Test AUSTRALIA v SOUTH AFRICA First Test. Dec 17-21, Gabba, Brisbane. 11.20am AEDT.

[Adelaide Hawk]

Being coached to be able to bat in all conditions - rather than just favourable ones - doesn't just cover batting locally on the occasional testing pitch.

It gives you the tools to bat in the different conditions experienced overseas as well. Or have we all forgotten how totally at sea some of our batters have looked in English conditions in recent times?

And it also underpins one of the underlying foundations of batting, which is having a good defence - from there you can build a solid and extensive batting technique.

Justin Langer continued to point this out. So many batsmen getting out when they were anchored to the crease. No forward nor backward movement. This can only indicate one thing, poor technique.

 

[DaRick]

Need a Royal Commission into how van der Dussen ever got to a role as a specialist bat in a Test team.

I not know much about him but he looked like a walking wicket to any Test standard bowler.

"We pulled him off the street."

 

[MarcMaverick]

Justin Langer continued to point this out. So many batsmen getting out when they were anchored to the crease. No forward nor backward movement. This can only indicate one thing, poor technique.

Also a lack of patience/ too many t20 mindset. Just sloppy application to Test.

Consider, also where JL is from, WA, where historically the ball does a lot and you have to hold your nerve/graft out an innings and put a very high price on your wicket, then cash in when the bowlers are tiring.

None of that happened in the Gabba. No-one, except Travis Head, came close. Just poor all round.

 

[Gethelred]

Being coached to be able to bat in all conditions - rather than just favourable ones - doesn't just cover batting locally on the occasional testing pitch.

But that's my point: none of what I stated as the goals of modern coaching are concerned purely with batting locally. They're as useful in India as they are in England.

It gives you the tools to bat in the different conditions experienced overseas as well. Or have we all forgotten how totally at sea some of our batters have looked in English conditions in recent times?

If you're going to have a crack at Australian batter production, I'm completely onboard to an extent. There's parochialism, then there's forgetting player's names because of what state they play for or deriding their weird techniques because they don't play for NSW.

Then there's the fact that you're meant to look all at sea away from home. There's a reason why successful teams tend towards having 30 year olds as batters and below 25's as bowlers; maturity and experience helps batters, helps them know what to expect and when to expect it.

The point of touring with younger players is to expose them to that difference and see how the adapt; criticising them for being all at sea is a bit silly, really. Struggling is how you grow.

I really don't see the point of teaching players how to bat on true surfaces only to be honest. Give them the tools to bat in all conditions. That's one thing that makes them elite players, the capacity to perform in varying conditions and situations and under varying levels of pressure.

Who said anything about only batting on true surfaces?

And it also underpins one of the underlying foundations of batting, which is having a good defence - from there you can build a solid and extensive batting technique.

This is an oft repeated truism that has so often been repeated that it's actually kind of meaningless. What do you mean by it, and be as specific as you can.

Bear in mind that knowing how to play the moving ball is essential as movement through the air isn't determined by pitch conditions (which can be controlled), rather by atmosphere (which can't be controlled).

I'm going to put it this way: playing the moving ball is about your eyes and hands as much as it's about your technique. Your technique gets you playing the line as opposed to chasing it, but your eyes and hands tells you which balls to chase and which you can get to versus those you can't.

Everyone can get better at it, but not everyone can do it.

I saw players in this match who were able to survive quite adequately on this supposed minefield. Head, Bavuma (twice), Verreynne, Smith, Zondo and even Carey, Green and Starc in our first innings.

Ignores the substantial difference in batting on day 1 versus day 2, and also ignores the fact that Zondo was damn ******* lucky to survive as long as he did.

I saw few dismissals which you could put down to the state of the pitch, either directly or indirectly. I didn't see any deliveries shoot along the ground or jump from a good length to nearly take the batsman's head off. I didn't see any more than moderate seam or swing that you wouldn't get in other Tests (check out Holder's dismissal in the last Test as a comparison).

The whole reaction is over the top and hysterical. If this had been like those Melbourne goat tracks of the 80s I'd understand the reaction, but this - nah.

