List Mgmt. 2014: The List

[etsal1]

i heard waite 400, but who knows

Either way - it's not 700-800K.

 

[gbatman]

Either way - it's not 700-800K.

Yeah, only the very top players should be in that bracket. I mean it probably wasn't great having Judd on all that money but at the time he was worth it. Also, no one should be over that bracket, no one should be reall over that bracket, it's too big of a strain on the cap. Maybe the best 5 players in the comp but still.

Betts is said to be on 600K a season which is overs and we were never going to match it. Betts is one of the best small forwards in the league and is a match winner. Our best midfielder at the moment is probably murphy, not sure what he si on, maybe around 600-700k which might be right. It gives a gauge of what Gibbs is worth which is no more than 600K, 500K should be about on the money.

 

[etsal1]

Yeah, only the very top players should be in that bracket. I mean it probably wasn't great having Judd on all that money but at the time he was worth it. Also, no one should be over that bracket, no one should be reall over that bracket, it's too big of a strain on the cap. Maybe the best 5 players in the comp but still.

Betts is said to be on 600K a season which is overs and we were never going to match it. Betts is one of the best small forwards in the league and is a match winner. Our best midfielder at the moment is probably murphy, not sure what he si on, maybe around 600-700k which might be right. It gives a gauge of what Gibbs is worth which is no more than 600K, 500K should be about on the money.

The problem is we had to overpay Gibbs last time he signed because GWS & GC were hunting him. He's on 600ish this year. So on one hand you understand why he is asking for a raise given this is meant to be the peak of his career & will probably be his most lucrative contract. However, has his form really improved since he signed in 2012? IMO his best year was 2011 (just like the rest of the team )

 

[BM123]

The problem is we had to overpay Gibbs last time he signed because GWS & GC were hunting him. He's on 600ish this year. So on one hand you understand why he is asking for a raise given this is meant to be the peak of his career & will probably be his most lucrative contract. However, has his form really improved since he signed in 2012? IMO his best year was 2011 (just like the rest of the team )

Gibbs finished in the top ten for the Brownlow in 2009.

 

[etsal1]

Gibbs finished in the top ten for the Brownlow in 2009.

So you think he played his best footy in 2009?

 

[BM123]

So you think he played his best footy in 2009?

Flip a coin between 2009 and 2011.

 

[gbatman]

The problem is we had to overpay Gibbs last time he signed because GWS & GC were hunting him. He's on 600ish this year. So on one hand you understand why he is asking for a raise given this is meant to be the peak of his career & will probably be his most lucrative contract. However, has his form really improved since he signed in 2012? IMO his best year was 2011 (just like the rest of the team )

Soooo Gibbs has held the club to ransom once before (using new franchise teams as ammo) and is already getting paid absolute top dollar as a result. Maybe he's not the sort of character we need at the club if we are looking to build a premiership list and a culture. You need players who make sacrifices on and off the field and maybe a few absolute guns who warrant high figures. I think a few Geelong players took their worth or less to keep a star list and when Ablett wanted more he had to leave but the Cats remained a powerhouse because no one gets over paid. If Gibbs was a Judd or Murphy type then 600+ is feasible but he's just not worth it.

Really starting to question Gibbs' priorities. Is it earning as much as possible or helping build a premiership team and contributing to that?

Hope to have a list of players who are content with what they are getting paid (lets face it it's plenty) and who have the team and winning a flag as their priorities. Funny thing is that I recon those who sacrifice and play in successful teams are the ones who are probably more likely to get a job in football after retirement coaching over the ones who chase dollars and have no success and probably end up earning more in the long term.

 

[BM123]

The calls to push Gibbs out are getting a bit overdramatic now. I'd rather wait until the end of the season before we start shipping him off to the highest bidder. We were rather intent on trading Yarran away last season and now everybody is singing his praises. I'm keen to see how we go once Doc, Carazzo and Judd are back in the team. Plenty of upside in this team and it's too early to call it quits yet since we will only get better as Hendo, Tuohy, Walker etc approach full fitness.

 

[Go_Blues!]

