Society/Culture Why I blame Islam for the fact it's raining today....

[Number37]

...even I would treat every individual, including Muslims, with respect...

I call BS on your claim...
In support of my argument I present Exhibit A:

... Muslims are the most bigoted and intolerant people in the world....

 

[douglyzia]

I call BS on your claim...
In support of my argument I present Exhibit A:

There is a difference between how you perceive a group of people based on their beliefs and behavior compared to how you would treat them on an individual basis.

I'm not gonna be a douchebag to someone just because he's Muslim, unlike that Muslim Olympian. That's not going to change the fact that it can be proven that Muslims are the most bigoted and intolerant people collectively in this world.

 

[JackOutback]

You just tarred a billion people with a single brush because of the actions of a few individuals. It was a dictionary definition of bigotry.

 

[douglyzia]

You just tarred a billion people with a single brush because of the actions of a few individuals. It was a dictionary definition of bigotry.

I'm not here to tar anyone with any brush. I'm not saying every single damn Muslim is a bigot. I'm just stating the fact that Muslims as a collective are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world. Their religion itself preaches bigotry and intolerance. That is a fact.

And I think Islam el-Shehaby was under pressure from much more than just "a few individuals" when he refused to shake the hand of his Israeli opponent in what was perhaps one of the most blatant acts of bigotry we've ever witnessed, just to prove my point.

When are you Islam-apologists going to understand that many us are actually opposed to Islam BECAUSE we are AGAINST bigotry and intolerance?

 

[Number37]

I'm not here to tar anyone with any brush. I'm not saying every single damn Muslim is a bigot. I'm just stating the fact that Muslims as a collective are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world. Their religion itself preaches bigotry and intolerance. That is a fact.

And I think Islam el-Shehaby was under pressure from much more than just "a few individuals" when he refused to shake the hand of his Israeli opponent in what was perhaps one of the most blatant acts of bigotry we've ever witnessed, just to prove my point.

When are you Islam-apologists going to understand that many us are actually opposed to Islam BECAUSE we are AGAINST bigotry and intolerance?

By removing all doubt you proved your point.

 

[douglyzia]

By removing all doubt you proved your point.

Yes, because a Muslim man just demonstrated his Islamic bigotry for all the world to see, and you're here whining about me pointing it out rather than being critical of what he did.

Are you denying that Muslims are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world?

 

[Number37]

Yes, because a Muslim man just demonstrated his Islamic bigotry for all the world to see, and you're here whining about me pointing it out rather than being critical of what he did.

Are you denying that Muslims are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world?

You've already said all that, got anything to add or are you just going to keep repeating the same thing over and over?

 

[DemonTim]

So do you agree with me that Muslims are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world?

Depends what you consider a group

 

[Number37]

So a Muslim man commits a blatant act of Islamic bigotry, but I'm an even bigger bigot than he is for pointing out the source of his bigotry? Ok. Very nice logic.

Your bigotry stands by itself without reference to anyone else's bigotry. You are the only one trying to justify it by reference to someone else's bigotry.

 

[DemonTim]

Can I just confirm that the only argument against "Muslims are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world." is "You're a bigot."?

Well no. That's the only posts you're replying to. As I said it depends on what you consider a group

 

[chelseacarlton]

I fear Apostasy for those that chose to leave.
Does this belong in any other religions,or is it just central to Islam?

 

[Rob]

FFS, does anyone even know what bigotry is?

It's not simply someone that doesn't share the same opinion as you do.

 

[CM86]

So a Muslim man commits a blatant act of Islamic bigotry, but I'm an even bigger bigot than he is for pointing out the source of his bigotry? Ok. Very nice logic.

Saying that 'A Muslim man" (single person) committed a blatant act of bigotry, therefor "Muslims are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world.", is not a fair statement.

You would need a lot more to support that claim.
I know a few Muslims and nearly all of them are very tolerant.
Is it fair to lump them into being the most intolerant and bigoted group of the people in the world?