None of this I disagree with, necessarily. The whole thing's borne as much from Indian Twitter as anything else. But to an extent, you've kind of got to listen to the players ahead of the commentators, and they felt it was dangerous to play on even if you don't.

As for the bolded, I don't know why this is suddenly a point worth raising when it is pretty much the entire basis of this site. Strange observation.

Armchair criticism doesn't mean said criticism is incorrect. But the point at which you're more or less ignoring what the players out there are saying in favour of 'Well, in my day'-ing is where it's worthwhile pointing that out.

 

[Gethelred]

Did any of the batters, apart from Elgar who has reason to stir the pot a bit, say it was dangerous? SS said it was the most difficult test pitch in Australia, which isn’t saying much.

I think too many are underestimating just how good some of the bowling and all of the fielding was - it was something to behold.

An awful lot of Indians have, and the commentary raised it a time or two.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

An awful lot of Indians have, and the commentary raised it a time or two.

So people who weren’t playing? I’m not sure you can really take the Indian comments at face value, and were the commentators saying it was dangerous or just poor?

 

[doggies ftw]

So people who weren’t playing? I’m not sure you can really take the Indian comments at face value, and were the commentators saying it was dangerous or just poor?

Ah yes Indians, definitely the most unbiased commentators in the cricketing landscape

 

[Gethelred]

So people who weren’t playing? I’m not sure you can really take the Indian comments at face value, and were the commentators saying it was dangerous or just poor?

I think it's hit twitter, then producers, then commentary in that order.

There's also a little reading between the lines in what the players have said of the surface as well; Australian players don't throw groundskeepers under the bus, and they don't show that kind of vulnerability to an opposition.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

I think it's hit twitter, then producers, then commentary in that order.

There's also a little reading between the lines in what the players have said of the surface as well; Australian players don't throw groundskeepers under the bus, and they don't show that kind of vulnerability to an opposition.

Agree with all that, but still don’t really think it was dangerous or that any players (Elgar excepted) were complaining.

 

[sherb]

If we are going to take into account the players' views, then I assume we should be listening to Cummins as well.

"There was some sideways movement, a little bit of up and down bounce but it was fine.

"There's no balls jumping off a length or anything like that.

"No way (was it dangerous)."

Pitch battle at the centre of historic two-day Test | cricket.com.au

A heavily grassed Gabba strip offered plenty for the bowlers, but opposing captains Dean Elgar and…

www.cricket.com.au

 

[frankrizzo]

It was a below average pitch and far too bowler friendly but elgar is full of it saying it was dangerous, just on that note is he really over rated as a batsmen? all the talk is what a fighter he is how much courage he shows with bat but bloke averages 28 away from home, warner is criticized non stop for averaging 35 away but elgar has pretty much struggled everywhere outside Bangladesh and zimbabwae.

 

[Westend]

If we are going to take into account the players' views, then I assume we should be listening to Cummins as well.

"There was some sideways movement, a little bit of up and down bounce but it was fine.

"There's no balls jumping off a length or anything like that.

"No way (was it dangerous)."

Pitch battle at the centre of historic two-day Test | cricket.com.au

A heavily grassed Gabba strip offered plenty for the bowlers, but opposing captains Dean Elgar and…

www.cricket.com.au

Yeah to some extent but cummins is a bowler and really did you see cummins bat he was scared

Really take into the account from batters who batted some time on that deck like marnus and smith who both say it was too juiced up

 

[eddiesmith]

Other players alluded to it being fine. Cummins. Starc.

Maybe the saffie skipper is just a sook?

They win the game probs if they played 6 batsman

I’ll agree, Labs is a giant sook and not worthy of being the no1 batsman in the world if he can’t handle a little bit of grass on the wicket.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

3 tests have been played this summer, the Gabba test has been the most enjoyable to watch by a mile. I stopped attending tests when they started preparing batting paradises. day one of any test at the WACA and the Gabba should be a very tough test to bat on. You should be bowling first at both places.
At Adelaide you will always bat as it's always been a batting paradise, not many quicks before pink ball cricket would have Adelaide in their favourite grounds to bowl at. MCG was always up and down, in the 80-s it was a terrible pitch. Sydney often offered the quicks something for the first session, but then it was a batting paradise for 3 days. Spin took over the last two days.
TV has decided they want all the pitches to be roughly the same. To be honest I have no idea how the Gabba curator got away with presenting that wicket, TV and the ACB generally inspect the wicket at Lunchtime before the first day and instruct the curator to shave the grass off it and make it batter friendly. Obviously the Curator convinced them it won't do as much as it looks like it might do. It will be the last time he gets a say.

