List Mgmt. OFFICIAL: Dangerfield + Pick 50 for Picks 9, 28 and Dean Gore

[Jhye Clark 13]

I'm still at a loss as to all the Walker love. He's a second rate footballer at best, too which he's constantly shown.

With Clark and Stanley being recruited, and Vardy back to full fitness, he'll struggle for a game. I certainly hope so if we're serious about winning.

 

[Turbocat]

Our difference mainly relates to price Turbo. I don't have a problem with targetting a player and paying a little overs. It's the quantum. Some are talking Franklin type figures. Danger is no Franklin.

Added to which paying him around $500,000 more than Selwood is allegedly getting would be unfair to put it mildly.

Perhaps price is different but we also have to decide if we want to pay market rates. One may equally say Buddy is no Danger. He may actually represent better value to us than Franklin would , especially if our forwards are adequate , it our mid are that needs depth and quality.

Its simply a matter of paying dollars rather dollars and picks.

 

[Turbocat]

I'm still at a loss as to all the Walker love. He's a second rate footballer at best, too which he's constantly shown.

With Clark and Stanley being recruited, and Vardy back to full fitness, he'll struggle for a game. I certainly hope so if we're serious about winning.

I think that is harsh SOG. He is still a young footballer , kicked on this year and played well in the roles asked. Potentially Clark and Stanley have more to offer... but second rate...Very Harsh

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

I think that is harsh SOG. He is still a young footballer , kicked on this year and played well in the roles asked. Potentially Clark and Stanley have more to offer... but second rate...Very Harsh

My opinion of course, and I'm quite happy to stand corrected if he proves me wrong.

 

[Turbocat]

My opinion of course, and I'm quite happy to stand corrected if he proves me wrong.

And you are entitled to it , and like all opinions neither right or wrong , its just opinion.

 

[Jimmy Yamazaki]

I'm still at a loss as to all the Walker love. He's a second rate footballer at best, too which he's constantly shown.

With Clark and Stanley being recruited, and Vardy back to full fitness, he'll struggle for a game. I certainly hope so if we're serious about winning.

In Walker's defense, he did do better than the "highly rated" Kersten and Brown though this year. But yeah I don't see him getting a game either.

What I don't get is Blitz on the wing, that was stupid then and is still stupid now. If all players are fit he doesn't fit in the best 22 anymore.

I would like him to go the VFL and see if he can learn to be a defender, but I can see the club playing him anyway and wonder why we get blown up on the spread.

 

[Willo_]

What I don't get is Blitz on the wing, that was stupid then and is still stupid now. If all players are fit he doesn't fit in the best 22 anymore.

I would like him to go the VFL and see if he can learn to be a defender, but I can see the club playing him anyway and wonder why we get blown up on the spread.

I'm exactly the same as you here.. people seem to think just because he can run all day makes him a natural wingman. Wingman need to be able to explode away with the footy to be able to run and carry the ball, they also need to know how to play the game.

It seems a common thing here that players get mentioned for certain positions based solely on their physical attributes, I'd prefer players that actually show a bit in a position myself.

I'm happy to be shown up as being wrong and for Blitz to turn into a great defender, but I'd also prefer to see him earn his stripes in the 2s

 

[Cataholic]

The post was categorical. The poster often seeks to puff himself up as having inside information.

I have no difficulties with your assumptions they may or may not be accurate as is the case with assumptions

Fair enough. You came in hard on PO's post is all, but I guess you have your own reasons for the opinion you've formed, although I personally have found PO to be a knowledgeable, sensible and respectul poster. Just my impression.

Anyhow, back on topic, I just hope that one way or another Dangerfield finds his way to us and not the Hawks.

I'll barf in my cornflakes if that happens.

 

[catempire]

I'm exactly the same as you here.. people seem to think just because he can run all day makes him a natural wingman. Wingman need to be able to explode away with the footy to be able to run and carry the ball, they also need to know how to play the game.

It seems a common thing here that players get mentioned for certain positions based solely on their physical attributes, I'd prefer players that actually show a bit in a position myself.

I'm happy to be shown up as being wrong and for Blitz to turn into a great defender, but I'd also prefer to see him earn his stripes in the 2s

When they have played him on a wing, do you think they were hoping he'd be that type of player? Or do you think they were experimenting with setups, particularly ruck setups and looking to have an extra marking target around the ground?

