Society/Culture Virgins new priority boarding for service men and women

[Gough]

Why should the armed forces be deserving of any more respect that anyone else who does a difficult job?

 

[ShanDog]

Yeah I was thinking "What about us parents trying to keep control of our two year olds? Who is thanking us? Nobody. That's who.

Soldiers are parents too, Chief. You need to brush up on your intersectionality

 

[smokingjacket]

Some posters are hateful pricks, but I don't think there's general disrespect for military vets. I'd say the level of respect military want from the public is about on par with what we get for the most part. Would be nice if people didn't believe everything negative they read in the media about military members, but that's an issue across every facet of society. Otherwise, ANZAC Day (done properly) and some cheap Hungry Jacks is a pretty good deal.

It was a joke based on the line about any sort of conversation about America's foreign policy always being turned back to "why don't you respect the troops?"

One of the few things littlegraham is consistent about is an anti-war politics and if I had to guess why he entered the thread guns blazing is that he's aware this sort of troop respecter politics is usually a trojan horse for criticism of anti-war activists.

His tone is a bit off for a reasonably well mannered thread but he raises some good points in that how do we differentiate the individual service of the men and women of Australia from the crimes of empire in our name? It's obvious that British servicemen weren't "defending" Britain from attack in Kenya, making the world safe for democracy, or even the more dubious anti-communist purges.

Australia's military has a split role that see's us do a lot of good in our region in natural disaster prevention and the defensive component of the ADF will become a lot more important over the next 50 years, but our military has also had an expeditionary component to it for the last two decades that has been controversial. Does everyone agree with our role in Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria? Or even our indirect help with intelligence and positioning in Yemen?

Australian society is much better off if we can have robust criticism of the military and I agree that the current level is about right. The ADF is a good Australian institution that means something to most Australian's who have served or had family members serve but having a society with mental cues about respecting the troops everywhere is a bad path to go down.

 

[kickazz]

Why should the armed forces be deserving of any more respect that anyone else who does a difficult job?

Yeah I'm not a fan of this move by any stretch of the imagination but in my opinion the answer to your question can be summed up in two (related) points.

1. It may well be the only job where you pledge to keep doing it even if there is potential it means certain death or major injury; and you can't pull out if it gets too much for you.

2. Strategically, the country always needs to recruit the next generation of soldiers. Killing people, dying and getting PTSD is hardly going to draw them in, so we need to give positive reasons for choosing this career. It's in the national interest.

 

[ShanDog]

It was a joke based on the line about any sort of conversation about America's foreign policy always being turned back to "why don't you respect the troops?"

One of the few things littlegraham is consistent about is an anti-war politics and if I had to guess why he entered the thread guns blazing is that he's aware this sort of troop respecter politics is usually a trojan horse for criticism of anti-war activists.

His tone is a bit off for a reasonably well mannered thread but he raises some good points in that how do we differentiate the individual service of the men and women of Australia from the crimes of empire in our name? It's obvious that British servicemen weren't "defending" Britain from attack in Kenya, making the world safe for democracy, or even the more dubious anti-communist purges.

Australia's military has a split role that see's us do a lot of good in our region in natural disaster prevention and the defensive component of the ADF will become a lot more important over the next 50 years, but our military has also had an expeditionary component to it for the last two decades that has been controversial. Does everyone agree with our role in Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria? Or even our indirect help with intelligence and positioning in Yemen?

Australian society is much better off if we can have robust criticism of the military and I agree that the current level is about right. The ADF is a good Australian institution that means something to most Australian's who have served or had family members serve but having a society with mental cues about respecting the troops everywhere is a bad path to go down.

LG has a long history of going bananas about this stuff. Hence the short lead.

I agree with much of what you have said. One thing that does irk me a little is the conflation of the military and the politicians. Or at the very least, the military and the very senior brass who are pseudo politicians anyway. Not that we have anywhere near the extent of that in Australia when compared to the US. Criticism of military action needs to be directed where it's due but it often (ironically) ends up being friendly fire.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

Yeah I was thinking "What about us parents trying to keep control of our two year olds? Who is thanking us? Nobody. That's who.

Thank you, Mr. Chief.

 

[Gough]

Yeah I'm not a fan of this move by any stretch of the imagination but in my opinion the answer to your question can be summed up in two (related) points.