Soooo Gibbs has held the club to ransom once before (using new franchise teams as ammo) and is already getting paid absolute top dollar as a result. Maybe he's not the sort of character we need at the club if we are looking to build a premiership list and a culture. You need players who make sacrifices on and off the field and maybe a few absolute guns who warrant high figures. I think a few Geelong players took their worth or less to keep a star list and when Ablett wanted more he had to leave but the Cats remained a powerhouse because no one gets over paid. If Gibbs was a Judd or Murphy type then 600+ is feasible but he's just not worth it.

Really starting to question Gibbs' priorities. Is it earning as much as possible or helping build a premiership team and contributing to that?

Hope to have a list of players who are content with what they are getting paid (lets face it it's plenty) and who have the team and winning a flag as their priorities. Funny thing is that I recon those who sacrifice and play in successful teams are the ones who are probably more likely to get a job in football after retirement coaching over the ones who chase dollars and have no success and probably end up earning more in the long term.

I think you are missing the point. If we were a premiership team stuffed full of talent then players may be willing to trade personal wealth for team success. Obviously the worst team pays the same as the best team in terms of salary cap and a premiership team has more stars that need to share the spoils. But since we are not currently a premiership team or even contending, we are not in this situation and Gibbs should get paid market rates and if that means looking at his options elsewhere he should. I think that he will stay and that Carlton's offer will be roughly market rates. We should not have serious cap issues and we should not be underpaying or overpaying players.

 

[gbatman]

I think you are missing the point. If we were a premiership team stuffed full of talent then players may be willing to trade personal wealth for team success. Obviously the worst team pays the same as the best team in terms of salary cap and a premiership team has more stars that need to share the spoils. But since we are not currently a premiership team or even contending, we are not in this situation and Gibbs should get paid market rates and if that means looking at his options elsewhere he should. I think that he will stay and that Carlton's offer will be roughly market rates. We should not have serious cap issues and we should not be underpaying or overpaying players.

Yeah that's fair, I think it's a little different with free agency, middle of the road teams like us can turn things around with successful bids in the free agency period, though taking too many may suck up the cap space. It's just a matter of doing the maths, working out how many you need to be contenders, what they cost and if you can afford them. Sacrifices make it easier to chase free agents you would believe. But i guess it depends how far behind we are.

 

[JustaBattler]

Carlton have been paying for Gibb's potential and have received back a good HBF player...

should have been AA by now - nowhere near it. Not worth 600 a year - let alone more..time to leave Gibbsy...

 

[BM123]

Mcinnes and Bootsma are two players that seem to have been forgotten recently after their banishment to the two's. With our current fixation on youth I'd like to see Mcinnes really push himself to get back to his best since he looked like a real player until his ACL. People seem to have already given up on Bootsma but all he needs to really put on some size. Bootsma's confidence issues won't be a problem once he gets a bit of weight on him.

 

[BluStreak]

Not fussed by Bootsma's stature, more concerned about his awareness lapses, as reported by other posters on his previous performances. That would appear to be a confidence issue imo.

 

[gbatman]

Mcinnes and Bootsma are two players that seem to have been forgotten recently after their banishment to the two's. With our current fixation on youth I'd like to see Mcinnes really push himself to get back to his best since he looked like a real player until his ACL. People seem to have already given up on Bootsma but all he needs to really put on some size. Bootsma's confidence issues won't be a problem once he gets a bit of weight on him.

Sometimes developing players in the AFL is the way to go, other times it isn't. Both these guys need a bit more time to fill out and build strength. Mcinness' tackling needs work and he's got a few things to tune up in his game, Bootsma isn't good enough one on one yet and has issues with his intensity and work ethic, particularly on ground balls. Both players just need the time to develop physically and mentally and learn to find the ball a bit more. Until then there are others trying playing better in the same roles and we are still trying to win games so best to be patient with them.

 

[Cringle]

It'll really come down to how we go this year as a team. If we win a few here and there, and don't go on big losing sprees then we won't have to change the team repeatedly. If we can get that core group of players, then an injection of younger players will be easy.


Core Group

Defenders: Jamison Tuohy Walker Simpson
Midfielders: Murphy Thomas Gibbs Judd Carrazzo
Forwards: Henderson Yarran Waite Garlett


We have regulars who aren't walk up starts every week like the named, so I didn't include them.

