Analysis 2016 List Management Discussion

[RAPPA]

I've slammed him previously on this board, but I truly think (and you can call me crazy) that Jones has improved significantly from last year. We are not a high scoring side, yet we expect him to kick a few eacg game. Levi goes through many games with just 1 or 2 goals, and I'd back Jones kicking for goal over Levi (although Levi's goal from 50 meters on an angle against the Saints did surprise me). Until we establish some semblance of a forward line, I'd retain him. I guess much of it will depend on how Bolton perceives his effort and work rate.

 

[Soapy V]

I've slammed him previously on this board, but I truly think (and you can call me crazy) that Jones has improved significantly from last year. We are not a high scoring side, yet we expect him to kick a few eacg game. Levi goes through many games with just 1 or 2 goals, and I'd back Jones kicking for goal over Levi (although Levi's goal from 50 meters on an angle against the Saints did surprise me). Until we establish some semblance of a forward line, I'd retain him. I guess much of it will depend on how Bolton perceives his effort and work rate.

i must have been watching different games. he was poor again and again. lacks effort and just isnt anywhere good enough. thats why he isnt in a side that needs a key forward. move on

 

[Iamcarlton]

the more i think about it the more i would be very happy getting marchbank tomlinson & steele. could we then add Brad Crouch as well? it would make a big difference to our list. all talented and still young. add another 4-5 draft picks inside top 50 and that would be another great trade period. I could then see us finishing bottom 3 next year where we can add another 4-5 gun players through the draft.

Bottom 3 with that lot coming in ? Bolton wont have that and would mean weve gone backwards on the improvements weve made this year . Athough I feel it unlikely but if we added crouch and Steele to our midfield hopefully get some games into Silvagni and McKay long shot C Curnow this year . With some natural improvement from many younger players we have in plowman Sumner even Phillips a few others a fit cripps next year no doubt he's being hampered by the knee this year . Marchbank stiffens our back line up even more maybe releases docherty at times into an exciting midfield of cripps Murphy Gibbs Steele and crouch ( starting to salivate now ) Tomlinson floating around as well there's no way! we are finishing bottom 3

 

[Soapy V]

Bottom 3 with that lot coming in ?

i said i could see it. talent takes time to produce results. they are all very young and inexperienced. i fully expect a step back in results before moving forward.

 

[BluesRule]

Tom Scully agreed a new 5 year contract of $500K pa. salary dropping from $1m a season.
This means the Giants no longer have a $600K salary cap hole, and it is possible to keep more players.
Hope it dies not cost us the GWS4 Mk2 trade.

 

[BluesRule]

With Redpath keeping Boyd out of Bulldogs best 22, wonder if Boyd is now gettable?
He would have to take a big salary cut to come to CFC, but if he could deliver on his draft potential would fill a need for us.
Not sure what the trade would cost though?

 

[BluesRule]

Another article this morning saying Prestia and O'Meara are gone from GCFC.
Are we a chance?

If GWS4 Mk2 falls over, would GC offer Prestia, O'Meara and Day as a package?

 

[Blueboy75]

I think Liam has played his role pretty much done what has been expected of him& also has stood up very importantly in games when it's been counted upon most,I was quite impressed with his game when he played I hope he does get more game time but know competition for places is strong these days which is always a good thing.

 

[therubbernub]

Tom Scully agreed a new 5 year contract of $500K pa. salary dropping from $1m a season.
This means the Giants no longer have a $600K salary cap hole, and it is possible to keep more players.
Hope it dies not cost us the GWS4 Mk2 trade.

Dont worry, they have 22+ young guns all will be wanting more coin as they roll off their existing contracts. The 600 k will be snapped up pretty quickly

 

[Red Bull]

Another article this morning saying Prestia and O'Meara are gone from GCFC.
Are we a chance?

If GWS4 Mk2 falls over, would GC offer Prestia, O'Meara and Day as a package?

