List Mgmt. 2025 List Management discussion - part 2

[True Believer]

That's something you can only say with hindsight.

No one would've said that at the time.

When Grundy signed his extension with Collingwood, he was the reigning All-Australian ruck. Coming off 2 straight AA appearances after being named in 2018 then first ruck in 2019, relegating Gawn to the bench.

TDK hasn't done anything like that. Not remotely close. Hasn't ever been in consideration for making the 40-man squad, let alone first ruck ahead of Gawn.

The thing with rucks, as Grant Thomas (and many others) have pointed out, is they aren't essential to success.

Gawn and Xerri are the top two rucks and their teams have won 12 games combined.

To be a premiership contender, you don't need a good ruck. Look at Rhys Stanley- Geelong's #1 ruck every year as they perennially contend for flags.

So if you can pay $700k and get a solid ruck through trade or Free agency (or promote one of your youngsters) compared to paying someone $1.7mil. Ask- what are you getting for the extra $1mil.

Overpaying any player is unwise but overpaying a ruck is especially bad business.

So assumedly if we win the flag with TDK as Norm Smith medalist you won't celebrate?.......

 

[akaifu]

So we're recruiting a 29 year old small forward because he used to take hangers back in 2018?

Feel like this has been said a thousand times already but

Ross thinks this list can contend over the next couple of years as phase 1 of the rebuild for sustained success

Go hard and re-assess at the end of 2027 when everyone is OOC. Can we keep pushing or do we reset under Enright? A poster raised the point yesterday that Hawthorn did something similar from 2008 premiership to 2013-2015 3-peat

We have this flexibility because of all the investment in kids the past few years. Our core will continue developing and will keep us up no matter what strategy we adopt

Late second round picks/third round picks aren't worth as much as a Ryan is to us now. We already nailed the likes of Garcia/Boxshall/Windy/maybe Hastie/maybe Keeler - yes we can keep going for them - but theres a point where theres an imbalance in list demographic

An injury to Butler meant we ended up with Wilson in the forward pocket. There's a clear issue with our small forward depth. Ryan Higgins Hall Butler all complement each other - a range of attributes amongst that group. Collard has become a wildcard of some sort - we will become a 2 goal better team if he realises his potential

Also the slight factor that we need to convince Nas to stay beyond 2027...

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Paddy Ryder won us an elimination final, then got injured in the closing minutes. I'd say he was very important.
Had he played the rest of that finals series, he may have had a big say in it.

 

[akaifu]

Paddy Ryder won us an elimination final, then got injured in the closing minutes. I'd say he was very important.
Had he played the rest of that finals series, he may have had a big say in it.

Losing Paddy and Carlisle for that Richmond semi gave us no chance

 

[SaintsofSteel]

Ryan is to old and well past his best - once again we become the AFL retirement/superannuation village. The most goals he has kicked in any season is 30 in 2019.

For the 2 or 3 years we will be forced to play him surely we can find other much younger alternatives with a future?

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Losing Paddy and Carlisle for that Richmond semi gave us no chance

Everitt & Vidovic too, but thats going back abit
Rehn monstered us in the GF, poor ol valiant Cook.

 

[akaifu]

Ryan is to old and well past his best - once again we become the AFL retirement/superannuation village.

For the 2 or 3 years we will be forced to play him surely we can find other much younger alternatives with a future?

Any suggestions that wouldn't cost us our first rounders?

Also, Ryan is younger than Rowan Marshall - and plenty on here have said Marshall has plenty of years left as a ruckman

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Ryan is to old and well past his best - once again we become the AFL retirement/superannuation village. The most goals he has kicked in any season is 24 in 2019.

For the 2 or 3 years we will be forced to play him surely we can find other much younger alternatives with a future?

Twomey has Dovaston around our 1st draft pick

 

[SaintsofSteel]

Twomey has Dovaston around our pick

Exactly Dovaston, Arki Butler or another kid.

 

[thekizzler]

I don't buy this "Hammer is a FWD" line of thinking.

This is what Ross the boss has been saying, chief.

You need arguably more smarts to play as a defender these days.

Not sure if you have watched our defence play or not but our team defence requires defenders to communicate, roll on to different opponents, plug space gaps and support your fellow defenders.

Caminiti is reasonable at 1-on-1 defending although he gives away too many free kicks. When the ball is in motion, he really struggles with transitioning between players.

I wouldnt 100% rule him out succeeding as a defender but I'm not filled with confidence he is a long-term solution in defence.

