Autopsy The Ruck

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Keen to hear your thoughts on my analysis guys.

The First Options:

Mark Jamar: I'm going to regrettably start with a roast to the Jamar haters. No, he's not as good as he once was. Yes, he's almost finished. No, however, is he a s**t ruck nor worthless to us or viable trade bait. His work around the ground is obviously lacking these days - but he's still an excellent tap ruckman and very strong in the body. Last night, when Maxy was exhausted, the Russian would have thrown his body at Minson and belted it as far forward as possible. Instead, Will got everything. Mark and Will are as comparable in style as possible, with Will having more in the tank than Mark. He's got to be first ruckman again when he's fit, at least until the end of the year.

Max Gawn: Completely unfit due to his knee injuries and then his hamstring at the start of the year. Very important that we keep him away from the vultures. Gawny's got a great height advantage, and his work around the ground is excellent, but his actual ruck work needs work before we can be sure that he's a viable option as number 1 into the future. Still only 21, and time is on his side. Important to keep him fresh and rotate him between the seniors and the Scorpions.

Jake Spencer: Will probably stay on the list for the next few years and not do a whole lot. Or, he could put it all together like Jamar once upon a time and become a likely first ruck type. Good endeavour, engine and speed. His work in the contest is improving, but his tap work and kicking are both very much under question. Not worried about his spot on the list, he's the ideal back up ruck. Only 23 and still developing. Would keep him around unconditionally.

The Second Stringers:

Cameron Pedersen: If he wasn't on a THREE YEAR DEAL, he'd be delisted immediately. He's actually a decent ruckman, but he's 193cm and doesn't really have the size to be a first choice. Not a good defender or forward - so perhaps we just keep trying him in the ruck until something clicks. 3 bloody years. Just pay him out PJ. Crazy of Neeld to trade out Stef for him.

James Sellar: The improvement from our other talls means Sellar is essentially a monty to be delisted unless something dramatic happens. He's best used as a full back who can play second string in the ruck - and his tapwork is okay.

Jack Fitzpatrick: My man. Confidence player. You play him, you give him a month before it clicks. 2m tall and still learning to command his body in the contest. With our plethora of tall forwards, I'd like to see him trialled in the ruck more often. Probably the cleanest ruck on the list when he wins the tap.

The Elephant in the Room:

Mitch Clark: This is all very much conditional on his recovery from the lisfranc. Mitch is obviously our lynchpin up forward, but we have a few of those competing now. Could he play ruck long term? Was a very good ruck at his old team, and only really started playing forward now. Keep in mind that he prefers playing forward, and that he might not have the body to be a #1 ruck.

The Trade: We obviously missed out on drafting Grundy and Hannath, and if we need to have another dip (Jamar may retire, Gawn may leave, Clark) in the market - there are currently very few options. Tom Bellchambers may leave the Bombers due to lack of opportunity, we could ressurect Ben Hudson again or try and lure Billy Longer with a big contract.
 
Agree with pretty much all of that. I think the next few weeks are crucial to Fitzy. If he can string some solid games as a forward/ruck together he'll should retain a spot on the list. Pedo and Sellar are both delist candidates I think. We've got plenty of talls and these 'jack of all trades, master of none' types aren't necessary. Hopefully Gawn signs on soon (he was out of contract right?) I think long term he should be our number 1.
After Jamar retires, I imagine our stocks to look like:
1: Gawn
Backup: Spencer
FF/Ruck: Clark/Fitzy (pending Clark's recovery)
With probably another rookie prospect developing at Casey.
I think Clark may need to play more ruck time with how our forward line will look next year. Watts, Dawes and Hogan are enough talls. Clark in there too makes things very top heavy. Hogan probably won't play every game, and Watts is pretty handy at ground level, but I still think having 4 tall forwards is too many. Maybe Watts takes on a Jarryd Roughead type role and moves into the middle/wing as a tall rover who can drift forward. At least our issues stem from having a lot of genuine options, rather than none.
 
