List Mgmt. 2021 Draft picks: 4/33/75

[Deaneus!]

thanks to Lore as always

AFL Draft Pick Value Calculator - Draftguru

 

[Jeffcrowe]

it’ll depend where the games end up being played.. could be back in adelaide in a fortnight.

norf in adelaide we win.. norf at marvel and you wouldnt put your hard earned on us..

North are a better side with a better midfield , I think people are getting carried away with a win over hawthorn

 

[Mr_Moogle]

North are a better side with a better midfield , I think people are getting carried away with a win over hawthorn

Totally agree. Hawthorn were so soft and somehow managed to get outworked by our blue collar midfield. I'm not reading too much into that game. This weeks game against Bulldogs will give us a better idea of where we are at.

 

[WheresGroomgone]

OK so I know I'm asking Santa for too much but I think my preferred draftees since I can't have what I really want, is Roberts and Draper - very keen on Draper I think he has a huge upside currently 185-86cm and reasonably late to footy but starting to bloom, probably over shadowed by team mates. Robert's use of the ball is impressive also has the class to become an outstanding footballer.

Yes it is biased somewhat by the SA factor and the Crow supporting element but I think to build a young strong group this really is valuable - not saying go 100% SA but if we have the undeniable top end talent grab it and build.

 

[Dewy006]

5 of the past 10 Larke Medalists have been from W.A.
The Vic winners go 1 or 2 in the draft.
The W.A. boys have continued to slide from 2, 2, 11, 21, 22
The S.A. guy 53.

View attachment 1187953

Jeeez how did Allen last to 21? For those draft watchers out there what was the knock on him?

 

[Crow till I die]

OK so I know I'm asking Santa for too much but I think my preferred draftees since I can't have what I really want, is Roberts and Draper - very keen on Draper I think he has a huge upside currently 185-86cm and reasonably late to footy but starting to bloom, probably over shadowed by team mates. Robert's use of the ball is impressive also has the class to become an outstanding footballer.

Yes it is biased somewhat by the SA factor and the Crow supporting element but I think to build a young strong group this really is valuable - not saying go 100% SA but if we have the undeniable top end talent grab it and build.

It would be hard to be unhappy with that if that was how it played out. It will be what do we do with the Melbourne pick that will be interesting in this scenario. If we lose one of our RFA / UFA's, do we then look to bundle up picks to get another 1st round talent if possible?. Imagine if we end up losing Matt Crouch (a big loss in my opinion) and we get an end of 1st or a pick straight after our 2nd, do we bundle that and the Melbourne pick up to get inside the back end of the 1st round if we can for Draper. Maybe we end up with in your scenario, Robertswith our 1st, Draper with the bundled picks and maybe Cooper Murley with our 2nd rounder. Then look at Dudley with late picks to match any bid. It would be hard to not like an outcome like that

 

[Thetrader15]

Talent matters mate, not height.

Agree. I'll take GAJ over Cripps, Bont, Pendles, Danger, Wines, JOK, Steele or Yeo anyday.

The only one in the same bracket is Dusty. And that's more to do with his forward work on the big stage than his midfield work.

 

[WeedsMullet84]

OK so I know I'm asking Santa for too much but I think my preferred draftees since I can't have what I really want, is Roberts and Draper - very keen on Draper I think he has a huge upside currently 185-86cm and reasonably late to footy but starting to bloom, probably over shadowed by team mates. Robert's use of the ball is impressive also has the class to become an outstanding footballer.

Yes it is biased somewhat by the SA factor and the Crow supporting element but I think to build a young strong group this really is valuable - not saying go 100% SA but if we have the undeniable top end talent grab it and build.

How do we get a second high draft pick?

Do a swap with GC for their 1st this year and our next years 1st, with a player or other pick thrown in?

Are we hoping Matt Crouch gets a miracle HUGE offer and we get a high compensation pick?

 

[Jarman3]

How do we get a second high draft pick?

Do a swap with GC for their 1st this year and our next years 1st, with a player or other pick thrown in?

Are we hoping Matt Crouch gets a miracle HUGE offer and we get a high compensation pick?

Is there much value in a pick swap like that with GC? Do we really need 2 1st round picks this year instead of 1 this year and 1 next year? Are there players we want this year that are likely to be that much better than those on offer next year? A good result for us next year would be to climb out of the bottom 4, which basically puts us in the zone where GC are now, so we're probably trading pretty much like-for-like as far as picks go, plus throwing in another pick/player as well.

We might also want to hold onto 2022 pick if we've got any interest in making a play for Lukosius / Rankine?

 

[StonesThrow]

Is there much value in a pick swap like that with GC? Do we really need 2 1st round picks this year instead of 1 this year and 1 next year? Are there players we want this year that are likely to be that much better than those on offer next year? A good result for us next year would be to climb out of the bottom 4, which basically puts us in the zone where GC are now, so we're probably trading pretty much like-for-like as far as picks go, plus throwing in another pick/player as well.

