2016 Draft discussion

[Kevvo]

According to Leppa it's best to get as many games into the kids as quickly as you can.

I think the context suggests that's to be taken as 'in our situation', where we're coming from a starting list that the coach (rightly or wrongly) judges to be poor and in need of a fast overhaul. The best strategy may be completely different where you have a strong senior list who condition good habits into the kids that play alongside them.

 

[jackess]

I think it's different for different players. Obviously there would have been no point in playing Archie in his first season but others like Taylor or Mayes looked quite good in their first season. It didn't stop them stagnating for a couple of seasons though.

Leppa has been keen to get games into them though with varying degrees of success.

 

[Kevvo]

I think it's different for different players. Obviously there would have been no point in playing Archie in his first season but others like Taylor or Mayes looked quite good in their first season. It didn't stop them stagnating for a couple of seasons though.

Leppa has been keen to get games into them though with varying degrees of success.

Yeah, I think that's right. I guess the challenge is knowing which players will benefit by early games before getting those games into them. I don't have a strong view on whether we're any good at that, although I think there are some interesting contrasting examples:

• as you say, we waited a long time to play Archie and he made an immediate impact
• Cutler has been in and out of the side until his third year, but looks to be improving consistently now at a good rate.
• in contrast, Mayes and Andrews have largely been kept in the side while they worked through form slumps (obviously Harris's slump was shorter and probably less severe), and have both really come on as the season has improved.

Taylor is the glaring example of someone who hasn't developed as expected, but I can only hope he may be a Mayes type that just needs some time.

 

[bungalow_bill]

Is it true that SPS is a Lions fan?

 

[JasRulz63]

Is it true that SPS is a Lions fan?

Someone mentioned on here that he's a Lions supporter and Cal Twomey's also said so in his podcast.

 

[James North]

Someone mentioned on here that he's a Lions supporter and Cal Twomey's also said so in his podcast.

So Cal reads BigFooty - interesting ...

 

[WA Lion]

Is it true that SPS is a Lions fan?

Someone mentioned on here that he's a Lions supporter and Cal Twomey's also said so in his podcast.

Yeah that was me, can confirm he is a Lions fan and was a particularly avid follower of Simon Black. I don't think who they support has an enormous impact on where they want to go though. He has spent a lot of time in WA and Freo are very keen on him also

 

[lionshine]

Andrew McGrath with 40 touches and a goal in the TAC Cup over the weekend. Second time this year he has had 40+ touches at TAC level. He has elite endurance so he has that ability to run all day and find the footy but he is also very quick and likes to break the lines which makes him an exciting prospect as he can do damage with each possession. His metre's gained stats will be crazy with his ability to find the footy, run for 10m-20m and then kick long.

I expect him to become a top class HBF at worst in the AFL and at best he will become a top class midfielder and I think his chances are quite high of transitioning into the AFL as a midfielder successfully. He possesses a great work ethic, he is very professional and he has fantastic leadership ability as both the Vic Metro captain and being School Captain. His disposal isn't elite but he is a good kick in my opinion and pretty reliable. Due to his high work rate, endurance and experience playing as a small defender in which he has shown a desire to defend well and tackle hard if he does become a midfielder at AFL level I think he'll be a two way runner who contributes both offensively and defensively which is essential in the modern game.

He has been one of his favourites all year and each day the idea of us selecting him with pick 2 grows on me.

 

[lionshine]

Stats for this weekend just gone (Once again I've only listed the more well known prospects).

WA prospects:

Sam Petrevski-Seton(Colts): 26 disposals, 3 marks, 7 tackles.

Sam Powell-Pepper(WAFL): 11 disposals, 2 goals, 6 marks, 2 tackles.

Shai Bolton(Colts): 20 disposals, 7 goals, 3 marks, 1 tackle.

Jeremy Goddard(Colts): 11 disposals, 5 marks, 1 goal, 52 hit-outs.

TAC Cup:

Jarrod Berry: 17 disposals, 5 marks, 4 tackles.

Hugh McCluggage: 29 disposals, 2 goals, 5 marks, 4 tackles.

Willem Drew: 30 disposals, 7 marks, 9 tackles.

Cedric Cox: 17 disposals, 7 marks.

Jarrod Korewha: 5 disposals, 1 mark, 1 tackle.

Dylan Clarke: 33 disposals, 4 marks, 9 tackles.

Jordan Gallucci: 19 disposals, 2 goals, 4 marks, 7 tackles.

Zac Sproule: 13 disposals, 1 goal, 6 marks, 4 tackles.

Will Brodie: 20 disposals, 3 marks, 2 tackles.

Esava Ratugolea: 19 disposals, 3 marks, 7 tackles, 10 hit-outs.

