The on topic thread

[Zidane98]

I thought Liverpool had a 'strategy' last transfer window and wouldn't 'do a Spurs'.

If that strategy was to stretch the Suarez money and bank on a number of decent players rather than a handful of good ones to do a job, you did a Spurs.

Apart from Balotelli & Lovren all the signings have been good IMO.

Selling Suarez, not buying a direct replacement and then losing Sturridge for 6 months has been tough on us and you will see a huge improvement second half of this season by us.

So in essence we've done half a Spurs

 

[Tulip]

Apart from Balotelli & Lovren all the signings have been good IMO.

Selling Suarez, not buying a direct replacement and then losing Sturridge for 6 months has been tough on us and you will see a huge improvement second half of this season by us.

So in essence we've done half a Spurs

Paulinho - crap
Soldado - crap
Chadli - good
Capoue - mediocre
Chiriches - mediocre
Lamela - wait and see
Eriksen - outstanding.

You've done a Spurs.

Also, you missed Moreno. He's been every bit as diabolical as Lovren, but gets away with it because he's young and looks like Gerrard with a line through his hair.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE HAPPEN

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30843034

Nah, he won't get the support of 5 associations imo.

I would like Michael Garcia to run.

 

[Zidane98]

Paulinho - crap
Soldado - crap
Chadli - good
Capoue - mediocre
Chiriches - mediocre
Lamela - wait and see
Eriksen - outstanding.

You've done a Spurs.

Also, you missed Moreno. He's been every bit as diabolical as Lovren, but gets away with it because he's young and looks like Gerrard with a line through his hair.

Moreno diabolical? You must be watching a different player. Has been good for us. Bit inconsistent but is a 22 year old LB. A great buy at the price we paid.

 

[chef]

Of all things anyone has ever said in this forum, this is by far the most offensive. You crossed the line pal

Sorry mate, but it was such a FAITH thing to say.

 

[Zidane98]

Our signjngs-

Balotelli - crap - wait and see how he performs with Studge
Lovren- crap - we should cut our losses and move on
Moreno - good
Lallana - good
Markovic - looking good after slow start
Origi - undecided until next season
Can - good

 

[ADL9798]

Also, you missed Moreno. He's been every bit as diabolical as Lovren, but gets away with it because he's young and looks like Gerrard with a line through his hair.

Offensively Moreno's been very good, defensively that left side of our defence has had issues but it has to be said he's looked far more solid with Sakho at LCB alongside him and there's a tactical reason for that.

It was pointed out a number of times on post game analyses that Lovren habitually leaves acres of space between himself and the LB, choosing to remain in the centre (even when there are 3 CB's on the pitch!) when the ball is coming down the wing rather than positioning himself to cut out any through balls down the inside left channel. This makes it too easy for the opposition to double up on Moreno, work a 1-2 past him into that space and get a cross in. It's remarkable to see how much more regularly that side of our defence is targeted when Lovren is on the pitch. Sakho does his job by getting tighter to Moreno when the ball is out there so those through balls down the wing are cut out at the source instead of having to defend the cross.

 

[SM]

Paulinho - crap
Soldado - crap
Chadli - good
Capoue - mediocre
Chiriches - mediocre
Lamela - wait and see
Eriksen - outstanding.

You've done a Spurs.

Also, you missed Moreno. He's been every bit as diabolical as Lovren, but gets away with it because he's young and looks like Gerrard with a line through his hair.

I've thought that for ages!! None of my mates see it.

 

[Zidane98]

Paulinho started out well IIRC.

 

[Tulip]

Paulinho started out well IIRC.

He did indeed, but he tapered off fast. He's not a DM or AM, and doesn't have any distinguishing features like his passing or tackling. He's just a good all round player, who was meant to have been too tired after the Confed Cup but then showed the kind of passion at the WC that we could have only dreamt of from him.

He's not made for England, IMO.

 

[Tulip]

Offensively Moreno's been very good, defensively that left side of our defence has had issues but it has to be said he's looked far more solid with Sakho at LCB alongside him and there's a tactical reason for that.

It was pointed out a number of times on post game analyses that Lovren habitually leaves acres of space between himself and the LB, choosing to remain in the centre (even when there are 3 CB's on the pitch!) when the ball is coming down the wing rather than positioning himself to cut out any through balls down the inside left channel. This makes it too easy for the opposition to double up on Moreno, work a 1-2 past him into that space and get a cross in. It's remarkable to see how much more regularly that side of our defence is targeted when Lovren is on the pitch. Sakho does his job by getting tighter to Moreno when the ball is out there so those through balls down the wing are cut out at the source instead of having to defend the cross.

The United game was a perfect example of this. Moreno made that great run early, but then remember Valencia's assist for the first goal? Moreno and the CB (can't recall if Lovren/Sakho) ran at him together but both scattered straight away leaving him ample room to walk through and cross to Rooney. Moreno was particularly bad, because he walked backwards to space that Allen was already guarding and gave Valencia an easy opening.

