When will the Carlton FC Arrive?

[Chief]

Part 2 of this thread is here:

When will the Carlton FC Arrive? Part 2

PART 1 of this thread is here: https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/when-will-the-carlton-fc-arrive.1259822/ ============= We're all thinking it. We're watching this story play out for the 4th time in the last 20 years and it's the same story every time. They have a great list of exciting...

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[Noidnadroj]

Part of his contract, it stands until he's paid out.

If Carlton are happy for a sacked coach to conduct exit interviews because it’s part of his contract then no more needs to be said about this whole process.


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[Robertio]

If Carlton are happy for a sacked coach to conduct exit interviews because it’s part of his contract then no more needs to be said about this whole process.


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That would be a good start, you could always go and check up on Richmond, seems they are dropping down the ladder a touch.

 

[cobra land]

And how about the integrity shown by Richmond and Hardwick sounding out and negotiating with a contracted senior coach whilst his club were in the process of completing an external review?

Don't let the truth get in the way of a good story...Hardwick reached out to see how his fellow coach was coping with what was a very stressful situation.
He said to Teague that IF he lost his job they would happily have him on board, no negotiations as you have stated.

 

[10571z]

If Carlton are happy for a sacked coach to conduct exit interviews because it’s part of his contract then no more needs to be said about this whole process.


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The joint in a rabble. How any one could defend that is insanity.

 

[Robertio]

We now find out Sayers was chatting to Ross Lyon and hosting him at his house from mid-year. Do Carlton fans still want to talk about the integrity of the review and waiting for its findings before making any decisions.

What a great way to start your presidency …. canvass others for the coaching job 10-weeks before the review that judged the coach was handed down and before finals were out of the question.

But no…. Carlton fans in here defend the process .




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And you think that's the first time that's ever happened at any club?

 

[76woodenspooners]

We now find out Sayers was chatting to Ross Lyon and hosting him at his house from mid-year. Do Carlton fans still want to talk about the integrity of the review and waiting for its findings before making any decisions.

What a great way to start your presidency …. canvass others for the coaching job 10-weeks before the review that judged the coach was handed down and before finals were out of the question.

But no…. Carlton fans in here defend the process .

To be fair …

… If Carlton have a strategy in place and go through due process then they get pilloried for taking too long and leaving their man to hang out to dry.

If Carlton make quick, timely decisions, then they get pilloried for being a boys club.

If Carlton make contingency plans, then they get pilloried for not respecting due process.

Carlton are getting pilloried whatever they do. And that’ll continue until either they start seeing success, or the President and board are turfed.

 

[LordLucifer]

Part of the HUN article this morning :

David Teague had lost the confidence of senior players and was sacked after a confidential survey showed only 30 per cent of his side and staff supported his coaching.

If true (and who really knows), then moving Teague on was completely inevitable.

 

[LordLucifer]

To be fair …

… If Carlton have a strategy in place and go through due process then they get pilloried for taking too long and leaving their man to hang out to dry.

If Carlton make quick, timely decisions, then they get pilloried for being a boys club.

If Carlton make contingency plans, then they get pilloried for not respecting due process.

Carlton are getting pilloried whatever they do. And that’ll continue until either they start seeing success, or the President and board are turfed.

Very well said.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

Oh dear …. it’s not Richmond’s responsibility to give 2 flutes about Carlton’s review.

Carlton give their coach contracted for 2022 no support but Hardwick and Richmond do …. but yeah, what’s Hardwick doing calling Teague whilst he’s been eaten alive by his own club and the media to offer a potential lifeline …. when the review everyone has known the results of for 6-weeks hasn’t been handed down …. how disrespectful to Carlton’s very respectful review process.



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Richmond showed zero integrity buttering up a contracted senior coach. Don’t blame Carlton.

 

[cobra land]

Part of the HUN article this morning :



If true (and who really knows), then moving Teague on was completely inevitable.

If he's lost the confidence of senior players he had to go, that's a game changer.
I don't think many on here are disputing the fact that Teague going was the right decision it's more about how it was handled by the club.

 

[HTPunter]

That would be a good start, you could always go and check up on Richmond, seems they are dropping down the ladder a touch.

Yep, because Richmond are dropping down after a dynasty, North is a wooden spooner, Collingwood traded out pick 2, and Hawthorn sacked Clarkson - there's nothing to be seen at Carlton land. Perfectly managed.
A board member who oversees 4 coaches sacked in 9 years is the new president, has clearly jumped the shark on the due process of appointing a new coach (doesn't take a genius to work out what has gone on), hasn't taken any responsibility of the failings of the last 9 years, and says to members they'll be the first to find out about Teague (they weren't)...perfect.

There's nothing good about the Carlton board management at the moment, an EGM coming up with a coterie president calling for a spill of the board.

