List Mgmt. 2017 List Management: Contracts, Trading, Drafting, Academy

[Raymann]

our only defensive mids are Scully & Whitfield, the others don't work as hard as these two....

 

[Raymann]

Agree on their counter-attacking importance, but teams are scoring too easily against us. Essendon and Carlton ran right through the middle continually. With Patfull gone, and Kenners & Buntine out, we've lost 3 close-checking defenders. It's a worry going into the 2nd half of the season.

whilst I agree with the lack of defensive effort from some mids & forwards (Steve J in particular) I think we really miss Haynes with his intercept marking. The rest of our tall defenders just punch.

 

[Determinant]

whilst I agree with the lack of defensive effort from some mids & forwards (Steve J in particular) I think we really miss Haynes with his intercept marking. The rest of our tall defenders just punch.

I'm thinking he is the biggest miss also, compounded by the loss of Rory who can play that role also when needed.

 

[Ichabod Noodle]

My half-term report card might say that the Giants still haven't found a game style that can beat the Bulldogs.

Except for that game we did.

 

[gee whiz giant]

Except for that game we did.

to clarify, I was thinking ahead to finals footy. This season's h & a 22 games feels like inessential dress rehearsals for the finals. Are we targetting a winning game style for the prelim & Grand. Perhaps we'll know when all the injured return. From last week;
1. Missed Haynes as noted above
2. Missed Smith's goals and grunt
3. Missed Lobb's aerial prowess when both Patton & Jezza were tightly held.
4. Reid's goal-kicking is unreliable
5. Surely Johnson can't retain his spot? He's lost yards of pace, and buckets of energy, he can flail and tap at balls, do loopy kicks and hand-balls, but the rest has passed him by.

 

[coniglio_number1]

to clarify, I was thinking ahead to finals footy. This season's h & a 22 games feels like inessential dress rehearsals for the finals. Are we targetting a winning game style for the prelim & Grand. Perhaps we'll know when all the injured return. From last week;
1. Missed Haynes as noted above
2. Missed Smith's goals and grunt
3. Missed Lobb's aerial prowess when both Patton & Jezza were tightly held.
4. Reid's goal-kicking is unreliable
5. Surely Johnson can't retain his spot? He's lost yards of pace, and buckets of energy, he can flail and tap at balls, do loopy kicks and hand-balls, but the rest has passed him by.

But stevie J has ice in his veins and has proven that this year already

 

[dlanod]

But stevie J has ice in his veins and has proven that this year already

Lucky he dodged out on the drug testing then.

 

[Danny88]

our only defensive mids are Scully & Whitfield, the others don't work as hard as these two....

Kelly? 10 tackles and 20 odd pressure acts stands out for me

 

[Raymann]

Kelly? 10 tackles and 20 odd pressure acts stands out for me

Running back to assist the defenders, yes Kelly is the best of the rest.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Question: Who do you reasonably expect to be cut from your list this season?

 

[Determinant]

Question: Who do you reasonably expect to be cut from your list this season?

Patful

 

[Snake_Baker]

Could you please point out to me who has been re-contracted from this list, and anyone else you think would be delisted?

GWS Players Out of Contract in 2017

Daniel Lloyd 2 Non-Free Agent
Dawson Simpson 2 Non-Free Agent
Devon Smith 6 Non-Free Agent
Harrison Himmelberg 2 Non-Free Agent
Jacob Hopper 2 Non-Free Agent
Jeremy Finlayson 3 Non-Free Agent
Joel Patfull 3 Non-Free Agent
Joshua Kelly 4 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Flynn 2 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Kennedy 2 Non-Free Agent
Samuel Reid 2 Non-Free Agent
Stephen Coniglio 6 Non-Free Agent
Steve Johnson 2 Non-Free Agent
Tendai Mzungu 1 Non-Free Agent
Zachary Williams 5 Non-Free Agent

 

[Gigantic]

Could you please point out to me who has been re-contracted from this list, and anyone else you think would be delisted?

GWS Players Out of Contract in 2017

Daniel Lloyd 2 Non-Free Agent
Dawson Simpson 2 Non-Free Agent
Devon Smith 6 Non-Free Agent
Harrison Himmelberg 2 Non-Free Agent
Jacob Hopper 2 Non-Free Agent
Jeremy Finlayson 3 Non-Free Agent
Joel Patfull 3 Non-Free Agent
Joshua Kelly 4 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Flynn 2 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Kennedy 2 Non-Free Agent
Samuel Reid 2 Non-Free Agent
Stephen Coniglio 6 Non-Free Agent
Steve Johnson 2 Non-Free Agent
Tendai Mzungu 1 Non-Free Agent
Zachary Williams 5 Non-Free Agent

Congilio, Williams, Flynn and Finlayson have re-signed

Steve Johnson is likely to retire

I think we'll retain Lloyd and Reid. I don't think anyone atm is likely to be de-listed, maybe Mzungu?

 

[Snake_Baker]

Congilio, Williams, Flynn and Finlayson have re-signed

Steve Johnson is likely to retire

I think we'll retain Lloyd and Reid. I don't think anyone atm is likely to be de-listed, maybe Mzungu?

