List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion

[dlanod]

Please be serious.

Yeah, we need the $$$ for $ammy!

 

[Tom14]

He made a comment in an interview or similar some time ago (last year I think) that that's his preference when asked about his form.

That's not the same as him saying "I refuse to play anywhere else ever". You guys are reading way too much into an off-hand comment.

Player prefers to play where he plays best. #shocker

 

[briztoon]

A bull midfielder doesn't have to be a big bodied mid. Matt Rowell

18

Matt Rowell

Age

24

Ht

180cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.4

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

D

17.4

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

D

17.4

5star

K

7.6

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

0.8

1star

T

5.2

5star

CL

3.8

5star

is the best bull midfielder in the competition, and he's two centimeters shorter than Will Ashcroft.

If we want a cheap fill in, bull midfielder, we have one in the reserves, Dev Robertson. But we don't play him in that role in the seniors because of his poor disposal by foot and his rushed decision making.

 

[p4p1]

If the coaches really felt we needed another big inside mid, the most effective option would be to put Berry in the middle. We don't use our wings a huge amount. Bringing in Marshall to cover Berry's wing time wouldn't cause an issue.

The two biggest things that will stop us from winning the premiership this year are, Jack Payne's injury that we haven't been able to cover. An effective forward who can pinch hit in the ruck.
As much as I love what Answerth has bought to the team since his pushed his way back in, his role can be filled by one of the players already in the 22. Maybe we have to Rob Peter to pay Paul but our depth means that we can still make it work.

A midfield bull is great. But WAshcrofts core strength and ability to stay on his feet in the contest are as good as almost anyone's in the league. What he doesn't do is be defensively accountable, I am sure that is something he and the coaches are working on though. When Dunks is off the ground or being rotated forward we need Berry filling in his role, because we can get exposed when we don't have someone filling that role.

We got spanked in the midfield on the weekend but a few months ago the same midfield spanked their midfield and made them look second rate. Let's not throw the baby out with the bath water.

 

[Tom14]

If the coaches really felt we needed another big inside mid, the most effective option would be to put Berry in the middle. We don't use our wings a huge amount. Bringing in Marshall to cover Berry's wing time wouldn't cause an issue.

The two biggest things that will stop us from winning the premiership this year are, Jack Payne's injury that we haven't been able to cover. An effective forward who can pinch hit in the ruck.
As much as I love what Answerth has bought to the team since his pushed his way back in, his role can be filled by one of the players already in the 22. Maybe we have to Rob Peter to pay Paul but our depth means that we can still make it work.

A midfield bull is great. But WAshcrofts core strength and ability to stay on his feet in the contest are as good as almost anyone's in the league. What he doesn't do is be defensively accountable, I am sure that is something he and the coaches are working on though. When Dunks is off the ground or being rotated forward we need Berry filling in his role, because we can get exposed when we don't have someone filling that role.

We got spanked in the midfield on the weekend but a few months ago the same midfield spanked their midfield and made them look second rate. Let's not throw the baby out with the bath water.

Agree with the above with the minor caveat that moving Bez off the wing is actually a problem defensively - big drop off between what he can do standing in leading lanes and taking intercept marks compared to what Marshall could.

The big problem as you identify is moving Dunks forward which they did in the second half on the weekend and against GWS when hippy moved back. Ditch the two ruck experiment and play a tall forward that can move please so Dunks isn't stranded forward.

 

[p4p1]

Agree with the above with the minor caveat that moving Bez off the wing is actually a problem defensively - big drop off between what he can do standing in leading lanes and taking intercept marks compared to what Marshall could.

The big problem as you identify is moving Dunks forward which they did in the second half on the weekend and against GWS when hippy moved back. Ditch the two ruck experiment and play a tall forward that can move please so Dunks isn't stranded forward.

I think you make a really good point about the defensive side. Without an injured Answerth and Kiddy, Fletch is probably back up on a wing which would help. You still want your best players in the middle and if only done when Dunks isn't in the midfield, you limit the loses on the defensive side of the wing.

 

[Tom14]

The clearances were bad on the weekend but I don't think that was the most significant problem - they were bad AND our pressure game was just slow to react.