We might also want to hold onto 2022 pick if we've got any interest in making a play for Lukosius / Rankine?

Our list profile will be incredibly young in a couple of years once the over 30s depart.

If the right players are there, I think this is the final year we should be going hard at the top end of the draft and then in following years looking to bring in some players to fill holes in the demographic (and positions).

 

[DaKids]

Since 2015 there's been a few interesting trends in the draft for the top performers
WB were already going tall, Bont 194cm, Stringer 191cm, Macrae 188cm. Then they took 21 players in a row with and ave height of 192cm between 2015 and 2017.

Richmond; Speed, x factor, coupled with mature late/rookie picks often from W.A. Miles, Broad, Lambert, Pickett, Baker, and a game plan based on speed

Geelong 1 mature ager cheaply each year in the draft starting with Menegola, Stewart, Kelly, Atkins, Close and pillaged FA at the same time.

Melbourne 2 top 12 picks or no 1sts at all. ex. 2014 Petracca 186cm, Brayshaw 187cm, 2015 Oliver 187cm, Weideman 196cm , 2019 Jackson 199cm, Pickett 171cm and then when they hit the trade period they went for multiple 2nds 2017 Lever then picks 29, 31, 37 Spargo, Fritsch, Petty, 2018 May pick 27 & 33 Sparrow and Jordan and did well.

Brisbane, Fagan arrive 2016 went 3-4 picks in top 25 for 3 years (1st 2 picks McCluggage 186cm, Berry 192cm) and drafted a midfield and smashed the trade period in 2017 & 2018.

Since 2018 we have had a significant change and what looks like a plan, better late than never as they say.

What we haven't done, is followed BRIS, MEL, WB and gone with big mids early as listed above.

Compare theirs to Jones 180cm, McHenry 178cm, Schoenberg 180cm, Pedlar 183cm, Berry 181cm . Not including MCrouch, Sloane, Laird, Murphy, Poholke, Gallucci, Sig, Jarman, etc

Seriously 10-15cm in reach and 10kg + for every guy in the centre square is a huge disadvantage especially if your not winning the taps and hitting to space.
Wasn't long ago we all screaming to put Greenwood in the middle form this exact reason.

Essendon suffer similar issues.

Sadly Kemp and Hollands did their knee otherwise they would have been viable options.

If Hately and O'Connor aren't the ones moving forward then all things being equal Callaghan is perfect but he will be gone before our pick.

I do wonder how Doedee would go and is our group creative enough to even try, we never played Smith there early and how frustrating.

This week will be interesting to watch and all those that continue to disagree that size don't matter in midfield watch the Bont and Macrae at the CB out reaching our guys continuously.

I think you’re clutching at straws a bit old mate. Talent comes in all different packages.

In 2 of Richmonds 3 flag winning teams, 12 of the 22 were 185 or under. When you take out rucks, key position players and respective 3rd talls, doesn’t leave many over 185’s around the ball. The WB 2016 flag side had 10 under 185. Once again it means most around the ball are under.

Football teams at every level are about balance and of course talent. I don’t think you’ll find any flag teams that have 22 above 185 players.

 

[70lethal]

I think you’re clutching at straws a bit old mate. Talent comes in all different packages.

In 2 of Richmonds 3 flag winning teams, 12 of the 22 were 185 or under. When you take out rucks, key position players and respective 3rd talls, doesn’t leave many over 185’s around the ball. The WB 2016 flag side had 10 under 185. Once again it means most around the ball are under.

Football teams at every level are about balance and of course talent. I don’t think you’ll find any flag teams that have 22 above 185 players.

Specifically talking midfield set up at centre square. Hard to ignore the facts and logic that you need at least 1 big body most of the time.
We are going even shorter on average when those mentioned are going bigger

The other team very similar is Ess with Merritt, Shield, Smith, Parish, McGrath.
With Heppell moving back they have Stringer and there fortunes seem to depend on him a bit. They've gone past 6000 without a final win.

 

[70lethal]

Talent matters mate, not height.

Premiership winners say otherwise.
A very small centre square set up is just as ineffective as undersized defences.

 

[Crow till I die]

Mutineer What is Motlop like as a prospect? worth us looking at

 

[MarcusP2]

Premiership winners say otherwise.
A very small centre square set up is just as ineffective as undersized defences.

Your examples were Melbourne, Brisbane and the Bulldogs for big midfields. 1 premiership between the lot of them.

 

[Jirkago75]

Premiership winners say otherwise.
A very small centre square set up is just as ineffective as undersized defences.

Agree to disagree on that. Bulldogs only won that flag by a 1 in the century umpiring phenomenon

 

[hey shorty]

Premiership winners say otherwise.
A very small centre square set up is just as ineffective as undersized defences.

