Combined Kurt Tippett contract negotiation/trade possibility thread

[Hollow Knight]

Polec was dropped before he got injured right? Dropped for the second time this year? In a team that has no chance of finals

Because he is struggling to run out games.

Missed most of the pre-season. Needs a big one... then bam

 

[Slippery Pete]

If only the same could be said for you and your mate SP

SP trotting out the simplistic comparison between players and their worth is a case in point. If he really was a "savvy" investor, then he would recognise the very real difference between a midfielder and a marking forward/ruckman. Sure, Pat's a superstar in the making, and would be our highest paid player by a street if it was based purely on football ability. But of course, such a measure is simplistic.

Case in point, Geelong lose the best player in the comp, then come out and win the 2011 premiership with an ageing list. The key reason they won? A stellar performance by a young power forward. Geelong dont win that game without that performance. Is he the most talented player in the team? Hell no. Is he the most valuable as a potential matchwinner? The evidence, on the biggest stage, doesn't lie.

Ah, the Feenix Special strikes again! Read three or four posts from different posters, then attribute them to one (usually me). Just a heads up on reading and comprehension - you have confused Rock n Roll's post with mine.

I have never undervalued the significance of an elite, key power forward. In fact, quite the contrary. Like many people here, the best player I've ever seen play the game was one of these.

Now, tell me how a discussion of elite, matchwinning power forwards has anything to do with Kurt Tippett?

Oh, that's right. You think he is currently one.

Please provide evidence of this at your earliest convenience.

 

[Tex200]

This is an interesting point, and something I was thinking about on Saturday. Jenkins came into the system a bit later than Tip, but in his first 10 games is averaging 11 touches, nearly 5 marks and 1 goal.

Tip's first 10 games: 6.6 touches, 2.4 marks, 1.3 goals. Even now, Tippett still only averages 10 touches and 4 marks over his career.

Admittedly Leeroy was 2 years older than Tip at debut, but his development actually stacks up pretty well against Tip's. Also, not sure if anyone else has noticed Leeroy's conversion - 10.2 so far, even including that sitter he missed in the first minute against Freo.

G
Thanks for this, very interesting. I feel quite confident when josh is lining up for goal. Just needs some time for natural development , but geez all the tools are there in terms of skills and competitveness. No greater example of his skills than that very clever pass that pin pointed danger on his own setting up the running goal!!

 

[SpeciousArgument]

A lot depends on whether Kurt decides on a set destination before trade week.

If he comes straight out and says "I want to go HOME. Gold Coast it is" or "The Brisbane contract is the one I want", the other party may drop out and leave them to it.

If he settles on the Gold Coast it will be tricky for you as they effectively have Pick 1 in the PSD as GWS can't take any more uncontracted Adelaide players (unless you agree to it).

If he comes out and says "I am happy to go to either Brisbane or the Suns" then you will be in a decent position as he clearly isn't the sort of guy who would shaft you unless he had no other option.

If he walks to get picked up in the draft by GCS i would want the club to agree to it just to **** him.

(note i said IF he walks. dont think he would do that to us though)

 

[The Crows Truth]

This is an interesting point, and something I was thinking about on Saturday. Jenkins came into the system a bit later than Tip, but in his first 10 games is averaging 11 touches, nearly 5 marks and 1 goal.

Tip's first 10 games: 6.6 touches, 2.4 marks, 1.3 goals. Even now, Tippett still only averages 10 touches and 4 marks over his career.

Admittedly Leeroy was 2 years older than Tip at debut, but his development actually stacks up pretty well against Tip's. Also, not sure if anyone else has noticed Leeroy's conversion - 10.2 so far, even including that sitter he missed in the first minute against Freo.

Ok thanks for the analysis. Let's face facts. We would all like Kurt to stay but he is over-valued at 650k based on output. And yes I know the structure arguments but Jenkins has shown he could potentially replace Kurt to a large degree - up forward at least

As a hypothetical getting Polec, Goddard (with saved cash) and Crouch could give us:

Shaw Rutten Johncock
Smith Talia Goddard
Mc Kay Danger Polec
Crouch Jenkins Henderson
Porps Walker Petrenko

Jacobs Thompson Sloane

Int VB, Mc Kernan, Vince, Wright with another 8+ quality depth players

This side > 2011 crows side with Tippett

 

[TheRoo32]

If Tippett did leave what would people think about having a dig at Hamish Macintosh? Ruckman who can play forward. Struggled with injuries this year but is a quality player. They also seem to prefer to play Goldstein as well and Scott said he would only play Macintosh as a forward predominantly if he did play him.

