List Mgmt. 2020 List Management II

[Malifice]

One thing's for certain now with Kruezer and Simmo retiring. We have tons of room in the Salary cap next year. Probably close to 2.5 million.

Time to break out the cheque book.

 

[HARKER]

What will our best team look like next year?

Docherty Jones Plowman
Williams Weitering Williamson/Newman.....not SPS. If Williams comes on board, let's make better use of SPS.

De Koning Cripps ECurnow
Walsh Setterfield *******........................not Newnes and O'Brien isn't an accumulator, either. Reckon we're going to find an inside/outside mid.
..............................................................De Koning to rotate with Pittonet, as required.
...............................................................The ******* would be a Gaff/Kelly type. Too much to ask, but let's see.

Martin McKay SPS
McGovern CCurnow Honey..........................Long shot with Honey, but someone will surprise.
...............................................................I still think McGovern has more to add forward than JSilvagni. We'll see

Fisher Dow Marchbank Kemp......................Good balance of speed and height.

Next in line - Cuningham, Cottrell and the one I really want to see in; Stocker. We need some nasty in this group.

With Papley seemingly out of the equation (I say seemingly, because I'm not 100% on Papley not being a possibility we're not going to find another jack Martin and I don't want us finding something that may be a type, without it being the right type. Would sooner put the work into Honey.

 

[mochacinolatte]

Lions also never played with the number of senior players we do. A sprinkle, sure, but only if they are performing considerably better than a younger version. That would be different if we are a flag contender, but we are not. If Fisher plays that role, you shift everyone down a line. We have a number of players that play HF/HHF rotaing around the stoppages. Cuners, Gibbons, Honey, Philp, Newnes

What do you consider old?

If we going to follow the Brisbane rebuild

2017 - 18th - Finished Last
Mitch Robinson (28)
Stefan Martin (30)
Dayne Zorko (28)

2018 - 15th
Pick 12 - Charlie Cameron
Brought in Hodge

Mitch Robinson (29)
Stefan Martin (31)
Dayne Zorko (29)
Hodge (34)

2019 - 2nd
Big Trade Period
Lachie Neale/McCarthy/Jarryd Lyons/Adams

Mitch Robinson (30)
Stefan Martin (32)
Dayne Zorko (30)
Hodge (35)

2020 - Top 4
Ellis Yolman, Ah Chee & Grant Birchill

Mitch Robinson (31)
Stefan Martin (33)
Dayne Zorko (31)
Grant Birchall (32)

If we look at our Senior players who played regulary in 2020.

Murphy (33)
Curnow (30)
Simpson (36) - Retired
Betts (36)
Casboult (30)

If anything we are tracking similar to Brisbane 2018 and if we have a big trade period we can shoot up in the top 8. So in some sense senior players do have a role.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

One thing's for certain now with Kruezer and Simmo retiring. We have tons of room in the Salary cap next year. Probably close to 2.5 million.

Time to break out the cheque book.

There is no one out of contract this year sans Zac Williams that is worth us throwing the big bucks at.

I like Jye Caldwell, but he is not someone we should be throwing serious cash at.

Happy for us to sit on our 'war chest' for anothee year, unless Ollie Wines or Powell-Pepper are gettable in which I would say we should go for it.

I want us to become better/focus on developing from within, first and foremost.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

What will our best team look like next year?

Docherty Jones Plowman
Williams Weitering Williamson/Newman.....not SPS. If Williams comes on board, let's make better use of SPS.

De Koning Cripps ECurnow
Walsh Setterfield *******........................not Newnes and O'Brien isn't an accumulator, either. Reckon we're going to find an inside/outside mid.
..............................................................De Koning to rotate with Pittonet, as required.
...............................................................The ******* would be a Gaff/Kelly type. Too much to ask, but let's see.

Martin McKay SPS
McGovern CCurnow Honey..........................Long shot with Honey, but someone will surprise.
...............................................................I still think McGovern has more to add forward than JSilvagni. We'll see

Fisher Dow Marchbank Kemp......................Good balance of speed and height.

Next in line - Cuningham, Cottrell and the one I really want to see in; Stocker. We need some nasty in this group.

