Israel, Palestine, and everything related

[00Stinger]

So basically a few people are arguing that because a few Israeli civilians are killed by Hamas militants, it makes the Israelis slaughtering hundreds of Palestinians civilians ok. Have I got it right?

 

[Smiling Buddha]

So basically a few people are arguing that because a few Israeli civilians are killed by Hamas militants, it makes the Israelis slaughtering hundreds of Palestinians civilians ok. Have I got it right?

Actually the justification iirc was that three Israeli teenagers were killed, and the blame was apportioned to Hamas.

Did somebody say false flag?

 

[blackcat]

Actually the justification iirc was that three Israeli teenagers were killed, and the blame was apportioned to Hamas.

Did somebody say false flag?

wrong chronology. was not a flase flag, but two palestinian teens got killed in the WB three weeks before this, and they werent even protesting or throwing stones. they were walking home, when a non-violent protest that never gets western coverage, when the non violent protest occurred, and then the IDF who were there, shot the teen IN THE BACK. civilian. teen. innocent. victim. matters not if he was jewish or palestinian. most salient: civilian. teen. innocent. victim.

the 3 israelis, also victims, and innocent. tho, one could argue, the 19yo, he was a murky, ambiguity, was an IDF conscript. Even if they lived on the WB occupied territories settlements, they were still innocent. even tho the 19 was a conscript. innocent. just like the palestinian kids. but we never hear about the Pals. never never never ever

 

[Smiling Buddha]

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2014/06/16/israeli-teens/

http://www.globalresearch.ca/were-t...pings-an-israeli-false-flag-operation/5389791

 

[slicedndiced]

but the palestinians should not be occupying and invading israel starting in 1948.

this is the chronology right? on israel land for the last 3 thousand years? thats how old israel is. i am a full blooded christian zionist. the jews wont be perfected until the rapture, and those who do not convert will be smited.

Ahhh...the rapture.

I saw ribbon lightning in Perth last night. Was that a sign?

 

[blackcat]

Ahhh...the rapture.

I saw ribbon lightning in Perth last night. Was that a sign?

did you see mark snarski or any saffas??

 

[slicedndiced]

did you see mark snarski or any saffas??

Thankfully no.

However Colin Sylvia haunts my sub-conscious.

Does that count?

 

[kanye_best]

And, hour by hour, militant Imams get more and more ammunition to radicilise young Muslims across the ME and elsewhere.

"We" will reap what "we" sow for decades to come.

the west's 'War on terror' has created more terrorists. which was probably their intention all along.

 

[Smiling Buddha]

the west's 'War on terror' has created more terrorists. which was probably their intention all along.

The very word 'war', therefore, has become misleading. It would probably be accurate to say that by becoming continuous war has ceased to exist... A peace that was truly permanent would be the same as a permanent war. This - although the vast majority of Party members understand it only in a shallower sense - is the meaning of the Party slogan War is Peace.

 

[Gough]

The very word 'war', therefore, has become misleading. It would probably be accurate to say that by becoming continuous war has ceased to exist... A peace that was truly permanent would be the same as a permanent war. This - although the vast majority of Party members understand it only in a shallower sense - is the meaning of the Party slogan War is Peace.

Should probably attribute that quote.

 

[Smiling Buddha]

Should probably attribute that quote.

To whom?

Emmanuel Goldstein?
George Orwell?
Eric Blair?

 

[Gough]

You've pretty much ripped it from 1984, Orwell will do do.

 

[Malifice]

Who is we and what is being sown?

Chrisitans and Jews. Anyone that can be classed as 'white' and 'western' really.

Most 'Westerners' dont know the difference between a Sunni and a Shia and basically think all Arabs are Muslims and vice versa. One gigantic monolithic 'bloc' that gets tarred with the same brush.

Works the other way too sadly.

 

[Malifice]

So basically a few people are arguing that because a few Israeli civilians are killed by Hamas militants, it makes the Israelis slaughtering hundreds of Palestinians civilians ok. Have I got it right?

Pretty much nailed it.

Also, any Palestinian attacks in response will be handwaved as 'terrorism' and will justify further slaughter of people that had nothing to do with it.

 

[blackcat]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/18/o...l-the-road-to-war-paved-by-the-west.html?_r=0

In John Kerry's defense, he flew in and out of Tel Aviv, thinking he had the treaty about 6 weeks back, actually, flying out, he was just pissed with the Israelis cos he had done everything they requested, then a new verb, goalpostchanged. a portmanteau

AS Hamas fires rockets at Israeli cities and Israel follows up its extensive airstrikes with a ground operation in the Gaza Strip, the most immediate cause of this latest war has been ignored: Israel and much of the international community placed a prohibitive set of obstacles in the way of the Palestinian “national consensus” government

 

[carnthemlions]

As James Fallows said a couple of days ago, you can't win when the message is "they're forcing us to kill children".
The question is, how long will this be allowed to go on? Dead soldiers are never popular in Israel.