What would you fellow crows supporters think about trying to get him from North if Tippett goes? Maybe package Knights in with a pick or Luke Thompson?

 

[TheRoo32]

Ok thanks for the analysis. Let's face facts. We would all like Kurt to stay but he is over-valued at 650k based on output. And yes I know the structure arguments but Jenkins has shown he could potentially replace Kurt to a large degree - up forward at least

As a hypothetical getting Polec, Goddard (with saved cash) and Crouch could give us:

Shaw Rutten Johncock
Smith Talia Goddard
Mc Kay Danger Polec
Crouch Jenkins Henderson
Porps Walker Petrenko

Jacobs Thompson Sloane

Int VB, Mc Kernan, Vince, Wright with another 8+ quality depth players

This side > 2011 crows side with Tippett

Looks decent but what about Reilly, Callinan, Douglas...?

 

[The Crows Truth]

Looks decent but what about Reilly, Callinan, Douglas...?

Mate thats what I am saying. We are adding top end talent like Goddard, and quite possibly Polec. Certainly Crouch.

Douglas, Callinan (in the shortish term) and Reilly are all certainly AFL quality but will be replaced by better players. With injuries all 3 will still play a majority of games you would think. That s how we can win from this situation. especially after last years aggressive trade stance and already communicated desire to look at FA players.

Goddard is certainly a standout and the Saints are very tight with salary cap from all accounts. If it just comes down to $ he would choose GWS but he would almost certainly be worth $3M + from his footy career ( and appreciating Melbourne property values in recent years) and is he wants to achieve the ultimate success before retiring combined with a near leagues best salary he may be very tempted by the crows opportunity

 

[The Crows Truth]

If Tippett did leave what would people think about having a dig at Hamish Macintosh? Ruckman who can play forward. Struggled with injuries this year but is a quality player. They also seem to prefer to play Goldstein as well and Scott said he would only play Macintosh as a forward predominantly if he did play him.

What would you fellow crows supporters think about trying to get him from North if Tippett goes? Maybe package Knights in with a pick or Luke Thompson?

Struggles with injuries most years doesn't he?

 

[Elder van Berlo]

What would you fellow crows supporters think about trying to get him from North if Tippett goes? Maybe package Knights in with a pick or Luke Thompson?

You see, the thing about trading Chris Knights...

 

[TheRoo32]

Struggles with injuries most years doesn't he?

Yeah but this year was very unlucky. Just an idea at when he's up and going he's quality.

You see, the thing about trading Chris Knights...

Yeah sorry forgot about Knights. I just mean would it be an option going after Macintosh with any kind of trade?

 

[Slippery Pete]

Ah Knights, the poster child for paying overs due to "flight risk."

Flight Risk has now turned into Stay Risk.

 

[Geoffa32]

This is an interesting point, and something I was thinking about on Saturday. Jenkins came into the system a bit later than Tip, but in his first 10 games is averaging 11 touches, nearly 5 marks and 1 goal.

Tip's first 10 games: 6.6 touches, 2.4 marks, 1.3 goals. Even now, Tippett still only averages 10 touches and 4 marks over his career.

Admittedly Leeroy was 2 years older than Tip at debut, but his development actually stacks up pretty well against Tip's. Also, not sure if anyone else has noticed Leeroy's conversion - 10.2 so far, even including that sitter he missed in the first minute against Freo.

Jenkins has a very nice kicking style.

 

[Vader]

It's very, very hard to see Goddard going anywhere. It's almost certain that he'll be a Saints man for life. Mind you, stranger things have happened.

Interesting team you've named there Crows Truth. You'd have to think that Reilly & Douglas would get a gig ahead of Henderson & Petrenko, and I think Johncock's days in defence are pretty much over. Polec would not necessarily be an automatic selection either at this stage, he may well start the season behind Callinan in the pecking order. That said, it's still a pretty strong team you've named.

 

[craig crowing]

If Tippett did leave what would people think about having a dig at Hamish Macintosh? Ruckman who can play forward. Struggled with injuries this year but is a quality player. They also seem to prefer to play Goldstein as well and Scott said he would only play Macintosh as a forward predominantly if he did play him.

What would you fellow crows supporters think about trying to get him from North if Tippett goes? Maybe package Knights in with a pick or Luke Thompson?

I agree McIntonsh had injury problems but real ability and would be a great Fwd that could assist ruck.
We could give them Smack + to get this deal done .
Freddy B will send email to Scott telling him how good Smack going to be even better than his brother and deal done .

 

[brent-83]

As for McIntosh, until injured he was the #1 ruck by a street at North Melbourne. Goldstein was playing in the 2's. The only reason Scott mentioned him playing forward as he didn't want to risk reinjuring the knee and therefore would have him play forward to save him from the centre square contests. Next year he will be North's #1 ruck, make no mistake.