With Papley seemingly out of the equation (I say seemingly, because I'm not 100% on Papley not being a possibility we're not going to find another jack Martin and I don't want us finding something that may be a type, without it being the right type. Would sooner put the work into Honey.

Guess that means Marchbank will be traded/out the door ?
Would like to hang onto him for at least one more season and see if we can get his body righr.

 

[Malifice]

There is no one out of contract this year sans Zac Williams that is worth us throwing the big bucks at.

Why do they need to be OOC?

 

[Arr0w]

What do you consider old?

If we going to follow the Brisbane rebuild

2017 - 18th - Finished Last
Mitch Robinson (28)
Stefan Martin (30)
Dayne Zorko (28)

2018 - 15th
Pick 12 - Charlie Cameron
Brought in Hodge

Mitch Robinson (29)
Stefan Martin (31)
Dayne Zorko (29)
Hodge (34)

2019 - 2nd
Big Trade Period
Lachie Neale/McCarthy/Jarryd Lyons/Adams

Mitch Robinson (30)
Stefan Martin (32)
Dayne Zorko (30)
Hodge (35)

2020 - Top 4
Ellis Yolman, Ah Chee & Grant Birchill

Mitch Robinson (31)
Stefan Martin (33)
Dayne Zorko (31)
Grant Birchall (32)

If we look at our Senior players who played regulary in 2020.

Murphy (33)
Curnow (30)
Simpson (36) - Retired
Betts (36)
Casboult (30)

If anything we are tracking similar to Brisbane 2018 and if we have a big trade period we can shoot up in the top 8. So in some sense senior players do have a role.

I agree, you still need some senior players, I feel the Lions players in that age range are collectively stronger

I would hang on to Ed and Levi

Murphy on the proviso he is not an automatic selection

 

[mochacinolatte]

There is no one out of contract this year sans Zac Williams that is worth us throwing the big bucks at.

I like Jye Caldwell, but he is not someone we should be throwing serious cash at.

Happy for us to sit on our 'war chest' for anothee year, unless Ollie Wines or Powell-Pepper are gettable in which I would say we should go for it.

I want us to become better/focus on developing from within, first and foremost.

Brisbane traded Lachie Neale (Solid mid before the trade) when they were on the cusp of top 8.

2018 Trade Period
Brisbane Recieve
Lachie Neale + Pick 30

Fremantle Recieve
Pick 6 + Pick 19 + Pick 55.

We should be offering
Pick 7 + Pick 25 for Josh Kelly before he gets targetted next year. Both inside/outside mid, great disposal, great 2-way player.

Then there are people on this board debating we should be getting more depth players.

 

[HARKER]

Guess that means Marchbank will be traded/out the door ?
Would like to hang onto him for at least one more season and see if we can get his body righr.

I've said before that the club really rate Marchbank.
Things can change and especially so, if he's deemed to be too injury prone.

I did have him in my starting 22, though.
It's been so long that's it easy to forget just how competitive he is.

 

[mochacinolatte]

I agree, you still need some senior players, I feel the Lions players in that age range are collectively stronger

I would hang on to Ed and Levi

Murphy on the proviso he is not an automatic selection

Each to their own, but I guess if you work internally we can only speculate what is happening behind doors.

I prefer Murphy in the team so we don't rush the development of Dow/Stocker/Kemp/Lob.

Betts is a line-ball call, prefer he stays on just as a mentor.

 

[CJMB]

Guess that means Marchbank will be traded/out the door ?
Would like to hang onto him for at least one more season and see if we can get his body righr.

Harks named Marchbank on the bench?

He's not getting traded weeks after signing an extension.

 

[Blue__Balls]

There is no one out of contract this year sans Zac Williams that is worth us throwing the big bucks at.

I like Jye Caldwell, but he is not someone we should be throwing serious cash at.

Happy for us to sit on our 'war chest' for anothee year, unless Ollie Wines or Powell-Pepper are gettable in which I would say we should go for it.

I want us to become better/focus on developing from within, first and foremost.

Jack Viney - worth a $500-600k offer for sure. Free agent.
Brad Crouch - same.
Ollie Wines - same. Not out of contract, but I'd have a dip.
Stephen Conglio - $600-750k would be my price if he's really not happy at GWS and wants to bail. Not out of contract, but maybe helps GWS with other OOC players.
Andrew Gaff - pretty sure there's that flexible contract situation whereby he could leave as a FA this year or extend long term.

