Autopsy Cats lose to Blues by 8 points.
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I would agree. But it's mostly been by necessity, really. For a club that has more than reasonable depth, we have been relatively smashed in the early stages of this season. Only Parf could be truly seen as a more bankable alternative at AFL level than the new boys we've put out there. And his game in Round 1 was easily the worst of his career.
All in all, getting some of the experienced boys back in the side (providing they're contributing) would be very handy indeed right now.
Early call? FFS they have been with us for not very long at all.
First of all - well done to Carlton - the Blues were too good - and thoroughly deserved their win
But yours is the best post in the thread so far by a mile - you just keep reading about injuries - lack of fitness - and every other excuse - and we will be 4-2 or 3-3 at a certain point and everything will be sweet - blah - blah - blah
But the bottom line is Geelong need a win - and the Suns at the Gold Coast - dont care what their form line is like - that is suddenly no push over - i think there will be quite a few nervous/apprehensive Geel players taking part in that game - currently we look like Melb ( reigning premier ) 1965 round 9 onwards
I wouldnt be backing Geelong at the moment even with counterfeit money
Who cares. If he's good for 2 goals, a handful of marks etc etc then he's staying in.
Fair enough. Our start to the year has seen some mud flung around, so I took your earlier post as more of that.
Based on one performance (so obviously a lot can change) I think Bowes will be settled in the 22 by mid-season. Bruhn I'm not so sure of - maybe not this year, but hopefully he's made himself undroppable by next season.
Ollie Henry is another that does some useful things but is it enough to stay in the 22 with Rohan? Perhaps not at this point.
Interesting, isn't it? I'm sure many here would say that a win against the Suns is massively preferable but not essential. Whereas I think another loss here leaves us more likely than not to simply be making up the numbers in 2023, given everything that can go wrong in any season of footy. So I see it being that big, even at this very early stage of the season.
Which brings you to the next uncomfortable reality to face. If we drop this game, there's actually opponents I would prefer for the following game than the Hawks at the 'G. People can say all they like about how pitiful they'll end up being this year. But I will be very surprised if they just roll over and gift us a win on Easter Monday.
So despite the fact that it looks like we have a very handy draw coming up, this current Cats incarnation certainly has it in them to make even the most comforting sequence of 'next opponents' look challenging.
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Not concerned yet.
Our backline is threadbare, with a rookie KPD having to learn on the run (while getting unfairly slaughtered by the umpires), we have many underdone physically and we have a number of key players banged up. I can't remember a run like this in recent memory in regards to the large number of players receiving heavy knocks, which is clearly affecting their output (Jezza aside).
We've also had to play two sides out to prove a point against the reigning premiers, so we're now dealing with the added pressure of being the hunted and for many of our group this is something they've yet to experience. For all this, we led Collingwood at 3QT and lost by 8pts last night, while not playing anywhere near our best. The media are already blowing their load over our weaknesses and our early struggles, and we're two games in with 21 to play! This increased overanalysis is typical of our shallow footy media, who only two weeks ago were declaring we'd go B2B!
I said last week it'll be a slow burn again and last night only typified that. It was very similar to many of our games early last year before it all clicked into place. No guarantees that will happen again, but they have the credits in the bank and deserve the chance to get it right before we decide to retire half the team that delivered that glorious premiership.
We could easily win our next six and if we do, this slow start will forgotten as quickly as the media change their narrative. Lose any of the next three and then we might have a problem.
Our backline is threadbare, with a rookie KPD having to learn on the run (while getting unfairly slaughtered by the umpires), we have many underdone physically and we have a number of key players banged up. I can't remember a run like this in recent memory in regards to the large number of players receiving heavy knocks, which is clearly affecting their output (Jezza aside).
We've also had to play two sides out to prove a point against the reigning premiers, so we're now dealing with the added pressure of being the hunted and for many of our group this is something they've yet to experience. For all this, we led Collingwood at 3QT and lost by 8pts last night, while not playing anywhere near our best. The media are already blowing their load over our weaknesses and our early struggles, and we're two games in with 21 to play! This increased overanalysis is typical of our shallow footy media, who only two weeks ago were declaring we'd go B2B!
I said last week it'll be a slow burn again and last night only typified that. It was very similar to many of our games early last year before it all clicked into place. No guarantees that will happen again, but they have the credits in the bank and deserve the chance to get it right before we decide to retire half the team that delivered that glorious premiership.
We could easily win our next six and if we do, this slow start will forgotten as quickly as the media change their narrative. Lose any of the next three and then we might have a problem.
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EFA.
- Jun 19, 2006
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Massive game against the suns now. Just have to win. Do that and take care of Hawthorn and West Coast and we'll be looking ok with players coming back.
- Jun 19, 2006
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The criticism of Esava around here is just insane. He was way better than most last night under an absolute barrage. And that's after being clearly our best the week before.
