Rolling Ashes Squad Thread, now featuring Haddin XII v Hick XII beginning p. 147

[Woody15]

Both are not and should not be keeping in a test match! We will take a second specialist keeper and that will be Alex Carey.

At it again LP..

Can see both sides to it. Either way not fussed. Bancroft could easily keep though.

 

[Damon_3388]

Wade keeping again...please no. The horror last time. No issues with Wade in there as a specialist bat

I'd like Wade there primarily for his batting (I feel like he could be a much better Test bat this time around, given that he is in-form and without the workload and responsibility of keeping and vice captaincy), but he also covers the back-up keeper role if it's needed.

I think Carey would be better served continuing to actually play on the A tour, rather than mixing the Gatorade for 5 Tests.

 

[Sproj]

I think Carey shouldn't be anywhere near any national side at the moment, he just isn't showing anything to warrant it. I'd prefer taking a Philippe or Inglis in a gaining experience role IF Wade isn't considered as a batsman/back up keeper option. Carey is the new Manou - might just stumble into a test cap without having actually really earned it.

 

[Pykie]

We've taken great pace arsenals to England before. It means nothing if the batsmen fail and the bowlers consistently bowl garbage lengths. And in Starc's case garbage lines too.

Yep.

In 2013 we went in proclaiming we had the best attack in the world (Mainly Aussies proclaiming this at the time) with Harris, Starc & Pattinson, with Siddle also there.

Harris got injured, Pattinson was underdone and with Starc, the latter two bowled too short and got creamed.


In 2015 we went into the series, as warm favorites with what most of the world wide cricket media was proclaiming as one of the best attacks to tour England. Johnson had absolutely destroyed England in Aus and South Africa at home in the previous 18 months, Hazlewood had emerged as a top test bowler and Starc was the #1 one day bowler in the world.

Johnson, Starc, Hazlewood.


Starc went at almost 4 an over, Johnson averaged 35 for the series.

Hazlewood actually bowled better than I remembered. 16 wickets @ 25, but again, went at E/R of 3.68.


We just couldn't restrict the runs over there last time. It's the reason why I don't want Starc in the side. If we're winning a 5 match away series, we can't have 1 piece of the machine leaking 4 runs an over.

 

[Howard Littlejohn]

There is no way Handscomb or Bancroft can be seriously considered for a back up keeper. The only way they should keep in tests is if they're in the side and Paine goes down in the middle of a match.

The same goes for Wade. If fit and showing something with the gloves then Whiteman joins Carey on the "A" tour. One of those becomes backup in the main squad.

 

[Blue1980]

Yep.

In 2013 we went in proclaiming we had the best attack in the world (Mainly Aussies proclaiming this at the time) with Harris, Starc & Pattinson, with Siddle also there.

Harris got injured, Pattinson was underdone and with Starc, the latter two bowled too short and got creamed.


In 2015 we went into the series, as warm favorites with what most of the world wide cricket media was proclaiming as one of the best attacks to tour England. Johnson had absolutely destroyed England in Aus and South Africa at home in the previous 18 months, Hazlewood had emerged as a top test bowler and Starc was the #1 one day bowler in the world.

Johnson, Starc, Hazlewood.


Starc went at almost 4 an over, Johnson averaged 35 for the series.

Hazlewood actually bowled better than I remembered. 16 wickets @ 25, but again, went at E/R of 3.68.


We just couldn't restrict the runs over there last time. It's the reason why I don't want Starc in the side. If we're winning a 5 match away series, we can't have 1 piece of the machine leaking 4 runs an over.

Agree, though no one gave us any chance in 2013 ashes. We had just been smashed by India and changed coaches. The 3-0 score line was pretty flattering to England, as we only got wiped in the 2nd test, had the better of the 2 weather effected draws and 2 close defeats in the 1st and 4th tests.

 

[Pykie]

Agree, though no one gave us any chance in 2013 ashes. We had just been smashed by India and changed coaches. The 3-0 score line was pretty flattering to England, as we only got wiped in the 2nd test, had the better of the 2 weather effected draws and 2 close defeats in the 1st and 4th tests.

Yeah I remembered not being favorites.

But I also remember the Aussie media being very confident with that bowling lineup and getting especially narky because the English media didn’t rate it anywhere near as highly.

 

[Damon_3388]

The same goes for Wade. If fit and showing something with the gloves then Whiteman joins Carey on the "A" tour. One of those becomes backup in the main squad.