Thanks.

Right at this point in time you have picks 24, 25 and 70 to replace these three players in red, with 5 estimated players still to re-sign.

GWS Players Out of Contract in 2017

Daniel Lloyd 2 Non-Free Agent
Dawson Simpson 2 Non-Free Agent
Devon Smith 6 Non-Free Agent
Harrison Himmelberg 2 Non-Free Agent
Jacob Hopper 2 Non-Free Agent
Jeremy Finlayson 3 Non-Free Agent
Joel Patfull 3 Non-Free Agent
Joshua Kelly 4 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Flynn 2 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Kennedy 2 Non-Free Agent
Samuel Reid 2 Non-Free Agent
Stephen Coniglio 6 Non-Free Agent
Steve Johnson 2 Non-Free Agent
Tendai Mzungu 1 Non-Free Agent
Zachary Williams 5 Non-Free Agent

 

[Gigantic]

Thanks.

Right at this point in time you have picks 24, 25 and 70 to replace these three players in red, with 5 estimated players still to re-sign.

GWS Players Out of Contract in 2017

Daniel Lloyd 2 Non-Free Agent
Dawson Simpson 2 Non-Free Agent
Devon Smith 6 Non-Free Agent
Harrison Himmelberg 2 Non-Free Agent
Jacob Hopper 2 Non-Free Agent
Jeremy Finlayson 3 Non-Free Agent
Joel Patfull 3 Non-Free Agent
Joshua Kelly 4 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Flynn 2 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Kennedy 2 Non-Free Agent
Samuel Reid 2 Non-Free Agent
Stephen Coniglio 6 Non-Free Agent
Steve Johnson 2 Non-Free Agent
Tendai Mzungu 1 Non-Free Agent
Zachary Williams 5 Non-Free Agent

I think you're also missing de Boer on the list. I don't think he has re-signed yet.

Of those 5 you've listed who haven't yet re-signed, I we're bound to have at least one squeezed out. As for who it will be, well I wouldn't have the slightest clue. Dawson Simpson I think we'll likely keep around though.

 

[_GT_]

Thanks.

Right at this point in time you have picks 24, 25 and 70 to replace these three players in red, with 5 estimated players still to re-sign.

GWS Players Out of Contract in 2017

Daniel Lloyd 2 Non-Free Agent
Dawson Simpson 2 Non-Free Agent
Devon Smith 6 Non-Free Agent
Harrison Himmelberg 2 Non-Free Agent
Jacob Hopper 2 Non-Free Agent
Jeremy Finlayson 3 Non-Free Agent
Joel Patfull 3 Non-Free Agent
Joshua Kelly 4 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Flynn 2 Non-Free Agent
Matthew Kennedy 2 Non-Free Agent
Samuel Reid 2 Non-Free Agent
Stephen Coniglio 6 Non-Free Agent
Steve Johnson 2 Non-Free Agent
Tendai Mzungu 1 Non-Free Agent
Zachary Williams 5 Non-Free Agent

Patfull and the Goo on the rookie list.

 

[Giant Strides]

Thanks.

Right at this point in time you have picks 24, 25 and 70 to replace these three players in red, with 5 estimated players still to re-sign.

A few posts back you'll find my summary of what I think. Essentially, there are 2 departures known from the main list - Steve Johnson & Tom Downie (retirement due mental health issues) - plus Patfull leaving the rookie list. Current picks as you've said (plus whatever our first ends up as once the 1000 points are removed). Ignoring Simpson & de Boer who are on 1-year contracts, but are likely to be retained IMHO unless we don't lose anyone, the focus is on the 5 OOC players (Kelly, Smith, Hopper, Kennedy & Himmelberg). I expect 1-3 of those guys to leave, with a mix of 2017 & 2018 picks to come in.

 

[Snake_Baker]

I think you're also missing de Boer on the list. I don't think he has re-signed yet.

Of those 5 you've listed who haven't yet re-signed, I we're bound to have at least one squeezed out. As for who it will be, well I wouldn't have the slightest clue. Dawson Simpson I think we'll likely keep around though.

A few posts back you'll find my summary of what I think. Essentially, there are 2 departures known from the main list - Steve Johnson & Tom Downie (retirement due mental health issues) - plus Patfull leaving the rookie list. Current picks as you've said (plus whatever our first ends up as once the 1000 points are removed). Ignoring Simpson & de Boer who are on 1-year contracts, but are likely to be retained IMHO unless we don't lose anyone, the focus is on the 5 OOC players (Kelly, Smith, Hopper, Kennedy & Himmelberg). I expect 1-3 of those guys to leave, with a mix of 2017 & 2018 picks to come in.

de Boer is contracted until the end of 2018 according to this:

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/out_of_contract_players?year=2018

The point I am trying to make is that pick 70 is a wasted pick and it would be ideal for GWS to attract 2 x high picks this season to account for delistings that included a player leaving.

 

[Determinant]

de Boer is contracted until the end of 2018 according to this:

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/out_of_contract_players?year=2018

The point I am trying to make is that pick 70 is a wasted pick and it would be ideal for GWS to attract 2 x high picks this season to account for delistings that included a player leaving.