GC blokes would be too pricey at this stage of our rebuild .
Work a ripper deal with the Giants or head to the draft ...

 

[inyourcool]

Jones hasn't been great but hasn't been too bad either. I just think Bolts can't afford to have both him and Levi in the forward line as they don't offer a lot of defensive pressure and make it harder to retain the ball in our forward line.

You could overlook this if he posed more of an attacking threat but unfortunately he doesn't

 

[ParapMarkets]

Tom Scully agreed a new 5 year contract of $500K pa. salary dropping from $1m a season.
This means the Giants no longer have a $600K salary cap hole, and it is possible to keep more players.
Hope it dies not cost us the GWS4 Mk2 trade.

They still have Kelly (among others) to re-sign. Plus they have to keep money for guys like Hopper (who is going to be an absolute star) coming through. Tomlinson and Stewart will come cheap now as they will be happy to get them off the payroll to free up space. They would prefer to keep the other 2, but their salary cap will be seriously tight.

 

[ShanDog]

I though Jones was pretty effective at pressuring opposition defenders and chasing etc when he was playing. Club might expect more or different of course, but I thought he'd really picked that area of his game up.

 

[Blue__Balls]

i said i could see it. talent takes time to produce results. they are all very young and inexperienced. i fully expect a step back in results before moving forward.

Probably the biggest consideration is how much improvement is evident in the other lower-placed sides. We'll be bringing more youth in over the next year or two, so an immediate rise up the ladder is probably unrealistic.

Essendon will get a number of quality players back, who will have a point to prove - expect them to climb back up the ladder a bit.
Freo pick up McCarthy, possibly Hogan, get Fyfe and Bennell on the park, and stop tanking...no way they don't enter into finals calculations.
Brisbane - who knows, but they'll get Beams back and will have put another year's work into their young talls.
St Kilda regain Carlisle, but maybe lose a few top-agers, could actually see them sliding a bit overall, but they gave us a touch-up last week.
Collingwood and Richmond are a bit of an unknown quantity, could easily go either way.

Would be easy to see us sliding at least two spots, potentially more if the Pies and Tigers pull their fingers out.

 

[BM123]

Probably the biggest consideration is how much improvement is evident in the other lower-placed sides. We'll be bringing more youth in over the next year or two, so an immediate rise up the ladder is probably unrealistic.

Essendon will get a number of quality players back, who will have a point to prove - expect them to climb back up the ladder a bit.
Freo pick up McCarthy, possibly Hogan, get Fyfe and Bennell on the park, and stop tanking...no way they don't enter into finals calculations.
Brisbane - who knows, but they'll get Beams back and will have put another year's work into their young talls.
St Kilda regain Carlisle, but maybe lose a few top-agers, could actually see them sliding a bit overall, but they gave us a touch-up last week.
Collingwood and Richmond are a bit of an unknown quantity, could easily go either way.

Would be easy to see us sliding at least two spots, potentially more if the Pies and Tigers pull their fingers out.

Not too worried about the short term. I want SOS just giving Bolton a good enough list to really challenge for a flag in the long term.

A down year or two just gives more opportunities to bring in fresh talent.

 

[Soapy V]

Not too worried about the short term. I want SOS just giving Bolton a good enough list to really challenge for a flag in the long term.

A down year or two just gives more opportunities to bring in fresh talent.

Exactly!

 

[passmark]

I know some make the point that all these GWS players may not be playing in the first 22 at GWS and that GWS are happy to get the cost off the books. Their argument seems to be if they are not good enough for GWS why do we want them?

They shouldn't worry. Nobody is going to be able to get anywhere near GWS in terms of talent, not only did they get massive concessions from the AFL, they used those concessions brilliantly.

As has often been the case with footy teams over the years, sometimes you just can't get the best list and have to rely on other factors, sometimes intangible factors, in order to win flags.

So the question shouldn't be "why do we want these guys when GWS don't?" it should be "are these guys better than other options?"

