General MFC Discussion 2.0

[pjfairbairn]

Talked about where we're at with Julian De Stoop on my podcast this morning:

Plug while I'm here - it's a Monday-Friday sports podcast, approx 15 mins in length, out before 8am AEST every day. Subscribe via Podcasts app: https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/best-on-ground-weekday-kickoff/id1519698333

 

[TheBoss]

Will we ever cut Josh Mahoney loose?

He has given us 12 years of mediocrity.

 

[pjfairbairn]

Will we ever cut Josh Mahoney loose?

He has given us 12 years of mediocrity.

I view it through a different lens - he worked so hard and was part of the revival under Roos/Jackson, and now has to work with Goodwin/Pert/Bartlett.

I actually rate him and wish he had greater authority

 

[Daemon]

I know this is early but I think the season is done for us. As there is no VFL to develop players I'm all for playing the young guys and letting them learn on the job. I'd leave Pickett and Jackson in (if fit). I'd like to see Rivers, Bedford, and Baker given an extended run.
I'd also be looking at making some tough calls at the end of the year - Jones and Jetta to retire. Look at trading Brayshaw, Omac, TMac, Preuss (not playing him so why bother keeping him), Hunt, ANB, for whatever we can get for them. I think the list is pretty good - a reliable key forward is a must, and a fast, good ball user in the guts would also be good.
Obviously a change in coach and game plan would also be helpful, but that seems very unlikely until Goodys contract ends. This is pure fantasy but I'd love Roosy to come back and finished what he started.

 

[Topkent]

Listened to David King talk about Gawn and he's 100% correct
We have the 'premier' ruck and 'elite' midfield in the competition yet we are ranked 17th for scores from forward 50 stoppages.
Also the average score from defensive 50 stoppages is 2 behinds per game

Whats the point of having an elite ruck and mid if it doesn't generate scores.

The reason why is often we sit Gawn a kick behind play in the forward half but it's not generating scores. Now quite often this board descends into a bitch fight over Steven May but he's done he's job this season, the real issue is Jake Lever.
Jake has 7 intercept marks in 8 games this year. We've sent Gawn back to protect Lever.
If he's not intercepting then we are in big big trouble. Darcy Moore took 6 intercept marks in one game the other week.
He's possibly our most under performed player who's gone under the radar

 

[mrmonkey]

Listened to David King talk about Gawn and he's 100% correct
We have the 'premier' ruck and 'elite' midfield in the competition yet we are ranked 17th for scores from forward 50 stoppages.
Also the average score from defensive 50 stoppages is 2 behinds per game

Whats the point of having an elite ruck and mid if it doesn't generate scores.

The reason why is often we sit Gawn a kick behind play in the forward half but it's not generating scores. Now quite often this board descends into a b*tch fight over Steven May but he's done he's job this season, the real issue is Jake Lever.
Jake has 7 intercept marks in 8 games this year. We've sent Gawn back to protect Lever.
If he's not intercepting then we are in big big trouble. Darcy Moore took 6 intercept marks in one game the other week.
He's possibly our most under performed player who's gone under the radar

I agree with you on lever looks no where near his best. However what percentage do you think is it due to what you just stated we just getting smashed in the midfield so it gets run into defense so quickly has no time to set up or our turnovers. Doesn't help when the backline looks so disorganised as well.

 

[Grimesy87]

Lever started looking better prior to Thursday night. But he was horrendous Thursday.

The fact is I think most supporters would have been reasonable to give him last few matches last year to settle after returning from injury. But he has no excuses this year. Be it confidence from the second knee, or something else, he is an absolute shell of what he can play like.

Was his contract 4 or 5 years? This is year 3, and if he has any credibility, his next contract should be 75k a year considering his output from this one.

I was absolutely stoked to get him, watched Adelaide a lot when he was there- he looked a genuine superstar on the rise. I don't blame him for having injuries, but return on investment has been shitful.

