Roast It's time to talk about the coaches

[1970crow]

Pyke could say who he wants but if the club can’t get it done, which we know they can’t, he’s not going to walk away.

Hell we couldn’t even keep Francou more than one year.

Given the year we had and with assistant coaches leaving early. do you think we would have been a destination quality coaches would have wanted to come to?

We kept a coach the quality of Ben Hart, that says it all.

Don had the option to stay and coach with what we could get or not coach, of course he was going to stay, no senior coach just walks away.

The reality is that no senior coach would walk away because even if they didn’t get exactly what they wanted in terms of inbound coaches, they have the power to get rid of long serving and underperforming incumbents. If you refused to work with any coach who’s contract is up, they’d be gone. You’re contracted, they’re not, a “it’s him or me” statement only has one outcome if you’re not on your last legs yourself. Having an assistant coach head to another club or look at opportunities outside of footy is commonplace. Explaining why the senior coach left with 2 years on his contract is a little less comfortable. Campo was easy, we’d already heard that he didn’t apply for the senior gig due to his family and business commitments. If Pyke had made a stand on him, he’d be gone and none of the pesky loss of face for an employee that worries our board so much.

 

[Elite Crow]

The reality is that no senior coach would walk away because even if they didn’t get exactly what they wanted in terms of inbound coaches, they have the power to get rid of long serving and underperforming incumbents. If you refused to work with any coach who’s contract is up, they’d be gone. You’re contracted, they’re not, a “it’s him or me” statement only has one outcome if you’re not on your last legs yourself. Having an assistant coach head to another club or look at opportunities outside of footy is commonplace. Explaining why the senior coach left with 2 years on his contract is a little less comfortable. Campo was easy, we’d already heard that he didn’t apply for the senior gig due to his family and business commitments. If Pyke had made a stand on him, he’d be gone and none of the pesky loss of face for an employee that worries our board so much.

As much as we aren’t a fan of Campo, when all you can get are guys like Hart and sanfl coaches, I don’t think he can be too picky.

 

[1970crow]

As much as we aren’t a fan of Campo, when all you can get are guys like Hart and sanfl coaches, I don’t think he can be too picky.

I posted this 2-3 year’s ago, when you’ve still got Campo it’s hard to entice driven and talented coaches. He’s a blocker, if you want to be a senior coach you need to be a midfield coach or senior assistant. That opportunity hasn’t existed at our club for years. So anybody good and on an upward trajectory, like Teague, needs to move sideways where there is upward opportunity. Anybody that’s average isn’t going anywhere anyway, so they slide in very comfortably. If you managed a potential future senior coach, would you suggest that being a line coach at AFC is a good strategic move in terms of career advancement?

 

[Elite Crow]

I posted this 2-3 year’s ago, when you’ve still got Campo it’s hard to entice driven and talented coaches. He’s a blocker, if you want to be a senior coach you need to be a midfield coach or senior assistant. That opportunity hasn’t existed at our club for years. So anybody good and on an upward trajectory, like Teague, needs to move sideways where there is upward opportunity. Anybody that’s average isn’t going anywhere anyway, so they slide in very comfortably. If you managed a potential future senior coach, would you suggest that being a line coach at AFC is a good strategic move in terms of career advancement?

No

 

[1970crow]

No

Exactly, Campo is the cause of us not being able to entice high quality line coaches. I accept that the reason that the reason he remains is because of administrative pressure, but Pyke, if so inclined, could exert a consioamount of pressure going the other way. That he hasn’t is on him and nobody else. Most of us knew that we needed a coach who was going to be an agent of change. Pyke’s business success was often spruiked as being a reason that he’ll not accept failure, but he readily accepts failure, he’s surrounded by it. I was hopeful that a guy who didn’t need to pay cheque to pay off a mortgage would be that non-negotiable, success or die doing it, agent of change. The signs were there early that he was fully at the Neil Craig end of the Blight/Craig spectrum. System, continuity and working harder can overcome talent deficiencies. He’s incapable of making a ballsy move which is why admin have been able to saddle him with whatever shit they choose to throw his way. He’s getting exactly what his philosophy on football deserves.

 

[ftmch]

I understand the notion that a head coach doesn't always get to pick and choose the exact assistants that they want (though they really should, but that's another discussion).

But still, if you're a head coach, coming off the shitful year we had in 2018, you need need to be able to demand, at a minimum, that you do NOT accept Ben Hart as your your forward line coach not Campo as a strategic coach going into the hugely important redemption year of 2019.

Such is the blatant incompentency of these appointments - particularly Ben Hart - it reflects as badly on Pyke that he was willing to accept them (again, giving him the benefit of the doubt that he didn't actually request or heavily influence these himself).