Ruck is one of our strongest positions. Jamar when fit is still our best ruck, just wish he could do more around the ground.

Gawn and Fitzy are both incredible for 21 year olds. I am confident that they will be in the side for the next 8 or so years.

Spenser will probably always be a back up and not much more. But his athleticism should not be under rated. he is capable of holding his own in the ruck if need be.

Clark should probably stay as a forward and ruck the f50. letting our other rucks work in

Pederson and Seller are not really rucks
 

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Ruck is our strongest line by far.

Fitzy and Spencil coming on in leaps and bounds (can't believe I am saying that!!!)

Gawn is staying, not wasting my time speculating with anyone about this.

Jamar still great as a mentor and first stringer.

Clark as another one.

We are the envy of the competition in the ruck stakes as we have been for most of the time since big Jim came on board.
 
We Draft Boyd this year if we get a PP, play Hogan, Boyd, Watts and Dawes as forwards and have Clark ruck. Boyd can do relief ruck duties.
 
We Draft Boyd this year if we get a PP, play Hogan, Boyd, Watts and Dawes as forwards and have Clark ruck. Boyd can do relief ruck duties.

Ludicrous
 
I've heard a rumour which may gain traction or not, but Brisbane may offer Billy Longer and their first round pick to GWS to gain the #1 draft pick and get Boyd as a replacement for Jono Brown.

So if this is true you can rule out getting Boyd. Would also shatter the Dogs unless they come up with a better deal.

As for the ruck, I was rapt with Gawnie last night, Fitzy also played well. I think both, and Spencer, are capable of taking us forward, would have Gawn and Spencer first in the pecking order post Jamar.
 
I've heard a rumour which may gain traction or not, but Brisbane may offer Billy Longer and their first round pick to GWS to gain the #1 draft pick and get Boyd as a replacement for Jono Brown.

So if this is true you can rule out getting Boyd. Would also shatter the Dogs unless they come up with a better deal.
With Hogan dominating VFL not getting Boyd isn't super horrible for us. The Dogs on the other hand really need to get pick 1 (either through tanking or trading) to guarantee he's playing for them next year
 
What's changed in the last couple of weeks? Been a bit disinterested recently so I'm surprised to read all these positive comments about our ruck stocks.

Always been an admirer of Jamar, but has Gawn and Spencer really come on in "leaps and bounds"? And what's with Fitz? I saw his ripping goal on the AFL website, but what else has he done in the seniors?

By no means is this a pessimistic post, but I'm genuinely curious to see what our talls have done in the past month to warrant all this optimism.
 
What's changed in the last couple of weeks? Been a bit disinterested recently so I'm surprised to read all these positive comments about our ruck stocks.

Always been an admirer of Jamar, but has Gawn and Spencer really come on in "leaps and bounds"? And what's with Fitz? I saw his ripping goal on the AFL website, but what else has he done in the seniors?

By no means is this a pessimistic post, but I'm genuinely curious to see what our talls have done in the past month to warrant all this optimism.

Spencer was solid against the Saints, although got himself suspended which was pretty dumb. Gawn has played very well when he's been in the side this year, but lacks fitness due to his injury history. Fitzy was pretty quiet in his first game for the year but has played pretty well the past couple of weeks. None have exactly starred but they have definitely improved a lot and there are signs all three could be handy options in the ruck going forward.
I also think a win makes people a lot more optimistic on the board and a lot of faults can be overlooked because we farking won for once!
 
What's changed in the last couple of weeks? Been a bit disinterested recently so I'm surprised to read all these positive comments about our ruck stocks.

Always been an admirer of Jamar, but has Gawn and Spencer really come on in "leaps and bounds"? And what's with Fitz? I saw his ripping goal on the AFL website, but what else has he done in the seniors?

By no means is this a pessimistic post, but I'm genuinely curious to see what our talls have done in the past month to warrant all this optimism.

Neeld was sacked so everyone's feeling pretty bullish, especially after two weaker opponents.