1. It may well be the only job where you pledge to keep doing it even if there is potential it means certain death or major injury; and you can't pull out if it gets too much for you.

2. Strategically, the country always needs to recruit the next generation of soldiers. Killing people, dying and getting PTSD is hardly going to draw them in, so we need to give positive reasons for choosing this career. It's in the national interest.

A friend of mine is a GP who also volunteers for the AMA's doctor's health service and the stories she's told me have been eye opening and give me a new appreciation of my GP every time I see them.

 

[Brunswick Trap King]

Australian society is much better off if we can have robust criticism of the military and I agree that the current level is about right. The ADF is a good Australian institution that means something to most Australian's who have served or had family members serve but having a society with mental cues about respecting the troops everywhere is a bad path to go down.

Bingo. The idea that we should be thankful of people doing a job they chose to do in a manner where we've often assisted in worsening the conditions of other nations is terrible. Then it's made worse by the argument that there should be no criticism of the military simply allows politicians/the army to continue in this manner without any reasonable critique.

 

[smokingjacket]

Bingo. The idea that we should be thankful of people doing a job they chose to do in a manner where we've often assisted in worsening the conditions of other nations is terrible. Then it's made worse by the argument that there should be no criticism of the military simply allows politicians/the army to continue in this manner without any reasonable critique.

You can't have an expeditionary armed forces and reasonably expect there not to be criticism. In fact critique is a healthy, even essential part of the liberal democratic process.

 

[kickazz]

A friend of mine is a GP who also volunteers for the AMA's doctor's health service and the stories she's told me have been eye opening and give me a new appreciation of my GP every time I see them.

I have no doubt about that. It's probably true that most GPs deserve more respect than most soldiers. But a GP who has had enough can retire without being charged with desertion.

 

[its free real estate]

I’ll support the troops unwaveringly when they’re all robots.

 

[kickazz]

How much of the modern day attitude toward soldiers is still in reaction to the poor attitude given to Vietnam vets?

 

[Richard Pryor]

How much of the modern day attitude toward soldiers is still in reaction to the poor attitude given to Vietnam vets?

I think the attitude during Vietnam was an aberration with the current attitude being a return to the norm rather than a reaction.

By default people approve of the military since it is the only real symbol and guarantee of sovereignty, but in Vietnam there was media coverage of very good arguments against what the troops were doing, resulting in disapproval of the military. In the absence of good reasons to criticize the actions of the military the public gradually returned to approving of the military as a concept. Current entanglements in the Middle East are different to Vietnam as I think to the average Joe Blow 9/11 and the WMDs in Iraq fiasco neutered criticism (see; Dixie Chicks).

 

[smokingjacket]

I’ll support the troops unwaveringly when they’re all robots.

Let me be the first to respect our robot troop overlords

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

I served in the Navy from '92 to '02 but am not a veteran. If I was, I wouldn't be telling anyone, it would make me cringe having an announcement like that made about me, it would actually be enough to make me use another airline. (as a gold member I get priority boarding anyway.)

 

[nut]

A transparent marketing exercise that's gone down like the Hindenburg and consequently looks like being retracted: https://www.theage.com.au/business/...lutes-following-backlash-20181105-p50e5b.html

Boggles the mind a large corporation wouldn't consult with the relevant groups or the public first.

There's already ANZAC Day and Remembrance Day to acknowledge the contributions made by soldiers and in any case I don't think the US reverence for their armed forces is something Australia should emulate.

The argument offered by Virgin that veterans "keep the country safe" is total bullshit too- blindly following the US into every war they've barged into hasn't made us safer, if anything it's done the opposite.

As for "acknowledging their role in the community", what about teachers, doctors, paramedics, and all the underpaid migrants who keep the 7-11's open for that 3:30am packet of Winnie Blues?

**** you Virgin.

I think they meant “they keep the price of jet fuel low”

 

[Freo Big Fella]

The card doesn't bother me all that much - it's discrete, the gold card already covers them for a lot of essential services and this seems like a reasonable extension of that.

The rest seems like the height of Yank stupidity.

 

[ShanDog]

I think the attitude during Vietnam was an aberration with the current attitude being a return to the norm rather than a reaction.