- Sep 26, 2017
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He’s being marked differently than most other players starting a new position , but for mine I haven’t seen too many negative posts
The postive posts far outweighs those that are using him as an excuse for why the teams struggling
I've dissected the Curnow goals and the sequences they came from again. Please actually read all of this and discuss:
18:18 on the clock in the first. Tuohy hesitates while trying to kick inside 50 (while completely open to begin with) and gets it smothered. Three Carlton players make the fast break while everyone is out of position. Tuohy jogs back and doesn't apply pressure to Durdin. Motlop is free so Sav peels off to try and intercept/hold him off. I concede this is an unwise decision as his man Curnow can now run to the goal square unimpeded. But Motlop I believe is still Tuohy's man so we can add a third error to his tally in this sequence. Defenders have still had some time to track back into defensive 50 but Bews, and yet again Tuohy, are 5 metres/2 seconds too late. Sure, Sav should have played the percentages and let Motlop run in on goal. But on those open fast breaks from an original turnover, your defensive unit is already on toast. It was a shambles from about 6 players trying to defend after the horrific Tuohy turnover.
8:27 on clock in the second. Not Sav's man. We turn the ball over on the wing while Sav is manning Mackay. SDK is 15m ahead and slightly to the right of Curnow. It's his man. Sav makes a desperate last ditch attempt to peel off from Mackay (Smith then moves next to Mackay...clearly Smith was not Mackay's man) and spoil Curnow. Can't get there and Curnow swings around for a beautiful 50m goal near the boundary (thus I'm hesitant to really get too stuck into SDK there).
3:15 in the second. Sav is on Curnow. Wins a 1v1 to get it to the boundary. From the throw in we get possession but Holmes handpasses straight to Saad who runs in and helicopters a kick that falls in front to Curnow with Sav just trailing. So yes, Sav is on him, but is he the main problem in this minute of play? He did his job, then the mids/Holmes cough it up and it's a horrible kick to defend as it dipped rather than floated.
15:56 in the third. Not Sav's man. Sav is deep on Mackay, as he was at times in the first half. Curnow rolls in from midfield and wins a mark with Cameron closest to him, but difficult to know exactly who was on him. Kicks a booming set shot goal from 50. Oh shall we analyse the cause of the goal anyway? Guthrie shanks a chip kick on the wing, it gets chopped off and Blicavs can't quite stay with Cripps on the lead, who then kicks to Curnow. The kick to Cripps was weighted well like a number were to Curnow, but I see no reason to chop Blicavs head off for this either. It was the skill error before.
13:23 in the third. Blicavs bullied in the ruck by TDK, who gets a clean Carlton clearance on the wing too easily yet again. Ball bounces a bit funny and Tuohy misjudges it. Can't get a handball clear before the tackle, then we fail to catch the Carlton small forward crumbing the spills. Look at the daisy cutter snap that lands in Curnow's lap for the goal. From this sequence of play, where the ruck (Blicavs) and his rovers (didn't tackle TDK), the rebounding defender (Tuohy) and the small defender have all failed - you are putting the weight of this goal onto Sav as well? SDK doesn't even have a man, it looks like he's tried to peel off Mackay to get back to the square too but it was too late. The ruck contest and the Tuohy error are the goal, essentially.
So Esava concedes 3 goals to Curnow. In one he shouldn't have peeled off to hold up a free Motlop, but who is Motlop's man, who was Durdin or Mackay's man in that set up and whose error resulted in five free Carlton players available for a fast break? In one he dealt with a 1v1 well and then another turnover results in a helicopter kick in front that most defenders would struggle to get to. But we can still say potentially he reacts half a second quicker to Holmes handballing straight to a Carlton player and/or playing in front. The last goal, it's a result of Blitz being monstered in the ruck, a bad bounce but another horrendous error by Tuohy (he was responsible for more goals than Sav...surely you can concede that), smalls unmanned and the dump kick to the goal square is just the final link on a bad chain for Geelong.
To the whipping boy crowd, wake the hell up and understand what the key issues are. SDK is being found out of position or struggling just as much, but I am also not getting stuck into him because of the systemic issues through midfield/half forward that are creating such havoc for our defenders. Who are missing four first choice defenders and their main leader, that together may be able to repel some of these goals but it would still be a huge task. Concede clean clearances/running chains through the middle or turn the ball over in dangerous areas, when your side appears to be unfit and unable to structure as they would like, and you're going to have a bad time. The coaches will be putting emphasis on that in review and unless you're a numpty so will you.
In the third qrt Hamish said ‘the cats have a strangle hold on the game’. And then Jobe mumbled for about 5 minutes. Absolute clowns
- Sep 26, 2017
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Fixed
catempire
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Nice work doing all of that work. I will say two things about Ratugolea’s performance:
1. He made some errors that were sometimes on the end of other errors up the ground which, had they not occurred, would not have put him in that position. BUT… defenders still have to stop goals when they have a chance by making good decisions. Ratugolea is still learning the caper and making more errors than is acceptable for a side pushing for a flag. He will need to get rid of these to hold his spot.