 

[Crusty Demon]

I know this is early but I think the season is done for us. As there is no VFL to develop players I'm all for playing the young guys and letting them learn on the job. I'd leave Pickett and Jackson in (if fit). I'd like to see Rivers, Bedford, and Baker given an extended run.
I'd also be looking at making some tough calls at the end of the year - Jones and Jetta to retire. Look at trading Brayshaw, Omac, TMac, Preuss (not playing him so why bother keeping him), Hunt, ANB, for whatever we can get for them. I think the list is pretty good - a reliable key forward is a must, and a fast, good ball user in the guts would also be good.
Obviously a change in coach and game plan would also be helpful, but that seems very unlikely until Goodys contract ends. This is pure fantasy but I'd love Roosy to come back and finished what he started.

Surely we can't write the season off just yet with us still to play Crows, Kangas, Swans, Dockers, Bombers, Pies and Dogs? All of these sides are either bad or have capitulated at times. We're strangely enough a chance in all those games. If nothing else, we have to finish as high up the ladder as we can to avoid giving Norf a decent pick. That's a decent enough reason alone to playing our best side and trying to win.

 

[Crusty Demon]

Listened to David King talk about Gawn and he's 100% correct
We have the 'premier' ruck and 'elite' midfield in the competition yet we are ranked 17th for scores from forward 50 stoppages.
Also the average score from defensive 50 stoppages is 2 behinds per game

Whats the point of having an elite ruck and mid if it doesn't generate scores.

The reason why is often we sit Gawn a kick behind play in the forward half but it's not generating scores. Now quite often this board descends into a b*tch fight over Steven May but he's done he's job this season, the real issue is Jake Lever.
Jake has 7 intercept marks in 8 games this year. We've sent Gawn back to protect Lever.
If he's not intercepting then we are in big big trouble. Darcy Moore took 6 intercept marks in one game the other week.
He's possibly our most under performed player who's gone under the radar

Has Lever gone under the radar though? Ask most Melb supporters and they will tell you he is an overpaid hack. Was under fire early days too with the Dees pre knee reco as he was being exposed badly as a 1on1 defender. IMO May has been great this season and is likely in the top 3 or 4 for the Bluey as of now. I think the major problem right now at the club is simply poor coaching across all lines. Goodwin is taking this team nowhere.

 

[stEdy]

Lever low on confidence means he's going for the double fist instead of the mark. Unfortunately, that's not what he's being paid big bucks to do.

He has done some good defensive jobs, though. Our whole backline synergy is largely shite and has been for a long time. The real kick in the teeth is seeing good backline setups bring in C grade talent to perform B and A grade jobs due to the cohesion of the defense. We're still very much less than the sum of our parts back there. It won't turn around until they play more and more together. Bit of a Catch 22.

 

[Fork n Hell]

the whole defensive set up of 3 tall defenders plus Gawn dropping back to help out is just shithouse imo. to me they need to either drop one tall defender for a more mobile mid sized type if they want to keep having Gawn dropping back to assist in the air, or just keep Gawn out of defense and trust those 3 tall defenders to do their job.

 

[stEdy]

Agree, it made sense in 2018 for Gawn to protect OMAC and Frosty but we've spent up big on Lever and May and we need to trust them to do their job, especially with OMAC in the team as well.

Gawn pushing forward and taking big grabs/kicking goals does more for our out of form forward line anyway.

 

[djpaulydemon]

Gawn pushing back doesn't work when there is no pressure up the field. But having him in the forward line in the way of the other 3 tall forwards won't work either.

 

[Grimesy87]

Surely we can't write the season off just yet with us still to play Crows, Kangas, Swans, Dockers, Bombers, Pies and Dogs? All of these sides are either bad or have capitulated at times. We're strangely enough a chance in all those games. If nothing else, we have to finish as high up the ladder as we can to avoid giving Norf a decent pick. That's a decent enough reason alone to playing our best side and trying to win.