Those mentioning Whiteman realise he hasn't played a single Shield match since December 2016, right?

He hasn't exactly been in cracking form when he has played recently, either:

2015/16
Sheffield Shield - 9 matches, 37.70 batting average, 32 dismissals
Matador Cup - 6 matches, 15.50 batting average, 8 dismissals
Big Bash League - 0 matches

2016/17
Sheffield Shield - 5 matches, 25.55 batting average, 14 dismissals
Matador Cup - 6 matches, 9.00 batting average, 6 dismissals
Big Bash League - 9 matches, 22.00 batting average, 4 dismissals

2017/18
Sheffield Shield - 0 matches
JLT Cup - 0 matches
Big Bash League - 2 matches, 4.50 batting average, 1 dismissal (didn't actually keep)

2018/19
Sheffield Shield - 0 matches
JLT Cup - 1 match, 0.00 batting average (dismissed for a duck), 0 dismissals (didn't actually keep)
Big Bash League - 4 matches, 24.50 batting average, 1 dismissal (kept in 3 out of 4 matches)

Career
Sheffield Shield - 44 matches, 33.90 batting average, 146 dismissals
Domestic List A Comp - 34 matches, 19.92 batting average, 32 dismissals
Big Bash League - 35 matches, 17.64 batting average, 24 dismissals

Why should he be anywhere near the Test squad, or even the A side, at the moment? In fact, why is he so highly rated at all? He literally hasn't done anything of note for years. He had one good Shield season near on five years ago (2013/14, 45.80 batting average, 45 dismissals), and some people have rode his nuts as the next big thing in keeping ever since.

 

[JackOutback]

Those mentioning Whiteman realise he hasn't played a single Shield match since December 2016, right?

He hasn't exactly been in cracking form when he has played recently, either:

2015/16
Sheffield Shield - 9 matches, 37.70 batting average, 32 dismissals
Matador Cup - 6 matches, 15.50 batting average, 8 dismissals
Big Bash League - 0 matches

2016/17
Sheffield Shield - 5 matches, 25.55 batting average, 14 dismissals
Matador Cup - 6 matches, 9.00 batting average, 6 dismissals
Big Bash League - 9 matches, 22.00 batting average, 4 dismissals

2017/18
Sheffield Shield - 0 matches
JLT Cup - 0 matches
Big Bash League - 2 matches, 4.50 batting average, 1 dismissal (didn't actually keep)

2018/19
Sheffield Shield - 0 matches
JLT Cup - 1 match, 0.00 batting average (dismissed for a duck), 0 dismissals (didn't actually keep)
Big Bash League - 4 matches, 24.50 batting average, 1 dismissal (kept in 3 out of 4 matches)

Career
Sheffield Shield - 44 matches, 33.90 batting average, 146 dismissals
Domestic List A Comp - 34 matches, 19.92 batting average, 32 dismissals
Big Bash League - 35 matches, 17.64 batting average, 24 dismissals

Why should he be anywhere near the Test squad, or even the A side, at the moment? In fact, why is he so highly rated at all? He literally hasn't done anything of note for years. He had one good Shield season near on five years ago (2013/14, 45.80 batting average, 45 dismissals), and some people have rode his nuts as the next big thing in keeping ever since.

He was 20 or 21 when he averaged 45, which is why people got excited. An average of 37 two seasons later isn’t bad either. Unfortunately injury hit, form hasn’t recovered. But people remember what he was like when playing freely.

 

[Damon_3388]

He was 20 or 21 when he averaged 45, which is why people got excited. An average of 37 two seasons later isn’t bad either. Unfortunately injury hit, form hasn’t recovered. But people remember what he was like when playing freely.

We shouldn't be picking guys based on what they did 3-5 years ago, or unrealised potential from their early 20s. Realistically, Whiteman has shown nothing recently that's even deserving of a mention.

 

[Doodlesweaver]

I'd like to wait to see how Richardson does in other conditions before claiming him as the anointed one for the Ashes and I'm sure the selectors are the same.

Having written that, GO JHYE!

 

[JackOutback]

We shouldn't be picking guys based on what they did 3-5 years ago, or unrealised potential from their early 20s. Realistically, Whiteman has shown nothing recently that's even deserving of a mention.

Don’t disagree; he’s been struggling to replace Inglis at state level when fit, he’s not in contention for higher honours. I hope he puts it back together though.