2. Curnow is a gun. He gave us headaches last year when we had Henry, Kolo and De Koning, kicking 3.2. That night we conceded 42 i50s but we won by 5 goals. Last night we conceded 48 i50s in a narrow loss. It was basically two more shots last night playing against Ratugolea (and others). It’s not a huge chasm.
I basically agree that defenders have to deal with mistakes up the field or quickly reacting to turnovers. But my main point is that all of our defenders are being exposed like this. Last week it happened with Collingwood's smalls. Teams kick to the key forwards more, especially if they are a superstar (so it stands out and as a defender it's playing on extreme difficulty...in your third AFL game in the role), but I honestly don't think many full backs in the league would've conceded less than the 5 or 6 goals Sav has from the first two games. He is still second choice and raw but is capturing people's imaginations far more than the seasoned veterans who are simply meant to be repeating their fine 2022s. I get that there's a fascination with the new but the nit picking is at extreme levels with a general ignorance to the sequences of play with bigger problems.
And yes Curnow is a superstar. I'm not too harsh on the times SDK was on him or others tried to roll onto him during those fast breaks. We didn't protect that defence and great players will kick great goals anyway.
catempire
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Yes, we didn’t win the flag because we have brilliant individual defenders (Stewart aside). We won because we had a system of defence that made it very hard for the opposition to score. That has been completely absent in 2022 so far and I agree that it means basically any defender is going to be exposed. I am still interested in seeing if Ratugolea can improve and get rid of the kinds of mistakes he is making now. I do think he will need to do so to remain in the side long term and that’s what matters IMO.
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- Mar 18, 2021
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After some reflection I have concluded as follows: we lost it between the arcs ( our strength last year); In other words our mids failed again. We didn't lose because Curnow got 5 sausages. Rather Close, Atkins, Cam G for 3/4 and Bruhn couldn't get a kick.Nor could Rohan. Bruhn is young and will improve. Holmes and Bowes were solid. O'Connor struggled. Ollie showed again he's a talent. Mieirs was one of our better players. Stanley was OK. Cameron was Cameron.
We lost our structure - 3 or 4 times Hawkins was our only player in the front half with only Blues players for company.
Whenever there was a scrum they got it; they seemed stronger.
Guthrie's last quarter heroics were spoiled by game-losing turnovers.
Danger ignored hard running players around him and went for the kick instead of the handball.
I was told only once has a team lost the first 2 and won the flag but it doesn't mean we can't do it.
We lost our structure - 3 or 4 times Hawkins was our only player in the front half with only Blues players for company.
Whenever there was a scrum they got it; they seemed stronger.
Guthrie's last quarter heroics were spoiled by game-losing turnovers.
Danger ignored hard running players around him and went for the kick instead of the handball.
I was told only once has a team lost the first 2 and won the flag but it doesn't mean we can't do it.
Exactly, in an ideal world we would introduce one or two at a time. Then when the older boys need a rest that may go up to three and at a stretch, four. I thought Bowes performance given all that was the best but he is also the most experienced (playing a similar role for a while at Gold Coast). It may take some time for the others. Esava is doing fine, which will become more apparent when the midfield hold their own. O.Henry is showing some good signs but anonymous at others and doesn't pressure. Not sure we need both him and G.Rohan in the same side.
Spot on. I also can't see how he could fit into a defence with everyone available, but in the mean time he's not quite the cause of our issues some make out. It's been an unfortunate time for Tuohy to get knocked around and lose his marbles too. If he remembers how to play and Kolo comes back in, I think it'll steady us a touch. But it's Stewart who we really miss.
- Nov 7, 2010
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I'm not seeing where he kicked goal while on Zuthrie and MOC not sure of the SDK allegation either and can't bebothered taking it further we seam to have settle on Curnow kicking 3 on Sav with a 4th in dispute and 1 on Cameron.We are now somewhere closer to the facts nice summaries by the way kudos to you.
That's not discussing the analysis at all. You've well and truly gone into your shell. 3 goal from bad Geelong sequences, Sav bears the blame being the last link on the chain but is not the major issue in any of them. A minor adjustment and he may contest one or two (now do you really need me to dissect every action he performed where he squared the contest?) if he is a truly elite and experienced defender. My opinion is that May and Lever splitting duties on Curnow in that exact game still ends up with the same result of 5 Curnow goals.
I see you've neatly avoided the root cause of each of Curnow's goals - Tuohy twice, Holmes, C.Guthrie, then the midfielders on the wing for one. Surely you can figure that out.
Holmes was beaten by Acres, Danger by Cripps, C.Guthrie by Kennedy, Atkins/Blicavs by Cerra/Ed Curnow, Close/Stengle by Saad, Stanley by TDK - all to more significant degrees than Sav/SDK on Curnow/Mackay. If you're stuck analysing the game as "key forwards kicked goals, therefore key defenders are what made us lose" you just don't have a footy brain. And there's nothing wrong with that, not everybody does. Some people prefer to screech and stomp their feet.
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