Todd Marshall: 10 disposals, 1 goal, 3 marks, 3 tackles.

Pat Kerr: 7 disposals, 1 goal, 4 marks, 1 tackle.

Ben Ainsworth: 26 disposals, 3 goals, 6 marks, 6 tackles.

Andrew McGrath: 40 disposals, 1 goal, 5 marks, 3 tackles.

Will Setterfield: 29 disposals, 2 goals, 3 tackles.

Oliver Florent: 16 disposals, 1 goal, 5 marks, 5 tackles.

Tim Taranto: 33 disposals, 1 goal, 9 marks, 8 tackles.

Hamish Brayshaw: 17 disposals, 4 goals, 8 marks, 2 tackles.

Jack Scrimshaw: 21 disposals, 1 goal, 1 mark, 2 tackles.

Myles Poholke: 21 disposals, 2 goals, 6 marks, 3 tackles.

Josh Battle: 7 disposals, 1 goal, 4 marks, 3 tackles.




2017 prospects:

Jaidyn Stephenson: 17 disposals, 1 goal, 2 marks, 3 tackles.

Sam Hayes: 11 disposals, 1 mark, 2 tackles, 19 hit-outs.

Jack Higgins: 31 disposals, 5 marks, 7 tackles.

Charlie Spargo: 17 disposals, 5 marks, 2 tackles.

Lachie O'Brien: 24 disposals, 3 marks, 2 tackles.

Hunter Clark: 13 disposals, 2 marks, 3 tackles.

James Worpel: 19 disposals, 3 marks, 8 tackles.

Cassidy Parish: 22 disposals, 1 mark, 2 tackles.

 

[M Malice]

hi lionshine why would players like SPS and Bolton be playing in the colts, surely they would be up to WAFL reserves level at this stage of their development? has SPS played much in the WAFL seniors and how did he go? is he being over rated due to playing in the lower levels?

 

[lionshine]

hi lionshine why would players like SPS and Bolton be playing in the colts, surely they would be up to WAFL reserves level at this stage of their development? has SPS played much in the WAFL seniors and how did he go? is he being over rated due to playing in the lower levels?

There are a variety of reasons I'd say with the main one being the WAFL is a legitimate competition that the clubs take seriously and they want to win the premiership so they'll only pick players who they think deserve a spot in their side and who they think can help them win. Sam Powell-Pepper has a bigger frame compared to SPS/Bolton and is ready to play against men whereas someone as skinny as Bolton probably isn't.

SPS absence from the WAFL most likely has to do with his injury interrupted year considering he played 3 league matches last season. If he'd had a good run at it I'd say he would have made the step up by now.

 

[Gibbo_88]

lionshine appreciate your work in putting together all the stats . Perhaps I'm asking too much but it would also be interesting to see the context that the better rated players are getting their 40 possession games etc such as if it was in a close game or big win or loss.

 

[lionshine]

lionshine appreciate your work in putting together all the stats . Perhaps I'm asking too much but it would also be interesting to see the context that the better rated players are getting their 40 possession games etc such as if it was in a close game or big win or loss.

Yep that is fair enough. You'll notice all the Sandringham Dragons players racked up some handy stat lines this week and the Dragons had a big win. So context is always important. What I'll do is post this link below which provides all the results from this weekends games

http://www.foxsportspulse.com/comp_info.cgi?a=ROUND&round=17&client=1-3020-0-392810-0&pool=1

 

[M Malice]

lionshine taking into account who is likely to be available who would you be going for at this stage with our picks 2, 20 and 28 if our academy boys are not bid on before then.

 

[lionshine]

lionshine taking into account who is likely to be available who would you be going for at this stage with our picks 2, 20 and 28 if our academy boys are not bid on before then.

Too hard to say for picks 20-28 although I am a fan of the likes of Bolton, Drew, Berry, Simpkin ect. who I think could fall into that 15-30 range. Pick 2 I still rate McCluggage and SPS as my preferred 2 who I can't split, however, I think Ainsworth and McGrath have closed the gap in the last couple weeks. I am such a big fan of Andrew McGrath and I see him as someone who is as close to a sure thing as you can get so I would be very, very happy if we walked away from the draft with him. McCluggage's potential is massive and would be hard to pass up but would the Bombers forgo the opportunity to take him considering he has been the clear standout this year? SPS is just so classy and yet isn't afraid to get his hands dirty on the inside of the contest as well. From what I saw from him as an underager he is one of the best U18 players I've ever seen, however, he hasn't really continued on with that this season due to injury interruptions among other things so it is hard to say with him. Ainsworth is such a game breaker you couldn't help but be extremely excited if we added him. I do tend to think that you wouldn't want to bypass selecting McCluggage to select him though. Brodie will be a good AFL player with the ability to become great in a similar manner to someone like Cripps but I feel like the other 4 have bigger potential and the go home factor surrounding Brodie obviously turns me off massively.