By default people approve of the military since it is the only real symbol and guarantee of sovereignty, but in Vietnam there was media coverage of very good arguments against what the troops were doing, resulting in disapproval of the military. In the absence of good reasons to criticize the actions of the military the public gradually returned to approving of the military as a concept. Current entanglements in the Middle East are different to Vietnam as I think to the average Joe Blow 9/11 and the WMDs in Iraq fiasco neutered criticism (see; Dixie Chicks).

This goes back again to what I said in reply to Smoking jacket. The criticism of the military and, specifically, the outright hostility followed by complete disregard of the soldiers in Vietnam was misdirected anger. They did what the politicians who were elected by the people charged them with doing. And a notable portion of them were doing it by force as conscripts! The criticism of the public's treatment of soldiers in the early 70s is appropriate. Unfortunately, it still happens today, but in very small and ultimately insignificant circles where extremists can't differentiate between the soldier and the powers who sent them.

Having said all that, I don't want to see society swing in the other direction, where a lack of reverence for soldiers and the military is considered a social faux pas. I'm comfortable stating that the vast majority of defence personnel would agree. Besides, what the * would you long haired civvy pond scum know about honour and service anyway? Get outta here with your patronising "respect"

 

[Admiral Byng]

It's just not the Australian way.

 

[smokingjacket]

 

[Rob]

Seems an odd exercise in virtue signalling that no one (Veterans included) actually wanted. We have a completely different culture to the US and it's reverence of the armed forces. I'm all for respect and recognising the service these people have given to their country - it's not their fault there's a war going on, whether we agree with it or not - but this isn't that.

As someone else said; offer a discount to Veterans if your going to do something meaningful, or take a $ or % from every fare and redirect it to a mental health service for Veterans.

Alas that would involve actually doing something.

Virtue signalling is all about saying how great you are but doing absolutely nothing.

 

[Frank Bunn]

Ladies and gentlemen, our flight to Brisbane is now ready for boarding. In accordance with our new policy can all virgins come to the gate for priority boarding.

 

[Benny78]

Ladies and gentlemen, our flight to Brisbane is now ready for boarding. In accordance with our new policy can all virgins come to the gate for priority boarding.

Maybe if the bible didn't motivate catholic crazies like Hitler into starting the holocaust. Aviation technology would've hit a wall in the 1930's and we wouldn't be able to ferry people around the world to whinge about their gender.

All forms of extremism are traced back to the bible. It's pretty clear if not for the bible there would've never been a Holocaust or an sjw fringe left.

 

[Thegibbsgamble]

This goes back again to what I said in reply to Smoking jacket. The criticism of the military and, specifically, the outright hostility followed by complete disregard of the soldiers in Vietnam was misdirected anger. They did what the politicians who were elected by the people charged them with doing. And a notable portion of them were doing it by force as conscripts! The criticism of the public's treatment of soldiers in the early 70s is appropriate. Unfortunately, it still happens today, but in very small and ultimately insignificant circles where extremists can't differentiate between the soldier and the powers who sent them.

Having said all that, I don't want to see society swing in the other direction, where a lack of reverence for soldiers and the military is considered a social faux pas. I'm comfortable stating that the vast majority of defence personnel would agree. Besides, what the **** would you long haired civvy pond scum know about honour and service anyway? Get outta here with your patronising "respect"

What about the RSL? They lead the shunning of Vietnam veterans. Or is this another truth you can't face?

What about indigenous soldiers? They didn't even have the right to vote own land or any of that but served in world war two Korea and nam. Why no mention of the way the gov tret then. Why only mention citizens treatment of Vietnam vets?



Vietnam vets who were conscripted do deserve special treatment as long as we're honest about what was done to them.

In the battle of long tan the Americans knew nva was preparing to attack our base. We were pawns. The Americans wanted the nva to committ to battle then bomb the s**t out of them and us. These were conscripts mostly poor people without the contacts to avoid the draft and they deserve to be looked after. Millions protested against that war and were right.

Why no recognition of those in those protests trying to save lives and stop the slaughter. Protestors were locked up abused and harrassed by the gov and police. They were trying to save lives.

They deserve recognition as well

 

[Bradesmaen]

The US reverence for their military is part of what is wrong with the US. You almost can't be president without having served in the military at some point it is that revered. They do it at sporting events there but it depends on the sport. NHL do it, but not massively. NFL at a random point during the game ask anyone who served to stand and they get a round of applause. It's what makes them war monger so much, and why Trump wants to put so much money into the military.. because they think that is how they gain respect.