List Mgmt. 2023 Trade Thread - Part I

[George]

 

[sammm]

I’m not sure I can be much clearer in explaining what is left to find out.

In short, the afl world think we lack stars and top level players.

Without those, we won’t ever win a flag.

Now, you could argue that you require great coaching and a strong level of investment in your football department to deliver that - aswell as matching that investment into your list management department.

The club have clearly done this part.

So that removes the excuses of elite coaching and an elite performance environment. It has invested in a more fleshed out list management department- which will hopefully reap dividends this year.

That means the only question left is the players inherited. Are they good enough?

That’s what Ross has to explore.

I’m not writing off finals. But on the same hand I have no interest in making a finals series to then go backwards in 1-2 seasons if we are kicking the can down the road to a degree if the list isn’t good enough.

So this year of “exploration” that has got a few of you up in arms - is just about the quality of the list.

Surely as a supporter. You want concrete answers as opposed to blind faith about certain players we pin our hopes on?

Surely it’s time the likes of Clark Higgins Bytel Coffield Roma Membrey Gresham etc start to deliver on promising seasons or an abundance of potential and become stars of the game?

That’s the exploration. Because for one reason or another. We have had 2 All Australians in a decade since the old brigade.

We have had 1 finals series since 2011.

I’m not sure everyone we rave on about as supporters is cut out for the top end of the league. But I’m curious to see how many show they should be here going forward via their onfield performances and who shows they need to be moved on.

and, we have a new coach and coaching assistants, Except for Corey, all of the coaches will have to learn the players capabilitite,x pre season is ony a part of this learning, the rest is in season itself.

 

[bird_man]

Bergman looked good again on the weekend

 

[hangdog]

Who were the blokes saying De Goey was overrated?

He played his one excellent game in 5 already?

 

[Joffaboy]

I’m not sure I can be much clearer in explaining what is left to find out.

In short, the afl world think we lack stars and top level players.

Without those, we won’t ever win a flag.

Now, you could argue that you require great coaching and a strong level of investment in your football department to deliver that - aswell as matching that investment into your list management department.

The club have clearly done this part.

So that removes the excuses of elite coaching and an elite performance environment. It has invested in a more fleshed out list management department- which will hopefully reap dividends this year.

That means the only question left is the players inherited. Are they good enough?

That’s what Ross has to explore.

I’m not writing off finals. But on the same hand I have no interest in making a finals series to then go backwards in 1-2 seasons if we are kicking the can down the road to a degree if the list isn’t good enough.

So this year of “exploration” that has got a few of you up in arms - is just about the quality of the list.

Surely as a supporter. You want concrete answers as opposed to blind faith about certain players we pin our hopes on?

Surely it’s time the likes of Clark Higgins Bytel Coffield Roma Membrey Gresham etc start to deliver on promising seasons or an abundance of potential and become stars of the game?

That’s the exploration. Because for one reason or another. We have had 2 All Australians in a decade since the old brigade.

We have had 1 finals series since 2011.

I’m not sure everyone we rave on about as supporters is cut out for the top end of the league. But I’m curious to see how many show they should be here going forward via their onfield performances and who shows they need to be moved on.

Lyon basically echoed the above in the presser, talked out finding out about players, mentioned Webster for example about finding out how he went in his set up.
Actually don't think he would have learnt much on the weekend as all players bought in to the game plan and his non negotiatables. Even Butler who had a poor game, was playing his role, he just couldn't get near it.
Reckon stav is correct, will take the grind of a season to get the wheat from the chaff.

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[Joffaboy]

Agree man, loser mentality, but but but but every year...

Don’t post here very often but wanted to say I can see the myriad points of view in this latest discussion but I have to say my excitement of Ross and the old boys assembling at the bottom of Everest is starting to be tempered by this ‘year of exploration’ monologue. I fully agree it is a year of exploration but Ross was brought in, so we were told, to improve the culture, professionalism and standards.

( A broken Hannebery was also once brought in to improve training standards, that is how appalling Richardson and his gormless cronies were. They could not identify and fix it themselves and then they had a gameplan of rabid monkeys. And Ratten I think had antiquated game plans, poor leadership and oratory skills. And lived off Clarkson like a remora on a shark.)



Perhaps I am naïve but I would have thought Ross, Banger, Hayes etc meant an improvement on last year not a regression. I am not expecting us to finish top four and with all the injuries we are having perhaps 8th is even unrealistic. But I would expect at least two more wins on last year.