With that in mind I think my preferences at pick 2 in order would be:

1. McClugage
2. Petrevski-Seton
3. McGrath
4. Ainsworth

 

[M Malice]

Too hard to say for picks 20-28 although I am a fan of the likes of Bolton, Drew, Berry, Simpkin ect. who I think could fall into that 15-30 range. Pick 2 I still rate McCluggage and SPS as my preferred 2 who I can't split, however, I think Ainsworth and McGrath have closed the gap in the last couple weeks. I am such a big fan of Andrew McGrath and I see him as someone who is as close to a sure thing as you can get so I would be very, very happy if we walked away from the draft with him. McCluggage's potential is massive and would be hard to pass up but would the Bombers forgo the opportunity to take him considering he has been the clear standout this year? SPS is just so classy and yet isn't afraid to get his hands dirty on the inside of the contest as well. From what I saw from him as an underager he is one of the best U18 players I've ever seen, however, he hasn't really continued on with that this season due to injury interruptions among other things so it is hard to say with him. Ainsworth is such a game breaker you couldn't help but be extremely excited if we added him. I do tend to think that you wouldn't want to bypass selecting McCluggage to select him though. Brodie will be a good AFL player with the ability to become great in a similar manner to someone like Cripps but I feel like the other 4 have bigger potential and the go home factor surrounding Brodie obviously turns me off massively.

With that in mind I think my preferences at pick 2 in order would be:

1. McClugage
2. Petrevski-Seton
3. McGrath
4. Ainsworth

thanks for that. sounds like a great draft to get a PP or to somehow trade up to another top pick

 

[Len S]

hi lionshine why would players like SPS and Bolton be playing in the colts, surely they would be up to WAFL reserves level at this stage of their development? has SPS played much in the WAFL seniors and how did he go? is he being over rated due to playing in the lower levels?

Very wary of the current W.A offerings,having watched their teams at the last 2 champs.Full of receivers.

 

[Len S]

Too hard to say for picks 20-28 although I am a fan of the likes of Bolton, Drew, Berry, Simpkin ect. who I think could fall into that 15-30 range. Pick 2 I still rate McCluggage and SPS as my preferred 2 who I can't split, however, I think Ainsworth and McGrath have closed the gap in the last couple weeks. I am such a big fan of Andrew McGrath and I see him as someone who is as close to a sure thing as you can get so I would be very, very happy if we walked away from the draft with him. McCluggage's potential is massive and would be hard to pass up but would the Bombers forgo the opportunity to take him considering he has been the clear standout this year? SPS is just so classy and yet isn't afraid to get his hands dirty on the inside of the contest as well. From what I saw from him as an underager he is one of the best U18 players I've ever seen, however, he hasn't really continued on with that this season due to injury interruptions among other things so it is hard to say with him. Ainsworth is such a game breaker you couldn't help but be extremely excited if we added him. I do tend to think that you wouldn't want to bypass selecting McCluggage to select him though. Brodie will be a good AFL player with the ability to become great in a similar manner to someone like Cripps but I feel like the other 4 have bigger potential and the go home factor surrounding Brodie obviously turns me off massively.

With that in mind I think my preferences at pick 2 in order would be:

1. McClugage
2. Petrevski-Seton
3. McGrath
4. Ainsworth

S P S was not too keen on the inside at the nationals ,Venables and co.made a mess of him.

 

[jjami15]

S P S was not too keen on the inside at the nationals ,Venables and co.made a mess of him.

I know that you're a fan and also know him but why should we draft Ainsworth at pick 2 instead of someone else? Nothing sinister but I know that he's got a bit of mongrel in him and that is something we lack so just curious. The part I really am struggling their year especially at this time of the is not being very certain of a player I would like especially at our first.

 

[lionshine]

S P S was not too keen on the inside at the nationals ,Venables and co.made a mess of him.

I disagree. He got in and won the hard ball at the contest on multiple occasions at times showcasing that aspect of his game beautifully.

 

[dmac_55]

I disagree. He got in and won the hard ball at the contest on multiple occasions at times showcasing that aspect of his game beautifully.

I think he could be Cyril light.. Had a knack of finding the ball in tight and quick sidesteps and good vision to feed out a handball into space.. He won't dominate at contested ball but will be able to win enough 1 on 1s for it to not be a significant weaknes

 

[dmac_55]

With regards to drafting strategy I am interested in people's thoughts on grabbing inside mids V outside mids.. Is it harder to find a classy outside who can use the ball and create space with breakaway speed?

Or is it harder to find the coal face warrior that is super in the contest and feeds the ball outside to runners and users?