So many times you would see 4-5 of our guys rushing forward to try apply front on pressure, but failing to get there and the suns getting easy transition afterwards. We lost clearances by 10 against the dogs but did a great job applying pressure and getting forward half turnovers. I don't remember any forward half turnovers yesterday.

 

[briztoon]

If the coaches really felt we needed another big inside mid, the most effective option would be to put Berry in the middle. We don't use our wings a huge amount. Bringing in Marshall to cover Berry's wing time wouldn't cause an issue.

Berry's shoulder is still cooked. Lost count of how many operations he's had on it (at least 3).

The two biggest things that will stop us from winning the premiership this year are, Jack Payne's injury that we haven't been able to cover. An effective forward who can pinch hit in the ruck.
As much as I love what Answerth has bought to the team since his pushed his way back in, his role can be filled by one of the players already in the 22. Maybe we have to Rob Peter to pay Paul but our depth means that we can still make it work.

A midfield bull is great. But WAshcrofts core strength and ability to stay on his feet in the contest are as good as almost anyone's in the league. What he doesn't do is be defensively accountable, I am sure that is something he and the coaches are working on though. When Dunks is off the ground or being rotated forward we need Berry filling in his role, because we can get exposed when we don't have someone filling that role.

We got spanked in the midfield on the weekend but a few months ago the same midfield spanked their midfield and made them look second rate. Let's not throw the baby out with the bath water.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Berry's shoulder is still cooked. Lost count of how many operations he's had on it (at least 3).

Not sure there's been any evidence that it's impacting the way he plays for a while now. Gone are the days where he'd be in visible pain from slight amounts of contact

We also know Neale has had serious shoulder surgery and Berry is still in a lot of contests despite playing well

 

[Tom14]

Not sure there's been any evidence that it's impacting the way he plays for a while now. Gone are the days where he'd be in visible contact from slight amounts of pain.

We also know Neale has had serious shoulder surgery and Berry is still in a lot of contests despite playing well

Bez has had a very good season! He's a really good winger! Clug is a really good inside mid!

One bad game doesn't mean that we need to change everything!

 

[The Flying Belgian]

Problem with planning a game plan around having an inside beast is when they get tagged or injured, you're screwed. A lot of our guys have the ability to win the inside ball, but there are some games where their role gets a little askew. Having a midfield full of guys who can play both is a let better plan.

Gotta wonder at the mental fragility of some people who catastrophise after one bad loss and instantly go into list-rebuild mode.

 

[pod17]

Well said.

On the last paragraph, I was also more confident of a win given we had two extra days break and they also had to travel back to Adelaide and had also lost one of their best three players in Rioli in addition to Miller still being out. I thought our mindset was disgraceful, not for the first time this year too, and probably complacently, assumed all the things I just said and just needed to turn up. Now if it was a hard fought win by the Suns, well understandable, but I don't know how a team as good as what we are supposed to be and last year's premiers can put up that deplorable effort.

Apparently calling out such pathetic efforts and the singling out of some players who have had numerous mares for 3-4 consecutive games makes you a shit supporter and supposedly ungrateful.

One thing that adds further weight to a complacency in our mindset (at times) is the way we got ourselves up for the Hawthorn and Geelong games. We looked switched on right from the start after some so-so form in the lead up, and the wins were banked against external expectations.

The weekend was poor, and a response is needed. If we come out and somehow knock Collingwood off, it would be three of those sorts of wins for the year. Irrespective of how we go on Saturday, there’s enough to do a deep dive on some of our in-week routine - whether it’s motivational, elements of our preparation or something else.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

I'm all for trying something different in the middle to ensure the Gold Coast result doesn't happen again. I just don't think has to involve bringing one-trick ponies like Brodie or Dev into the midfield. Maybe it involves a few magnets being swung around the board instead.

 

[Tom14]

I'm all for trying something different in the middle to ensure the Gold Coast result doesn't happen again. I just don't think has to involve bringing one-trick ponies like Brodie or Dev into the midfield. Maybe it involves a few magnets being swung around the board instead.

Maybe it involves the players playing better!

 

[knaf]

Agree with the above with the minor caveat that moving Bez off the wing is actually a problem defensively - big drop off between what he can do standing in leading lanes and taking intercept marks compared to what Marshall could.