While indeed it is a common thing for players to be associated with positions based on physical attributes, another common thing I've noticed is players being ruled out of playing certain positions based on physical attributes.

I'm not hopeful of convincing you or anyone else, but my distinct impression is that Blicavs is being used in a variety of ways because they are yet to find how best to utilise his skills and physical attributes. And I don't think they are afraid of trying just because he doesn't fit the usual mould.

 

[Willo_]

When they have played him on a wing, do you think they were hoping he'd be that type of player? Or do you think they were experimenting with setups, particularly ruck setups and looking to have an extra marking target around the ground?

While indeed it is a common thing for players to be associated with positions based on physical attributes, another common thing I've noticed is players being ruled out of playing certain positions based on physical attributes.

I'm not hopeful of convincing you or anyone else, but my distinct impression is that Blicavs is being used in a variety of ways because they are yet to find how best to utilise his skills and physical attributes. And I don't think they are afraid of trying just because he doesn't fit the usual mould.

I'm not sure if a final against Hawthorn is the right time to experiment with him on a wing.

I'm all for being proven wrong about what he can do, I'd just prefer he prove himself in the 2s if they are experimenting with him in positions.
Obviously it's a luxury we may not have had given our tall players injury woes of late but I still don't want to see him on the wing against the Hawks ever again

 

[catempire]

I'm not sure if a final against Hawthorn is the right time to experiment with him on a wing.

I'm all for being proven wrong about what he can do, I'd just prefer he prove himself in the 2s if they are experimenting with him in positions.
Obviously it's a luxury we may not have had given our tall players injury woes of late but I still don't want to see him on the wing against the Hawks ever again

He had played there before. There was a plan, it didn't work. I'm not sure it warrants the definitive statements we are seeing here. I can envisage him giving teams headaches playing on a wing in future. I can't envisage him playing much VFL footy ever again though so I think you and Partridge will be disappointed there!

 

[Turbocat]

When they have played him on a wing, do you think they were hoping he'd be that type of player? Or do you think they were experimenting with setups, particularly ruck setups and looking to have an extra marking target around the ground?

While indeed it is a common thing for players to be associated with positions based on physical attributes, another common thing I've noticed is players being ruled out of playing certain positions based on physical attributes.

I'm not hopeful of convincing you or anyone else, but my distinct impression is that Blicavs is being used in a variety of ways because they are yet to find how best to utilise his skills and physical attributes. And I don't think they are afraid of trying just because he doesn't fit the usual mould.

Upside / downside of tactical advantage. Im guessing but I suspect they thought they could get a missmatch , use his marking which is quite good...but as can happen , if you strive for a missmatch , it may be you get a missmatch not in your favour.

As time goes on I feel he will rely on his stamina a fraction less. Different type but I could see him doing what Mackie and Taylor do , running from the backline. Now if he becomes dangerious , get on the end of it and score , the forwards would hate his height and run.

 

[Jimmy Yamazaki]

He had played there before. There was a plan, it didn't work. I'm not sure it warrants the definitive statements we are seeing here. I can envisage him giving teams headaches playing on a wing in future. I can't envisage him playing much VFL footy ever again though so I think you and Partridge will be disappointed there!

What is this "plan" that you're referring too and how will he give teams headaches on a wing?

 

[Swarles Barkley]

Saw Paddy walking around Glenelg Beach yesterday with Tom Lynch. Had to stop myself from yelling out to him to come home.

 

[catempire]

What is this "plan" that you're referring too and how will he give teams headaches on a wing?

I'm not privy to the plans, I can only go by what I observe. What I see when they play Blicavs on a wing appears like an attempt at making up for the shortfall in running power possessed by McIntosh and Simpson - i.e. making sure that we have someone competing at ruck contests and for marks all around the ground. It might also be a little of what Turbocat said - a failed attempt to exploit a smaller player through superior marking ability. Clearly, that backfired.

Of course there's the alternative that there was no plan and the coaches are incompetent, as several will have you believe...

 

[Stan The Caddy]

I'm not privy to the plans, I can only go by what I observe. What I see when they play Blicavs on a wing appears like an attempt at making up for the shortfall in running power possessed by McIntosh and Simpson - i.e. making sure that we have someone competing at ruck contests and for marks all around the ground. It might also be a little of what Turbocat said - a failed attempt to exploit a smaller player through superior marking ability. Clearly, that backfired.