I daresay if he was a guaranteed first choice defender going forwards, Dougal Howard would be delisted right now.

 

[ARCHIE66]

Feeling so excited about next year

 

[Dard Ball Get]

Where does everyone want to see Tauru settle positionally long term?

 

[Saints4ever]

Where does everyone want to see Tauru settle positionally long term?

Forward thanks

 

[akaifu]

Exactly Dovaston, Arki Butler or another kid.

The idea is to attack success over the next 2 years

Drafting an 18 yr old small forward is highly unlikely to make as much impact as a Ryan in this period, whose impact in the next 3-4 years could outweigh the impact of a kid taken in the second round across their entire career

If there was a Shaun Mannagh type this year then Id see your point, but there doesn't seem to be one

Plus, Butler is a 2026 prospect

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

This is what Ross the boss has been saying, chief.

You need arguably more smarts to play as a defender these days.

Not sure if you have watched our defence play or not but our team defence requires defenders to communicate, roll on to different opponents, plug space gaps and support your fellow defenders.

Caminiti is reasonable at 1-on-1 defending although he gives away too many free kicks. When the ball is in motion, he really struggles with transitioning between players.

I wouldnt 100% rule him out succeeding as a defender but I'm not filled with confidence he is a long-term solution in defence.

I daresay if he was a guaranteed first choice defender going forwards, Dougal Howard would be delisted right now.

Howard for depth, 1 more year, eases the pressure on Barrat & Tauru.
Aĺeer & Caminiti the starters for next year, l assume?

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Where does everyone want to see Tauru settle positionally long term?

C.H.F

 

[Ads734]

Gawn’s team won a premiership.
And he was a huge part in it.

Where does everyone want to see Tauru settle positionally long term?

Will
Be a generation forward if he develops there. Mark my words.

 

[ARCHIE66]

Why is everyone fussing over Ryan being a bad pickup, he is playing forward in an all tome bad team of course his stats aren’t gonna look amazing. It’s not like will be giving up the world for him and it’s the first mature age recruit we’ve gone after for a whee. He will be good.

 

[ARCHIE66]

Also he hasn’t changed as a player since their premiership and when they were still winning games, it’s only cos there so bad as a team that he gets less of it now.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

The idea is to attack success over the next 2 years

Drafting an 18 yr old small forward is highly unlikely to make as much impact as a Ryan in this period, whose impact in the next 3-4 years could outweigh the impact of a kid taken in the second round across their entire career

If there was a Shaun Mannagh type this year then Id see your point, but there doesn't seem to be one

Plus, Butler is a 2026 prospect

Massimo Raso, Richmond vfl 20y.o small forward, has been touted as a pick up in the draft,
171cm though ???

 

[akaifu]

Massimo Raso, Richmond vfl 20y.o small forward, has been touted as a pick up in the draft,
171cm though ???

I haven't watched him at all except that one Sandy vs Richmond game so all I'll say is that I feel like if he was good enough he would've been taken in the MSD when he had a ton of hype

Probably some underlying issue in his game behind his sizeable goal tally

 

[thekizzler]

Howard for depth, 1 more year, eases the pressure on Barrat & Tauru.
Aĺeer & Caminiti the starters for next year, l assume?

If fit, I expect Dougal to be our first choice full back.

Ross has said he sees Caminiti as a forward. That might change over summer.

Howard, Aleer, Wilkie, Tauru to be the tall defenders.

Tauru can be used as a swingman if need be. Hope he settles as a forward in the future too.

 

[SaintsofSteel]

Why is everyone fussing over Ryan being a bad pickup, he is playing forward in an all tome bad team of course his stats aren’t gonna look amazing. It’s not like will be giving up the world for him and it’s the first mature age recruit we’ve gone after for a whee. He will be good.

Because we have wasted picks on other clubs retirees for decades, what has that achieved?

Even Macrae is already looking like a poor investment given last year's draft strength and what he is getting paid.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

I haven't watched him at all except that one Sandy vs Richmond game so all I'll say is that I feel like if he was good enough he would've been taken in the MSD when he had a ton of hype

Probably some underlying issue in his game behind his sizeable goal tally

Yeah Raso, around 30 goals, if he's played every game? 2.6 tackle ave. 12 disp. ave.

 

[Joffaboy]

So we're recruiting a 29 year old small forward because he used to take hangers back in 2018?

Yeah that's it.