Rumour GFC 2025 Player Trading, Drafting FA, Rumours and Wish lists Pt 2

[CoolCat75]

Not that well - really the only bargain we got was Tom Hawkins. And that was almost 20 years ago, the stakes are higher and the professionalism is greater.

FWIW, I'm not against Father-Sons, or the NGA, just need to have a fair system for allocation. Points dont work, the system gets rorted and teams who have nothing to do with the trade get shafted. Should be that you sacrifice a pick reasonably close to the selection. If you cant do it, then tough. That way poor performing teams will still get their NGA and/or father sons whilst good teams will really have to do some genuine sacrifice to select such a topline player

This. For example Brisbane this year have Annable projected to go top 5. They should have to pay 1 high end pick, or 2 first rounders for this.

 

[Hinkley29]

Can someone please explain to me why the NGA’s exist?

My understanding is that the official reason they exist is to grow the game in non-afl heartland locations or areas that need resources. Ie. the northern states, or remote locations.

So if this is true, why are the NGA’s run by individual clubs? Why is it the club’s responsibility to grow the game? Surely they are acting in the club’s best interest and not the best interest of the game as a whole. Is “growing the game” in non-afl heartland locations not the AFL’s responsibility?

So why do the AFL not run these NGA’s, with the intent that these players are distributed in the same way that every other draftee does? It seems ludicrous to me that these NGA’s have been outsourced to the clubs.

What am I missing? Apart from the actual intent of funnelling local kids into the non-afl state teams?

 

[cats_09]

The only bad thing about not having Twitter anymore is the random trade ideas from trade radio.

Or some random guy posting a totally one sided deal that makes sense to him.

I'm more than happy to share those stupid ideas

 

[cats_09]

Can someone please explain to me why the NGA’s exist?

My understanding is that the official reason they exist is to grow the game in non-afl heartland locations or areas that need resources. Ie. the northern states, or remote locations.

So if this is true, why are the NGA’s run by individual clubs? Why is it the club’s responsibility to grow the game? Surely they are acting in the club’s best interest and not the best interest of the game as a whole. Is “growing the game” in non-afl heartland locations not the AFL’s responsibility?

So why do the AFL not run these NGA’s, with the intent that these players are distributed in the same way that every other draftee does? It seems ludicrous to me that these NGA’s have been outsourced to the clubs.

What am I missing? Apart from the actual intent of funnelling local kids into the non-afl state teams?

NGAs are different to Northern Academies - every club has their own NGA, here's the info from our:

NEXT GENERATION ACADEMIES
ABOUT THE PROGRAM​

The Next Generation Academies (NGA's) are a joint initiative between the AFL and AFL Clubs aimed at the attraction, retention and development of all talented players (both male and female), whilst growing participation in the under-represented segments of our community. A key objective of the NGA's is to increase the talent pool of Indigenous and Multicultural players. These groups are significantly under-represented in the AFL comparative to the population, and therefore AFL Clubs are incentivised through draft concessions for their role in growing this talent pool. However, the primary function of the NGA's is to provide a Club based talent program to all kids, using the AFL Clubs' profile and expertise to raise awareness and interest in the programs.

ELIGIBILITY​

To qualify for the Geelong Cats NGA the player:

1. Resides in the Geelong Cats zone in Victoria or the Northern Territory
2. Identifies as Aboriginal and/or Torres Strait Islander
3. Was born in an African, Asian or non-English speaking country
4. Has at least one parent born in an African or Asian country; or
5. Has both parents born in a non-English speaking country other than Africa or Asia

GEELONG CATS NGA ZONE​

Geelong's Victorian NGA zone stretches from Lara in the east to Terang in the west and Skipton (north) to Cape Otway (south), with the club also having access to NGA talent in East Arnhem land in the Northern Territory.

