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List Mgmt. 2021 Trade & List Management Thread II - IN: CCJ

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Joshen said:
IF Carlton are struggling for cap space, and the Cerra-to-Melbourne talks stall due to a lack of draft capital...

THEN North Melbourne may be well positioned to cheaply pick up the Mitch McGovern contract and transform the out-of-sorts forward into a tall intercepting defender.

???
Click to expand...
yuck.
I hope not.
 


Port Adelaide tall Peter Ladhams to explore his options
Port Adelaide’s Peter Ladhams has one year left on his contract but the big man will explore his options ahead of the trade period. Here’s why, plus who could be interested.

Port Adelaide ruck-forward Peter Ladhams will explore his options ahead of the trade period as the Power attempt to change their forward mix after their finals failure.
Ladhams has one more year left on a three-season deal and, despite mid-year speculation, was happy to remain at the club after booting 13.5 in 17 games this season.

But the Herald Sun can reveal, in his exit meeting, the club suggested he might like to consider his options given their list of key talls and determination to remain with first-choice ruckman Scott Lycett well into the future.



Port Adelaide ruck-forward Peter Ladhams will explore his options ahead of the trade period as the Power attempt to change their forward mix after their finals failure.
Ladhams has one more year left on a three-season deal and, despite mid-year speculation, was happy to remain at the club after booting 13.5 in 17 games this season.
But the Herald Sun can reveal, in his exit meeting, the club suggested he might like to consider his options given their list of key talls and determination to remain with first-choice ruckman Scott Lycett well into the future.


Port Adelaide lost the preliminary final to the Western Bulldogs and have since put GWS key position forward Jeremy Finlayson, who wants to return to South Australia for family reasons, through a medical.
They also have talls Charlie Dixon, Mitch Georgiades and Todd Marshall who will likely be ahead of Ladhams next year.
Ladhams was strongly pursued by Sydney last year before they secured Tom Hickey and is equally adept at playing in the ruck or pushing forward.
He is happy to stay and fight for his position but there are clubs on the market for a ruckman, who can rest forward.
Brisbane and St Kilda are both keen for a back-up ruckman, but neither are keen to offer significant money for a player who would be behind their established rucks in the pecking order.

The Western Bulldogs are keen to retain Stef Martin, who missed a games-based trigger clause on his one-year deal but is open to playing on.
They are still looking around for ruck-forwards to help out Tim English, who is still not fully developed as an established ruckman.


Sydney has cap space given the departure of Jordan Dawson but Hickey was a revelation in his first year at the Swans.
At only 23, Ladhams has significant upside and could play in a side as a 75-25 ruck-forward or take on more of the ruck responsibilities.
But the tight salary caps of most clubs, and the late notice of Port Adelaide’s intentions, mean Ladhams might see his deal out at Alberton and fight for his spot.
North Melbourne has secured Richmond’s Callum Coleman-Jones as Todd Goldstein’s heir apparent, while the Suns have lured unrestricted free agent Mabior Chol on a four-year deal.
 
King Corey said:
Nobody is considering the biggest hit we're taking with Tarrant going.

With Robbie, Majak and Higgins all leaving in the last 12 months our 2022 calendar sales could be left in tatters.

You can't expect Jy, LDU and Cunners (hey we need to cater to the rural markets too) to do all the heavy lifting when it comes to striking a pose.

The club needs to ditch the data driven approach to recruiting and start requesting draftees to submit professional portfolios.
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I am pretty happy we picked up Charlie Lazzaro. Pretty easy on the eye in my opinion.
 
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Joshen said:
IF Carlton are struggling for cap space, and the Cerra-to-Melbourne talks stall due to a lack of draft capital...

THEN North Melbourne may be well positioned to cheaply pick up the Mitch McGovern contract and transform the out-of-sorts forward into a tall intercepting defender.

???
Click to expand...
Happy to do a McGovern salary dump, but it'll cost them their first round pick.
 

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Joshen said:
IF Carlton are struggling for cap space, and the Cerra-to-Melbourne talks stall due to a lack of draft capital...

THEN North Melbourne may be well positioned to cheaply pick up the Mitch McGovern contract and transform the out-of-sorts forward into a tall intercepting defender.