I'm surprised some people are portraying Pyke as an innocent victim in all of this.

 

[Mismatched]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/2018-09-16/next-off-the-bench-senior-coaches-in-waiting

Interesting article. A very conspicious absence of current or past Adelaide assistants in what's quite an extensive list. Now a media list of "coaches in waiting" is obviously not the be all and end all, but sums up where we're at. Either long standing "rusted on's" going no where, bringing in no new IP or new ideas, and rookie SANFL coaches. Oh and plus Ben Hart who simply had no other options and apparently neither did we...

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

What personnel changes did Richmond make after their big external review a few years ago?

 

[Scorpus]

What personnel changes did Richmond make after their big external review a few years ago?

New GM of Football and I believe they replaced 2-3 assistants with highly experienced coaches and added several new development coaches

 

[lincsPJ]

What personnel changes did Richmond make after their big external review a few years ago?

They ditched choco and brought in balmey. The signing of the great NB to come home would’ve been their biggest piece of the premiership puzzle.

Lepitsch came down from Brisbane and they also landed highly lauded caracella for the box.

 

[Thetrader15]

They ditched choco and brought in balmey. The signing of the great NB to come home would’ve been their biggest piece of the premiership puzzle.

Lepitsch came down from Brisbane and they also landed highly lauded caracella for the box.

Compare:

Balme - Burton
Lepitsch - Hart
Caracella - Godden

All due respect to MG, but just off reputation it's not a strong start

 

[Doctor B]

We were promised the best footy department by Fagan in 2014, he said that was the one thing that he could absolutely control, putting the right people in the right seats and getting the right systems in place.

We have Burton > Pyke > Campo > Hart, Mattner, Godden, Clarke.
Compare that to Hawthorn
Graham Wright > Clarkson > Yze (Melbourne) Burns (Collingwood, West Coast) Glass (West Coast) Newman (Richmond)

Burton absolutely is not the right person for his seat, Pyke is a maybe.
How do our assistants compare with names like Carracella, Longmuir, Harvey, Burns, Glass, Cox, Lappin, Scarlett, Giansiracusa, Hickmont, Graham, Barker, Kingsley, Nicks, Rawlings, Ratten, Solomon, King, I'm sure theres plenty more that I can't think of at the moment.

Chappy has had his tenure quietly extended, the clubs administration are happy in a nice cozy comfort zone knowing that ultimately they are unanswerable.

The metrics of success for the AFC are bums on seats, sponsorship revenue and not dropping down the ladder too far.
I want to support a club that has a mentality of ruthlessness for success and truly getting the right people in the right seats to achieve prolonged success.

Having a good list that is poorly coached is a wasted opportunity.

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I reckon Fangan's found that putting the right people in the right seats is easier said than done

It's not as though we've never been able to attract good people though. Over the journey people like Hamilton, Rendell, Noble, Teague, Ogilvie, Walsh, Stewart, Jonas are all respected industry wide and sought after.

Sure there might be a smaller pool of options compared to interstate clubs (many of those listed above have an SA link) but in a way that should make it easier to hone in on the better people. Only one competitor to outbid too.

 

[GreyCrow]

Mattner , Godden , and Pyke for the mens team are the ones I would keep (for now) but if Marty insists on a handball from full back I can be convinced to move him on .

Clarke , McLeod and Caven for the womens team

The rest I either dont know or can be moved on Hart , Clarke(ruck) and Camporeale

 

[jackster83]

Mattner , Godden , and Pyke for the mens team are the ones I would keep (for now) but if Marty insists on a handball from full back I can be convinced to move him on .

Clarke , McLeod and Caven for the womens team

The rest I either dont know or can be moved on Hart , Clarke(ruck) and Camporeale

I don't want that **** Burton interviewing and hiring coaches. Get the GM of Football position sorted first.

 

[mistylake]

Pyke is a poor coach, made a GF off genuine talent but he is no motivator and tactically out coached. Roo has to take responsibility for a poor appointment.

Burton, Fagan and Pyke are frauds.

Isn’t Fagan just there for the business side though. In this area we’re doing OK from the little I know.

 

[Cap]

I reckon Fangan's found that putting the right people in the right seats is easier said than done

It's not as though we've never been able to attract good people though. Over the journey people like Hamilton, Rendell, Noble, Teague, Ogilvie, Walsh, Stewart, Jonas are all respected industry wide and sought after.

Sure there might be a smaller pool of options compared to interstate clubs (many of those listed above have an SA link) but in a way that should make it easier to hone in on the better people. Only one competitor to outbid too.