Click here to see more on the NGA Academy Zones.
---
We've picked up a couple of our NGA players in previous seasons in Blake Schlensog & Clohesy, while this year we're likely to pick up at least one if not both of Jesse Mellor & Ben Rongdit. Next year we've got Tom Steinfort coming through as an NGA


The Northern Academies are different because they're specific to GWS, Sydney, GC & Brisbane where they're designed to help grow and promote the game in non-traditional AFL markets

One key issue with that is when they become a piss take due to Nick Blakey being an academy player even though father John played 359 games, Robert Scott played 245 across Geelong & North but Bailey was part of GCs academy, and then there's Luke Hodge who not only has 345 games under his belt but 4 premierships including 3 as captain, where his kids are likely to be eligible for Brisbane's academy due to the family living in Brisbane

Potentially similar with Harley's boys should the family still live in Sydney even with his new AFL role




More on our NGA here - https://www.geelongcats.com.au/teams/academy/

 

[Turbocat]

Not that well - really the only bargain we got was Tom Hawkins. And that was almost 20 years ago, the stakes are higher and the professionalism is greater.

FWIW, I'm not against Father-Sons, or the NGA, just need to have a fair system for allocation. Points dont work, the system gets rorted and teams who have nothing to do with the trade get shafted. Should be that you sacrifice a pick reasonably close to the selection. If you cant do it, then tough. That way poor performing teams will still get their NGA and/or father sons whilst good teams will really have to do some genuine sacrifice to select such a topline player

I think it should be gone. No bidding on any player R1. If players are so enamoured with playing with their father side or their home state or what ever ..then the current fluidity of movement means that once uncontracted they will be able to be traded to where they wish to be .

Points are a strawman. No amount of payment would have been enough to compensate the system for Brisbane getting Ashcroft. To allow the ability for them to get dibs on him as a top team breaks the system.

Not only does it distort the talent equalisation effect where luck can kill the draft, it distort teams strength, it also denies bottoms side the value they deserve.

Some may grumble and complain that if you cant add R1 FSons then the system is no longer of value. Then so be it. but then the clubs would not get the likes of Josh Dacios or Jed Bews either.

Mellor this year for us is already a distortion. Imagine if the kid was a the best kid in the draft going us. Great for us . Bad for the comp.

Yes ..we gained Hawkins in the system that was in then…. and getting him and selwood was the biggest gain we ever got from Father Son. It gave us two players for over 300 games. and plenty demanded change after we got that. I hate to think we we are setting up Brisbane to be.

 

[cats_09]

Is Robertson an idiot?

Reminds me a bit of Preuss - goes from North where he was behind Goldstein to Melbourne where he was behind Gawn. Then he opted to move to GWS where he was behind Mumford

It was almost like he was happy to play second fiddle at the teams he moved to and get paid an AFL salary to play VFL football

 

[Hinkley29]

NGAs are different to Northern Academies - every club has their own NGA, here's the info from our:

NEXT GENERATION ACADEMIES​

ABOUT THE PROGRAM​

The Next Generation Academies (NGA's) are a joint initiative between the AFL and AFL Clubs aimed at the attraction, retention and development of all talented players (both male and female), whilst growing participation in the under-represented segments of our community. A key objective of the NGA's is to increase the talent pool of Indigenous and Multicultural players. These groups are significantly under-represented in the AFL comparative to the population, and therefore AFL Clubs are incentivised through draft concessions for their role in growing this talent pool. However, the primary function of the NGA's is to provide a Club based talent program to all kids, using the AFL Clubs' profile and expertise to raise awareness and interest in the programs.

ELIGIBILITY​

To qualify for the Geelong Cats NGA the player:

1. Resides in the Geelong Cats zone in Victoria or the Northern Territory
2. Identifies as Aboriginal and/or Torres Strait Islander
3. Was born in an African, Asian or non-English speaking country
4. Has at least one parent born in an African or Asian country; or
5. Has both parents born in a non-English speaking country other than Africa or Asia

GEELONG CATS NGA ZONE​

Geelong's Victorian NGA zone stretches from Lara in the east to Terang in the west and Skipton (north) to Cape Otway (south), with the club also having access to NGA talent in East Arnhem land in the Northern Territory.