???
Click to expand...
He'd be good in that role if fit.
 
ferball said:
He averaged 7.38 marks per game, 13th in the comp. Harris Andrews was forth in the comp with 7.87, (less than one mark per two games more.) Darcy Moore was third on that list and averaged less than a mark a game more. Tom Stewart was at one and he had 8.9 per game. So Jack did okay on that front. Josh Rotham was second btw. He averaged 8.47 marks per game.

He was tenth in the comp for total marks. Aliir and Nick Haynes had one more mark for the whole season and they are considered elite so where does that leave Jack?
Click to expand...

The haters are gonna hate of JZ regardless of the facts. Best to ignore them.
 
speedy said:
It would be a nice fit if he could be our key position swing man. BMac Corr Ziebs down back, Larks CCJ Zurhaar up forward and Charlie where ever the extra height is needed. It would give us a lot of flexibility in the key posts and in the ruck.
Click to expand...
I might swap Chom and CCJ but optherwise its a very good idea.
 
Daniltchenko Magic said:
CCJ has been sold on opportunity. He’s a lock for best 22.
Click to expand...
Didn't he want more time as a Ruckman?

I reckon it's Xerri who he replaces and a fit Comben is a CHF lock.
 

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B4Bear said:
The haters are gonna hate of JZ regardless of the facts. Best to ignore them.
Click to expand...

Jack was good this year in the bottom team, but he did play in a way that gave him a lot of freedom to do as he pleases. Others do the same but can Jack do it in a team that isn't on the bottom of the ladder? Most intercept players have height and/or agility and Jack has neither. He isn't a big presence so doesn't mark in packs, just dropping back into holes when he works off his man. He is a stop-gap and no amount of stats changes that. Remember when Dumont was rated the number 2 wingman in the comp?

What Jack does get is first dibs on the position due to his year.
 
Daniltchenko Magic said:
One too many talls. Comben was replacing Xerri.

Add in Comben to Larkey and Goldy/CCJ is three talls plus Zurhaar. Can’t see us doing that.
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Disagree. I think we have set the list up to play 2x KP forwards (Larkey and Comben) and rotate a resting ruckman (Goldy/CCJ then CCJ/Edwards). This mirrors what the Dees are doing. Zurhaar is not tall and should be developing his game to reflect the Dusty / Petracca style as he has the speed and agility to be a mid sized forward.

We have recruited big with high picks, can't see us wasting them.
 
buttox said:
yuck.
I hope not.
Click to expand...

Cheaply? If they were paying us to take him I'd still need convincing that it was cheap enough.

Moti said:
Disagree. I think we have set the list up to play 2x KP forwards (Larkey and Comben) and rotate a resting ruckman (Goldy/CCJ then CCJ/Edwards). This mirrors what the Dees are doing. Zurhaar is not tall and should be developing his game to reflect the Dusty / Petracca style as he has the speed and agility to be a mid sized forward.

We have recruited big with high picks, can't see us wasting them.
Click to expand...

Agree completely. Post Goldy planning IMO and we would expect CCJ & Edwards to share the role. I don't think we see a Goldy style 80% gametime ruckman as the future of the team.
 
Daniltchenko Magic said:
One too many talls. Comben was replacing Xerri.

Add in Comben to Larkey and Goldy/CCJ is three talls plus Zurhaar. Can’t see us doing that.
Click to expand...

I could. Would be a nice problem to have though.
 
Daniltchenko Magic said:
Can't remember where it was mentioned in the media but I remember it being said that we like Comben as a potential defender.

Would think Larkey, CCJ/Goldy and Comben is too tall, especially when guys like Zurhaar, Cunners, Jed, Taylor and JHF can play tall too.

I could see him working as primarily an intercept marking tall. We know he has the dukes.
Click to expand...

Too tall isn't in the vocabulary. Too tall and too slow would be a definite problem if that was the case.

You need good mobility so you can apply defensive pressure. The benefit of guys like Zurhaar, etc is when they are matched up on medium defenders, they don't have the same impact when playing on key defenders who are very good in the air, it is why I think we will do better with a good forward structure.