No, I don't see that as a short term need at all..
Our under 22 yo players are numerous talented and mostly pushing for or holding a best 22 spot, with the potential to leave if they can't get one.
We don't have much in the way of traditional depth, so a year of drafting players who we can put a few years into without them wanting mansions after 2 weeks wouldn't hurt at all. Draft picks for the following year are likely to be more valuable.

 

[Snake_Baker]

No, I don't see that as a short term need at all..
Our under 22 yo players are numerous talented and mostly pushing for or holding a best 22 spot, with the potential to leave if they can't get one.
We don't have much in the way of traditional depth, so a year of drafting players who we can put a few years into without them wanting mansions after 2 weeks wouldn't hurt at all. Draft picks for the following year are likely to be more valuable.

The consensus is that the 2017 draft will turn in to a lucky dip past pick 30.

You must delist 3 players.

As it currently stands picks 24, 25 and 70 would only likely return you a single decent player.

 

[Giant Strides]

de Boer is contracted until the end of 2018 according to this:

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/out_of_contract_players?year=2018

The point I am trying to make is that pick 70 is a wasted pick and it would be ideal for GWS to attract 2 x high picks this season to account for delistings that included a player leaving.

Well, that footywire list is incorrect for several other players, and we would believe it's wrong for de Boer - he joined on a 1 year contract from our sources. Not that it really matters much. I'd expect we would re-sign him on another 1 year contract, & only delist him (with possible redraft or rookie) if we wanted to create a space on the list.

I'm unsure of your second point other than encouraging us to trade a player out to ensure picks come in - if so, I think that it will happen naturally. I think HH is a case by himself - rumours of both joining his bro at Adelaide or moving to Brisbane to be with his parents. Don't really see that either club would need him, but he hasn't re-signed to date so might leave. The other 4 are IMHO all tied to whether Kelly re-signs or departs. As I said, I think between 1 & 3 guys will leave naturally & we'll manage it from there. 2 likely academy draftees (Jack Powell & Nick Shipley) depending on how they go in the U18 Championships, who are likely to be covered by the 2 second round picks. We could just upgrade a rookie if needed, no real need to push for multiple early picks this year, but it's likely to happen naturally from someone(s) leaving.

 

[Jaffa Fan]

The consensus is that the 2017 draft will turn in to a lucky dip past pick 30.

You must delist 3 players.

As it currently stands picks 24, 25 and 70 would only likely return you a single decent player.

Anyone else feel like there's a big pitch coming? C'mon dude get to it, you know you want to.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Well, that footywire list is incorrect for several other players, and we would believe it's wrong for de Boer - he joined on a 1 year contract from our sources. Not that it really matters much. I'd expect we would re-sign him on another 1 year contract, & only delist him (with possible redraft or rookie) if we wanted to create a space on the list.

I'm unsure of your second point other than encouraging us to trade a player out to ensure picks come in - if so, I think that it will happen naturally. I think HH is a case by himself - rumours of both joining his bro at Adelaide or moving to Brisbane to be with his parents. Don't really see that either club would need him, but he hasn't re-signed to date so might leave. The other 4 are IMHO all tied to whether Kelly re-signs or departs. As I said, I think between 1 & 3 guys will leave naturally & we'll manage it from there. 2 likely academy draftees (Jack Powell & Nick Shipley) depending on how they go in the U18 Championships, who are likely to be covered by the 2 second round picks. We could just upgrade a rookie if needed, no real need to push for multiple early picks this year, but it's likely to happen naturally from someone(s) leaving.

Thanks.

I can see why your club is pushing for a response from Josh as so much more relies on his position.

Unfortunately, if he has decided to leave, then talk from your club of not playing him after August (source: Caro) would only facilitate his silence and make matters worse for GWS.

This is dumb psychology.

The giants would be much better served by ensuring the kid that regrettably but ultimately they support his decision, keep it silent, and encourage him to give a 110% effort in their flag push as a departing contribution.

 

[Giant Strides]

Well, as much as you might think GWS has given him an ultimatum and made a threat, I've not heard any whispers of that - and I would be surprised if they had because it would be a dumb move and I don't believe that it's the way they operate. I know in the Josh Kelly thread on the D&T board you posted the excerpt from Caro on a footy show making some comments, but my personal view is that you drew conclusions that you wanted to & not supported by tangible evidence. I'm not saying that Josh will stay - the North Melbourne offer is pretty hard to refuse - but people need to keep their heads for the remaining half of the season.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Well, as much as you might think GWS has given him an ultimatum and made a threat, I've not heard any whispers of that - and I would be surprised if they had because it would be a dumb move and I don't believe that it's the way they operate. I know in the Josh Kelly thread on the D&T board you posted the excerpt from Caro on a footy show making some comments, but my personal view is that you drew conclusions that you wanted to & not supported by tangible evidence. I'm not saying that Josh will stay - the North Melbourne offer is pretty hard to refuse - but people need to keep their heads for the remaining half of the season.

It isn't my opinion and here is the tangible evidence:

@ 1:00



Matthews doesn't do himself any favors either. He exhibits the brinkmanship skills of a warthog.