Better draw and IMO a better squad.

If we do finish bottom four then I feel the board spills and Lethlean falls on his sword. We can’t keep accepting this mediocrity, these yearly excuses.

Absolutely though this is the year where we develop and challenge. If we are not good enough ok. Then we develop and challenge again in 2024. My view of the Ross appointment is that he is here to establish the develop/challenge model and to set all our club standards at a height that we don’t lower from.

As the previous posters - GRINGO, Mowman, George have said, I hope the club knows and enacts a dedicated, strategic course of action behind the scenes and holds high expectations for improvement this year, and the next and next. I won’t abide more of this ****** a corpse crap we have had for a decade. I am not a young man anymore.

The first two things I will be looking for are selection integrity (when we have a 90% fit squad) and no losses more than two goals in the first 5 rounds.
don
We can be better and better again next year but don't give ourselves an out before round 1.

Really terrific post. And as we know one swallow does not a summer make, however R1 may have tempered some concerns.
The standards of our on field play have been driven by the standards of training. Have been doelwn four times this year and needed to be reassured I didn't have rose coloured glasses, as my impressions was training was at as a high intensity and as structured as I have ever seen.
Match sim was intense, drills were intense, running was punishing.
This is just the beginning. I was surprised with the players buy in and actual execution on the weekend with only one preseason and a raft of players out. But the standard is set.
That standard is one that needs to be carried forward for game after game, season after season. We have wallowed in below par standards and performance since Lyon left. It was stark how poor we have been structurally in comparison.
Do I expect miracles this season? Hardly, especially with our injuries, I expect losses, probably starting this week, we don't have the top end soldiers on field even with our full list.
What Lyon can do is identify a groups strengths and play to it. We have 10 players who can run sub 10 minute 3 klm trials and ten others just outside that. We can run. When Cordy got here he was amazed the amount of run we had and has had to work his arse off to get near them.

So what's next? Lyon knows what this groups capabilities and limitations are. He will work out what we need for a tilt and trade accordingly.
One thing is for sure, a player and their manager sees our direction off field, and our on field structure and Linton St is a much more attractive place than it previously was.


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[The_Steadier]

The biggest news to come out of the freo win is that RTB clearly has us on a trajectory to a flag which is far closer than it was the last time we tried to snare Ben King

34

Ben King

Age

25

Ht

202cm

Wt

98kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

2.2

2star

M

3.5

4star

T

0.5

3star

G

1.3

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

5.6

2star

HB

1.9

1star

M

3.6

4star

T

0.3

1star

G

1.5

5star

D

6.8

2star

K

4.4

2star

HB

2.4

3star

M

3.2

4star

T

0.2

3star

G

1.0

4star

.

Surely a kid who went to watch Ross' 09 grand final team go so close will come and fulfill destiny with his brother under RTB?

(In my mind at least) All we need to do is show Ben this year that RTB really will put us into flag contention in the next few years... and of course he'll say yes

You may say im a dreamer... but im not the only one

 

[mighty_sainters]

The biggest news to come out of the freo win is that RTB clearly has us on a trajectory to a flag which is far closer than it was the last time we tried to snare Ben King.

Surely a kid who went to watch Ross' 09 grand final team go so close will come and fulfill destiny with his brother under RTB?

(In my mind at least) All we need to do is show Ben this year that RTB really will put us into flag contention in the next few years... and of course he'll say yes

You may say im a dreamer... but im not the only one

I’m with you there, all in on Ming and Bing.

 

[The_Steadier]

I’m with you there, all in on Ming and Bing.

Missing on degoey could be a blessing in disguise.
I'd be far happier paying bing a million a year longterm than degoey if I had the choice.

 

[Minga]

Sheezel signed on until 2026

Reckon he would be on our radar once his contract is up, saints fan and local boy if I remember.

 

[longlivelenny]

Best options for us are the free agents. Recruiting one of them allows us to keep our picks and build the strength of our team with youth and experience.

Definitely should be having a look at himmelberg (that's who I would choose), parish and McKay.

If we got parish we could easily let go of a Fringe midfielder like bytel and have Ross or similar drop down to Sandy.

Would definitely improve our team while still bringing in elite (hopefully) youth.

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[Sphynx]

Sheezel signed on until 2026

Reckon he would be on our radar once his contract is up, saints fan and local boy if I remember.