The big problem as you identify is moving Dunks forward which they did in the second half on the weekend and against GWS when hippy moved back. Ditch the two ruck experiment and play a tall forward that can move please so Dunks isn't stranded forward.

Agree that we need a tall forward who can move, but who? Wasn’t that impressed with Day over the last two weeks in the vfl.(though I didn’t see all of both games). Day is handy against a fill in ruck but gets donimated by a genuine ruck (you can argue that Oscar is the same at the moment). Gallop obviously needs another preseason. I quite like the way that Ryan stepped up in the ruck when needed in the vfl. Does the occasional brilliant thing, but overall lack of core strength will limit his impact at afl (imo). Smith? Improving and if we had no chance of finals I would be all in for him to come in as second ruck. Cupboard is really bare.
Throw ZZ in and tell him see ball get ball. Big bodied follower and see what happens.

 

[Tom14]

Agree that we need a tall forward who can move, but who? Wasn’t that impressed with Day over the last two weeks in the vfl.(though I didn’t see all of both games). Day is handy against a fill in ruck but gets donimated by a genuine ruck (you can argue that Oscar is the same at the moment). Gallop obviously needs another preseason. I quite like the way that Ryan stepped up in the ruck when needed in the vfl. Does the occasional brilliant thing, but overall lack of core strength will limit his impact at afl (imo). Smith? Improving and if we had no chance of finals I would be all in for him to come in as second ruck. Cupboard is really bare.
Throw ZZ in and tell him see ball get ball. Big bodied follower and see what happens.

Day or Smith imo. Day is never going to put up any kind of numbers but we looked a lot better with him there. I'm open to giving Henry a shot though.

 

[briztoon]

I'm all for trying something different in the middle to ensure the Gold Coast result doesn't happen again. I just don't think has to involve bringing one-trick ponies like Brodie or Dev into the midfield. Maybe it involves a few magnets being swung around the board instead.

I haven't looked at the stats or anything, but at the game, it appeared that Rayner and Bailey played more centre bounces than I've ever seen before. Most of the time our mids were ineffective because the ball went to a Gold Coast player, or GC won the loose contested ball, and cleared to their winger who had stayed out wide, while our wingers continually went in to the contest.

I'm not suggesting we bring in Brodie, or play Dev.

My initial point is that we don't really have a prime extractor any more. Not like what Matt Rowell did to us in the the third term. Continually winning the ball at stoppage and getting the clearance to advantage.

 

[dlanod]

Maybe it involves the players playing better!

Why didn't Fagan think of this???

Someone get Christ Scott on the line.

 

[briztoon]

Agree that we need a tall forward who can move, but who? Wasn’t that impressed with Day over the last two weeks in the vfl.(though I didn’t see all of both games). Day is handy against a fill in ruck but gets donimated by a genuine ruck (you can argue that Oscar is the same at the moment). Gallop obviously needs another preseason. I quite like the way that Ryan stepped up in the ruck when needed in the vfl. Does the occasional brilliant thing, but overall lack of core strength will limit his impact at afl (imo). Smith? Improving and if we had no chance of finals I would be all in for him to come in as second ruck. Cupboard is really bare.
Throw ZZ in and tell him see ball get ball. Big bodied follower and see what happens.

Day is way ahead of any of our rucks that we might play in the forward line.

If we brought Smith in to the seniors, I'd be surprised if he was capable of playing any more than 50% game time. He's missed to much footy, that he doesn't have the fitness to play senior footy, in my opinion.

 

[Sunny Land]

Not sure there's been any evidence that it's impacting the way he plays for a while now. Gone are the days where he'd be in visible pain from slight amounts of contact

We also know Neale has had serious shoulder surgery and Berry is still in a lot of contests despite playing well

Nothing wrong with Bez's shoulder. Best it's been for many years now.

 

[Elitek]

I think most people league would have us as the no.1 midfield in the league, and almost no one would have us not in the top 5 at the very least. It's nitpicking suggesting we need much change in there. We destroyed the Suns last time in there, beat the Dogs Port Cats recently all with fantastic mids themselves.

Sure we'd all love the mids to be two way running beasts but we've got it pretty good, and that dominance we've had there is the no.1 reason we're in contention this year when we've been pretty sloppy in other spots consistently.

Neale seems to have slowed down a touch tho still good I will admit but others have gone another level.