 

[ADL9798]

The United game was a perfect example of this. Moreno made that great run early, but then remember Valencia's assist for the first goal? Moreno and the CB (can't recall if Lovren/Sakho) ran at him together but both scattered straight away leaving him ample room to walk through and cross to Rooney. Moreno was particularly bad, because he walked backwards to space that Allen was already guarding and gave Valencia an easy opening.

The first goal here? It was actually Lallana and Allen.

What's happened is Moreno has made a run forward and put Sterling in 1 v 1 against De Gea, De Gea has made the save and United have broken forward. No problem with Moreno being caught upfield in that situation, full backs are expected to push forward, it happens and it isn't an issue as long as your midfielders recognize the gap and fill it (as we see here with Lallana and Allen) until the fullback returns. What happens next is a total disaster, Lallana & Allen should be able to block Valencia here or at the very least foul him once he pokes the ball into the space behind them. However, that space really shouldn't exist in the first place, and that's the real issue in my opinion. If Lovren is where he needs to be, Valencia doesn't even bother attempting to make that run because he knows Lovren is going to clean it up. Instead, he would pass the ball back to his right back and they would work it around to the other side - danger averted. That is the true art of defending, positioning yourself so well that the opposition attacker doesn't even bother attempting a pass or run in the first place.



This is where Moreno has been caught out this season and why I think he's looked so much better with Sakho alongside him. Lovren habitually leaves that space in the inside channel open time after time, and the opposition are obviously going to try to exploit it by looking to create an overlap (hence why we've looked so weak down our left for most of this season). You can see it again here:



It was interesting to see almost half of United's attacks come down our left side in that game, as it's a stat I've heard several times this season. As soon as Lovren's positioning was pointed out, you could see why that's been happening. Moreno has pushed out to meet the ball carrier (as he should be), and in that situation Lovren should be shifting across to block the space in behind him. Instead, he's 20 metres away, Moreno is left isolated, and the overlap is on. It's amazing to see the effect having one pawn out of place can have on the entire team structure. What's more disappointing is the lack of on field leadership shown by Skrtel in particular. He's nearly 30, he should know better - when Lovren is standing a metre away from him while Moreno is isolated like that over on the wing, tell him where he needs to go, guide him through it and hopefully eventually it will click for him.

Long story short, yes we've been vulnerable down our left side this season. However, I'm more inclined to blame Lovren than Moreno for that weakness for the reasons I've given above.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

The first goal here? It was actually Lallana and Allen.

What's happened is Moreno has made a run forward and put Sterling in 1 v 1 against De Gea, De Gea has made the save and United have broken forward. No problem with Moreno being caught upfield in that situation, full backs are expected to push forward, it happens and it isn't an issue as long as your midfielders recognize the gap and fill it (as we see here with Lallana and Allen) until the fullback returns. What happens next is a total disaster, Lallana & Allen should be able to block Valencia here or at the very least foul him once he pokes the ball into the space behind them. However, that space really shouldn't exist in the first place, and that's the real issue in my opinion. If Lovren is where he needs to be, Valencia doesn't even bother attempting to make that run because he knows Lovren is going to clean it up. Instead, he would pass the ball back to his right back and they would work it around to the other side - danger averted. That is the true art of defending, positioning yourself so well that the opposition attacker doesn't even bother attempting a pass or run in the first place.

View attachment 103211

This is where Moreno has been caught out this season and why I think he's looked so much better with Sakho alongside him. Lovren habitually leaves that space in the inside channel open time after time, and the opposition are obviously going to try to exploit it by looking to create an overlap (hence why we've looked so weak down our left for most of this season). You can see it again here:

View attachment 103226

It was interesting to see almost half of United's attacks come down our left side in that game, as it's a stat I've heard several times this season. As soon as Lovren's positioning was pointed out, you could see why that's been happening. Moreno has pushed out to meet the ball carrier (as he should be), and in that situation Lovren should be shifting across to block the space in behind him. Instead, he's 20 metres away, Moreno is left isolated, and the overlap is on. It's amazing to see the effect having one pawn out of place can have on the entire team structure. What's more disappointing is the lack of on field leadership shown by Skrtel in particular. He's nearly 30, he should know better - when Lovren is standing a metre away from him while Moreno is isolated like that over on the wing, tell him where he needs to go, guide him through it and hopefully eventually it will click for him.

Long story short, yes we've been vulnerable down our left side this season. However, I'm more inclined to blame Lovren than Moreno for that weakness for the reasons I've given above.

Thanks for posting that video ADL, really enjoyed it mate.

 

[chef]

 

[Thistle]

The first goal here? It was actually Lallana and Allen.

What's happened is Moreno has made a run forward and put Sterling in 1 v 1 against De Gea, De Gea has made the save and United have broken forward. No problem with Moreno being caught upfield in that situation, full backs are expected to push forward, it happens and it isn't an issue as long as your midfielders recognize the gap and fill it (as we see here with Lallana and Allen) until the fullback returns. What happens next is a total disaster, Lallana & Allen should be able to block Valencia here or at the very least foul him once he pokes the ball into the space behind them. However, that space really shouldn't exist in the first place, and that's the real issue in my opinion. If Lovren is where he needs to be, Valencia doesn't even bother attempting to make that run because he knows Lovren is going to clean it up. Instead, he would pass the ball back to his right back and they would work it around to the other side - danger averted. That is the true art of defending, positioning yourself so well that the opposition attacker doesn't even bother attempting a pass or run in the first place.