For me, bigotry is judging an entire people by the actions of a few.
Blanket statements about Aboriginal people, based on the interactions of a few in a certain area. I would find that bigoted.
Calling Aboriginals stupid, because they don't have the Western number system. That would be a bigoted comment.

That kind of thing.

So, I would say that condemning an entire people, as you have done multiple times over the last couple of pages, based on the actions of one man, is bigoted.


Do you think that, in general, Australian Muslims are the most intolerant and bigoted group of people in Australia?

 

[douglyzia]

Saying that 'A Muslim man" (single person) committed a blatant act of bigotry, therefor "Muslims are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world.", is not a fair statement

That's not what I said. I am saying this is just one example of Muslim bigotry that is rampant.

Need I remind you that virtually all Christians and Jews have been wiped out from most of the Arab world (bar Israel)?

I know a few Muslims and nearly all of them are very tolerant

Saying that "I know a few Muslims" (small number) who "are very tolerant", therefor (sic) "Muslims are, in general, very tolerant", is not a fair statement (sic)

Can you ask your Muslim friends what they think of Israel and the Jews? Should make for some interesting discussion.

Is it fair to lump them into being the most intolerant and bigoted group of the people in the world?

I am not lumping every Muslim, so your point is redundant.

So, I would say that condemning an entire people, as you have done multiple times over the last couple of pages, based on the actions of one man, is bigoted.

Well, based on your logic, wouldn't you be considered a bigot then for effectively saying that an entire group of people are tolerant based on the actions of "a few Muslims"?

So, it's ok to make blanket statements on a whole group of people, "based on the interactions of a few in a certain area" as long as it's a complimentary statement. How does that work?

And again, my statement is based on the effective genocide of Christians and Jews in the Arab world. What Mr. Islam el-Shehaby did is but a microcosm of the wider issue.

Do you think that, in general, Australian Muslims are the most intolerant and bigoted group of people in Australia?

We are already seeing some issues with the community at 2% of the population. For example, at just 2% of the population, they are responsible for 100% of terrorism in this country this decade. I'd rather not find out what will happen when that population reaches 5% or more.

So people, let's recap:

To say that Muslims, in general, are bigoted and intolerant based on the genocide of Christians and Jews in the Middle East, that is bigoted.

To say that Muslims, in general, are very tolerant based on "a few Muslims", that is ok.

Love that logic.

By the way, here is some breaking news for: Two men charged with childcare fraud in multi-million-dollar counter-terrorism investigation

 

[DemonTim]

That's not what I said. I am saying this is just one example of Muslim bigotry that is rampant.

Need I remind you that virtually all Christians and Jews have been wiped out from most of the Arab world (bar Israel)?



Saying that "I know a few Muslims" (small number) who "are very tolerant", therefor (sic) "Muslims are, in general, very tolerant", is not a fair statement (sic)

Can you ask your Muslim friends what they think of Israel and the Jews? Should make for some interesting discussion.



I am not lumping every Muslim, so your point is redundant.



Well, based on your logic, wouldn't you be considered a bigot then for effectively saying that an entire group of people are tolerant based on the actions of "a few Muslims"?

So, it's ok to make blanket statements on a whole group of people, "based on the interactions of a few in a certain area" as long as it's a complimentary statement. How does that work?

And again, my statement is based on the effective genocide of Christians and Jews in the Arab world. What Mr. Islam el-Shehaby did is but a microcosm of the wider issue.



We are already seeing some issues with the community at 2% of the population. For example, at just 2% of the population, they are responsible for 100% of terrorism in this country this decade. I'd rather not find out what will happen when that population reaches 5% or more.

So people, let's recap:

To say that Muslims, in general, are bigoted and intolerant based on the genocide of Christians and Jews in the Middle East, that is bigoted.

To say that Muslims, in general, are very tolerant based on "a few Muslims", that is ok.

Love that logic.