At present, we do not have many forwards who do scoreboard damage.
Larkey kicked 42 goals (1.9 avg)
Zurhaar 31 (1.6)
Thomas 24 (1.1)
Stephenson 17 (0.9)
Goldy 12 (0.5)
it is single digits below that, Garner averaged 1.8 but he is gone and his ability to stay on the park was ultimately his major problem.

I think Larkey is best suited for the #2 forward role, i can see him playing the Waite role when we had Drew at FF. Drew was the go-to guy but Waite was a great option as well and being dangerous he took pressure off Drew. Zurhaar is like JZ when he played forward, dangerous when we got the matchup on our terms.

An idealistic forward structure long-term:
FF: (small forward) Comben Larkey
HF: Zurhaar Edwards Stephenson

Comben the go-to target, Stephenson playing the Boomer role where he comes out of forward 50 and sets up goals and gets a lot of the ball running towards/into the forward 50, that also opens some room for Larkey to lead into.

Edwards rotate with CCJ for ruck/forward role, they would be most likely to come out of the F50 and provide marking coverage through the middle.

What we are missing atm is a seagull forward like Weightman or Fritsch who is opportunistic, can be damaging on the scoreboard or has a Rioli like traits where he can get front and square or very creative with his use of the ball, ie getting a lot of goal assists.

Melbourne has got 53 goals out of Fritsch and 40 from Pickett, they are more impactful than their key forwards. I like Mahony but atm he isn't doing enough scoreboard damage, doesn't really show the traits of a dangerous small forward.

I think Stephenson needs to go back to being a bit more like he was at Collingwood, in terms of getting the ball in a dangerous position and either going for goal or setting up a forward. I don't mind him spending time in the middle, but his forward craft has taken a bit of a hit, he is going for goal when it is unrealistic or there are better options to go to, tries to pass when he is in the clear and in a good position to go for goal. He had 28 I50sin 2019 for 15 goal assists, he had 74 this year for 8. He needs more time to gel with our players, but I think he needs a more defined role that he can focus on to execute.

I think when we have LDU, Simpkin, Phillips, Powell and JHF in full flight, the lack of supply that currently exists wont be an issue going forward, I do think we need the right structure to make the most of the midfield we are putting together... Phillips getting the ball into JFH's hands streaming forward, he is going to want to see big targets coming at him.
 

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Moti said:
Jack was good this year in the bottom team, but he did play in a way that gave him a lot of freedom to do as he pleases. Others do the same but can Jack do it in a team that isn't on the bottom of the ladder? Most intercept players have height and/or agility and Jack has neither. He isn't a big presence so doesn't mark in packs, just dropping back into holes when he works off his man. He is a stop-gap and no amount of stats changes that. Remember when Dumont was rated the number 2 wingman in the comp?

What Jack does get is first dibs on the position due to his year.
Click to expand...

How does Jack not do it in a better side? It stands to reason that if we are better, then there is less pressure on him down back. 'Just dropping back into holes' gee you just throw that in there so casually as if it is easy to do. He had a great year, one of his better ones and you have been at him all year despite this.

'No amount of stats changes that.' If we have good shape and structure there is no reason why he cant improve again. You have had him in the gun all year and no amount of stats will change your perception of him
 
ferball said:
He averaged 7.38 marks per game, 13th in the comp. Harris Andrews was forth in the comp with 7.87, (less than one mark per two games more.) Darcy Moore was third on that list and averaged less than a mark a game more. Tom Stewart was at one and he had 8.9 per game. So Jack did okay on that front. Josh Rotham was second btw. He averaged 8.47 marks per game.

He was tenth in the comp for total marks. Aliir and Nick Haynes had one more mark for the whole season and they are considered elite so where does that leave Jack?
Click to expand...

Based on actual evidence, hes a pretty solid medium intercept defender
 
If we hadn't gone in for CCJ with that seemingly locked in, but what if we had the choice between him and Ladhams? I saw some people earlier in the year saying we should make a play for him though that's kinda moot given our current position. Obviously draft capital would be different given CCJ is out of contract but Ladhams is contracted but told to consider options elsewhere
 
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