Traded James Aish [traded to Collingwood for #26 and St Kilda's 2016 second round pick]

[iBeng]

Well, at least Tom Bell wants to be here at least, even if its for unfortunate circumstances. Wonder if that 2nd will be the 28 that Collingwood want from Adelaide or their other second. Would'nt be the one from the Freeman trade you'd think.

 

[Bic]

Well, at least Tom Bell wants to be here at least, even if its for unfortunate circumstances. Wonder if that 2nd will be the 28 that Collingwood want from Adelaide or their other second. Would'nt be the one from the Freeman trade you'd think.

This is a little bit side tracked - but can I ask what happened to Brisbane saying they wouldn't trade Aish at all? After all that to get a 2nd round pick only, I would be ropeable.

 

[iBeng]

This is a little bit side tracked - but can I ask what happened to Brisbane saying they wouldn't trade Aish at all? After all that to get a 2nd round pick only, I would be ropeable.

Who knows whats been said in the background. Things change in the trade period. As the example that is brought up quite a bit, and I know we dont like mentioning the B word here...but last year, Collingwood set a 5pm Friday deadline that was "If we dont get what we want from Beams from Brisbane by this time, we'll be looking to trade Beams elsewhere."

And in the end he got here.

Honestly, no one can really say whats happened internally. Leigh made his stance clear, Swan agreed, we got torched in the media for being cruel and heartless...Maybe the AFL had a word to us? Maybe the Players Association? Maybe even Leigh spoke with Aish and softened his approach?

The complications of the Academy picks now has probably also influenced this. And of course if the trade involves Tom Bell in any way then that would make sense why we softened our stance.

 

[dlanod]

This is a little bit side tracked - but can I ask what happened to Brisbane saying they wouldn't trade Aish at all? After all that to get a 2nd round pick only, I would be ropeable.

Probably the same thing that happens every year when clubs insist that player X is a required player, only to end up trading them - the club got offered a reasonable deal instead of just cents on the dollar.

 

[SnowRoo]

This is a little bit side tracked - but can I ask what happened to Brisbane saying they wouldn't trade Aish at all? After all that to get a 2nd round pick only, I would be ropeable.

Pretty much they decided to go for Bell, Bastinac and Astbury.

Those choices require more picks, Aish was the way to get those required picks.

Now it suits Bris to trade, they are not being forced to!

Ya dont slash the seats at a drive in!

 

[Vankri]

Probably the same thing that happens every year when clubs insist that player X is a required player, only to end up trading them - the club got offered a reasonable deal instead of just cents on the dollar.

No, this is different. Matthews spoke to Aish directly, telling him 'it's us or the draft', he wasn't speaking to Collingwood at the time but trying to make a stance to young players that they won't be able to leave Brisbane easily after two years.

Looks like it there was a lack of alignment on the stance and strategy between your board director / ceo / list manager as the media is now discussing potential trades and saying the negotiations are open.

 

[dlanod]

No, this is different. Matthews spoke to Aish directly, telling him 'it's us or the draft', he wasn't speaking to Collingwood at the time but trying to make a stance to young players that they won't be able to leave Brisbane easily after two years.

Looks like it there was a lack of alignment on the stance and strategy between your board director / ceo / list manager as the media is now discussing potential trades and saying the negotiations are open.

Sorry, I was wrong. Yes, it's a conspiracy theory where Brisbane is backflipping and miscommunicating and we're different from every other club. How could that have slipped my mind?

 

[Mick39]

Pickering said this morning the discussions are progressing well and it's only Coll for Aish still.

 

[PicaBoo]

Who knows whats been said in the background. Things change in the trade period. As the example that is brought up quite a bit, and I know we dont like mentioning the B word here...but last year, Collingwood set a 5pm Friday deadline that was "If we dont get what we want from Beams from Brisbane by this time, we'll be looking to trade Beams elsewhere."

And in the end he got here.

Honestly, no one can really say whats happened internally. Leigh made his stance clear, Swan agreed, we got torched in the media for being cruel and heartless...Maybe the AFL had a word to us? Maybe the Players Association? Maybe even Leigh spoke with Aish and softened his approach?