Our ruck department is solid, Jamar would get games in most sides and any team would have space on their list for someone like Gawn. If we retain him at the end of the year, I'd only be thinking about bringing in another ruckman in a couple of years to start thinking about cover for Gawn in 5-10 years time.

Would be interested in an autopsy of our other lines, Show Some Fight.
 

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I'm so happy Fitzpatrick has finally been given a heap of consecutive games. Giving him a pointless one off at the end of the seasons achieved nothing. Finally he gets a few oppurtunities over the last few weeks and he progresses. That kick from the boundary line was genius.
 
Neeld was sacked so everyone's feeling pretty bullish, especially after two weaker opponents.

Our ruck department is solid, Jamar would get games in most sides and any team would have space on their list for someone like Gawn. If we retain him at the end of the year, I'd only be thinking about bringing in another ruckman in a couple of years to start thinking about cover for Gawn in 5-10 years time.

Would be interested in an autopsy of our other lines, Show Some Fight.

When I get a chance, I'll do my best.
 
Gawn and Fitzy are the long term future, and I see Spence as a viable no.1 if Jamar retires before the young'uns are ready for full games. Not necessarily because Spence is better (he is patchy) but because I think his body is more up for it.

Keep Clark out of the ruck as much as possible, he'll shatter into a million pieces.
 
If we draft Boyd I will go ballistic. Aish, Dunstan, Sheed or Scharenberg please.

Ideally I'd like to see Clark play first ruck in a Dean Cox style.

How would Stefan Martin fit into the picture? Is he capable of first rucking?
 
If we draft Boyd I will go ballistic. Aish, Dunstan, Sheed or Scharenberg please.

Ideally I'd like to see Clark play first ruck in a Dean Cox style.

How would Stefan Martin fit into the picture? Is he capable of first rucking?

Martin was a really good first ruck during Jamar's lengthy absence in mid-2011.
 
I am bullish and optimistic because I am always bullish and optimistic. Not because of 1 win or a coaching change.

Dee's ruck stocks are great!
 
After Fitzpatrick's showing the last few weeks... I really start to wonder if they'll look hard at trading Jamar - probably to GWS.

The other option is Collingwood - if Hudson and Jolly retire, the only rucks they have will be young blokes (Grundy, Witts) who need more time to develop.

We will have way too many tall options in 2014.
 
After Fitzpatrick's showing the last few weeks... I really start to wonder if they'll look hard at trading Jamar - probably to GWS.

The other option is Collingwood - if Hudson and Jolly retire, the only rucks they have will be young blokes (Grundy, Witts) who need more time to develop.

We will have way too many tall options in 2014.

They're not going to trade a life member. Especially one with no currency.
 
They're not going to trade a life member. Especially one with no currency.

I'm not sure how much a new coach would care about whether or not a player is a life member. You're right about him not having a whole lot of currency though. GWS is probably the only place if they dont manage to land someone like Bellchambers.

Trying to fit Gawn, Jamar, Fitz, Watts, Clark, Hogan and Dawes into our side is doing my head in.
 
Ruck is our strongest line by far.

Fitzy and Spencil coming on in leaps and bounds (can't believe I am saying that!!!)

Gawn is staying, not wasting my time speculating with anyone about this.

Jamar still great as a mentor and first stringer.

Clark as another one.

We are the envy of the competition in the ruck stakes as we have been for most of the time since big Jim came on board.


I don't want to say I told you so. But I told you so (who am I kidding, I definitely wanted to!) :p
 
Jamar still offers more in the ruck at the moment then Gawn. Yes, Gawn is very mobile and the future, Jamar typically gets up towards 40 hitouts a game. At least he doesn't let the opposition ruckman completely dictate stoppages.
 
I'm not sure how much a new coach would care about whether or not a player is a life member. You're right about him not having a whole lot of currency though. GWS is probably the only place if they dont manage to land someone like Bellchambers.

Trying to fit Gawn, Jamar, Fitz, Watts, Clark, Hogan and Dawes into our side is doing my head in.


Depth mate. Every team carries extra talks for depth. If the big men go down, they go down hard.

The bigger they are...
 

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