View attachment 103211

This is where Moreno has been caught out this season and why I think he's looked so much better with Sakho alongside him. Lovren habitually leaves that space in the inside channel open time after time, and the opposition are obviously going to try to exploit it by looking to create an overlap (hence why we've looked so weak down our left for most of this season). You can see it again here:

View attachment 103226

It was interesting to see almost half of United's attacks come down our left side in that game, as it's a stat I've heard several times this season. As soon as Lovren's positioning was pointed out, you could see why that's been happening. Moreno has pushed out to meet the ball carrier (as he should be), and in that situation Lovren should be shifting across to block the space in behind him. Instead, he's 20 metres away, Moreno is left isolated, and the overlap is on. It's amazing to see the effect having one pawn out of place can have on the entire team structure. What's more disappointing is the lack of on field leadership shown by Skrtel in particular. He's nearly 30, he should know better - when Lovren is standing a metre away from him while Moreno is isolated like that over on the wing, tell him where he needs to go, guide him through it and hopefully eventually it will click for him.

Long story short, yes we've been vulnerable down our left side this season. However, I'm more inclined to blame Lovren than Moreno for that weakness for the reasons I've given above.

Wow that is basic defending 101. Is it a Lovren problem or coaching issue? Criminal by whoever is at fault!

 

[chef]

Wow that is basic defending 101. Is it a Lovren problem or coaching issue? Criminal by whoever is at fault!

You would have to say coaching as Lovren looked decent last season in a better managed side.

 

[Thistle]

You would have to say coaching as Lovren looked decent last season in a better managed side.

That's what I was thinking but surely it can't be a tactic, or otherwise it should be an easy issue to have identified and fixed.

 

[ADL9798]

Wow that is basic defending 101. Is it a Lovren problem or coaching issue? Criminal by whoever is at fault!

You would have to say coaching as Lovren looked decent last season in a better managed side.

As I said the other day when someone asked me my opinion of Alderweireld, I think he and Lovren are good defenders but are/were made to look excellent by the very compact system Southampton play (they had a fairly tight defence last season but they also didn't create much going forward), and by the great cover provided by Schneiderlin and Wanyama. At Liverpool we don't give our CB's that sort of protection as we are more interested in pushing numbers forward, creating positional overloads, creating opportunities and outscoring our opponents than shutting games down.

That high risk-high reward approach nearly won us the title last season so while it's frustrating to watch at times and of course we could be better down that end of the field, it's difficult to say I'd rather we were tighter defensively or that it's poor management from Rodgers because if we played less openly then we may not have come as close as we did last season. The obvious caveat is that it takes a certain type of defender to play in that system, and the risk Rodgers has taken in playing this way becomes even greater if you have players who are continually committing basic positional errors. Players not following instructions is difficult to account for as a manager! I had concerns about this when we were spending all that money on Lovren last year, that he hadn't been all that great at Lyon (we were linked with him the summer he went to Southampton too) and while he'd been lauded for his form at Southampton I wondered how much of it was him and how much of it was the system.

In terms of the positional mistakes he's been making, Carragher pointed out (and I can't find the video right now) on Monday Night Football that he and Neville went back to watch a few games, to see what had changed between Lovren's performances last season compared to this season. They found that even then he was prone to leaving these enormous gaps between himself and his fullback on the outside. I doubt very much that it was a tactical instruction from either Pocchetino or Rodgers, I think it's probably just a reflection of what Lovren himself is most comfortable with. However, they also pointed out that as you say it's very basic defending, and as such it should be very easy to fix if you have half a brain. You just need to have your head on a swivel and be constantly aware of your position relative to your team mates and what triggers to look for in terms of 'ball is in x location, therefore I need to be covering y space'. It's definitely something Rodgers needs to work on with Lovren, hopefully we see some improvement in the 2nd half of the season.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Nsfw

 

[Sub_Zero]

The Carlton board drives me insane. Don't post about footy much on there at all anymore.

Having to deal with posters like TheGeneral or whatever his name is now would drive anyone insane

 

[Magma]

when the hell did this thread reach 15 pages

 

[chef]

Torres happened then it was a s**t fight.

 

[Sozabarus]

It's time like this I wish Fox Sports had Serie A. Would love to watch Lazio/Napoli but not to the point of putting up with a shitty stream.

 

[moomba]

The FA doing it's bit to help out the English teams by moving our game before the 2nd leg in the Champions League to a late kick off, and moving the game after the 2nd leg to an early kickoff.

Twats.

 

[Zidane98]

Not sure where to post this but AC Milan are in such a state financially they've had to sell the team bus.


I can just imagine the negotiations when they buy a new one:

"This model looks great. We'll take it but we want to try it out first on a 6 month lease after which we will buy it for $200,000 euros if we run up more than 15,000 km on the odometer"

"Payments will come in 400 installments of $500 ea"

Sounds fun