The complications of the Academy picks now has probably also influenced this. And of course if the trade involves Tom Bell in any way then that would make sense why we softened our stance.

All the above shouldn't have come as a surprise. A premeditated backflip is still one.
Disappointing compo I might give you although even that should have been factored in.

 

[iBeng]

All the above shouldn't have come as a surprise. A premeditated backflip is still one.
Disappointing compo I might give you although even that should have been factored in.

Back flips happen frequently enough in our game that crucifying us on the back of doing one that actually BENEFITS your club would be the height of stupidity if you ask me. Even more stupid than back flipping in the first place. Odds are Aish could be a very good 250+ games player for you.

 

[Vankri]

Sorry, I was wrong. Yes, it's a conspiracy theory where Brisbane is backflipping and miscommunicating and we're different from every other club. How could that have slipped my mind?

So you're going to use sarcasm to try and avoid the argument?

Can you really not see that your board director giving Aish an ultimatum one week before he nominates us that he has to choose between Brisbane and being sent to the draft, then this being re-iterated on the evening he chooses us, is vastly different to a club saying ' X is a required player'.

You made a stance but haven't followed up since (for various reasons, perhaps opportunities coming up on the market, the underwhelming compo, your list manager coming to his senses that it's a bad idea to lose players for nothing, etc.), and instead have opened negotiations in what seems a pretty amicable manner. Just seems very disconnected from what was originally meant to be a line in the sand moment.

 

[Scodog10]

Sorry, I was wrong. Yes, it's a conspiracy theory where Brisbane is backflipping and miscommunicating and we're different from every other club. How could that have slipped my mind?

The first half of that post was bang on the money the second part less accurate.

Aish was indeed told directly that he would not be traded under any circumstances. My take on what has taken place since then for there to be a shift in mindset is the opportunity to acquire both Bell and Bastinac has arisen plus the lowball compensation on Luenberger.

Edit: On a side note one thing it illustrates to me is that clubs shouldn't make definitive hardline stances because ground shifts this time of year Collingwood were burned by their stupid deadline last year and Matthews, whilst not to the same level of stupidity, looks like he'll come out of this worse for the comments.

 

[iBeng]

And in 12 months time everyone will forget this whole thing and we'll be focused on what other kid wants to go to Collingwood

 

[PicaBoo]

And in 12 months time everyone will forget this whole thing and we'll be focused on what other kid wants to leave Brisbane to go to Collingwood

EFA.

 

[dlanod]

The first half of that post was bang on the money the second part less accurate.

Aish was indeed told directly that he would not be traded under any circumstances. My take on what has taken place since then for there to be a shift in mindset is the opportunity to acquire both Bell and Bastinac has arisen plus the lowball compensation on Luenberger.

Edit: On a side note one thing it illustrates to me is that clubs shouldn't make definitive hardline stances because ground shifts this time of year Collingwood were burned by their stupid deadline last year and Matthews, whilst not to the same level of stupidity, looks like he'll come out of this worse for the comments.

I think Leigh went a bit early initially, but by the time he talked to Aish the Lions had already listened to informal approaches from Collingwood that were definitely on the low side. I don't think there was any point where Brisbane came out and told Collingwood to their face that there was no trade interest - rather it was all purely in the media.

Agree on the hard line statements - it does come across a bit silly. Ultimately though 99% of AFL followers won't remember it in two weeks time. It will live forever in BF history though, and will inevitably be brought back up next time there's Collingwood-Brisbane trade discussions. Edit: I know this because I take full blame/credit for digging up and republicising the equivalent line from Eade and the Collingwood press release.

 

[Vankri]

I think Leigh went a bit early initially, but by the time he talked to Aish the Lions had already listened to informal approaches from Collingwood that were definitely on the low side. I don't think there was any point where Brisbane came out and told Collingwood to their face that there was no trade interest - rather it was all purely in the media.

Agree on the hard line statements - it does come across a bit silly. Ultimately though 99% of AFL followers won't remember it in two weeks time. It will live forever in BF history though, and will inevitably be brought back up next time there's Collingwood-Brisbane trade discussions. Edit: I know this because I take full blame/credit for digging up and republicising the equivalent line from Eade and the Collingwood press release.