As others have said, there are other holes in our line up that could be our shortfall this year...

• Key Fwd/ 2nd Ruck
• Key Lockdown Defender
• Lockdown Small Defenders (really worried about Starc, not looking like himself after concussions)
• Main Ruck

Our big fellas are just a mess right now. Hipwood is average/ and or out of form badly, both our rucks are getting smashed so often we're having to play 2 & still losing in that space, with getting not much fwd of the ball from them. Morris isnt really a proper key fwd & cant play ruck. Gardiner is struggling which is leaving Harris on the best oppo fwd & we've lost his intercepting (though tbf he wouldve always played on Darcy & King the past few weeks given their height).

How many of the other teams in contention have such major questions marks/ holes in their side? Recent injuries have made me concerned we're a bit imbalanced now.

 

[knaf]

Day is way ahead of any of our rucks that we might play in the forward line.

If we brought Smith in to the seniors, I'd be surprised if he was capable of playing any more than 50% game time. He's missed to much footy, that he doesn't have the fitness to play senior footy, in my opinion.

Yes Day is ahead of either of our current rucks, as a forward, perhaps not “way” ahead. I recall that the yank absolutely dominated Day in the centre square last time we met. Or was that just a nightmare?

 

[Sunny Land]

I think most people league would have us as the no.1 midfield in the league, and almost no one would have us not in the top 5 at the very least. It's nitpicking suggesting we need much change in there. We destroyed the Suns last time in there, beat the Dogs Port Cats recently all with fantastic mids themselves.

Sure we'd all love the mids to be two way running beasts but we've got it pretty good, and that dominance we've had there is the no.1 reason we're in contention this year when we've been pretty sloppy in other spots consistently.

Neale seems to have slowed down a touch tho still good I will admit but others have gone another level.

As others have said, there are other holes in our line up that could be our shortfall this year...

• Key Fwd/ 2nd Ruck
• Key Lockdown Defender
• Lockdown Small Defenders (really worried about Starc, not looking like himself after concussions)
• Main Ruck

Our big fellas are just a mess right now. Hipwood is average/ and or out of form badly, both our rucks are getting smashed so often we're having to play 2 & still losing in that space, with getting not much fwd of the ball from them. Morris isnt really a proper key fwd & cant play ruck. Gardiner is struggling which is leaving Harris on the best oppo fwd & we've lost his intercepting (though tbf he wouldve always played on Darcy & King the past few weeks given their height).

How many of the other teams in contention have such major questions marks/ holes in their side? Recent injuries have made me concerned we're a bit imbalanced now.

Was Hipwood's game so bad against the Suns? For me it was one of his better games.
15 disposals (6 of them contested the other 9 uncontested)
6 marks
1 tackle
1 goal (the only shot at goal he had for the day)

Had he kicked straight against both the Bulldogs & Carlton (instead of kicking like a donkey) he would have added 7-8 goals to his tally.

We need to sort out the ruck situation. Big O is not close to the player he can be when fit, and in my opinion, shouldn't be selected right now. Forty is not a key forward the same as Hipwood is not a relieving ruckman. At the start of the year Eric was going along nicely just playing the key forward role..... nek minit it all fell apart when hois role changed a couple of times. Smith or Day for me need to come in and Forty our main man in the ruck with Smith/Day relieving ruckman when he needs a breather. Do that with Kai back and the forward line has a lot more stability which allows them to work together as a close knit group.
With Loges kicking 5 goals back-back, he now has a significantly bigger presence and more focus each week from the oppo's defenders...it showed on Saturday with only 2 posessions for the whole game. Young fella was devastated but now the learning of how to play as a key forward really begins. He will be fine because he's a talent but life on the footy field now gets more of a challenge for him. That said, think our forward line is capable: Hipwood, Morris, Rayner, Bailey, Day/Smith, Cameron, Ah Chee and Lohman when he's again fit. They need to play games as a group before finals.

 

[mpal6]

Please be serious.

Alright mate, everything is perfect. Midfield will handle it just fine next time too. Hope that makes you happy

 

[mpal6]

I'll keep receipts of everyone shouting down on people talking about midfield issues ! If I see any of you posting contrary to your position in the coming weeks - you will hear from me !!!!