Pakistan vs. New Zealand in UAE (3 Tests, 2 T20, 5 ODI)

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happy_eagle said:
Since Lyon made his debut in 2011, the only other spin bowlers in world cricket to take more wickets than him have been Herath and Saeed Ajmal
Not sure if thats what i'd call average
Sure he's no Shane Warne, but he's the best we have

Craig and Sodhi have averages of 41 and 50 respectivly
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and one of those is a chucker...

Nail on the head I think Re: Warne. Spinners in this country are still being compared to Warne who in fairness was more rare than a 'once in a generation' player.

Lyon is no world beater but he's a solid contributor and currently the best option we have.
 

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thorne89 said:
Is he, though? Reckon if O'Keefe was given as long a run as Lyon has been his numbers would stack up just as well, if not better.
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#notsureifsrs

O'Keefe as in NSW's O'keefe? pfft get a grip... I'd rather go with Clarke's part timers, even with his ****ed back. He's nothing more than a good FC player who at test level would be a pedestrian trundler who will never transfer his FC record internationally.

Think Mitch Brown from Geelong... same scenario.

I would say have the 3rd most wickets for a spinner since his debut classifies as solid contributor given he's behind Herath and Ajmal who both play in spin friendly countries.

still lolling at O'keefe being mentioned.. lol.
 
NSFB said:
O'Keefe as in NSW's O'keefe? pfft get a grip... I'd rather go with Clarke's part timers, even with his stuffed back. He's nothing more than a good FC player who at test level would be a pedestrian trundler who will never transfer his FC record internationally.
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This old line eh. How will we ever know if it will transfer, he's never been given the chance. He's shat all over Lyon in FC cricket (hell, every Aussie spinner in the Shield for years) and he outbowled Lyon in the one Test they've played together. He's very stiff to have not played more Test cricket and at the very least been given a chance to prove whether his excellent FC game can be transferred into Tests.
 
NSFB said:
#notsureifsrs

O'Keefe as in NSW's O'keefe? pfft get a grip... I'd rather go with Clarke's part timers, even with his stuffed back. He's nothing more than a good FC player who at test level would be a pedestrian trundler who will never transfer his FC record internationally.

Think Mitch Brown from Geelong... same scenario.

I would say have the 3rd most wickets for a spinner since his debut classifies as solid contributor given he's behind Herath and Ajmal who both play in spin friendly countries.

still lolling at O'keefe being mentioned.. lol.
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Seen Lyon at first class level?
 
thorne89 said:
This old line eh. How will we ever know if it will transfer, he's never been given the chance. He's shat all over Lyon in FC cricket (hell, every Aussie spinner in the Shield for years) and he outbowled Lyon in the one Test they've played together. He's very stiff to have not played more Test cricket and at the very least been given a chance to prove whether his excellent FC game can be transferred into Tests.
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Now I want him to play. I'd love to be proven right. Trundler, nothing more.

The_Reaper said:
Seen Lyon at first class level?
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No I've seen him the level above first class, you know where he's been a solid performer:drunk:
 
NSFB said:
Now I want him to play. I'd love to be proven right. Trundler, nothing more.
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At the very least he has deserved a chance to prove whether or not he would be up to it ahead of all those who have been granted a Baggy Green post-Warne. Yes, including Lyon.
 
thorne89 said:
At the very least he has deserved a chance to prove whether or not he would be up to it ahead of all those who have been granted a Baggy Green post-Warne. Yes, including Lyon.
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Maybe so, but there's a reason Lyon has got more games than the other 'post-Warne' spinners, he's been the only one so far that's looked up to it.

I've never said he's a world beater or anything like that, in all honesty he's keeping the seat warm for when we get that next good spinner, but I don't think it's O'keefe.

Fun fact: from the moment he debuted to Swann's retirement, he only has 7 less wickets than Swann (admittedly 4 extra matches) with a similar average.

So since his debut he's not a hell of a lot away from Swann. Who had been quite good for England.
 
NSFB said:
Maybe so, but there's a reason Lyon has got more games than the other 'post-Warne' spinners, he's been the only one so far that's looked up to it.

I've never said he's a world beater or anything like that, in all honesty he's keeping the seat warm for when we get that next good spinner, but I don't think it's O'keefe.

Fun fact: from the moment he debuted to Swann's retirement, he only has 7 less wickets than Swann (admittedly 4 extra matches) with a similar average.