I do think there was to much grass left on it, I would prefer a shorter cover of green grass but a substantial amount of moisture in the track. Either way the big first innings totals with declarations will be back soon enough. No need to watch those games until the last two days.

 

[eddiesmith]

If we are going to take into account the players' views, then I assume we should be listening to Cummins as well.

"There was some sideways movement, a little bit of up and down bounce but it was fine.

"There's no balls jumping off a length or anything like that.

"No way (was it dangerous)."

Pitch battle at the centre of historic two-day Test | cricket.com.au

A heavily grassed Gabba strip offered plenty for the bowlers, but opposing captains Dean Elgar and…

www.cricket.com.au

Of course the bloke who took 5 wickets loved it, as did Starc who produced his best non pink ball bowling in 5+ years probably!!!

 

[frankrizzo]

Yeah to some extent but cummins is a bowler and really did you see cummins bat he was scared

Really take into the account from batters who batted some time on that deck like marnus and smith who both say it was too juiced up

he wasnt scared cummins batting has just fallen off a cliff last few years.

 

[frankrizzo]

Of course the bloke who took 5 wickets loved it, as did Starc who produced his best non pink ball bowling in 5+ years probably!!!

All bowlers loved it doesnt make the pitch dangerous, dangerous to a batsman averages yes but not any more dangerous physically than any other deck with pace and bounce though and what would it say about SA attack anyway if they get a pitch that "dangerous" and they let head belt 94 on it like it was a odi game?

 

[Westend]

he wasnt scared cummins batting has just fallen off a cliff last few years.

yup it seriously has

 

[Jim Prideaux]

It was a below average pitch and far too bowler friendly but elgar is full of it saying it was dangerous, just on that note is he really over rated as a batsmen? all the talk is what a fighter he is how much courage he shows with bat but bloke averages 28 away from home, warner is criticized non stop for averaging 35 away but elgar has pretty much struggled everywhere outside Bangladesh and zimbabwae.

Elgar is Warner lite - if he played for us he’d be copping the same stick now

 

[Cleavy]

cummins batting has just fallen off a cliff last few years.

sure has, aside from that 70-odd in the IPL

 

[t_94]

The alternative is a batting highway where the team that bats first declares 500 plus. There is no in between as any life fir the fast bowlers at all will knock the modern batsman over.

It is such a shame no one says balance between bat and ball is required when teams are getting 500 plus in the first innings. Only ever seems to work one way.

Don’t they?

 

[t_94]

It was a below average pitch and far too bowler friendly but elgar is full of it saying it was dangerous, just on that note is he really over rated as a batsmen? all the talk is what a fighter he is how much courage he shows with bat but bloke averages 28 away from home, warner is criticized non stop for averaging 35 away but elgar has pretty much struggled everywhere outside Bangladesh and zimbabwae.

He has carved out a good career considering he is a limited player. South Africa is a difficult place to bat too.

 

[Gethelred]

All bowlers loved it doesnt make the pitch dangerous, dangerous to a batsman averages yes but not any more dangerous physically than any other deck with pace and bounce though and what would it say about SA attack anyway if they get a pitch that "dangerous" and they let head belt 94 on it like it was a odi game?

More to the point...

If it's a dangerous wicket, why did they abandon the stumps and instead deliberately bowl bumpers on a supposedly dangerous surface?

 

[Gethelred]

Elgar is Warner lite - if he played for us he’d be copping the same stick now

He isn't that good at home. He's more like Matty Wade if Wade was an opener rather than a keeper; a struggler and a scrapper rather than a blaster.

 

[Sphynx]

Of course the bloke who took 5 wickets loved it, as did Starc who produced his best non pink ball bowling in 5+ years probably!!!

Just imagine if Starc got the pitches that Anderson and Broad have had for 75% of their test matches.

That GABBA wicket was a run of the mill English green top.