Autopsy Saints forget how to kick a ball and lose to Hawthorn.

[BrutThough]

If they're on it, they can't play for a minimum 6 rounds

That's the old system. The current one means once they are on the inactive list, they cant play again for the year.

 

[On the Outer Wing]

They saw “several surgeons”. Let’s be honest, if this was ourselves with the issue we would be ropable it’s taken multiple surgeries to correct and not picked up for 6 months.

The fact it’s a multimillion dollar asset is worse

I trust that under Dave Misson, particularly as an ex-physio himself, that we have best practice sports medicine at St Kilda.

That doesn't mean we always get it right. If you have, for example, a 2% failure rate - but it only affects your no. 43 and 44 player on the list, then no one talks about it (not even on Big Footy). It's just unlucky when it happens to our multimillion dollar asset.

At the same time, if there are lessons to be learnt about King, I trust that they'll take them on board. RTB continually talks about every day at the club as an opportunity to get better. I'm sure that applies to our sports medicine too. But I sincerely doubt if they've been negligent or done anything glaringly wrong with King.

 

[Nutsngum]

If they're on it, they can't play for a minimum 6 rounds

No, its the entire year.

https://resources.afl.com.au/afl/document/2025/02/13/b37f8086-9a25-44de-9c9d-ba7df30004ba/AFL-Rules-effective-14-February-2025-Final-.pdf

Page 101.

I think they changed it when rookies became available to play at any time. The 2023 rules still have the old system which is what people are reading, it admitably took waaaay too long to find the 2025 one.

 

[stavro#4]

Yep agree but there are no guarantees in surgery. They’ll even get you to sign the clause that identifies the percentage or risk.

I trust that under Dave Misson, particularly as an ex-physio himself, that we have best practice sports medicine at St Kilda.

That doesn't mean we always get it right. If you have, for example, a 2% failure rate - but it only affects your no. 43 and 44 player on the list, then no one talks about it (not even on Big Footy). It's just unlucky when it happens to our multimillion dollar asset.

At the same time, if there are lessons to be learnt about King, I trust that they'll take them on board. RTB continually talks about every day at the club as an opportunity to get better. I'm sure that applies to our sports medicine too. But I sincerely doubt if they've been negligent or done anything glaringly wrong with King.

I wasn’t implying negligence. But they are employed to ensure our best players are on the park as often as possible. There just can’t be any leeway in how the management of King this year can be viewed as anything other than an absolute failure.

As soon as the initial attempt to recover was deemed a failure, we should have gone to the lengths we went to the third time around which was an ultrasound whilst under physical load to identify the issue (did I imagine Ross saying it was his meniscus?)

 

[jwikked]

No, its the entire year.

https://resources.afl.com.au/afl/document/2025/02/13/b37f8086-9a25-44de-9c9d-ba7df30004ba/AFL-Rules-effective-14-February-2025-Final-.pdf

Page 101.

I think they changed it when rookies became available to play at any time. The 2023 rules still have the old system which is what people are reading, it admitably took waaaay too long to find the 2025 one.

26.5 Transfer from Inactive List to Primary List
(a) A Club may, subject to that Club having an available List position, make written
application in the form prescribed in Schedule 1 as Form 43A to the General
Counsel for the transfer of a Player from its Inactive List to the Club’s Primary
List or Category A Rookie List in the relevant AFL Season that Player was
transferred to the Inactive List provided that the Club Medical Officer or the
medical practitioner who has treated the Player certifies that the Player has
recovered from their injury sufficiently to allow the Player, having due regard to
their health and safety, to play in a Match and such certification is lodged with
the application.
(b) The General Counsel may in their absolute discretion, approve or disapprove an
application under Rule 26.5(a) for the transfer of a Player to the Club’s Primary
List or require such further medical evidence, including without limitation, a
medical report from a duly qualified medical practitioner approved by the General
Counsel, prior to determining whether to approve or disapprove the transfer.
(c) The transfer of a Player back to a Club’s Primary List or Category A Rookie List
under Rule 26.5(b) shall not take effect until the General Counsel has notified
their approval. Where the General Counsel does not approve the transfer of the
Player back to the Club’s Primary List or Category A Rookie List, they shall notify
the Officer of the Club and the Application shall be of no effect.

 

[phantom13]

Yep agree but there are no guarantees in surgery. They’ll even get you to sign the clause that identifies the percentage or risk.

Personally im not giving that as an out but to each their own.

 

[Nutsngum]

Quote system isnt working but Jwikked, that paragraph is special consideration if a pre-thought season ending injury turns out to be not so bad, its not a clause to just shuffle people around the lists. Besides, it even specifically says you still need an available list position to put them back on. If we took a mid season selection that player will have taken that spot I believe (The document is kind of a bit all over the place and I havent read through all of it).