Click here to see more on the NGA Academy Zones.
---
We've picked up a couple of our NGA players in previous seasons in Blake Schlensog & Clohesy, while this year we're likely to pick up at least one if not both of Jesse Mellor & Ben Rongdit. Next year we've got Tom Steinfort coming through as an NGA


The Northern Academies are different because they're specific to GWS, Sydney, GC & Brisbane where they're designed to help grow and promote the game in non-traditional AFL markets

One key issue with that is when they become a piss take due to Nick Blakey being an academy player even though father John played 359 games, Robert Scott played 245 across Geelong & North but Bailey was part of GCs academy, and then there's Luke Hodge who not only has 345 games under his belt but 4 premierships including 3 as captain, where his kids are likely to be eligible for Brisbane's academy due to the family living in Brisbane

Potentially similar with Harley's boys should the family still live in Sydney even with his new AFL role




More on our NGA here - https://www.geelongcats.com.au/teams/academy/

Thanks cats_09 for that info. It is very helpful.

I guess my question remains the same for NGA’s and northern academies:

Why are they run by the clubs for their own club gain, rather than being run by the AFL for the betterment of the game overall?

I am totally onboard with the AFL splashing a lot of cash into underserviced markets to encourage young players to have pathways into the game that they otherwise would not have. But this needs to be AFL run, not run by the clubs.

Why have the AFL outsourced this?

 

[Commando]

Reminds me a bit of Preuss - goes from North where he was behind Goldstein to Melbourne where he was behind Gawn. Then he opted to move to GWS where he was behind Mumford

It was almost like he was happy to play second fiddle at the teams he moved to and get paid an AFL salary to play VFL football

I suppose if you don't love footy or are not that competitive it's a good living

 

[jim boy]

Yes ..we gained Hawkins in the system that was in then…. and getting him and selwood was the biggest gain we ever got from Father Son. It gave us two players for over 300 games

I know you probably meant this - but just pointing that we got ONE player who played over 300 games from this system. We got selwood because we fell down the ladder in 2006 - exactly as the system should work.

 

[ChrisLOA]

NGAs are different to Northern Academies - every club has their own NGA, here's the info from our:

NEXT GENERATION ACADEMIES​

ABOUT THE PROGRAM​

The Next Generation Academies (NGA's) are a joint initiative between the AFL and AFL Clubs aimed at the attraction, retention and development of all talented players (both male and female), whilst growing participation in the under-represented segments of our community. A key objective of the NGA's is to increase the talent pool of Indigenous and Multicultural players. These groups are significantly under-represented in the AFL comparative to the population, and therefore AFL Clubs are incentivised through draft concessions for their role in growing this talent pool. However, the primary function of the NGA's is to provide a Club based talent program to all kids, using the AFL Clubs' profile and expertise to raise awareness and interest in the programs.

ELIGIBILITY​

To qualify for the Geelong Cats NGA the player:

1. Resides in the Geelong Cats zone in Victoria or the Northern Territory
2. Identifies as Aboriginal and/or Torres Strait Islander
3. Was born in an African, Asian or non-English speaking country
4. Has at least one parent born in an African or Asian country; or
5. Has both parents born in a non-English speaking country other than Africa or Asia

GEELONG CATS NGA ZONE​

Geelong's Victorian NGA zone stretches from Lara in the east to Terang in the west and Skipton (north) to Cape Otway (south), with the club also having access to NGA talent in East Arnhem land in the Northern Territory.

Click here to see more on the NGA Academy Zones.
---

Just on this...

We live in the City of Casey and my son was invited to Melbourne's NGA u15s team earlier this year. He made the team, despite being 13 years old and only having played 1 season of footy for Narre Warren JFC. He was invited down under the same criteria as listed above but when we got there I saw a lot of kids who didn't seem to fit. For the record, my Dad is Aboriginal & Mum is white and I look Greek/Italian. My wife is Australian Born Chinese, so my son is actually half Chinese and looks it. But he got invited due to his 'Aboriginality'.