Not correct at all

 

[Crow till I die]

Premiership winners say otherwise.
A very small centre square set up is just as ineffective as undersized defences.

I'd say having 3 very sympathetic and patriotic umpires goes a long way to winning flags on the big day. Richmond and the Dogs have all had this phenomenon in flag wins this century

 

[70lethal]

Your examples were Melbourne, Brisbane and the Bulldogs for big midfields. 1 premiership between the lot of them.

And the point was trends in the last 5 years and whose moved up the ladder in that time

 

[Mr_Moogle]

I'd say having 3 very sympathetic and patriotic umpires goes a long way to winning flags on the big day. Richmond and the Dogs have all had this phenomenon in flag wins this century

Agree the Dogs got a ride from the umps. Richmond still win those flags even without help from the umpires.

 

[Thetrader15]

Specifically talking midfield set up at centre square. Hard to ignore the facts and logic that you need at least 1 big body most of the time.
We are going even shorter on average when those mentioned are going bigger

The other team very similar is Ess with Merritt, Shield, Smith, Parish, McGrath.
With Heppell moving back they have Stringer and there fortunes seem to depend on him a bit. They've gone past 6000 without a final win.

We seemed to do ok in 2017 with Matt, Brad and Sloane in there most of the time.

In 2017, Greenwood and CEY (our two 190cm+ mids) played a combined 15 games

In 2018 and 2019, they averaged 30 games between them.

2018 and 2019 must have been great years.

 

[Thetrader15]

And the point was trends in the last 5 years and whose moved up the ladder in that time

How have Carlton gone with Cripps, Kennedy, Setterfield and Dow, all >187cm?

 

[Sanders]

Since 2015 there's been a few interesting trends in the draft for the top performers
WB were already going tall, Bont 194cm, Stringer 191cm, Macrae 188cm. Then they took 21 players in a row with and ave height of 192cm between 2015 and 2017.

Richmond; Speed, x factor, coupled with mature late/rookie picks often from W.A. Miles, Broad, Lambert, Pickett, Baker, and a game plan based on speed

Geelong 1 mature ager cheaply each year in the draft starting with Menegola, Stewart, Kelly, Atkins, Close and pillaged FA at the same time.

Melbourne 2 top 12 picks or no 1sts at all. ex. 2014 Petracca 186cm, Brayshaw 187cm, 2015 Oliver 187cm, Weideman 196cm , 2019 Jackson 199cm, Pickett 171cm and then when they hit the trade period they went for multiple 2nds 2017 Lever then picks 29, 31, 37 Spargo, Fritsch, Petty, 2018 May pick 27 & 33 Sparrow and Jordan and did well.

Brisbane, Fagan arrive 2016 went 3-4 picks in top 25 for 3 years (1st 2 picks McCluggage 186cm, Berry 192cm) and drafted a midfield and smashed the trade period in 2017 & 2018.

Since 2018 we have had a significant change and what looks like a plan, better late than never as they say.

What we haven't done, is followed BRIS, MEL, WB and gone with big mids early as listed above.

Compare theirs to Jones 180cm, McHenry 178cm, Schoenberg 180cm, Pedlar 183cm, Berry 181cm . Not including MCrouch, Sloane, Laird, Murphy, Poholke, Gallucci, Sig, Jarman, etc

Seriously 10-15cm in reach and 10kg + for every guy in the centre square is a huge disadvantage especially if your not winning the taps and hitting to space.
Wasn't long ago we all screaming to put Greenwood in the middle form this exact reason.

Essendon suffer similar issues.

Sadly Kemp and Hollands did their knee otherwise they would have been viable options.

If Hately and O'Connor aren't the ones moving forward then all things being equal Callaghan is perfect but he will be gone before our pick.

I do wonder how Doedee would go and is our group creative enough to even try, we never played Smith there early and how frustrating.

This week will be interesting to watch and all those that continue to disagree that size don't matter in midfield watch the Bont and Macrae at the CB out reaching our guys continuously.

Nice work. Interesting

How will Callaghan be gone before our pick though?

 

[Crow till I die]

Nice work. Interesting

How will Callaghan be gone before our pick though?

There has been a bit of chirp on the Hawthorn board about him, and as such if they finish below us could select him..now whether that has anything to do wit what their recruiters think is a totally different thing

Me, I think you could throw a blanket over a number of kids that will be available at our pick that will all add something good to our team so not too fussed personally

 

[Crow till I die]

Agree the Dogs got a ride from the umps. Richmond still win those flags even without help from the umpires.

not in the first half v us when the game was in the balance - what a leg up Richmond were given..remember

 

[Mr_Moogle]

not in the first half v us when the game was in the balance - what a leg up Richmond were given..remember

I know the umpiring was bullshit. I just don't think it affected the result. We were outplayed. I've come to terms with it.