List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion

[Captain Paddy]

So... Signing a top 5-10 talent in the league for two years is bad... because he might leave in two years which would set us back.

It's better to lose him now and get draft picks in a terrible & compromised draft, than lose him in 2027 when he might even be worth more if he keeps on the same trajectory he's been on this season.

2027 we might be talking about trading a Brownlow medalist and multi All Australian.


This has gotta be one of the dumbest things I've seen on Big Footy and that's saying something

 

[phantom13]

If you are emotional enough about this that you can’t see the big picture. So be it.

Apply a list build strategy to your $2m/2 year scenario and you start to see the significant issues with it.

A week ago you were all for signing Rowell, TDK and NAS, no issues with the cap.

Why is giving Nas a raise in 2 years (if we had to) such an issue, Rowell not coming literally saved you $2m a year to do with as you please.

 

[pebblesofsand]

Can't see how anybody can argue that the club (or anybody connected with the club) is at fault if a 22 yo adult decides he is homesick.

Would be different if he was going to West Coast or Geelong for simply money - then its feel free to stick the boots in.

 

[gringo2011]

The good thing is IF Aleer can't match it as a true full back, he has the versatility to play CHB/3rd tall/even lockdown small

I agree though, even though we are getting Aleer, I'd like to also get a James Blanck type to play as backup and potentially transition into best 22 if we're lucky

Then we can go with Blanck Aleer Wilkie as a back 3 with Tauru playing forward

Check out Wade Derksen for the Giants. He's getting ridiculous numbers in the VFL. Against the Gold Coast 2 matches ago had a 24 disposal 14 mark game. They picked him up as a KPF from the WAFL in the midseason draft a couple of years back. He'd be getting games at most clubs. https://vfl.aflmstats.com/player/Wade_Derksen

 

[stavro#4]

Im not predicting anything, im playing out all the angles and every one of them looks better for us if we sign him for 2 years, only a total moron thinks otherwise.

The draft capital in 2 years is better, the potential that well be better and have a better sell than just money is better, everything bar global warming looks better for Nas in saints colors in 2 years time.

Sure you realise in the one post you just claimed you aren’t predicting anything and have then told me everything is better in 2 years.

 

[OxSaint]

So... Signing a top 5-10 talent in the league for two years is bad... because he might leave in two years which would set us back.

It's better to lose him now and get draft picks in a terrible & compromised draft, than lose him in 2027 when he might even be worth more if he keeps on the same trajectory he's been on this season.

2027 we might be talking about trading a Brownlow medalist and multi All Australian.


This has gotta be one of the dumbest things I've seen on Big Footy and that's saying something

He will be a free agent though. No trade, just a compo pick. And if the mumours about a protected first round are true we are talking end of first round in Tassie diluted draft. There are big risks either way. It really isn’t a great spot for the club to be in.

 

[akaifu]

Max King and TDK are both relevant here. If we’re willing to pay overs for blokes that are yet to truely prove they are genuine stars but we’ve decided to play funny buggers for an actual home grown genuine star it just shows how out of wack our priorities are.

Overpaying Max King is an opinion made by fans, not a fact

The fact of the matter is that Dilena & Co have said that King rejected more financially lucrative offers to stay at St Kilda. By definition, that is 'unders'

Paying financial overs for TDK is to ensure that we do not have to pay overs at the trade table for him. Would you rather pay an extra 600k/year for 7 years that would otherwise have to be invested in a different player or the AFL takes it away from us, or lose 2 first round picks?

 

[phantom13]

Sure you realise in the one post you just claimed you aren’t predicting anything and have then told me everything is better in 2 years.

Because it is, its not a prediction, its looking at all the options available.

I dont know which one happens but literally every possible scenario is better if hes still here (short if him doing a knee i suppose, in which case your 10 year contract would be ****ing terrible anyway).

 

[stavro#4]

A week ago you were all for signing Rowell, TDK and NAS, no issues with the cap.

Why is giving Nas a raise in 2 years (if we had to) such an issue, Rowell not coming literally saved you $2m a year to do with as you please.

You can’t see how Nas TDK & Rowell is better than TDK & Nas on a shit load of money?

 

[gringo2011]

He will be a free agent though. No trade, just a compo pick. And if the mumours about a protected first round are true we are talking end of first round in Tassie diluted draft. There are big risks either way. It really isn’t a great spot for the club to be in.

I don't think so. I'm pretty sure that wouldn't take him to FA.

 

[phantom13]

Paying Max King is an opinion made by fans, not a fact

The fact of the matter is that Dilena & Co have said that King rejected more financially lucrative offers to stay at St Kilda. By definition, that is 'unders'

Paying financial overs for TDK is to ensure that we do not have to pay overs at the trade table for him. Would you rather pay an extra 600k/year for 7 years that would otherwise have to be invested in a different player or the AFL takes it away from us, or lose 2 first round picks?

Everyone seems to be of the opinion we can have TDK and Nas for the money being thrown around.