He was a massive Hawks fan fwiw.

 

[Minga]

He was a massive Hawks fan fwiw.

Redacted, maybe he just trained with us - would sure love him though!

"[It] was an incredible experience, to be training and spending the whole day and seeing how they go about it, especially players like Jack Steele, Max King and Rowan Marshall, they were really good to me," Sheezel said.

"[They] offered me a lot of support and showed me, I guess, the way of an AFL footballer.

"I wish I could just stay": Top draft prospect Harry Sheezel details "incredible" St Kilda experience

Saints fans will be licking their lips after hearing these comments.

www.zerohanger.com

 

[botts]

He was a massive Hawks fan fwiw.

I listened to all this blokes interviews in his draft year. He values loyalty, his isn’t going anywhere

 

[bird_man]

Best options for us are the free agents. Recruiting one of them allows us to keep our picks and build the strength of our team with youth and experience.

Definitely should be having a look at himmelberg (that's who I would choose), parish and McKay.

If we got parish we could easily let go of a Fringe midfielder like bytel and have Ross or similar drop down to Sandy.

Would definitely improve our team while still bringing in elite (hopefully) youth.

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Fair chance NWM leaves too. If that’s the case it gives us some currency for a trade.

I’d like to replace him with a ready made youngster if we can. Either Bergman or Sinn if he can ever get on the park.

 

[botts]

Fair chance NWM leaves too. If that’s the case it gives us some currency for a trade.

I’d like to replace him with a ready made youngster if we can. Either Bergman or Sinn if he can ever get on the park.

Geez. Havnt heard this scenario before. No offence

 

[bird_man]

Geez. Havnt heard this scenario before. No offence

Geez, apologies sir

Was replying to a post suggesting we are best keeping our picks

Don’t see the harm in trading away picks if it is for a young player

We’d be silly if we weren’t chasing these boys. We can always go back to talking to Ben King though, that hasn’t been done much

 

[austinnn]

Fair chance NWM leaves too. If that’s the case it gives us some currency for a trade.

I’d like to replace him with a ready made youngster if we can. Either Bergman or Sinn if he can ever get on the park.

Parish is poison. Don't want him

 

[PoppedCorn]

Id trade membrey and gresh
Billings can be the Dempster steak knives


Yeah, thats right.
While they have some currency at least

 

[Barrels]

If we do decide to throw a bucketload of cash at De Koning Jr and he comes across, he'll be a fwd/ruck right, not a KPD like big brother?

So, if we then take out Gresh as a free agency casualty, going forward we might have something like this forward of centre;

C: Hill - Crouch - Wood
HF: Phillipou - Membrey - Billings
F: Owens - King - De Koning
Foll: Marshall - Steele - Windhager

Int: Higgins Butler Clark Ross
Sub: Hayes​

 

[MrFoster]

Since we have up to 5 injured players classified as “indefinite”, think we should use the mid-season draft more to get a look in players that have been overlooked in state leagues. Obviously adjust the strategy according to the talent available.

 

[Veer Right]

Sheezel signed on until 2026

Reckon he would be on our radar once his contract is up, saints fan and local boy if I remember.

Good integrity to do that so quickly. Respect.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Id trade membrey and gresh
Billings can be the Dempster steak knives


Yeah, thats right.
While they have some currency at least

Get us an elite small forward and change and I'm in.

 

[ScrappyDo]

If we do decide to throw a bucketload of cash at De Koning Jr and he comes across, he'll be a fwd/ruck right, not a KPD like big brother?

So, if we then take out Gresh as a free agency casualty, going forward we might have something like this forward of centre;

C: Hill - Crouch - Wood
HF: Phillipou - Membrey - Billings
F: Owens - King - De Koning
Foll: Marshall - Steele - Windhager

Int: Higgins Butler Clark Ross
Sub: Hayes​

Billings? Honestly?

 

[DougalHoward]

If we do decide to throw a bucketload of cash at De Koning Jr and he comes across, he'll be a fwd/ruck right, not a KPD like big brother?

So, if we then take out Gresh as a free agency casualty, going forward we might have something like this forward of centre;

C: Hill - Crouch - Wood
HF: Phillipou - Membrey - Billings
F: Owens - King - De Koning
Foll: Marshall - Steele - Windhager

Int: Higgins Butler Clark Ross
Sub: Hayes​

Tom is the older one

 

[Barrels]

Tom is the older one

You are correct, sir.