I rate Fagan, the guy is clearly a talented operator

But you do have to wonder if his role needs to be separated out and someone with greater footy industry experience can manage the AFL mens portion of the club*

*not nigel smart.

 

[Redline]

I am putting a fair bit of blame on the coaching staff for the two losses. Outcoached both times. I am not a big Don Pyke fan but him aside.

Camporeale - Hard to guage but has been with us close on 10 years, he must be getting a bit stale.

Clarke - I know he won the AFLW but there is a school of thought that anyone could of coached that team to a flag. He has been there 10 years as a ruck coach and not developed anyone in that time. Jacobs came ready made.

Ben Hart - Literally only there as he can't get a job in Victoria. He was going to he demoted to coaching the SANFL team until a vacancy came up late.

Godden - I have alot of time for him and I think he can add value but AFL is relatively new to him. I think maybe a lesser AFL role for a year just to have an induction may have been better.

Mattner - Clearly a good coach and has a future but hasn't been involved at AFL level for three years. You have to lose intel in that time.

Individually they may all be good coaches but the mix is all wrong.

 

[GreyCrow]

Clarke - I know he won the AFLW but there is a school of thought that anyone could of coached that team to a flag.

I disagree. They may have won it or not but I see some major structural differences between Year 1-2 and this year

I do agree on staleness , imagine Don asking the group for any ideas

'' Yeah Don at Sturt we did this and it seemed to work ok''

''aw Don dont listen to Marty (pun intended ) this is how we always do it at Adelaide''

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

"It's the players fault, not ours".

No, you idiot.... you guys have to wear a good portion of it

If it really was all the players fault, we should see plenty of changes this week... not!

 

[Doctor B]

"When small men attempt great enterprises, they always end by reducing them to the level of their mediocrity"

Quoted from Napoleon Bonaparte talking about the 2019 AFC Footy Department

 

[Eagleboy2011]

I am putting a fair bit of blame on the coaching staff for the two losses. Outcoached both times. I am not a big Don Pyke fan but him aside.

Camporeale - Hard to guage but has been with us close on 10 years, he must be getting a bit stale.

Clarke - I know he won the AFLW but there is a school of thought that anyone could of coached that team to a flag. He has been there 10 years as a ruck coach and not developed anyone in that time. Jacobs came ready made.

Ben Hart - Literally only there as he can't get a job in Victoria. He was going to he demoted to coaching the SANFL team until a vacancy came up late.

Godden - I have alot of time for him and I think he can add value but AFL is relatively new to him. I think maybe a lesser AFL role for a year just to have an induction may have been better.

Mattner - Clearly a good coach and has a future but hasn't been involved at AFL level for three years. You have to lose intel in that time.

Individually they may all be good coaches but the mix is all wrong.

Is anyone also talking about the SANFL developmental coaches.

 

[hey shorty]

Is anyone also talking about the SANFL developmental coaches.

Our development is fine, it's selection policy that needs to change.

 

[Murray2503]

I have seen many a coach come and go from Cornes to Shaw to Ayres to Blight to Craig to Sanderson to Walsh to Pyke. Blight and Walsh were great coaches and great men. I know a good coach when I see one. Pyke imo is the worst coach we have ever had and the sooner he is terminated the quicker the club can start to heal and grow. He is not the total problem. The real problem is the ones that hired him. Chapman, Riccuito, Fagan. The 3 blind mice who hire a coach more bland and vanilla then Craig. FMD. What did they see? Listen to Pyke talk. He talks a lot but says nothing. I would prefer a coach who talks little and says a lot. Trust me there is a difference. He lost the players a while ago. Was when he stood on the field like a dickhead and stared at them without talking. Reminded me of Sanderson digging his fingers into players chests. You know what the players thought about Don up in Alice Springs? This guy has no answers. Don mate, you are out of your depth. The excuses need to come to an end. Time for honesty. There is no shame in being a bad coach, you aren't the first and you won't be the last. You'll just be one of the many bad coaches who have graced our club. I remember walsh being interviewd after a bad loss and he stated in so many words "Well i am going look at the players in the SANFL to see who can replace the underperformers". Would you ever hear that out of Pyke's mouth? You know the answer. By the way, Camporeale, Hart and Burton must exit as well. As for the others I have no clue if they can coach but I would leave it to the next coach to choose his own crew.

 

[footy4ever]

Funny you say that about the handball. I too thought that at the time. Lynch should have ran harder.

Sent from my MI PAD 4 using Tapatalk

Of the two it was obvious who was at fault. I screamed at Lynch for plodding along in a bloody daydream. But more at fault was our set up or lack of running with absolutely nobody ahead of Jerka and Lynch but Geelong players.