I have a feeling that you can get the grunt work mid later in drafts or through trading much easier than the classy skilled outside mid..

This is not taking Into consideration players that excel in both categories (Bont, Parker etc.).

I can think of more success stories of inside mids being traded in to a club than the skilled outside users..

 

[M Malice]

With regards to drafting strategy I am interested in people's thoughts on grabbing inside mids V outside mids.. Is it harder to find a classy outside who can use the ball and create space with breakaway speed?

Or is it harder to find the coal face warrior that is super in the contest and feeds the ball outside to runners and users?

I have a feeling that you can get the grunt work mid later in drafts or through trading much easier than the classy skilled outside mid..

This is not taking Into consideration players that excel in both categories (Bont, Parker etc.).

I can think of more success stories of inside mids being traded in to a club than the skilled outside users..

agree with all of that and to make the decision easier for us this year i feel the outside pace/elite ball use type is what we are lacking and should go for. the only one we have who is anywhere near eilite at present is Zorko, Hanley was but he has been seriously down this year.

hence i would be going for either McCluggage or SPS with our pick 2. Jy Simpkin/Shai Bolton may fit the bill for our pick 20 although if an elite outside player is not available i like the sound of W.Drew an inside player who could be available at 20.

 

[ManeMan]

agree with all of that and to make the decision easier for us this year i feel the outside pace/elite ball use type is what we are lacking and should go for. the only one we have who is anywhere near eilite at present is Zorko, Hanley was but he has been seriously down this year.

hence i would be going for either McCluggage or SPS with our pick 2. Jy Simpkin/Shai Bolton may fit the bill for our pick 20 although if an elite outside player is not available i like the sound of W.Drew an inside player who could be available at 20.

I like the look of Drew too. Doesn't seem to be rated too highly in many of the phantom drafts, other than KM's, or by Cal Twomey. May not get selected until much later than 20. Who knows where the club recruiters would have him though. I liked the look of him in the champs in the 3 games that he played; has a really clean set of hands and takes some nice marks above his head. Is the prototypical size for the modern day midfielder. Has been doing really well at TAC cup level too, getting into the bests most weekends including this weekend where he was apparently BOG. I'm hoping Allison slides out of the top 30 and we can take Drew with pick 28.

I haven't seen anything of Jy Simpkin other than some underager highlights, but looks a natural small forward. I still think this is something we are in need of. Other than Green, all of our small forwards are maufactured i.e Christensen, Taylor, who are more natural smaller midfielders and not really that effective around goals. What worries me about Simpkin and Bolton is their defensive ability. Bolton sometimes gets a run in the midfield for the colts, but would really be playing as a small forward for us, at least initially. His tackle numbers aren't that impressive. Simpkin i can't comment on. We already have Taylor and Green who won't tackle. At the moment, i'd lean towards us taking Simpkin as he was by all reports a top 10 pick before breaking his leg, no small feat as a small forward.

If we walk away from this draft with Mcluggage/SPS, Simpkin, Drew, Allison and Watson I'd be stoked.

 

[M Malice]

I like the look of Drew too. Doesn't seem to be rated too highly in many of the phantom drafts, other than KM's, or by Cal Twomey. May not get selected until much later than 20. Who knows where the club recruiters would have him though. I liked the look of him in the champs in the 3 games that he played; has a really clean set of hands and takes some nice marks above his head. Is the prototypical size for the modern day midfielder. Has been doing really well at TAC cup level too, getting into the bests most weekends including this weekend where he was apparently BOG. I'm hoping Allison slides out of the top 30 and we can take Drew with pick 28.

I haven't seen anything of Jy Simpkin other than some underager highlights, but looks a natural small forward. I still think this is something we are in need of. Other than Green, all of our small forwards are maufactured i.e Christensen, Taylor, who are more natural smaller midfielders and not really that effective around goals. What worries me about Simpkin and Bolton is their defensive ability. Bolton sometimes gets a run in the midfield for the colts, but would really be playing as a small forward for us, at least initially. His tackle numbers aren't that impressive. Simpkin i can't comment on. We already have Taylor and Green who won't tackle. At the moment, i'd lean towards us taking Simpkin as he was by all reports a top 10 pick before breaking his leg, no small feat as a small forward.

If we walk away from this draft with Mcluggage/SPS, Simpkin, Drew, Allison and Watson I'd be stoked.

yep, like that summary. have you seen or heard much of Zac Fisher he seems to be another one who is all over the shop on draft boards. i have never seen him play but i am a very keen observer of stats and draft summaries and i love the write ups re what he would bring to a team. i did hear Andy Maher say he thought Fisher was the best "footballer" he had seen in this years crop he compared him to the likes of Simon Black/Sam Mitchell who were grossly under rated in their draft years.