Rightly or wrongly if Nas goes itll be linked to TDKs pay day forever.

Id rather overpay Nas to keep him than overpay TDK to get him, but if we can do both, why dont we?

 

[phantom13]

You can’t see how Nas TDK & Rowell is better than TDK & Nas on a shit load of money?

You really reckon thats the point being made here?

 

[jwikked]

Can't see how anybody can argue that the club (or anybody connected with the club) is at fault if a 22 yo adult decides he is homesick.

Would be different if he was going to West Coast or Geelong for simply money - then its feel free to stick the boots in.

Yeah it was a risk dating back to the day we drafted him. It’s why Gerard Healy said we made the wrong move, despite people dancing on that a few days ago

 

[Sully111]

He will be a free agent though. No trade, just a compo pick. And if the mumours about a protected first round are true we are talking end of first round in Tassie diluted draft. There are big risks either way. It really isn’t a great spot for the club to be in.

You sure about that?

 

[stavro#4]

Because it is, its not a prediction, its looking at all the options available.

I dont know which one happens but literally every possible scenario is better if hes still here (short if him doing a knee i suppose, in which case your 10 year contract would be ****ing terrible anyway).

So you know all the players going to Tassie in 2 years that will give us those glorious picks and you know we will be in contention so Nas will take less

Interesting.

 

[Zzzed]

There must be a part of Nas that knows if he leaves now, we are going to get shafted in terms of what we get back.

In my best case version of how this plays out, he tells his manager that he is taking 2 more years at St Kilda, but he plans to return to Adelaide at the end of that - and tells his manager that he doesn't care which SA club he goes to as long as both he and the Saints are well compensated.

Of course, things could change in those 2 years, but at the very least the clubs and we as supporters get 2 years to prepare.

 

[HeavenlySources]

7 year deal

2 years at 2 mil to retain.

5 years at 1.4mil

Clause 1a)

If St Kilda wins a flag within the first two years or thereafter Nas gets a 600k per year bonus for every year left on his contract

 

[akaifu]

Check out Wade Derksen for the Giants. He's getting ridiculous numbers in the VFL. Against the Gold Coast 2 matches ago had a 24 disposal 14 mark game. They picked him up as a KPF from the WAFL in the midseason draft a couple of years back. He'd be getting games at most clubs. https://vfl.aflmstats.com/player/Wade_Derksen

I have watched Derksen before. He is another third tall, not a full back

If we get him then we're just adding the same type of player as Tauru/Barrat/Wilkie/LOC who can't all play in the same side

I'd like to see his 1v1 contest numbers and the stats of his direct opponent

 

[littlecreatures]

A week ago you were all for signing Rowell, TDK and NAS, no issues with the cap.

Why is giving Nas a raise in 2 years (if we had to) such an issue, Rowell not coming literally saved you $2m a year to do with as you please.

Look, the sky could be purple but if the club says it’s Red then Stav says it’s red.

 

[stavro#4]

You really reckon thats the point being made here?

That’s precisely the point. You use your cap to get better. Not giving it all to retain what you have when you are at the ass end of the ladder.

You take what’s fair. You sign on and the club will build around you.

 

[thekizzler]

He will be a free agent though. No trade, just a compo pick. And if the mumours about a protected first round are true we are talking end of first round in Tassie diluted draft. There are big risks either way. It really isn’t a great spot for the club to be in.

I don't think this is true, mate.

Eight years of service for Wanganeen-Milera is after the 2029 season - that's when he is a free agent.

 

[phantom13]

So you know all the players going to Tassie in 2 years that will give us those glorious picks and you know we will be in contention so Nas will take less

Interesting.

... i didnt say Nas would take less though did I? Also didnt say it would be picks, also didnt say wed be in contention.

Did say that all those scenarios wind up being better than losing Nas for ports shithouse 2 futures and Bergman or Berry. I mean worst case we just get that same deal in 2 years time when we know were trash anyway and are starting another rebuild.

It is a comprehension issue. All good brother. You keep at it.

 

[stavro#4]

Look, the sky could be purple but if the club says it’s Red then Stav says it’s red.

Club was wrong on Billings and Gresham and battle.

You all carried on and yet…. The club was right.

 

[gringo2011]

Can't see how anybody can argue that the club (or anybody connected with the club) is at fault if a 22 yo adult decides he is homesick.

Would be different if he was going to West Coast or Geelong for simply money - then its feel free to stick the boots in.

How do we assume that that is the only criteria for him? Perhaps money, projected improvement, time frames etc all contribute. If he's willing to sign for two years but then he goes because we held out paying him what the SA sides would pay him over a long term average you can't say it was just homesickness.

 

[littlecreatures]

Club was wrong on Billings and Gresham and battle.

You all carried on and yet…. The club was right.

Painting me with a broad brush. Never said the club was wrong about Billings, Gresham, or even Battle for that matter, but this is going into nuffy territory re Nas.