Turns out, Melbourne uses the criteria listed above to invite a lot of kids down and expose them to the game, but also to find talent. This way they balance out the numbers to make up the teams. My son played alongside Brad Greene's son, who hardly fits the criteria above. We got to chat with him one day and he surprised me by telling me his son was there for the NGA. That's when I realised Melbourne have a team they use as a foundation then top it up with talented kids they find through this program. They found some ripper Sudanese boys. Tall and very gifted athletes.

A lot of boys who attended were great footballers but were cut because "you can't have a team of midfielders" as one assistant coach said to me. My son wasn't the best footballer, but he was the best small, lockdown defender with good speed, clean hands (he rarely fumbles) and competitive attitude (think of a smaller Tom Atkins but faster who can play in the back pocket).

I think the NGA concept is good, even if it is run differently to what I originally envisioned. It gives a lot of local kids the opportunity to experience some good coaching and to play alongside really good footballers when they otherwise wouldn't be able to.

I just wish my son could play for Geelong's NGA

 

[Kitcat]

Thanks cats_09 for that info. It is very helpful.

I guess my question remains the same for NGA’s and northern academies:

Why are they run by the clubs for their own club gain, rather than being run by the AFL for the betterment of the game overall?

I am totally onboard with the AFL splashing a lot of cash into underserviced markets to encourage young players to have pathways into the game that they otherwise would not have. But this needs to be AFL run, not run by the clubs.

Why have the AFL outsourced this?

Presumably because that would be very expensive to set up, whereas the clubs are most of the way there already in terms of coaches and facilities.

 

[Hinkley29]

Presumably because that would be very expensive to set up, whereas the clubs are most of the way there already in terms of coaches and facilities.

Do you think that Geelong already had coaches and facilities set up in remote parts of the country where their nga is located?

The northern state teams are heavily subsidised by the afl, so it is the afl’s money anyway.

 

[Jimmy Yamazaki]

With Trac requesting a trade, I wonder if Oliver will too.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Won't happen the AFL want these northern states to be successful.

WE Did bid on Gulden but swans matched that straight away.

We did well on the father sons .

Not as good as some like to obsess about.

Who were our father sons?? Scarlett, G ablett + N ablett?? Hawkins??

Scarlett a 3rd-4th rounder who took time to develop.

G ablett- end of first round early second rounder as dal santo put he was a low accumulating flashy HF who was inconsistent in games.

N ablett- was talk during HA season of him being dropped but we stuck with him.

Hawkins- was average until 2012 breakout season.

My point being more.. We werent gifted walk up gun top 3-5 picks who walked in ready made stars like daicos, ashcroft x2, anabble.

We got 3 guns that took years to turn into what they are in our system.

Ashcroft x2 and daicos walked thru the doors and helped win flags

 

[D BRIDGE]

With Trac requesting a trade, I wonder if Oliver will too.

Clubs would want Trac... Oliver has probably run his race as a wanted talent.

Dees and him will be locked together forever now due to A: form, and B: a contract worth double the player's value.

 

[Kobe Gryant]

Our overall team is clearly not better, but we are great at extracting maximum from our list, until the GF.
We have many B graders, Lions have many A graders.
Jaspa Fletcher would walk into our team as # 1 or 2 mid, and he's about 9 at Brisbane.
Then their age profile is great as well.

You can make the point without dripping in hyperbole Dubs. Why do you always do this?

I’ve been as high on Brisbane’s list as anyone here, and rate Fletcher highly. He’d still be our third best mid at best.

That still proves your point, but it removes the weird need to just throw an extra 30% on any Geelong related issue.

Putting extra mayo on everything lacks the same objectivity as just pretending we’re the best at everything, too.

 

[rocker_oz33]

Not as good as some like to obsess about.

Who were our father sons?? Scarlett, G ablett + N ablett?? Hawkins??

