List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part 3

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 3

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
​

 

[bergholt]

In regards to trading Steele, do we believe windy is now ready to take that position on a FT basis?

RTB said multiple times that he was having trouble fitting Steele and Macrae into the same midfield. Steele doesn't need replacing as long as Macrae is around.

 

[Stan_Darsh72]

Very interesting article by Wilson in the Age today about the strategy adopted by the Saints and it is exactly what has been discussed here.
1.Put in place over a year ago
2. Supporter groups saw Saints as 'meek'. I remember saying similar in the after season review the Saints sens members, I obviously wasn't alone.
3. Deliberate FU to other clubs over FS and NGA. Effect is rule changes in 26
4. Confirmed that NWM would not have been traded and would have ended in the PSD going to WCE.
5. Lyon decided in August to go after JSOS, and got Allen on to it.
6 The big one is her affirmation that we only paid 83% of the SC this year. And also money for Billings and Crouch
So my calculations for excess SC
2 X 5% Savings on SC = 1.83 million
17% in Savings in 25. = 3.11 million

A warchest of nearly 5 million.
Unknowns and estimates
Billings and Crouch = 500k?
All contracts have no future SC increases built in, estimates vary but likely 1.5 to 2 million increase.
After paying 95% of the cap a club can pay 105% the following year, not sure if this is part of the current calculations but a potential 915k extra.
So what we can confidently say is Saints had a minimum 5 million to spend in trade period 2025.
If the 105% rule is invoked this year, that's 5.9 million.
Then going take off Billings and Crouch, we could have had up to 6.5 million over the cap to spend in 2025.
Going forward, any increase of SC has not been factored in to contracts.
Figures have a little bit of rigour as we know the SC total, the years we saved SC, the 105 % rule on SC spend, and Wilson has mentioned a number of times 83 to 85% spend on SC in 2025.
So in future you can just laugh at idiot oppo supporters when they talk about SC, the figures, based on known facts ( except Caro's figure of course, that can't be corroborated) are all above.
As for the strategy, it is bold and decisive, has rattled the AFL, oppo clubs and coaches as can be seen by the petulant salty offer by the Western nepo babies towards a contracted and happy Wilkie.

About time this club grew some balls. I say bravo. You have got me back as a 11 game member with a reserved seat for next season.

The club is not going to die wondering.

Beats being timid bitches and being stuck.

 

[Joffaboy]

We're running out of teams to piss off really.

• The Northern Nepo Babies are riled up about the threat to the academy gravy train
• Port and Adelaide are livid Nas knocked them back
• Carlton are up in arms their refugees running to us

Why not add the Doggies to the list after they failed to undercut us?

Dogs and Collingwood for us getting JSOS.
WCE for going after Ryan.
Geelong for demanding a big price for Marshall.
Only GWS happy with us for going after Aleer

 

[Diehard Saint]

Dogs and Collingwood for us getting JSOS.
WCE for going after Ryan.
Geelong for demanding a big price for Marshall.
Only GWS happy with us for going after Aleer

Ol mate Dimma not so crash hot on us apparently going after Flanders as well.

 

[gringo2011]

100% agree. If people on here are seriously unhappy with what the club are doing right now, then I'd have to question people's grasp of what's coming up for the competition in the next few years with Tassie coming in. If you're not competitive and challenging the top eight now, then you're probably looking at another 5 to 10 years of bottom 6 mediocrity.

Also the flow on effect of these signings is its own momentum. Nothing but good news at the moment. Got people at the club who are actually turning the wheel rather than just talking shit about it. As a club we're standing on business for the first time in about 15 years. I don't how anyone could be unhappy about that.

One of the curses of being a st Kilda supporter is having to deal with so many sad sack fellow supporters. Does my head in.

I think that's totally unfair. The club is rolling the dice and mortgaging the future on the next couple of years. I think it's got a. much better chance of working this time than Lethlean's version of it. But it's still going an extremely risky route and we are paying top dollar for mostly B grade talent with potential.

It has to work out or it's a likely to end in tears with lots of improving youth likely to get tempted away for cash while we pay a bunch of GOPs instead. People are perfectly entitled to have concerns about our future. They are like politicians throwing cash around right now. It feels good but you are paying for it later.

You have emotional issues if you think that other supporters are ruining your experience. Maybe you need the club to perform to get some positivity in your life.

 

[stavro#4]

Article Joffa referenced. Interesting that Caro got the inside word.

 

[stavro#4]

I think that's totally unfair. The club is rolling the dice and mortgaging the future on the next couple of years. I think it's got a. much better chance of working this time than Lethlean's version of it. But it's still going an extremely risky route and we are paying top dollar for mostly B grade talent with potential.

It has to work out or it's a likely to end in tears with lots of improving youth likely to get tempted away for cash while we pay a bunch of GOPs instead. People are perfectly entitled to have concerns about our future. They are like politicians throwing cash around right now. It feels good but you are paying for it later.

You have emotional issues if you think that other supporters are ruining your experience. Maybe you need the club to perform to get some positivity in your life.

No sorry. Won’t cop that.

What future is mortgaged? At worst case it’s one First round pick and salary cap on TDK.

That isn’t mortgaging the future.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

In regards to trading Steele, do we believe windy is now ready to take that position on a FT basis?

Windy isnt a big stoppage tackler, & seems to enjoy the freedom on the wing.
So, l'd say no.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

So how many key defenders do you want in the team? Who do you pick in the seniors from Wilkie, Howard, Silvagni, Aleer, Tauru and Caminiti? Keeping in mind that King, Sharman, Marshall and Owens are automatic marking forward picks so there is no room Caminiti or Tauru forward.