 

[Jeremias]

I'm intrigued to see how we handle our older players over the next year or two.

I have a feeling we're going to very quickly go from one of the oldest squads in the competition to one of the youngest.

Let's have a look at the 10 oldest players on the list:

1. Scotland
2. Waite
3. Judd
4. Carrazzo
5. Simpson
6. McLean
7. Walker
8. Jamison
9. Armfield
10. Warnock

It is not unreasonable to suggest that 7 of that 10 will be gone within 18 months. I believe both Scotland and Judd will hang the boots up at the end of 2014, with question marks hovering over Waite, Carrazzo, McLean and Armfield for various reasons.

Simpson, Walker, Jamison and Warnock all look to have a few more years in them yet.

To me this signals a real changing of the guard. Our list management was aggressive at the end of last season & I think we'll see similar at the end of this year and beyond. Under Ratts we seemed particularly keen at times, probably to our detriment, to make the minimum number of changes possible per season but that has changed under MM who is not afraid to wield the ax.

It seems at times we've been somewhat reluctant to embrace the draft and trade periods and, coupled with drafting and development that has not been above average, we've seen our age profile balloon out to a point where we are not sitting particularly comfortably. With MM at the helm - a coach seemingly far more au fait with the requirement to bring youth in at every opportunity - as well as a revamped recruiting department and a greater emphasis on the development of younger players, that looks to be changing. However these things take time, they won't happen overnight, and this is exactly what MM refers to when he talks about the 'process'.

 

[goreds]

So, do we still think Gibbs doesn't want to be at the club????

For the record, I think that was the first time anyone from the media made the effort to ask Gibbs directly how things are going....

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story! #media101

 

[ESKIE]

So, do we still think Gibbs doesn't want to be at the club????

For the record, I think that was the first time anyone from the media made the effort to ask Gibbs directly how things are going....

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story! #media101

I'd be surprised if he left

 

[pepalenko]

Is anyone confident that Brock will get back in the side this season before guys like Graham and Cripps?

 

[Cringle]

So, do we still think Gibbs doesn't want to be at the club????

A good 5% on this board thought that.

 

[chunkylover53]

Is anyone confident that Brock will get back in the side this season before guys like Graham and Cripps?

Hope not. No point. This more than likely won't be a top 4 year for us and we can still make the 8 with Cripps/Graham playing McLeans role.

But if he dominates twos and finds form then he deserves a run.

Would rather kick start the younger blokes.

 

[No1Suspect]

Is anyone confident that Brock will get back in the side this season before guys like Graham and Cripps?

If any of those 2 kids hold Brock out of the team we'll be better for it

 

[BM123]

So, do we still think Gibbs doesn't want to be at the club????

For the record, I think that was the first time anyone from the media made the effort to ask Gibbs directly how things are going....

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story! #media101

Tbh I just want Gibbs to sign and for us to get focused back on the footy. The fact that we are looking at the off-season after two rounds is painful on so many different levels. Just get Gibbs signed to a reasonable deal and move on since Gibbs won't play good football with the media hounding him.

 

[BLUEALLTHRU]

Carlton have been paying for Gibb's potential and have received back a good HBF player...

should have been AA by now - nowhere near it. Not worth 600 a year - let alone more..time to leave Gibbsy...

Carlton have been paying for Gibb's potential and have received back a good HBF player...

should have been AA by now - nowhere near it. Not worth 600 a year - let alone more..time to leave Gibbsy...

It's not time to leave at all contract negotiations are difficult, SOS was very hard to deal with as lots of others are.(I am not saying Gibbs is like SOS just an example)you have to remember the media is driving this and Gibbs will sign!!

Now stop bagging him and realise he is much better than just a good HBF.

 

[JustaBattler]

It's not time to leave at all contract negotiations are difficult, SOS was very hard to deal with as lots of others are.(I am not saying Gibbs is like SOS just an example)you have to remember the media is driving this and Gibbs will sign!!

Now stop bagging him and realise he is much better than just a good HBF.

Nothing difficult about contract negotiations with Murph/Kreuz/Walker .....