Scarlett a 3rd-4th rounder who took time to develop.

G ablett- end of first round early second rounder as dal santo put he was a low accumulating flashy HF who was inconsistent in games.

N ablett- was talk during HA season of him being dropped but we stuck with him.

Hawkins- was average until 2012 breakout season.

My point being more.. We werent gifted walk up gun top 3-5 picks who walked in ready made stars like daicos, ashcroft x2, anabble.

We got 3 guns that took years to turn into what they are in our system.

Ashcroft x2 and daicos walked thru the doors and helped win flags

Agree these guys are guns from the start.
and yes they should of paid up.

 

[Mad_Hatter]

Lions essentially got 2 number 1 picks, and top 3-5 pick and a top 5 pick for a big handful of picks in the 20s and 30s.
That's the issue.

 

[Jumping Jack]

Clubs would want Trac... Oliver has probably run his race as a wanted talent.

Dees and him will be locked together forever now due to A: form, and B: a contract worth double the player's value.

Genuine question and without wanting to stir up a wild response, but on face value is there a huge gap between the output of Worpel this year, and the output of Oliver.

I don't have access to the stats but I'm not sure that's a perfect way to compare either. One played in a side that made a prelim - the other at a club that finished at the other end of the ladder. I also get that one is a free agent and the other not - so the question here really just relates to who had the better output of the two.

Again, at face value I'm not sure they were poles apart were they?

 

[Kobe Gryant]

Genuine question and without wanting to stir up a wild response, but on face value is there a huge gap between the output of Worpel this year, and the output of Oliver.

I don't have access to the stats but I'm not sure that's a perfect way to compare either. One played in a side that made a prelim - the other at a club that finished at the other end of the ladder. I also get that one is a fee agent and the other not - so the question here really just relates to who had the better output of the two.

Again, at face value I'm not sure they were poles apart were they?

Probably not, and if we did get Clarry, you can basically kiss goodbye any small chance of Butters, Curnow, etc with that contract.

If anyone wants him, you're holding onto the 1% chance he rediscovers what he was - which is four years ago now, an eternity in footy years.

Worpel's no world beater, but at least we know what he is. He's a model citizen, and he's cheap too.

Love him or hate him, you can at least understand why the club is intrigued in that regard.

If he spuds it up, just kick him to the curb. There's no real risk profile.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Surely we are asking the question of petracca?? Exactly what our midfield needs.

Petracca + worpell i would prefer. Huge midfield upgrade. Then add butters next season.

I am also shocked nobody has tried to raid brisbane.

I cant imagine W ashcroft is on mega bucks..

Surely someone would knock on his door and say “ here is 1.2m over 7 years” and he would have to think

 

[strauchnyy]

I don’t understand why Geelong has t had a crack at Petracca. He’d be the perfect inside bull we need.

 

[Cataholic]

I don’t understand why Geelong has t had a crack at Petracca. He’d be the perfect inside bull we need.

Maybe they've reached out and he's said he's not interested?

 

[D BRIDGE]

Genuine question and without wanting to stir up a wild response, but on face value is there a huge gap between the output of Worpel this year, and the output of Oliver.

I don't have access to the stats but I'm not sure that's a perfect way to compare either. One played in a side that made a prelim - the other at a club that finished at the other end of the ladder. I also get that one is a free agent and the other not - so the question here really just relates to who had the better output of the two.

Again, at face value I'm not sure they were poles apart were they?

I'd actually prefer Oliver if we could get him as an FA at the same $$$ as we will get Worpel.

Oliver has a slight chance of becoming very good again... Worpel probably doesn't in my eyes and is looking like a solid role player at best.

However, Oliver's contract is a real thing and will keep him at the Dees forever, unless he becomes allergic to money.

Both not great form-wise.

 

[bombersboy]

I don’t understand why Geelong has t had a crack at Petracca. He’d be the perfect inside bull we need.

He has not been the same player since he got injured.