I think that Steele should be traded if we can get anything back for him. Not sure that's going to happen though. I also don't think there's any point in keeping both Marshall and TDK (would have preferred to just have Marshall at less than half the cost of TDK but that ship has sailed)

You're going to see a tap ruckman that hits its to advantage.
You'll come round

 

[gringo2011]

Partially, but it's also a choice to continually think like a loser.

Depends on how you frame it. Someone who lives on their knees and accepts the situation is the definition of a loser. I'd rather fight for better than accept mediocrity. The club administrators are representatives of the fan base not owners. They need holding to account. The club has made huge inroads but we should strive for being the best run and best performing club in the country. Aiming low is sad. I don't want to be a little bit better than North Melbourne. I want people to hate us like people hate Geelong.

 

[Joffaboy]

No sorry. Won’t cop that.

What future is mortgaged? At worst case it’s one First round pick and salary cap on TDK.

That isn’t mortgaging the future.

Haven't we actually paid off the mortgage on SC savings and now are renovating with the excess cash?

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Marshall helps the Cats waaaay more than pick 15 (which will slide several spots) helps us

Plus, he's contracted and we've paid most of that contract's value due to it being front ended. It would literally take SDK or Pick 15 + Brad Close to be worth our while

I’d be after Connor O’Sullivan straight up.

Kid will be a superstar.

 

[Joffaboy]

Depends on how you frame it. Someone who lives on their knees and accepts the situation is the definition of a loser. I'd rather fight for better than accept mediocrity. The club administrators are representatives of the fan base not owners. They need holding to account. The club has made huge inroads but we should strive for being the best run and best performing club in the country. Aiming low is sad. I don't want to be a little bit better than North Melbourne. I want people to hate us like people hate Geelong.

Read the Caro article.

 

[gringo2011]

I think Bassat has his hands all over it.
Particularly in the planning and execution of this strategy.
The list choices - absolutely Lyon.

I think Lyon is the driver but Bassat the conduit. He's letting Lyon call shots but helping to get shit done to achieve it. Carton are the opposite. No-one has control and decisions are all over the place.

Having an autocrat in charge can be a problem but for club that was a bit lost it's absolutely a positive to redirect our energy in one direction.

It's not like no one knew that Ross was like that.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

Marshall helps the Cats waaaay more than pick 15 (which will slide several spots) helps us

Plus, he's contracted and we've paid most of that contract's value due to it being front ended. It would literally take SDK or Pick 15 + Brad Close to be worth our while

Thank god someone else likes? Brad Close

 

[stavro#4]

Haven't we actually paid off the mortgage on SC savings and now are renovating with the excess cash?

If Roma goes, we likely have 2 First round picks this year or next.

Even if he stays, we lost this years and bring in Flanders - who we all agree is probably worth a first of some sorts on his own.

I do however take note that Caro gets this exclusive and DOES NOT rule out Cmac.

Either way, future firsts all remain. A lot of youth on the list that ensures no impact to build for 12 months.

 

[gringo2011]

Box looks like he'll be Steele 2.0 with a hint of Dal Santo. Very excited about him

I see more Lenny in him. He's a mild mannered tough guy. The don't argue and the willingness to use his body as a battering ram have already been on show. The guy shoved Cripps (a KP sized mid) out of his way like he was an irritation and kicked multiple goals in his first outing in our colours. Good way to endear yourself to a fan base.

 

[stavro#4]

I’d be after Connor O’Sullivan straight up.

Kid will be a superstar.

I want whatever you are drinking

But in all seriousness. He looked great in his draft season, we just weren’t in a position to really trade up.

 

[stavro#4]

Interesting that Steele wasn’t in the frame for a 50k belly rub.

 

[gringo2011]

Interesting, my family who are all Bulldogs supporters never mention the PF's to me. The time we spoke about it they seemed pretty fair.
Maybe because alot live on the Bellerine peninsula they have bigger fish to hate in Geelong.
They really aren't enamoured with Bailey Sniff playing there.

Not the prelim now, just the first time the rivalry started. They seem to hate the Saints for being a small dysfunctional club that takes handouts to survive. I think we all kick down and they see us as their down.

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

I’d be after Connor O’Sullivan straight up.

Kid will be a superstar.

That's why he won't be leaving

 

[gringo2011]

We're running out of teams to piss off really.

• The Northern Nepo Babies are riled up about the threat to the academy gravy train
• Port and Adelaide are livid Nas knocked them back
• Carlton are up in arms their refugees running to us

Why not add the Doggies to the list after they failed to undercut us?

I can guarantee that the Suns don't really hate us. They had more publicity and 'us against the world' publicity than ever before this season. They knew the free ride of NGA talent was going to have to end and it's all a bit of theatre.

They are playing finals, making the nightly news and are getting locals who hate being disrespected take notice.
In reality they would be loving the Saints.

List managers maybe not as much because we cut their gravy train but overall we've done them a service. Getting access to high end talent hasn't ever been a problem for them. It's making anyone give a shit that's hard for them.

 

[stavro#4]

Booom

 

[Joffaboy]

Crunch Time - Merrett wearing thin at Bomberland. Still wants out, doesn't like direction.

Somebody might want to check on Cal Twomey

 

[goodie23]

I can guarantee that the Suns don't really hate us. They had more publicity and 'us against the world' publicity than ever before this season. They knew the free ride of NGA talent was going to have to end and it's all a bit of theatre.

They are playing finals, making the nightly news and are getting locals who hate being disrespected take notice.
In reality they would be loving the Saints.

List managers maybe not as much because we cut their gravy train but overall we've done them a service. Getting access to high end talent hasn't ever been a problem for them. It's making anyone give a shit that's hard for them.

Was facetiously lumping all the northern clubs in the one basket - after all, the line was before the Gold Coast game but it was Brisbane that probably reacted hardest (the club that got a "local product" out of the Sandringham Dragons last year)