But sure, Richmond finished down the ladder haha bad Richmond

 

[zeggie]

If he's lost the confidence of senior players he had to go, that's a game changer.
I don't think many on here are disputing the fact that Teague going was the right decision it's more about how it was handled by the club.

Same old story. Damned if we do, damned if we don't.

Sakc him ages ago we've jumped the gun, sakc him now and we've waited too long. It was Teague himself who didn't want to address the review until the season was over.

 

[HTPunter]

Richmond showed zero integrity buttering up a contracted senior coach. Don’t blame Carlton.

Cmon

Don't blame Carlton?

Teague knew he was gone. His comments to the media said as much. Carlton butchered it. They've clearly gone after Ross Lyon for months - reports yesterday confirm as much.

 

[zeggie]

Yep, because Richmond are dropping down after a dynasty, North is a wooden spooner, Collingwood traded out pick 2, and Hawthorn sacked Clarkson - there's nothing to be seen at Carlton land. Perfectly managed.
A board member who oversees 4 coaches sacked in 9 years is the new president, has clearly jumped the shark on the due process of appointing a new coach (doesn't take a genius to work out what has gone on), hasn't taken any responsibility of the failings of the last 9 years, and says to members they'll be the first to find out about Teague (they weren't)...perfect.

There's nothing good about the Carlton board management at the moment, an EGM coming up with a coterie president calling for a spill of the board.

But sure, Richmond finished down the ladder haha bad Richmond

3 coaches, with 1st hired without his input
took responsibility for teague at yesterday's presser, 90% of the rest of the board gone.
no media announcement throughout until email to members. no leaks.
*former* coterie president, of a coterie group that wants nothing to do with him, and he only has 100 signatures.

but thanks for your very uneducated input.

 

[Robertio]

Yep, because Richmond are dropping down after a dynasty, North is a wooden spooner, Collingwood traded out pick 2, and Hawthorn sacked Clarkson - there's nothing to be seen at Carlton land. Perfectly managed.
A board member who oversees 4 coaches sacked in 9 years is the new president, has clearly jumped the shark on the due process of appointing a new coach (doesn't take a genius to work out what has gone on), hasn't taken any responsibility of the failings of the last 9 years, and says to members they'll be the first to find out about Teague (they weren't)...perfect.

There's nothing good about the Carlton board management at the moment, an EGM coming up with a coterie president calling for a spill of the board.

But sure, Richmond finished down the ladder haha bad Richmond

You've got the ramblings of a ratbag mate, I never said the Carlton board was ok, in fact two days ago on here i said they got it wrong, try and keep up.

 

[HBF]

Sounds like SOS has been agitating again. And Murphy disgruntled after the coach nursed him to 300 games.

Morris: Key figures in Teague’s demise — and the final act of torture Blues made him endure

The key figures in Teague’s demise — and final act of torture Blues made him endure

www.foxsports.com.au

Murphy got the shits after he was dropped mid way through the year.
I'm glad he's no longer at the footy club.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

I watched the press conference yesterday with interest.

Sayers essentially said from this point on we are going to have a culture of openness, honesty blah blah.

I don’t think honesty works that way where you can undertake clandestine activities up to a point but then expect everyone believes you will be open and honest from that point onwards.

———————————————

Sayers said something like: there are 23 wonderful recommendations from this review which we will be adopting going forward….so Ross Lyon or whoever comes in and part of the reason you appoint the guy is he knows what he is doing and he says recommendation 16 is no good, we are going to do something else. What happens then?

It looks to me like this won’t happen by the way, because the 23 recommendations are probably Ross Lyon recommendations anyway.

There are so many questions about this whole process after listening to Sayers. Like do you really expect us to believe you need Pavlich to come in to find out certain players don’t rate the coach?

I will take this back if Lyon is not appointed, but this whole coach selection process now looks a sham. It just looks like Sayers appointed Lyon months ago and called a review to make the whole process look like something it isn’t. Lyon’s sudden narrative change around the possibility of coaching Carlton can surely only have been cooked up between he and Sayers to cover the fact they were dealing behind the back of the incumbent Teague.

I started from a point of thinking the Teague appointment looked foolish and that he didn’t seem to have all the players playing to a unified game plan and the Blues were probably best off cutting their losses and moving on. But the way this whole thing has been conducted doesn’t look good to me. It appears more designed to keep the heat off Sayers and Lyon than to set the club up for a great future.

 

[bjwilliams]

I've never understood why clubs remain so guarded about their aspirations to make finals.

That is the reason why they're playing footy, and when you're a few wins away the prior season it should be the natural course of things. We haven't gone out and sacked Teague so we could finish around the same mark.

Saying the club "expects to be playing finals next year" puts a lot of pressure on the coach and staff right off the bat. Hypothetically let's say Carlton lose the first against the Tigers and get unlucky with an Eagles round 2 and then play Geelong round 3. Probably all three are losses. They have now already opened up for the barrage of media attention on your new coach from reporters after clicks. "Are Carlton going to make finals", "will they sack their new coach", "is the season looking like another Carlton failure" etc. etc. etc.