By the way, here is some breaking news for: Two men charged with childcare fraud in multi-million-dollar counter-terrorism investigation

Not arguing the rest of what you're saying, but you do realise the very definition of bigotry refers to negative statements yeah? You can't say something positive and be a bigot.

 

[skilts]

Can I just confirm that the only argument against "Muslims are, in general, the most bigoted and intolerant group of people in the world." is "You're a bigot."?

Another argument might be that the statement is so vague and generalised as to be rendered meaningless.

 

[CM86]

That's not what I said. I am saying this is just one example of Muslim bigotry that is rampant.

Need I remind you that virtually all Christians and Jews have been wiped out from most of the Arab world (bar Israel)?

That is what you said. I actually quoted you.

Saying that "I know a few Muslims" (small number) who "are very tolerant", therefor (sic) "Muslims are, in general, very tolerant", is not a fair statement (sic)

Which is why I didn't make that statement.
What I did do, was to reject your statement, and explain why I rejected it.

Can you ask your Muslim friends what they think of Israel and the Jews? Should make for some interesting discussion.

Sure, I've talked about it with some of them. Some are confused about the situation in Israel, some hate what they believe Israel is doing, but none of them hate all Jews because of Israel.
Some hate the Israeli politicians, some hate the defense force, some hate all Israelis.

I am not lumping every Muslim, so your point is redundant.

You said 'in general'. So my point is very valid.

Well, based on your logic, wouldn't you be considered a bigot then for effectively saying that an entire group of people are tolerant based on the actions of "a few Muslims"?

So, it's ok to make blanket statements on a whole group of people, "based on the interactions of a few in a certain area" as long as it's a complimentary statement. How does that work?

I think you're being ridiculous. Deliberately so.
The main reason being that I didn't make that statement.

And again, my statement is based on the effective genocide of Christians and Jews in the Arab world. What Mr. Islam el-Shehaby did is but a microcosm of the wider issue.

Well you repeatedly made the statement due to "A Muslim man" before. Which is what I took issue with.

We are already seeing some issues with the community at 2% of the population. For example, at just 2% of the population, they are responsible for 100% of terrorism in this country this decade. I'd rather not find out what will happen when that population reaches 5% or more.

Fear of the unknown.
I think this is why you avoided my question about Australian Muslims.
Because a discussion of actual Australian Muslims would be more reasonable and there would be less hysterics.

Needing to connect IS with Australian Muslims, and then draw perceived correlations between the two, to initiate fear and misunderstanding, is a ploy.
And I believe it is a ploy used by actual bigots to hide among us.

There are a lot of people who have picked up on this fear, and have genuine concerns because of it. I don't think they are bigots, I think they misunderstand a very complex issue.
But there are bigots among them who add as much fuel to the fire as possible.

So people, let's recap:

To say that Muslims, in general, are bigoted and intolerant based on the genocide of Christians and Jews in the Middle East, that is bigoted.

To say that Muslims, in general, are very tolerant based on "a few Muslims", that is ok.

Love that logic.

By the way, here is some breaking news for: Two men charged with childcare fraud in multi-million-dollar counter-terrorism investigation

That isn't a recap.
A recap is a summary of what had been said.
You added new information into your recap, to change the dialog. You also included a strawman.
It's disingenuous.

 

[Lakeside Swan]

How nice

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...me-Islam-taking-part.html?ito=social-facebook

But lets just have a one sided discussion about bigotry shall we? the bigotry in the islamic world is astound at times.

They're never going to get along. The Arab nations just don't have the ability to forgive and forget.

 

[fleabitten]

It's not the only incident at these games either. The Lebanese team refused to share a bus with Israelis, blocking the door so that they couldn't board. A Saudi female judoka faked an injury to avoid an Israeli opponent. Before the Olympics, in the qualifying stages, a Syrian boxer did the same. Same stuff happened in London as well.

 

[Lakeside Swan]

You just tarred a billion people with a single brush because of the actions of a few individuals. It was a dictionary definition of bigotry.

