List Mgmt. 2020 Trade Thread - Part I

[ScrappyDo]

Didnt we pay out Paddy last year? We brought the payment forward which is why the club finances were at a loss last year.

Waaa??
What's the club finances got to do with Salary Cap?
The only reference l saw was "came to an agreement"

 

[BrutThough]

Waaa??
What's the club finances got to do with Salary Cap?
The only reference l saw was "came to an agreement"

This is from the club at the time.

The St Kilda Football Club has posted an overall accounting net profit of $2,462,880 for the year ending October 31 2019, while increasing total net assets to $17,220,691 (2018: $14,757,811).

The club was preparing to post an operating profit of $383,208 before making some recent decisions on the timing of player injury and contract payments over the 2019 and 2020 financial years.

St Kilda FC Financial Results

The St Kilda Football Club has posted an overall accounting net profit of $2,462,880 for the year ending October 31 2019.

www.saints.com.au

 

[ScrappyDo]

This is from the club at the time.

The St Kilda Football Club has posted an overall accounting net profit of $2,462,880 for the year ending October 31 2019, while increasing total net assets to $17,220,691 (2018: $14,757,811).

The club was preparing to post an operating profit of $383,208 before making some recent decisions on the timing of player injury and contract payments over the 2019 and 2020 financial years.

St Kilda FC Financial Results

The St Kilda Football Club has posted an overall accounting net profit of $2,462,880 for the year ending October 31 2019.

www.saints.com.au

Ok, but l still don't get it.
Bringing forward contract payments should just be using the league's money still, unless Paddy was paid by the club in lieu of his final year.. seems weird

 

[bird_man]

I really don’t think trading in a mid for a first rounder is the way to go. I’d be going all out for a FA - Williams would be ideal and drafting a mid with our first pick.

Would set up our midfield well. A core of Williams, Steele, Jones, Ross and Hanners (when he’s on the park). Byrnes, Bytel and the draftee as options/depth.

I’d then be tempted to move Gresham back to more of a permanent forward with the odd burst in the middle. He’s capable of being 40 plus goal kicker in a season I think, we just need to have the midfield cattle that ensures we don’t need him in there.

We've been going all out for a FA for 5 years though. Unfortunately that has proven harder than we'd hoped.

 

[BrutThough]

Ok, but l still don't get it.
Bringing forward contract payments should just be using the league's money still, unless Paddy was paid by the club in lieu of his final year.. seems weird

I dont really get it either. But from what they have said, it sounded like they paid Paddy's 2020 contract in 2019.

And thats worked great for Paddy who then wouldnt have had the same pay cuts as everyone else right now.

 

[Moral Decay]

I'm hesitant about getting a "gun" from outside.
It's the price of the players and what they return in the GWS era that hurts; Tom Mitchell (pick 14) aside , and Ablett junior being there at the start so I'm not sure he counts I cant remember a mid changing clubs and it working out and when I say worked out I mean the player being the difference between getting a flag or not. I'm not even sure that GWS holding on to their "guns has been worthwhile, they'll need to deliver soon or have a massive rethink about their list management strategy.

Someone better than me will know how many Brownlows, Flags and B&Fs have been delivered, the millions of dollars and the draft picks, Dylan Shiel was 2 firsts with a second coming back and I'd think that trade was close to a bust. Not that he isn't a good footballer but is he worth the price paid?

At this point I want to wait before committing, see how much Clark can deliver as a mid, Byrnes and Bytel to debut this year and see what they can deliver, have a hard look at the draft and make a call from that position rather than making the trade the starting point and working everything around that, even a free agent comes with an expectation of playing and keeping Bytel and Byrnes out.

I'm far more interested in how we can get further up the draft, who we can trade out and what we can get for them?

 

[Dr Spaceman]

I dont really get it either. But from what they have said, it sounded like they paid Paddy's 2020 contract in 2019.

And thats worked great for Paddy who then wouldnt have had the same pay cuts as everyone else right now.

As I drove past the local bottle shop last night I suddenly had a very disturbing, and unsettling, flashback

 

[sammm]

McCartin...

McCartin and Young had contracts for this year. Maybe they were paid out under last year's SC, maybe this year. But all said and done, together its worth ballpark $450k+
"If" it falls under this year's cap, and you throw in $400k for Jack Steven, that's $850k we're paying for players no longer on our list.