 

[On the Outer Wing]

I wasn’t implying negligence. But they are employed to ensure our best players are on the park as often as possible. There just can’t be any leeway in how the management of King this year can be viewed as anything other than an absolute failure.

As soon as the initial attempt to recover was deemed a failure, we should have gone to the lengths we went to the third time around which was an ultrasound whilst under physical load to identify the issue (did I imagine Ross saying it was his meniscus?)

Agreed, I know you weren't implying negligence, just wanted to address the vibe I get from some other comments.
As for the process. At each stage they would have had a set of clinical findings (eg where is the pain, when does it occur, manual joint tests, radiology etc)

And based on those clinical findings, there would be a recommended treatment, being the most effective and successful as determine by the medical evidence. Sometimes it can be surgical, other times conservative (ie non-surgical).

My understanding was the clinical findings that required an ultrasound whilst under physical load didn't appear until the third time.

But if those clinical findings were there earlier, but they didn't look for them for some reason, then that is a major stuff up. And they would need to fess up to that. Because it will come out at some stage. It would be great to know what King and his management are saying behind the scenes.

 

[karnaby]

....

My understanding was the clinical findings that required an ultrasound whilst under physical load didn't appear until the third time.

But if those clinical findings were there earlier, but they didn't look for them for some reason, then that is a major stuff up. And they would need to fess up to that. Because it will come out at some stage. It would be great to know what King and his management are saying behind the scenes.

I know nothing about the loading stuff, and I haven't gone back to check, but, iirc, the 2nd surgery involved trimming a bone spur. I can understand that when they found that that they didn't go looking for something else as well, especially if it there wasn't anything obvious.

 

[True Believer]

I wasn’t implying negligence. But they are employed to ensure our best players are on the park as often as possible. There just can’t be any leeway in how the management of King this year can be viewed as anything other than an absolute failure.

As soon as the initial attempt to recover was deemed a failure, we should have gone to the lengths we went to the third time around which was an ultrasound whilst under physical load to identify the issue (did I imagine Ross saying it was his meniscus?)

You didn't imagine anything, that's what RTB said....

No-one can disagree that the management of King's issue has been a failure, I think the disagreement revolves around who wears the responsibility. I think some ascribe it to the surgeons/specialists whilst a second camp believes our medical/high performance team are at fault.

I am in the first camp, but think that our medical guys have to wear some of it......

 

[phantom13]

You didn't imagine anything, that's what RTB said....

No-one can disagree that the management of King's issue has been a failure, I think the disagreement revolves around who wears the responsibility. I think some ascribe it to the surgeons/specialists whilst a second camp believes our medical/high performance team are at fault.

I am in the first camp, but think that our medical guys have to wear some of it......

Evidently some can in spite of all the evidence to the contrary

 

[Ads734]

He's just for too light for me. He gets pushed off the ball far too easy so unless he gets a clear run at it, he has issues finding it.

This is a weird take. In the pt two games since he’s come back in. He’s led both games in clearances. I’d suggest that isn’t going to happen if hes getting pushed off the ball…he also was head to head against Newcomb who wasn’t that influential.

 

[akaifu]

Does Hall go into the midfield? I'm seeing no reason why he couldn't. Clean, quick and a good decision maker. He's benefited from our shift to put more numbers around the contest. His goals from nowhere were incredible. Where did he play at Box Hill?

Paired with Garcia we might start to have some actual mids on our hands (plus Pou who hasn't got going this year).

He played full time inside mid at Box Hill. Then we drafted him and started developing him as a high half forward probably to train his outside game

I dont know what the coaches have planned but ideally he can play a Zac Bailey type role where he's a high half forward but can competently play CBAs when rotations are short. This half forward role is working for him - theres no need to change it while we have some midfield depth

Long term he'll definitely play some inside mid. How much is the ultimate question

 

[StCicatriz]

He played full time inside mid at Box Hill. Then we drafted him and started developing him as a high half forward probably to train his outside game

I dont know what the coaches have planned but ideally he can play a Zac Bailey type role where he's a high half forward but can competently play CBAs when rotations are short. This half forward role is working for him - theres no need to change it while we have some midfield depth

Long term he'll definitely play some inside mid. How much is the ultimate question

Alot of attacking mids at state league often don't make it in the midfield at AFL level.

Krak was a great example of this. He was a dominant midfielder for swanies. Insane stats. But wouldn't translate to being an inside mid in the AFL.

Hall is perfectly fine on the flank I reckon. If he can make it as an inside mid even better.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I think he’s doing well at HF but the game is often won/lost in centre
If he can get around the contest and be - with NAS - one our mids streaming from centre to deliver into forward 50 why wouldn’t you want that ?
He could also be handy defensively as a mid and through the corridor on transition with his smarts/footskills

Well he’s already doing all that (especially the last paragraph), so it would really only be the streaming out of centre bounces that we could potentially gain by having him actually start in there.