 

[Sharks On A Plane]

I've said before that the club really rate Marchbank.
Things can change and especially so, if he's deemed to be too injury prone.

I did have him in my starting 22, though.
It's been so long that's it easy to forget just how competitive he is.

I like Marchbank to take over Simmo's role. Similar pace & disposal, both very courageous and brave, both good at reading the play and impacting contests.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Brisbane traded Lachie Neale (Solid mid before the trade) when they were on the cusp of top 8.

2018 Trade Period
Brisbane Recieve
Lachie Neale + Pick 30

Fremantle Recieve
Pick 6 + Pick 19 + Pick 55.

We should be offering
Pick 7 + Pick 25 for Josh Kelly before he gets targetted next year. Both inside/outside mid, great disposal, great 2-way player.

Then there are people on this board debating we should be getting more depth players.

We should do both...like Brisbane did.

Find that A-grade acquisition that makes a significant impact on field. And supplement that with 2-3 role players who create even more competition for spots and drive improvement in our younger cohort.

McCarthy has been very good for Brisbane. Highly underrated recruitment.

 

[FRUMPY]

Guess that means Marchbank will be traded/out the door ?
Would like to hang onto him for at least one more season and see if we can get his body righr.

Resigned for 2 years a few weeks ago, isnt going anywhere

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Why do they need to be OOC?

We have not really got a trove of trade assets/picks to barter with (am very reluctant to part with our 2021 first round pick unless it's for an exceptional player aged 25 or under)

I still believe we need to hit the draft and try develop more quality players via that route. It's still a major concern of mine.

I don't want us to go down the Norf route and throw big bucks at foot soldiers like Jared Polec and now Aidan Corr, because they have money in the cap.
That is a trivial waste of club resources in my opinion.

 

[HARKER]

I like Marchbank to take over Simmo's role. Similar pace & disposal, both very courageous and brave, both good at reading the play and impacting contests.

Interesting idea. Why not?
Marchbank is very courageous as you say and will throw himself around and support his fellow back-men.

One whole year gone for what? Bone bruising? Can that be real?

 

[Eiffel 65]

Brisbane traded Lachie Neale (Solid mid before the trade) when they were on the cusp of top 8.

2018 Trade Period
Brisbane Recieve
Lachie Neale + Pick 30

Fremantle Recieve
Pick 6 + Pick 19 + Pick 55.

We should be offering
Pick 7 + Pick 25 for Josh Kelly before he gets targetted next year. Both inside/outside mid, great disposal, great 2-way player.

Then there are people on this board debating we should be getting more depth players.

The big question is are we on the cusp of the 8?

When Ed, Simmo, Murphy and Betts hang up the boots, we could well go backwards. We're still too reliant on our older players. We need both star power and depth.

Neale was a gun at the Dockers. Averaging over 30 disposals a game. He was just being overshadowed by Fyfe. He also wasn't getting a lot of recognition for his work because he was playing on the other side of the country. Had he of been playing for a club in Melbourne, he would have been rated as elite by the media.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Resigned for 2 years a few weeks ago, isnt going anywhere

Did he ? Missed that, fab news

 

[mochacinolatte]

We should do both...like Brisbane did.

Find that A-grade acquisition that makes a significant impact on field. And supplement that with 2-3 role players who create even more competition for spots and drive improvement in our younger cohort.

McCarthy has been very good for Brisbane. Highly underrated recruitment.

Quite a few on the market.

Ah Chee, Witherdon, Saad, Ridley (lol if Essendon can't resign him), Lachlan Shultz, Cockatoo, Caldwell, Halloran, Williams, Viney, Lonie, Hewett.

A few out there, just need to get the fishing rod out.

 

[mochacinolatte]

The big question is are we on the cusp of the 8?

When Ed, Simmo, Murphy and Betts hang up the boots, we could well go backwards. We're still too reliant on our older players. We need both star power and depth.

Neale was a gun at the Dockers. Averaging over 30 disposals a game. He was just being overshadowed by Fyfe. He also wasn't getting a lot of recognition for his work because he was playing on the other side of the country. Had he of been playing for a club in Melbourne, he would have been rated as elite by the media.

