist at it."

 

[Bjo187]

WA teams are at the bottom of the AFL distribution ladder. On top of that they're expected to fund the junior development pathways despite having no access to players from those same pathways.

Why even bother?

I don't think any traditional footy states should just have access to all the talent from their state though. It would be unfair, because per capita 10 Victorian teams compared to 2 WA teams, the Vic teams would have access to a lot slimmer of a talent pool.

I do like the idea of each southern state having a state academy though like the SANFL are doing with their $25 million facility. To run that should be funded through the state body and AFL though, then the clubs can fund their next gen academies for multicultural and indigenous talent. So each southern state is effectively double dipping with resources going to the overall under 18 pool then club resources going to their own nga's which they resource for their own benefit.

I would assume after a while when they're strong enough to stand on their own two feet, that Qld and NSW should also be absorbed into this type of model too.

 

[bzparkes]

I don't think any traditional footy states should just have access to all the talent from their state though. It would be unfair, because per capita 10 Victorian teams compared to 2 WA teams, the Vic teams would have access to a lot slimmer of a talent pool.

I do like the idea of each southern state having a state academy though like the SANFL are doing with their $25 million facility. To run that should be funded through the state body and AFL though, then the clubs can fund their next gen academies for multicultural and indigenous talent. So each southern state is effectively double dipping with resources going to the overall under 18 pool then club resources going to their own nga's which they resource for their own benefit.

I would assume after a while when they're strong enough to stand on their own two feet, that Qld and NSW should also be absorbed into this type of model too.

It's not about having priority access to players from their state. No club should get that IMO.

It's about who actually funds the development pathways. Pretty poor from the AFL to throw 10s of millions at Vic and northern development pathways whilst expecting West Coast and Freo to fund the development of players who are more likely to get picked up by other clubs than the 2 WA clubs. Why would those 2 clubs waste their time and money developing players who'll never play for them when no other club is expected to do that?

Might as well just keep on drafting Vic kids and target any decent WA players via trade/FA.

I can't speak for SA, as I don't know about their development pathways funding.