They've gone through this whole football department review and it bought them time. A couple of years at least where they can say they're working through the required changes from the report. Instead they've put a literal one year timeline where it's finals or failure right off the bat.

Obviously every team should be aspirational in looking to play finals each year. But after such a big year of negativity in the media around the club, why add fuel for next year?

EDIT: Noticed I was a few pages early and a few have pointed this out, so not expecting a response and not meant to be a pile on.

 

[Vassp]

Richmond showed zero integrity buttering up a contracted senior coach. Don’t blame Carlton.

The writing was on the wall, everyone knew your coach was getting the axe.
hardwick justcalled to support a fellow coach, as Clarkson called dimma in 2016 when dimma was in a similar position. Research helps.

 

[zeggie]

I watched the press conference yesterday with interest.

Sayers essentially said from this point on we are going to have a culture of openness, honesty blah blah.

I don’t think honesty works that way where you can undertake clandestine activities up to a point but then expect everyone believes you will be open and honest from that point onwards.

———————————————

Sayers said something like: there are 23 wonderful recommendations from this review which we will be adopting going forward….so Ross Lyon or whoever comes in and part of the reason you appoint the guy is he knows what he is doing and he says recommendation 16 is no good, we are going to do something else. What happens then?

It looks to me like this won’t happen by the way, because the 23 recommendations are probably Ross Lyon recommendations anyway.

There are so many questions about this whole process after listening to Sayers. Like do you really expect us to believe you need Pavlich to come in to find out certain players don’t rate the coach?

I will take this back if Lyon is not appointed, but this whole coach selection process now looks a sham. It just looks like Sayers appointed Lyon months ago and called a review to make the whole process look like something it isn’t. Lyon’s sudden narrative change around the possibility of coaching Carlton can surely only have been cooked up between he and Sayers to cover the fact they were dealing behind the back of the incumbent Teague.

I started from a point of thinking the Teague appointment looked foolish and that he didn’t seem to have all the players playing to a unified game plan and the Blues were probably best off cutting their losses and moving on. But the way this whole thing has been conducted doesn’t look good to me. It appears more designed to keep the heat off Sayers and Lyon than to set the club up for a great future.

Let's just entertain your hypothetical, that the review was a sham. You're either suggesting:

1. Pavlich, Walsh, Lowe were all in on it and the entire review was a sham to give an excuse to sack Teague
2. We all knew Teague was the problem, and did the Review anyway as an excuse to sack Teague and make ourselves look better.

Which is it?

 

[zeggie]

Saying the club "expects to be playing finals next year" puts a lot of pressure on the coach and staff right off the bat. Hypothetically let's say Carlton lose the first against the Tigers and get unlucky with an Eagles round 2 and then play Geelong round 3. Probably all three are losses. They have now already opened up for the barrage of media attention on your new coach from reporters after clicks. "Are Carlton going to make finals", "will they sack their new coach", "is the season looking like another Carlton failure" etc. etc. etc.

They've gone through this whole football department review and it bought them time. A couple of years at least where they can say they're working through the required changes from the report. Instead they've put a literal one year timeline where it's finals or failure right off the bat.

Obviously every team should be aspirational in looking to play finals each year. But after such a big year of negativity in the media around the club, why add fuel for next year?

EDIT: Noticed I was a few pages early and a few have pointed this out, so not expecting a response and not meant to be a pile on.

Media attention never stops. Why would we let the media concern us?

 

[Noidnadroj]

And you think that's the first time that's ever happened at any club?

Not at all. It’s just amusing so many Carlton tragics have been defending their ‘review process’ when it was clearly a complete sham to provide an external ‘excuse’ to turf Teague. Such a gutless board.


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[76woodenspooners]

Media attention never stops. Why would we let the media concern us?

Because media attention is a good thing. You want it.

Without it then you’d have just sacked your coach and nobody gives a toss how or why it was done. You’d have become irrelevant.

 

[bjwilliams]

Media attention never stops. Why would we let the media concern us?

Do you think it was good for Teague to be battered all year about his position in the club and whether he thinks he'll be coaching next year? If you think constant negatives media attention doesn't have an affect on the club I'd be speechless.

And it's not just you're club in this, Melbourne of 2011-2013 copped it every week. I can tell you the club wasn't some impervious fortress and this didn't have an impact.

 

[zeggie]

Not at all. It’s just amusing so many Carlton tragics have been defending their ‘review process’ when it was clearly a complete sham to provide an external ‘excuse’ to turf Teague. Such a gutless board.


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The external 'excuse' agreed that Teague and some of his assistants were the issue, and the other parts of the football department were operating fine.

Do you think Pavlich, Walsh, Lowe were all in on it and lied?