Lions finished with

5-17 with 89.1% record in 2018.

Close losses
Round 3
Port - 5 points

Round 5
West Coast - 5 points

Round 7
Collingwood - 7 points

Round 18
Adelaide - 5 points

Round 20
Adelaide - 3 points

In their 2018 off-season they seemed to fixed a lot of things to shoot up to the top 4.

If you look at their 2018 season they weren't objectively that bad. They didn't get flogged by 30+ points on a regular basis and were competive with most teams (similar to us in 2020).

If we can fix up the 30 point swing in matches we can easily make the top 8 with good trading and extra year of development.

 

[Eiffel 65]

Lions finished with

5-17 with 89.1% record in 2018.

Close losses
Round 3
Port - 5 points

Round 5
West Coast - 5 points

Round 7
Collingwood - 7 points

Round 18
Adelaide - 5 points

Round 20
Adelaide - 3 points

In their 2018 off-season they seemed to fixed a lot of things to shoot up to the top 4.

If you look at their 2018 season they weren't objectively that bad. They didn't get flogged by 30+ points on a regular basis and were competive with most teams (similar to us in 2020).

If we can fix up the 30 point swing in matches we can easily make the top 8 with good trading and extra year of development.

The problem I see with our team that makes me think that we're further away than what Brisbane were in 2018 is that we've been dominated for extended periods of matches against bottom end teams.

Adelaide getting up by 7 goals wasn't an anomaly. Sydney did it the week before. Hawthorn absolutely dominated us after quarter time. Melbourne did it when they were out of form. The list goes on.

We're definitely on the up, but I still feel like we need another 12 months to iron things out before we charge up the ladder.

We haven't had a lot of continuity with our forward line, which will take time. It feels like one of Harry or Charlie has always been out over the past two seasons. Need some time for these guys to gel as a unit. Hopefully this will allow us to score on a more regular basis in years to come.

 

[BlueJet]

I like Marchbank to take over Simmo's role. Similar pace & disposal, both very courageous and brave, both good at reading the play and impacting contests.

It'd certainly improve our side defensively & another option would be to have Kemp play that role.
He's not as good a stopper as Marchbank but will offer more going the other way.

 

[FRUMPY]

Lions finished with

5-17 with 89.1% record in 2018.

Close losses
Round 3
Port - 5 points

Round 5
West Coast - 5 points

Round 7
Collingwood - 7 points

Round 18
Adelaide - 5 points

Round 20
Adelaide - 3 points

In their 2018 off-season they seemed to fixed a lot of things to shoot up to the top 4.

If you look at their 2018 season they weren't objectively that bad. They didn't get flogged by 30+ points on a regular basis and were competive with most teams (similar to us in 2020).

If we can fix up the 30 point swing in matches we can easily make the top 8 with good trading and extra year of development.

The old brisbane lions comparison, werent people on here doing this last year and we were supposed to make top 8, maybe top 4?......bEcAuSe BrIsBaNe DiD iT

 

[mochacinolatte]

The problem I see with our team that makes me think that we're further away than what Brisbane were in 2018 is that we've been dominated for extended periods of matches against bottom end teams.

Adelaide getting up by 7 goals wasn't an anomaly. Sydney did it the week before. Hawthorn absolutely dominated us after quarter time. Melbourne did it when they were out of form. The list goes on.

We're definitely on the up, but I still feel like we need another 12 months to iron things out before we charge up the ladder.

We haven't had a lot of continuity with our forward line, which will take time. It feels like one of Harry or Charlie has always been out over the past two seasons. Need some time for these guys to gel as a unit. Hopefully this will allow us to score on a more regular basis in years to come.

However there is a lot of merrit in games against Sydney, Melbourne and Adelaide we were able to close the gap. I guess with his first year as senior coach there is a lot of experimentation and consitency with his brand of footy. I didn't expect Teague nor anyone should of antcipated a finals campaign but more of a "I can see these players developing and I see a lot of improvement in this team" in which will be fine tuned and developed. You can't expect a new coach to come in and we 'premiership contention'.

Took Hardwick a few years to develop his brand 2017/2019
Took Beveridge quick hand style to be adapted a few years in 2016

I would hope that some of the issues you have outline above does get address in the pre-season and treated as a "learning excercises" moving forward.