 

[Freddy Bassett]

Lets avoid players who have played a dozen games or less in 3 years

Please no more talk of Gumbleton or Mcintosh unless we get them for free and put them on a rookie list

 

[The Crows Truth]

L

It's very, very hard to see Goddard going anywhere. It's almost certain that he'll be a Saints man for life. Mind you, stranger things have happened.

Interesting team you've named there Crows Truth. You'd have to think that Reilly & Douglas would get a gig ahead of Henderson & Petrenko, and I think Johncock's days in defence are pretty much over. Polec would not necessarily be an automatic selection either at this stage, he may well start the season behind Callinan in the pecking order. That said, it's still a pretty strong team you've named.

obviously some creative license used to illustrate the younger players with high potential eg Crouch > Douglas, Polec > Reilly. Realistically, if we were playing in the 2013 GF the older guys may get the gig.

That said, I rate Hendo. Looked good in defense early this year. Certainly toughened up. And not too many players can kick 5/6 goals in a game of AFL. His combination of speed, leap, a good mark and kick could be potentially very very damaging IMO. Injured at a horrible time. His re- signing is important IMO as a leading high HF

Johncock is versatile. Over his career back pocket is where he has become a near elite player. Hopefully he pulls his proverbial out and returns to full fitness to add value to the team next year - either in defense or attack.

Polec is very highly rated at the Lions from my understanding. Bad injury run. Top 5 draftee would offer some pace, excitement and goal kicking ability to our midfield

You are right. Goddard is a hard get. But if we can offer him a genuine premiership opportunity in the medium term (3 years) combined with a large contract you just never know..a supremely talented and totally focussed on success individual craving a flag in his final years will be the sort of player possibly tempted to move in FA to a rising team like the crows

 

[Sekaj]

I would take GC's first pick for Tippett if he really wants to go.

 

[pjcrows]

Putting Goddard in a future Crows team. Now I've seen everything.

 

[WAG]

From the Gold Coast Bulletin this morning (from the GCS board)...

Suns will make play for Tippett
Brad Davidson | August 15, 2012
THE Gold Coast Suns will make a bold play to bring home star Adelaide power forward Kurt Tippett next season.
The Bulletin can reveal the Suns, who missed out on securing Tippett for their first two seasons, are preparing to throw a massive three-year offer at the star.

Suns football manager Marcus Ashcroft refused to comment on the issue yesterday.

"We think it is inappropriate to talk about individuals while they are contracted to other clubs," Ashcroft said.
The Suns will gain pick No.2 in this year's national draft if they finish 17th as expected and Ashcroft said this could "potentially" be used as bargaining power at the table.

"We could but I would have thought if we have a high first-round draft pick you would be pretty keen to utilise that," Ashcroft said. "You still need to bring in young elite talent over the journey."

I read that means their first draft pick is off the table.

 

[Crows4Eva]

Can't see GC giving up pick 2 for Tippett.

They'd be very reluctant to give up Sam Day but a Tippett for Day and exchange of second rounders might be within the realms of possibility, they have a few developing talls and the prospect of adding an experienced tall in Tippett might outweigh their desire to hang onto Day.

Another possibility would be Tippett and our third or fourth rounder for Gorringe and GC's second rounder (Which would be pick 24 or 25 at this stage I believe.)

At Brisbane, they might be willing to give up their first rounder (Almost certain to be pick 6) but I think it's unlikely.
One of Polec/Redden is also an option, although I'd say Polec is the more likely of the two but they'd probably need to throw in a 2nd or 3rd round pick to get the deal done.

 

[craig crowing]

As for McIntosh, until injured he was the #1 ruck by a street at North Melbourne. Goldstein was playing in the 2's. The only reason Scott mentioned him playing forward as he didn't want to risk reinjuring the knee and therefore would have him play forward to save him from the centre square contests. Next year he will be North's #1 ruck, make no mistake.

Pretty sure remember McIntonsh was trade bait a few years ago.
Understand FB you worry about injured type players have to remember Smack had quiet a few injuries in short time at club. Then you have Otten Knights , Porps etc etc that want to keep that have lots of injuries as well.

 

[headache1]

How much more "young elite talent" do they need. They're already bringing in O'Meara without the draft pick. If they don't start bringing in players who can play at AFL level NOW, Ablett will be retired before they have a shot at a flag.

 

[Hollow Knight]

At Brisbane, they might be willing to give up their first rounder (Almost certain to be pick 6)

Try 8. Can't see how we could possibly get pick 6 from here.