So since his debut he's not a hell of a lot away from Swann. Who had been quite good for England.
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Lyon is okay. But his average is drifting out a bit and hasn't looked overly convincing lately. Really hoping Agar keeps developing and takes his spot over the next few years. Think his ceiling is higher and he offers more as an all-round package.
 
Impressions from last night's T20:

- Milne ******* cranking up the pace. Looked good and fit.
- McClenaghan rocked up with a s**t haircut, new action and a few extra kgs.
- If Devcich expects to be in the World Cup 15, he's going to be disappointed.
- Nathan McCullum on thin ice. Only need one spinner for a WC squad to play in Aus/NZ.
- The Rock FTW.

Oh, and if you ingrates don't want Lyon, can we have him??
 

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Kyptastic said:
What's your NZ World Cup squad DrVanNostrand ?
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Been asking myself that a bit lately. There's real competition among the quick bowlers and it's tough to know what the strategies are when it comes to hitters up the order or the make-up on a bowling attack. Jesse Ryder must play IMO. Even if he has to be hooked up to a Tui drip for the entire tournament, just get him out there.

Guptill
Ryder (share 10 with Anderson)
Williamson (get yourself cleared to bowl dammit)
Taylor
McCullum*
Anderson (share 10 with Ryder)
Ronchi+
Vettori (10, through middle)
Southee (10, death)
Mills (10, all up front)
McClenaghan (10, death)

Boult, Neesham, Latham, Milne

That's probably the best I can do right now. I'm a fan of Brownlie, so I'd like to see him given more chances in the ODIs before the WC. I think Boult will find his way into the first XI, Mills might be in the process of getting pensioned off due to horrific death bowling. Milne is obviously a punt, could easily be Henry or Bracewell in his spot. Latham is no cert, but has shown he's capable at the top at international level, which is more than can be said for most who are tried out in the top order for NZ.
 
Ronchi picks up the man of the series award. Going from strength to strength and I could not be happier for him. Funny how things work out, in his current form would probably be the number one keeper in Australia in the two shorter versions of the game.

Agree with the majority of that lineup for the world cup DrVanNostrand but Ryder being there is seemingly a pipe dream and I would have absolutely no qualms in selecting Boult before Mills. I haven't seen a heap of Devicich but when I have he seems fine enough to me, how come you aren't a fan? Also I think Nathan McCullum will be in the squad. Has been a pretty stable member of their lineup for the past few years, would be surprised if the change was sprung at this stage. He's never really delivered any great numbers, but the selectors seem to be satisfied with what he brings to the team.
 
Hellgood said:
Ronchi picks up the man of the series award. Going from strength to strength and I could not be happier for him. Funny how things work out, in his current form would probably be the number one keeper in Australia in the two shorter versions of the game.

Agree with the majority of that lineup for the world cup DrVanNostrand but Ryder being there is seemingly a pipe dream and I would have absolutely no qualms in selecting Boult before Mills. I haven't seen a heap of Devicich but when I have he seems fine enough to me, how come you aren't a fan? Also I think Nathan McCullum will be in the squad. Has been a pretty stable member of their lineup for the past few years, would be surprised if the change was sprung at this stage. He's never really delivered any great numbers, but the selectors seem to be satisfied with what he brings to the team.
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I think Nathan McCullum will be in the squad, and may even be in the first XI alongside Vettori. In the lead up to the 2011 World Cup, NZ played both spinners in most limited overs game because the pitches were (and eventually did) suit the tactic. And it's a strategy we've retained ever since for major tournaments (Vettori has only played at World T20s and Champs Trophies every since). But this time around, I can't see two spinners paying off when NZ play all their games at home on small grounds with pitches that aren't going to turn in the conditions prepared for a one-day game. As you say, pretty ordinary numbers, but a staple in the ODI squad for a long time now.

Devcich has been a solid performer in the domestic game for a while game now, but is he ever really going to make an impact at international level? I don't think so. He's a good ND lad, and a killer beard, but I couldn't believe how tamely the Pakistanis played him last night. But if he performs in this ODI series and the ODIs against SL and Pakistan at home before the tournament, no reason why he couldn't be selected.

I think Boult being sent home to rest with McCullum and Southee tells us he's already been pencilled in. He wouldn't be resting from this series just for a meaningless two-Test series against Sri Lanka. He hasn't played anywhere near the white ball cricket the other contenders have, but I think he's being kept up the sleeve a touch. He'd have to bowl his overs with the new ball IMO.

Ryder. lol. Whether we like it for not, he's essential to NZ's chances in this thing. Superstar.
 
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