Of course there's the alternative that there was no plan and the coaches are incompetent, as several will have you believe...

Another reason as to why they like to play Blitz on a wing is because he is good at covering for our defenders men if they decide to go for a run up the ground to join in with the link of play. Mackie does this alot and if his man doesn't go with him he can be confident that if the ball is turned over Blitz will have folded back to help cover for him.

He also did this alot for Taylor in 2013 when he used to run forward and try to take a mark inside 50. It didn't happen much last season cos teams caught onto it and put a stack of defensive attention into Taylor, with the instructions probably being to follow him wherever he went no matter what the situation of the game was.

 

[Jimmy Yamazaki]

I'm not privy to the plans, I can only go by what I observe. What I see when they play Blicavs on a wing appears like an attempt at making up for the shortfall in running power possessed by McIntosh and Simpson - i.e. making sure that we have someone competing at ruck contests and for marks all around the ground. It might also be a little of what Turbocat said - a failed attempt to exploit a smaller player through superior marking ability. Clearly, that backfired.

Of course there's the alternative that there was no plan and the coaches are incompetent, as several will have you believe...

Fair enough, it's a massive risk though to do in a final on a player that's become one the better wingers going around.

To me, It would never make sense and would never work, In theory yes it can work as you said. But you have to ask the questions, what happens when the ball hits the deck? (not if...when) Also what will happen if the smaller player can run off of Blivcas in to space? To make that work he would have to mark it 10+ times a game I feel.

I mean Blitz can run all day and maybe once the game slows down he can find his own space. But that is the same the other way and then it become a game of who is more damaging with ball in hand? And how many times can they get into space per game to use it to advantage?

He isn't a fast runner either so Hill can play on Blitz, Hmac and Simpson and it will make no difference if Hill gets it first, they won't catch him.

This is also my questions to our tall 4 back-line, and I believe it's the reason small forwards kill us so bad. We are so slow there.

I'm no expert though. this is all of my own theory.

 

[Grimoz]

I'm still at a loss as to all the Walker love. He's a second rate footballer at best, too which he's constantly shown.

I agree, his skills are pretty poor but they did improve last year to a point especially his marking, he also has a huge tank which can be a factor later in games which we struggled with last year. He will struggle to get a game this year with Clarke and Stanley now there but you never know, dont be surprised if they move him on in 2016 if this year is a failure.

 

[Claude Balls]

I'm still at a loss as to all the Walker love. He's a second rate footballer at best, too which he's constantly shown.

With Clark and Stanley being recruited, and Vardy back to full fitness, he'll struggle for a game. I certainly hope so if we're serious about winning.

Such constancy in his 17 games in various positions.

 

[catempire]

Fair enough, it's a massive risk though to do in a final on a player that's become one the better wingers going around.

To me, It would never make sense and would never work, In theory yes it can work as you said. But you have to ask the questions, what happens when the ball hits the deck? (not if...when) Also what will happen if the smaller player can run off of Blivcas in to space? To make that work he would have to mark it 10+ times a game I feel.

I mean Blitz can run all day and maybe once the game slows down he can find his own space. But that is the same the other way and then it become a game of who is more damaging with ball in hand? And how many times can they get into space per game to use it to advantage?

He isn't a fast runner either so Hill can play on Blitz, Hmac and Simpson and it will make no difference if Hill gets it first, they won't catch him.

This is also my questions to our tall 4 back-line, and I believe it's the reason small forwards kill us so bad. We are so slow there.

I'm no expert though. this is all of my own theory.

Massive risk? That’s one view. Another is that McIntosh was so stuffed by finals that we simply had no option but to have Blicavs follow him around trying to pick up the slack. So you can play him in the centre square as something of a ruck-rover (where he’s clearly not suited as he’s not a clearance player or a tagger) or you can play him on a wing where he perhaps can use his greatest attributes – running power and marking ability. To me, I can see the logic of it. If anything, they let it go on too long when it was clear Hill was hurting us too much. At the very least they needed to switch Blicavs to the other wing and put a negating player (e.g. Guthrie or even Kelly) on Hill. They didn’t and the rest is history.