 

[HalloweenJack]

I though Jones was pretty effective at pressuring opposition defenders and chasing etc when he was playing. Club might expect more or different of course, but I thought he'd really picked that area of his game up.

Jones has definitely improved that area of his game but his biggest problem is keeping, or getting back to his feet, after he flies for a mark. Is he injured at the moment because I thought he was going OK?

 

[IanW]

They still have Kelly (among others) to re-sign. Plus they have to keep money for guys like Hopper (who is going to be an absolute star) coming through. Tomlinson and Stewart will come cheap now as they will be happy to get them off the payroll to free up space. They would prefer to keep the other 2, but their salary cap will be seriously tight.

This.

 

[Moody Blue]

Jones is not going to be part of the team going forward. He is just not up to it. Once we get Harry McKay back and get some games into him and Silvagni, then we will be in a better position to understand what we need. Buckley, Boekhorst, Jaksch, have all had disappointing seasons and can only improve. Our backline is looking very good but we need to plan for the retirements of Simpson (ideally with Buckley if he can get up and running)and Jamieson. Rowe seems to have been invigorated by Bolton and the coaching staff. We probably need one more quality mid fielder to take some of the pressure of Murphy and Cripps. Without doubt Kerridge and Wright have been the pick of the mature recruits this season. The test for them will be whether they can maintain their form in the coming seasons. Sumner has been serviceable and is still trying to find his feet after being on the sidelines for so long. Has anyone heard or seen Clem Smith? He seems to have disappeared.

 

[LordLucifer]

With Redpath keeping Boyd out of Bulldogs best 22, wonder if Boyd is now gettable?

What planet are you on ??

Boyd is on a huge contract $$ wise and has not shown anything remotely resembling that of a gun key forward.

I'll put my faith in Harry McKay right now thanks.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Not too worried about the short term. I want SOS just giving Bolton a good enough list to really challenge for a flag in the long term.

A down year or two just gives more opportunities to bring in fresh talent.

Absolutely - just pointing it out in the context of trading future picks.

I'll actually be quite surprised if we finish higher on the ladder next year than we do this year. We're getting some quality output from previously-maligned players in Armfield, Rowe, Everitt, Daisy etc. - but some of these guys will naturally make way for younger players.

Even if we maintain our output with the younger cohort, there are a few teams below us on the ladder who really should improve substantially next year.

With that in mind, I'd put more stock in trading this year's first round pick than next year's.

 

[ParapMarkets]

Absolutely - just pointing it out in the context of trading future picks.

I'll actually be quite surprised if we finish higher on the ladder next year than we do this year. We're getting some quality output from previously-maligned players in Armfield, Rowe, Everitt, Daisy etc. - but some of these guys will naturally make way for younger players.

Even if we maintain our output with the younger cohort, there are a few teams below us on the ladder who really should improve substantially next year.

With that in mind, I'd put more stock in trading this year's first round pick than next year's.

I agree. Also, if we finish outside the bottom 6 this year we will get a much tougher draw than we had this year which will make it difficult to move higher up the ladder. Most of our young guys will still be very raw and inexperienced next year, and as you suggest, we will likely be playing with a much younger team next year.

 

[FlowersByIrene]

For everyteam that improves teams will fall too.

I expect North and Hawthorn to fall down the ladder. Collingwood to keep falling. Brisbane not to improve. Essendon not to improve (on 2015) St Kilda to stay about the same and GC not to improve.

All of those sides are bottom 10 I think.

 

[Mezzoculo]

For everyteam that improves teams will fall too.

I expect North and Hawthorn to fall down the ladder. Collingwood to keep falling. Brisbane not to improve. Essendon not to improve (on 2015) St Kilda to stay about the same and GC not to improve.

All of those sides are bottom 10 I think.

As will we be. Teams will have had an entire offseason to analyse Bolton's game plan. We will no longer have the element of surprise - see Port of 2014.
Next year is a big test for Bolts. I'm super excited to see what he can do.