Meanwhile, the Israeli communications minister wants al-Jazeera off air, BBC Arabic journalist is attacked off air and Israel won't let journalists leave Gaza. Too many right wing ultra nationalist, ultra religious nutters have been allowed to become too influential in Israel. It will only get worse if the theory that the younger generation of Israelis tend to be more right wing than their parents.

I'm a Palestinian mother. I have 4 kids aged 2, 4, 5 and 9.

My roof gets 'tapped' and I have 30 seconds to get my 2 year old up from its nap, my 4 year old out of the bath, my 5 year old and 9 year old out of the street, to my side to help carry the other 2 kids 500 meters to safety before they blow the s**t out of my house and neighbouring houses. Sounds reasonable....

And once people get to "safety", they can still be bombed anyway.
Bit difficult when about 50% of somewhere the size of Gaza is considered safe.

Yup, they should just go somewhere else if they don't want to be bombed.
Oh wait...

 

[medusala]

Chrisitans and Jews.

Yeah right. Christians are responsible. FFS you are talking utter nonsense. I suppose we are responsible for Shia vs Sunni violence as well.

 

[carnthemlions]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-...ildren-could-be-killed-in-gaza-strike/5618990
So they had visual surveillance of the beach. Can't pass that one off as an accident.

 

[Tulip]

come on guys give the idf some credit the ratio would be 10:1 if the friendly idf men didnt warn civilians before bombing their homes. how is israel supposed to defend its people from popgun 'rocket' attacks which kill nobody if it cant bomb civilians? and these civilians arent really innocent given that they are on the chosen peoples land. it is actually very polite of israel to have given these people seventy years to get out. if somebody was in your home would you give them seventy years to remove themselves before calling the police? the idf are really just police evicting tenants. bad teneants at that given that they build mosques everywhere, how would you like it if tenants in your house started building mosques? you lefties need to visit israel before you can understand how sacred it is.

but i wouldnt expect you to understand, it is all anti-israel on this forum. you never focus on the horrors of hummus.

You once again show the ignorance of your views here, Smiling Buddha.

The Israeli people are rarely killed by these missiles, because the rare ones that aren't intercepted by defensive infrastructure are voided due to the sirens that give people a quarter of a minute to get underground. "They hide like mice from our rockets", a Hamas official gleefully said the other day.

I know people there now, and they have to evacuate their homes multiple times a day. Many of them have seen rockets fly over their head, or be intercepted above them.

Never mind the fact that the IDF don't go bombing homes for the fun of it, they attack places that have weaponry stashed within them. Who puts weapons in mosques, kindergartens and hospitals - could it be Hamas?

Or that nine years ago, the IDF were the ones driving the Israeli's out of the Gaza strip and handing it to the Palestinians - infrastructure and all.

More fun trivia, Israel opened a field hospital in Gaza to treat injured Palestinian civilians the other day.

The hitch?

Hamas won't let the injured be treated there.

Your attempt at sarcasm here is nothing more than a thin vail to disguise your ignorance.

The good news today (although perhaps not for you, not so hidden agendas and all) is that Abbas and the independent branch of Fatah have gone to Egypt to try and broker a ceasefire. Israel has agreed to every single on in this war so far, so I don't see why they wouldn't say yes to this one. The ball is firmly in Hamas' court, though I'm not sure they've had their fill of civil blood for the media yet. Quotes from them about firing rockets until every last drop of blood from their side has been spilled seem to be lost in this thread.

Funny, that.

 

[Tulip]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-...ildren-could-be-killed-in-gaza-strike/5618990
So they had visual surveillance of the beach. Can't pass that one off as an accident.

Absolutely tragic. No doubt there are certain members of the IDF, reminiscent somewhat of the US soliders in Afghanistan who raped and pissed on local women, with a horrible bloodlust.

Hopefully they're brought to justice, if this story is indeed as it is portrayed.

 

[Smiling Buddha]

Show Some Fight Your genocide apologism would sicken me if I were the kind of person to be sickened by the inhumanity of others.

 

[Tulip]

Show Some Fight Your genocide apologism would sicken me if I were the kind of person to be sickened by the inhumanity of others.

You say potato, I say potato.

Very weak answer from you here.

You could have at least addressed the points that I made without the drama.

Then, I am dealing with a man who jumps at the very shadows he lurks within.

 

[blackcat]

As James Fallows said a couple of days ago, you can't win when the message is "they're forcing us to kill children".

is a riff on the golda meir quote about being forced to kill their children and they cannot forgive/forget, but their equanimity coupled with their magnanimous disposition they could forgive the killing of their occupation IDF <rolling eyes golda, you are american arent you?>

 

[blackcat]

You say potato, I say potato.

Very weak answer from you here.

You could have at least addressed the points that I made without the drama.

Then, I am dealing with a man who jumps at the very shadows he lurks within.

SB offers a clarity you could only to aspire to.

hint: go sleep with a shiksa and get over yourself

 

[kanye_best]

Why is there a bigger focus on this when you have an even worse situation unfolding in Syria? More people dead in the last 72 hours than the last how many weeks of this conflict?

ah Syria. i was such a supporter of the rebels when it started. power to the people and all that.
now it's just turned into unnecessary bloodshed without any real aim in sight.