However, this is not an issue of pace; it's about footy smarts. Hill has it in spades and Blicavs clearly lacks it.
Hill is a superior footballer who knows where to run and knows how to use his pace to advantage. He has been doing it all his life and he was able to get off the leash. He did it not with superior pace, but through finding space. Have a look at the replay and see how many of Hill's 18 possessions in the first half were simply through being in the right place to receive the ball.

That’s Blicavs’ biggest challenge now – learning the game, learning how to find space and hurt the opposition, learning where the ball is likely to go, learning where his opponent is likely to run to so he can be there with him or before him. It’s not a pace issue. If he is to succeed in this game he has to get smarter about it.

Anyway, I won't clog the Dangerfield thread any further on this topic...

 

[Jimmy Yamazaki]

Massive risk? That’s one view. Another is that McIntosh was so stuffed by finals that we simply had no option but to have Blicavs follow him around trying to pick up the slack. So you can play him in the centre square as something of a ruck-rover (where he’s clearly not suited as he’s not a clearance player or a tagger) or you can play him on a wing where he perhaps can use his greatest attributes – running power and marking ability. To me, I can see the logic of it. If anything, they let it go on too long when it was clear Hill was hurting us too much. At the very least they needed to switch Blicavs to the other wing and put a negating player (e.g. Guthrie or even Kelly) on Hill. They didn’t and the rest is history.

However, this is not an issue of pace; it's about footy smarts. Hill has it in spades and Blicavs clearly lacks it.
Hill is a superior footballer who knows where to run and knows how to use his pace to advantage. He has been doing it all his life and he was able to get off the leash. He did it not with superior pace, but through finding space. Have a look at the replay and see how many of Hill's 18 possessions in the first half were simply through being in the right place to receive the ball.

That’s Blicavs’ biggest challenge now – learning the game, learning how to find space and hurt the opposition, learning where the ball is likely to go, learning where his opponent is likely to run to so he can be there with him or before him. It’s not a pace issue. If he is to succeed in this game he has to get smarter about it.

Anyway, I won't clog the Dangerfield thread any further on this topic...

Agree, won't go further off topic, but I think what you said there strengthens my argument.

He's no more suited to the wing as he is a tagger or ruck-rover. It was not a good move.

 

[Partridge]

Agree, won't go further off topic, but I think what you said there strengthens my argument.

He's no more suited to the wing as he is a tagger or ruck-rover. It was not a good move.

But if we ignore the evidence and keep saying it - it makes it more true!

 

[Partridge]

I'm exactly the same as you here.. people seem to think just because he can run all day makes him a natural wingman. Wingman need to be able to explode away with the footy to be able to run and carry the ball, they also need to know how to play the game.

It seems a common thing here that players get mentioned for certain positions based solely on their physical attributes, I'd prefer players that actually show a bit in a position myself.

I'm happy to be shown up as being wrong and for Blitz to turn into a great defender, but I'd also prefer to see him earn his stripes in the 2s

That is so accurate. Physical attributes - genuine or not - appear to be more important than football ability now. Strangely enough the team I saw Grand Final (who had contemptuously swatted us away twice in the closing months of the season) seems to have far more of an emphasis on the latter.

 

[catempire]

But if we ignore the evidence and keep saying it - it makes it more true!

When you win POTY it's great contributions to discussion like this that I'll remember fondly.

 

[dazbroncos]

Fair enough, it's a massive risk though to do in a final on a player that's become one the better wingers going around.

To me, It would never make sense and would never work, In theory yes it can work as you said. But you have to ask the questions, what happens when the ball hits the deck? (not if...when) Also what will happen if the smaller player can run off of Blivcas in to space? To make that work he would have to mark it 10+ times a game I feel.

I mean Blitz can run all day and maybe once the game slows down he can find his own space. But that is the same the other way and then it become a game of who is more damaging with ball in hand? And how many times can they get into space per game to use it to advantage?

He isn't a fast runner either so Hill can play on Blitz, Hmac and Simpson and it will make no difference if Hill gets it first, they won't catch him.

This is also my questions to our tall 4 back-line, and I believe it's the reason small forwards kill us so bad. We are so slow there.

I'm no expert though. this is all of my own theory.

I think that Clarkson saw it coming and expiated it to the fullest. Knowing that our rucks were limited, Clarko ( if that is the reference point) deliberately played Hill there and got exactly what he wanted - knowing that Hill would kill Blitz on speed but that overall Blitz would keep going all day.

The ploy worked and Hill burned him up.

Go Catters