Your own CEO went on radio and alluded to the fact that talks hadn't begun with Collingwood because we needed to work on the Treloar trade first. Where do you get that we made 'informal approaches that were definitely on the low side'?

 

[iBeng]

EFA.

What a scoop it'll be when you get...Um...Who hasnt signed on until at least 2017 and is from Victoria...Huh, no one, maybe try the year after I guess?

 

[dlanod]

Your own CEO went on radio and alluded to the fact that talks hadn't begun with Collingwood because we needed to work on the Treloar trade first. Where do you get that we made 'informal approaches that were definitely on the low side'?

Word other than the public posturing of our club.

And while I say "on the low side", that's not meant as a pejorative. It's a negotiation, so it was to be expected.

 

[dlanod]

What a scoop it'll be when you get...Um...Who hasnt signed on until at least 2017 and is from Victoria...Huh, no one, maybe try the year after I guess?

Aish isn't from Victoria.

 

[iBeng]

Aish isn't from Victoria.

Shit, forgot that, just so used to kids using the "Home" excuse. Typical Lions supporter!

 

[PicaBoo]

What a scoop it'll be when you get...Um...Who hasnt signed on until at least 2017 and is from Victoria...Huh, no one, maybe try the year after I guess?

Who said anything about contracts? Don't let those get in the way of demanding a move. You should know that by now

 

[iBeng]

Who said anything about contracts? Don't let those get in the way of demanding a move. You should know that by now

Contracts are like Saloon doors, they open both ways and sometimes need some WD-40 to stop the squeak. And you can see peoples heads and ankles but nothing else. Also made of wood.

Im not sure where I was going with that analogy.

 

[PieLebo87]

I've seen a fair bit - a few of his U18 games and then his Lions games obviously. He doesn't really have a weapon and I wouldn't consider him elite in any particular respect but he's almost certain to rack up 200 games and look pretty good doing so as he's also got very few knocks on him. His best role to date is really spreading the ball from a contest or out on a wing, as he's had reasonable endurance for a rookie/second year player. Don't bother throwing him inside. A bit weedy but again - rookie/second year. The best Lions' comparisons I can think of are Simon Black minus his fantastic in and under work, or Redden minus his tackling but with more aggressive and better disposal. Aish just knows how to play football.

Worthy of 2 second rounders or mainly potential atm?

 

[Vankri]

Word other than the public posturing of our club.

And while I say "on the low side", that's not meant as a pejorative. It's a negotiation, so it was to be expected.

OK so negotiations went as they always have and always will in this business. So the whole 'we'll scare Aish with the draft threats so that Collingwood overpays' or 'we'll make a big stance about not trading our young talent for the future benefit of the club' was never really a thing, was it.

Just seems like very strange and strategically clumsy looking at the stance from your highest execs in retrospect when all we're hearing at the moment is negotiations are underway we'll pay something like 2 x 2nd rounders.

 

[Scodog10]

I think Leigh went a bit early initially, but by the time he talked to Aish the Lions had already listened to informal approaches from Collingwood that were definitely on the low side. I don't think there was any point where Brisbane came out and told Collingwood to their face that there was no trade interest - rather it was all purely in the media.

Agree on the hard line statements - it does come across a bit silly. Ultimately though 99% of AFL followers won't remember it in two weeks time. It will live forever in BF history though, and will inevitably be brought back up next time there's Collingwood-Brisbane trade discussions. Edit: I know this because I take full blame/credit for digging up and republicising the equivalent line from Eade and the Collingwood press release.

The initial stance was provided to James in his exit interview. It's why he took so long to make up his mind because they were deadly ****ing serious when they made the statement so Pickering and Aish needed to sit down to discuss the likelihood of getting to where he wanted. It was well before Collingwood entered into things.

Selling it as Leigh/ Brisbane v Collingwood/ Pickering is good for the papers when in reality it was far from that. It's been fun to speculate on and get the banter going, but each party will win out of it. Except North...