Bingo. We could fairly conceivably be 5-5 in 8 days time, with a game to come against an equally inconsistent Essendon. This season will be decided on fit/healthy list and who misses their bed back home the least.

Unfortunately, other clubs inconsistencies involve missing players/injuries. The one thing in our favour is our healthy list. Unfortunately, the only anomaly from all inconsistencies this season in our consistency in having no ****ing idea how to play a team game.

Beating Adelaide and north to go 5-5 would be akin to beating Carlton and gold coast in 2018 before we line up against a half decent side to pants us (bar 4 games late in 2018). It's only inevitable that even if we do go 5-5, we will still be made into GWS/Collingwoods bitch when we play them.

As a supporter, I accept that now, where as years gone by I used to get my hopes up.

 

[blitznu]

Gawn in doubt Preuss is fit yeah?

 

[Topkent]

Agree, it made sense in 2018 for Gawn to protect OMAC and Frosty but we've spent up big on Lever and May and we need to trust them to do their job, especially with OMAC in the team as well.

Gawn pushing forward and taking big grabs/kicking goals does more for our out of form forward line anyway.

I don't mind Gawn behind the ball as a tactic sometimes, if we are under pressure or ahead late etc then by all means throw him back. But to always have him there is crazy, he's possibly the best contested mark in the competition but only has 1 inside 50 for the year.
Saving games not trying to win them.

 

[blitznu]

Surely we can't write the season off just yet with us still to play Crows, Kangas, Swans, Dockers, Bombers, Pies and Dogs? All of these sides are either bad or have capitulated at times. We're strangely enough a chance in all those games. If nothing else, we have to finish as high up the ladder as we can to avoid giving Norf a decent pick. That's a decent enough reason alone to playing our best side and trying to win.

I said same thing and got called a crackhead. put down the pipe son.

 

[stEdy]

I agree. It's easy to plan for as the opposition if you know Gawn will always be behind the ball.

Either bring the ball in with pace through our largely disorganised zone, or switch the ball and go around Gawn.

We need to at least give their ruckman and defence something to think about and throw him forward sometimes.

 

[Grimesy87]

Gawn in doubt Preuss is fit yeah?

Not yet I don't think. Has been back training for a month but not sure he's played any of those scratch matches.

 

[blitznu]

how about picking players who actually get back to help out at a reasonable pace. who in the midfield actually goes back to help out and plug a hole like every single other team does? besides Langdon there's ****ing none its why I'm still baffled by the Tomlinson omission atleast he has a tank to get back. just robbing Peter to pay Paul having Gawn down there

 

[blitznu]

Not yet I don't think. Has been back training for a month but not sure he's played any of those scratch matches.

hope Gawn gets up then Jackson and TMac rucking a game is scary. also in top 200 in fantasy and dont really want to trade in another ruckman as cover

 

[Grimesy87]

hope Gawn gets up then Jackson and TMac rucking a game is scary. also in top 200 in fantasy and dont really want to trade in another ruckman as cover

I'm hearing you, he's been a a solid captain too.

Who knows maybe McDonald in the ruck will give him some form of influence. He had about as much impact as the goal umpire at our end til quarter time.

 

[ABray10]

View attachment 920931
AFL ratings has our starting mid set up as being in the top 11 players for the year WTF

Jeez this rating system is terrible, with the exception of maybe one OK game and one good game, Oliver has been pus this year. Used to love him, but I would say Viney has been far better this year with daylight afterwards.

Still curious to know what out highest rated forward would be? Probably not in the top 250

 

[schmuttt]

Tom Morris apparently said on the couch board are fed up and if we miss finals they will sack Goodwin, apparently our balance sheet is quite strong and we can afford it.

 

[Topkent]

Tom Morris apparently said on the couch board are fed up and if we miss finals they will sack Goodwin, apparently our balance sheet is quite strong and we can afford it.

The issue is that the soft cap is 6 million next year. Sack Goody and we are spending a million if it paying him which means the assistant coaching department will be very shit again