There's your free agent right there. One can only hope so.

both Mcartin and Young, were paid out from last year's cap, but the cap will most likely go down, and the number of players will go down. so not sure what will happen then.

 

[bird_man]

I'm hesitant about getting a "gun" from outside.
It's the price of the players and what they return in the GWS era that hurts; Tom Mitchell (pick 14) aside , and Ablett junior being there at the start so I'm not sure he counts I cant remember a mid changing clubs and it working out and when I say worked out I mean the player being the difference between getting a flag or not. I'm not even sure that GWS holding on to their "guns has been worthwhile, they'll need to deliver soon or have a massive rethink about their list management strategy.

Someone better than me will know how many Brownlows, Flags and B&Fs have been delivered, the millions of dollars and the draft picks, Dylan Shiel was 2 firsts with a second coming back and I'd think that trade was close to a bust. Not that he isn't a good footballer but is he worth the price paid?

At this point I want to wait before committing, see how much Clark can deliver as a mid, Byrnes and Bytel to debut this year and see what they can deliver, have a hard look at the draft and make a call from that position rather than making the trade the starting point and working everything around that, even a free agent comes with an expectation of playing and keeping Bytel and Byrnes out.

I'm far more interested in how we can get further up the draft, who we can trade out and what we can get for them?

To be fair, there probably aren't a lot of mids drafted or traded that you could categorically say were the difference between a flag or not.

Hawks gave up pick 9 and a Premiership player for Burgoyne and he was fairly pivotal in their 3 peat.

Tigers fans were up in arms when they have up pick 6 for the human meatball but they wouldn't be complaining now after 2 flags.

Fair chance if we don't trade away our first we'll use it on a mid, so it makes sense to at least look at what is out there.

I wouldn't not bring in a recruit just so we can make sure we can fit two guys in picked in the 50's that haven't played a game yet. If they are good enough they'll play.

 

[L_W_P]

The other thing with players coming in from other clubs is that, unless you nail their introduction into the starting line up, it takes probably a season for them to find their feet.

Butler has been perfect. Hill still working it out.

Im all for talking to guys like Crouch and Williams but we need to understand they won't just walk in and instantly propel us into the top 4 or a Grand Final.

That said, give me one of those guys + our first rounder vs a guy like Wines costing us that pick, even with something back.

 

[ScrappyDo]

both Mcartin and Young, were paid out from last year's cap, but the cap will most likely go down, and the number of players will go down. so not sure what will happen then.

I guess this is the crux of my question. How do we know they were paid from last years cap?
The article from the club was vague at best, and there was no reference to Young.
It's a reasonable assumption to say it was last year's cap given we were tracking around the minimum spend, but again nothing concrete is out there about it..

 

[Crusty Undies]

I'm hesitant about getting a "gun" from outside.
It's the price of the players and what they return in the GWS era that hurts; Tom Mitchell (pick 14) aside , and Ablett junior being there at the start so I'm not sure he counts I cant remember a mid changing clubs and it working out and when I say worked out I mean the player being the difference between getting a flag or not. I'm not even sure that GWS holding on to their "guns has been worthwhile, they'll need to deliver soon or have a massive rethink about their list management strategy.

Someone better than me will know how many Brownlows, Flags and B&Fs have been delivered, the millions of dollars and the draft picks, Dylan Shiel was 2 firsts with a second coming back and I'd think that trade was close to a bust. Not that he isn't a good footballer but is he worth the price paid?

At this point I want to wait before committing, see how much Clark can deliver as a mid, Byrnes and Bytel to debut this year and see what they can deliver, have a hard look at the draft and make a call from that position rather than making the trade the starting point and working everything around that, even a free agent comes with an expectation of playing and keeping Bytel and Byrnes out.

I'm far more interested in how we can get further up the draft, who we can trade out and what we can get for them?

Prestia and Caddy for Richmond, Yeo and Redden for WC, Burgoyne for Hawthorn among their many many other imports during the threepeat. There are other good trades these are just the midfielders from recent premiers.