Firstly, that is not the definition of bigotry. It's the definition of a generalization. Seriously, if your going the label people as a racist or bigot you need to know what they mean beforehand.

Secondly, don't you understand the difference between a generalized comment about a group of people and a comment stating that ALL people are like that? This has been pointed out to you a million (yes don't take me literally) times and you are unable to comprehend this. Saying "Muslims are the most bigoted and intolerant people in the world" is completely different to saying "ALL Muslims are bigoted and intolerant".

Given the fact that Muslims have been constantly fighting with each other and nearly everyone else in the world ever since their religion was born and that currently large proportions of them want to murder infidels and other Muslims who don't fit their sect it seems like a fair statement don't you think? Disagree if you want but don't call those you disagree with bigots.

 

[Lakeside Swan]

It's not the only incident at these games either. The Lebanese team refused to share a bus with Israelis, blocking the door so that they couldn't board. A Saudi female judoka faked an injury to avoid an Israeli opponent. Before the Olympics, in the qualifying stages, a Syrian boxer did the same. Same stuff happened in London as well.

Imagine the outrage if a white man did that to a black man or a Muslim man. There would be hell to pay but for some reason certain groups are allowed to get away with it. Hypocrisy of the left.

 

[DemonTim]

You still don't understand the definition of bigot do you? I'm sick of repeating myself.

How about pointing out what was wrong with the definition, instead of just making post after post saying "you're wrong" to everyone.
Please advise how what I said was at odds with:
a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices;especially: one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

Are you saying you can be a positive bigot? You can make positive bigoted statements?

 

[DemonTim]

If you refer to the numerous times I've done this in my previous posts you'll see my answer. I don't need to repeat myself.

No You haven't. My point was in relation to the comment:

Well, based on your logic, wouldn't you be considered a bigot then for effectively saying that an entire group of people are tolerant based on the actions of "a few Muslims"?

So, it's ok to make blanket statements on a whole group of people, "based on the interactions of a few in a certain area" as long as it's a complimentary statement. How does that work?

To which I responded:

Not arguing the rest of what you're saying, but you do realise the very definition of bigotry refers to negative statements yeah? You can't say something positive and be a bigot.

None of your previous posts address this, so i'll ask the question again:

Please advise how what I said was at odds with:
a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices;especially: one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

Are you saying you can be a positive bigot? You can make positive bigoted statements?

 

[JackOutback]

Firstly, that is not the definition of bigotry. It's the definition of a generalization. Seriously, if your going the label people as a racist or bigot you need to know what they mean beforehand.

Secondly, don't you understand the difference between a generalized comment about a group of people and a comment stating that ALL people are like that? This has been pointed out to you a million (yes don't take me literally) times and you are unable to comprehend this. Saying "Muslims are the most bigoted and intolerant people in the world" is completely different to saying "ALL Muslims are bigoted and intolerant".

Given the fact that Muslims have been constantly fighting with each other and nearly everyone else in the world ever since their religion was born and that currently large proportions of them want to murder infidels and other Muslims who don't fit their sect it seems like a fair statement don't you think? Disagree if you want but don't call those you disagree with bigots.

Did you just spend an entire post playing semantics over something that was obviously a turn of phrase itself? I have a dictionary, I am aware that the listed definition of bigotry is not 'a post on Big Footy describing Muslms as the most intolerant people in the world because of the actions of a few'. It's still bigoted though, as most generalisations, based on race or religion are.

 

[Ruck Machine]

Islamic Intolerance
Homophobia - Check
Misogyny - Check
Anti-Semetic - Check
Anti-Democracy - Check

What other religion can hit this intolerant quadrella on such an consistent basis?

Note: Islam does not equal Muslim.

Islam is an indisputably intolerant ideology ... this does not mean all Muslims are intolerant!

Also people seem to be forgetting that of the 1.6 Billion Muslims in the world 37% (600 Million) are illiterate ... illiteracy and intolerance go hand in hand.