 

[bird_man]

I felt relief to hear Hohns admit a few weeks back that they might be better off picking 6 batsmen due to the fact that we really don't have an all rounder of test quality.

After just one match we have added Stoinis to the test squad...

 

[frenchcutforsix]

Marcus probably won't get a game so goodbye to the stars chances in the bbl lol. Hohns had a cunning plan. Love the way the wheel turns. Nothing is ever as it seems.

 

[Beutbrute]

Khawaja a chance to lose his spot when Warner and Smith return? Harris the only lock I reckon unless something disasterous occurs on this tour.

It is a sorry state of affairs when your only batsman who is a "lock" averages under 40 and has never hit a hundred.

 

[Pykie]

The media seems to be running with him actually debuting......

Surely not....

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

Past 50 once in his past 10 innings, and before that wasn't too great either. How long does 1 good innings guarantee him a test spot?

He should do well against England. I saw their spinners trying to bowl the other day and neither of them could bowl me out in the middle of the night.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

I felt relief to hear Hohns admit a few weeks back that they might be better off picking 6 batsmen due to the fact that we really don't have an all rounder of test quality.

After just one match we have added Stoinis to the test squad...

I really cannot get my head around that. Surely they can't be serious about playing him. They try to tell us they don't pick Test teams in January based on BBL performances, and yet they pick Stoinis? I just don't get it. Good luck to the lad if he plays and I hope he does well, but I just cannot understand the selection policy.

 

[frenchcutforsix]

I really cannot get my head around that. Surely they can't be serious about playing him. They try to tell us they don't pick Test teams in January based on BBL performances, and yet they pick Stoinis? I just don't get it. Good luck to the lad if he plays and I hope he does well, but I just cannot understand the selection policy.

Hohns seems to be swayed by public opinion/media interest these days a bit more than he used to.... But it's one thing adding Stoinis to the squad another thing playing him

 

[frenchcutforsix]

The media seems to be running with him actually debuting......

Surely not....

The media also virtually guaranteed pucovski was playing the last test so I would take that with a grain of salt

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Hohns seems to be swayed by public opinion/media interest these days a bit more than he used to.... But it's one thing adding Stoinis to the squad another thing playing him

Putting him in the squad and not playing him will be worth it for plastic man Warne's rant though!

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

Hohns seems to be swayed by public opinion/media interest these days a bit more than he used to.... But it's one thing adding Stoinis to the squad another thing playing him

There's been a real media push for Stoinis since the beginning of the season, with that story on him driving his car around telling us where he went to school, played grade cricket ..... with Justin Langer no less ..... I've seen it at least 6 times, and remember thinking that's pretty good coverage for someone who is in reality, still an average Sheffield Shield player. Then I've heard Shane Warne trying to work his name into just about every conversation he has, to the degree eventually every other commentator started talking about him.

As I said, I support anyone who plays for Australia and I hope he does well if selected, I just worry that he's being massively over-rated and he will find Test runs and wickets a lot harder to come by than the cheap ones he picks up in BBL.

 

[frenchcutforsix]

Putting him in the squad and not playing him will be worth it for plastic man Warne's rant though!

Warne be like "Is he playing, is he playing, is he playing??? Why isn't he playing...how could he not be playing with what he brings to the table....god it'll be like a broken record player

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Warne be like "Is he playing, is he playing, is he playing??? Why isn't he playing...how could he not be playing with what he brings to the table....god it'll be like a broken record player

Better question will be which fellow comment will want to deck Warne first?

 

[frenchcutforsix]

There's been a real media push for Stoinis since the beginning of the season, with that story on him driving his car around telling us where he went to school, played grade cricket ..... with Justin Langer no less ..... I've seen it at least 6 times, and remember thinking that's pretty good coverage for someone who is in reality, still an average Sheffield Shield player. Then I've heard Shane Warne trying to work his name into just about every conversation he has, to the degree eventually every other commentator started talking about him.

As I said, I support anyone who plays for Australia and I hope he does well if selected, I just worry that he's being massively over-rated and he will find Test runs and wickets a lot harder to come by than the cheap ones he picks up in BBL.

Bingo. You nailed it. Marketing ploy for sure. He's their new pin up. Ticks all the boxes, young ethnic good looking hits the ball a mile and can bowl well.... This is social engineering. 100% social engineering