 

[Rizz64]

I guess this is the crux of my question. How do we know they were paid from last years cap?
The article from the club was vague at best, and there was no reference to Young.
It's a reasonable assumption to say it was last year's cap given we were tracking around the minimum spend, but again nothing concrete is out there about it..

What happened with Young, its kind of perplexing that we took a bloke in the draft and sent him packing after one year. Especially as he signed a 2 year contract

 

[ScrappyDo]

What happened with Young, its kind of perplexing that we took a bloke in the draft and sent him packing after one year. Especially as he signed a 2 year contract

He was just part of the attempt to get leg speed into the team. Hind and Parker the others.
Young just didn't make the cut, and we obviously wanted the list spot for someone with a chance. Also may have grated with others on the team if you believe the scuttlebutt..

 

[SaintsSeptember]

What happened with Young, its kind of perplexing that we took a bloke in the draft and sent him packing after one year. Especially as he signed a 2 year contract

He got 2 years AFL pay despite being a spud.
In the old days we'd have held onto him for 4 years shuffling him on and off the rookie list.

 

[goodie23]

Have to wonder how many players are looking at our free-flowing, joyful approach to footy and are contemplating joining us? Combine that with us wooing and successfully trading in Ryder, Howard, Jones, Hill and Butler last year and we're a very attractive option - if we want you and you want us, we'll land you.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Any interest in Petruccelle? He's not getting much love on the main board.
I think he would have played under Coff at the knights.
3rd of 4th round pick perhaps, maybe a DFA...

 

[NeXus Nick]

There is no set rule. As if you would make that decision now. You do realise you trade for a 21 year old that could have 10 years in the system

Yes i do realize, but generally when you trade you pay overs. Grab the FA's for free and recruit the youngsters from the Draft.

 

[MOLTEN GANGLANDS]

Any interest in Petruccelle? He's not getting much love on the main board.
I think he would have played under Coff at the knights.
3rd of 4th round pick perhaps, maybe a DFA...

what happened to him? He came out of the blocks strong in his first year

 

[FQFjt]

I'm hesitant about getting a "gun" from outside.
It's the price of the players and what they return in the GWS era that hurts; Tom Mitchell (pick 14) aside , and Ablett junior being there at the start so I'm not sure he counts I cant remember a mid changing clubs and it working out and when I say worked out I mean the player being the difference between getting a flag or not. I'm not even sure that GWS holding on to their "guns has been worthwhile, they'll need to deliver soon or have a massive rethink about their list management strategy.

Someone better than me will know how many Brownlows, Flags and B&Fs have been delivered, the millions of dollars and the draft picks, Dylan Shiel was 2 firsts with a second coming back and I'd think that trade was close to a bust. Not that he isn't a good footballer but is he worth the price paid?

At this point I want to wait before committing, see how much Clark can deliver as a mid, Byrnes and Bytel to debut this year and see what they can deliver, have a hard look at the draft and make a call from that position rather than making the trade the starting point and working everything around that, even a free agent comes with an expectation of playing and keeping Bytel and Byrnes out.

I'm far more interested in how we can get further up the draft, who we can trade out and what we can get for them?

There are plenty of mids who have gone to a new club and had an instant positive impact overall.

Most recently, Neale to Brisbane and Danger to Geelong. Kelly at Geelong too (although he wasn't traded).

But that said, there is always a gamble when paying a high price for a player whether you will get what you pay for. Some players might look a whole lot better in one environment and surrounded by certain players/rucks than others.

 

[ScrappyDo]

what happened to him? He came out of the blocks strong in his first year

Seems to have gone a bit quiet, but you can say that for the whole WC squad really.
I was surprised to see he was OOC after his early form, but if he wants to come home you'd think this would be the year.

 

[plugger66]

Yes i do realize, but generally when you trade you pay overs. Grab the FA's for free and recruit the youngsters from the Draft.

No wait

 

[George]

What happened with Young, its kind of perplexing that we took a bloke in the draft and sent him packing after one year. Especially as he signed a 2 year contract

Didn't get along with the playing group.

 

[Joffaboy]

Didn't get along with the playing group.

Was a FIGJAM but couldn't back it up with actual football.

 

[Rizz64]

Didn't get along with the playing group.

There you go, I thought with his player welfare background and study history might have made him the type that gets along with everyone. Wonder if it also had to do with not adjusting to moving to melbourne