The price you’d pay for that though is that he would have a direct opponent playing like that, unlike at the moment, where he’s running around the midfield on his own for most of the game.

 

[Flandersss]

Hastie will be ok. Reminded me of Gilbert & his turnovers sometimes by foot.

Play the kids. It’s exciting to watch

 

[billings2paddy]

Alot of attacking mids at state league often don't make it in the midfield at AFL level.

Krak was a great example of this. He was a dominant midfielder for swanies. Insane stats. But wouldn't translate to being an inside mid in the AFL.

Hall is perfectly fine on the flank I reckon. If he can make it as an inside mid even betbette

Had 27 and kicked 3 goals
If you put a geelong jumper on him the media would be claiming how they've drafted and developed another gun and are ahead of the competition with development and drafting
Great pick by Dalrymple

 

[Minga]

Had 27 and kicked 3 goals
If you put a geelong jumper on him the media would be claiming how they've drafted and developed another gun and are ahead of the competition with development and drafting
Great pick by Dalrymple

To be fair to the media, they’ve cottoned on to Hall and he has been getting a rev up the last two weeks.

 

[gringo2011]

absolutely. i'd throw windy in that mix as well, has shown he can lock down the best of them when required.

all this kerfuffle about wanting a top 5 pick to draft a mid when it's potentially our best line in a few years. who knows if owens/travaglia/wilson etc end up rolling through there too. night and day compared to the state of our forward line

we should be all over dovaston in the upcoming draft imo. outside sharp/greeves, who will be gone by our pick, i am yet to see any mids that project better than the current crop. on the other hand i am losing faith in our small pressure forwards by the day

Doveston would be nice but Grlj and Rodriguez both look likely to be around our pick. Little Pou is looking the goods as well. Might bolt.

 

[akaifu]

absolutely. i'd throw windy in that mix as well, has shown he can lock down the best of them when required.

all this kerfuffle about wanting a top 5 pick to draft a mid when it's potentially our best line in a few years. who knows if owens/travaglia/wilson etc end up rolling through there too. night and day compared to the state of our forward line

we should be all over dovaston in the upcoming draft imo. outside sharp/greeves, who will be gone by our pick, i am yet to see any mids that project better than the current crop. on the other hand i am losing faith in our small pressure forwards by the day

I think Sharp could slide. Eagles are the only team ahead/around us that needs an inside contested bull but taking him at pick 1 ahead of CDT and Duursma is unlikely

Richmond already took Smillie and Lalor last year and they'd be looking at outside players like Lindsay and Grlj

Essendon have Hobbs & Tsatas in addition to Caldwell Merrett Setterfield Durham etc.

Melbourne traded their pick to the Bombers

Imagine nabbing Sharp at pick 15(5) and plonking him alongside Garcia and Pou at our first centre bounce of 2026

 

[g_TRAIN]

Maybe play Clark as a forward, as he clearly hasn't got the tank as a mid for four quarters- seems to go ok for a quarter and a half then drops off.

Forwards need speed

 

[gringo2011]

He played full time inside mid at Box Hill. Then we drafted him and started developing him as a high half forward probably to train his outside game

I dont know what the coaches have planned but ideally he can play a Zac Bailey type role where he's a high half forward but can competently play CBAs when rotations are short. This half forward role is working for him - theres no need to change it while we have some midfield depth

Long term he'll definitely play some inside mid. How much is the ultimate question

Watched a couple of BHH games to look at him when we were linked. Looked to be playing exactly the role he is now. A running high half forward that moves up like an extra mid. Didn't see him attend centre bounces.

 

[g_TRAIN]

Cordy going on the LTI makes sense lol. It’s poor list management not to do it.

He definitely won’t be at the club next year, but instead of trialing someone new, we’re stuck with a list clogger until the end of the year.

Dumb decision by the club

You actually need the medical evidence to do so and it needs to be submitted to the AFL.

I don't think it's that easy to just put someone on the LTI list.

 

[Teflon]

He's just for too light for me. He gets pushed off the ball far too easy so unless he gets a clear run at it, he has issues finding it.

Yes now but size will come year 2?
He’ll be fine
Must persist

 

[Teflon]

Well he’s already doing all that (especially the last paragraph), so it would really only be the streaming out of centre bounces that we could potentially gain by having him actually start in there.

The price you’d pay for that though is that he would have a direct opponent playing like that, unlike at the moment, where he’s running around the midfield on his own for most of the game.

Yeah you might be right
I’m just keen on 2-3 clones of him tbh