2021 Non-Crows AFL Discussion Part 1: we can have lots of fun!

[GROTTO]

SRP board is your friend

Are you a mod? I thought you were one of the common folk?

 

[AFC3000]

Someone on their board... something like "why would we believe him, not a Port supporter, he wouldn't have the best interests of Port at heart" hahhahha yep that's how it works!

They actually get behind the spin, hide threads that are negative, because they think it's their part to play in saving the club and hey, the media are 100% against them and positive towards the Crows so they are just balancing things out.

To me, Ken's lost the players, what's going on at Port and why have they underachieved all of these years even though everything they do is apparently world class, the best of the best and never wrong?

In all seriousness, be interesting to see how a Port story is handled post KT. Fixing the media seemed to be his number one priority coming in, does the replacement have those connections.

Right on the eve of the season too, feel for them, I really do.

 

[hey shorty]

So what we're saying is that not everything is Rosey......

 

[Mr_Moogle]

Are you a mod? I thought you were one of the common folk?

I thought the same and then he banned me for a day.

 

[BACCS]

'Tis funny reading the port board and the shock that one or two of their players may be *******s.

All their players are *******s. All our players are *******s. They're AFL players. Support them as they kick a ball between sticks. Anything away from that, they are deadshits. We don't know half the rotten stuff they get up to. Stop being so naïve.

Probably a bit harsh to label every single player one, there are just the same number of dickheads as there are in most workplaces. Not all are great blokes as the media likes to play out at times.

 

[BACCS]

Treadrea was right though. Our first rounders are poor. Last really good one was Smithers.




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It’s just impossible to make that judgement on the last couple of drafts yet. It was an easy cheap shot from a media person who I thought was above this type of stuff. It sounded like a BigFooty rant.

 

[Drakescoffeecake]

So what we're saying is that not everything is Rosey......

I see what you did there.

Along with Woodcock, not the most modest lads going around.

 

[Geoffa32]

It’s just impossible to make that judgement on the last couple of drafts yet. It was an easy cheap shot from a media person who I thought was above this type of stuff. It sounded like a BigFooty rant.

2017 draft onwards I agree.

But from then backwards is a real issue.


I reckon Tredders is one guy in the media who has little behind his comments other than how he sees it. Does not work for Crocmedia

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[BACCS]

2017 draft onwards I agree.

But from then backwards is a real issue.


I reckon Tredders is one guy in the media who has little behind his comments other than how he sees it. Does not work for Crocmedia

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We all know that though, but we had a focus on a premiership back then and got close. Easy in hindsight to now pot the club for things that happened over 5 years ago as we go through a rebuild.

 

[jackster83]

We all know that though, but we had a focus on a premiership back then and got close. Easy in hindsight to now pot the club for things that happened over 5 years ago as we go through a rebuild.

I think his point was that some of those people who made bad decisions five years ago are still there and still making bad decisions.

 

[BACCS]

I think his point was that some of those people who made bad decisions five years ago are still there and still making bad decisions.

I think it’s a bit harsh on Hamish, has generally drafted as well as most recruiters out there. Agree on the other two.

 

[GreyCrow]

We all know that though, but we had a focus on a premiership back then and got close. Easy in hindsight to now pot the club for things that happened over 5 years ago as we go through a rebuild.

The things that did or didn't happen 5 years ago are precisely why we are going through a deep cut rebuild

Your continual failure to recognize this is your greatest weakness

 

[relapse]

They are a touchy lot over there. Wonder if they’ll give that Carlton poster the Elspeth treatment.

They can try and deny it all they like, but the reality is that particular Carlton poster definitely has legitimate sources because he always seems to have an incredibly good hit rate with rumours being true.

 

[CrowsB4hoes]

So what we're saying is that not everything is Rosey......

So you’re thinking why send someone to Sydney for a pretty simple foot surgery unless there was another meeting the player needed to have in a state where no one knows who he is and rumour less likely to get out?

 

[StonesThrow]

2017 draft onwards I agree.

But from then backwards is a real issue.


I reckon Tredders is one guy in the media who has little behind his comments other than how he sees it. Does not work for Crocmedia

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2012: No 1st round pick. First pick was 61

2013: No first round pick. First pick M Crouch at 23. Good pick.

2014: First round pick Lever at 14. Good pick but left.

2015: Two 1st rounders Milera and Doedee at 11 and 17. Good picks but injured.

2016: First round pick Gallucci at 15. Bad pick.

The problems here are :

1. Lack of top end selections (poor list strategy and stupidity by management)
2. Retention (this goes back even further)

This is why there is a massive hole in our list.

The picks per se were relatively good with only 1 bust. The key to our future will be from the fog draft to this year's draft. There are some poor signs early but time will tell.

Non first rounders will also be key such as Himm, Sholl, McPherson, Hamill, Schoenberg, Gollant, Berry, Cook etc

 

[hey shorty]

So you’re thinking why send someone to Sydney for a pretty simple foot surgery unless there was another meeting the player needed to have in a state where no one knows who he is and rumour less likely to get out?

Surely not....

They wouldn't hide something like that would we.

 

[Vader]

2012: No 1st round pick. First pick was 61

2013: No first round pick. First pick M Crouch at 23. Good pick.

2014: First round pick Lever at 14. Good pick but left.

2015: Two 1st rounders Milera and Doedee at 11 and 17. Good picks but injured.

2016: First round pick Gallucci at 15. Bad pick.

The problems here are :

1. Lack of top end selections (poor list strategy and stupidity by management)
2. Retention (this goes back even further)

This is why there is a massive hole in our list.

The picks per se were relatively good with only 1 bust. The key to our future will be from the fog draft to this year's draft. There are some poor signs early but time will tell.

Non first rounders will also be key such as Himm, Sholl, McPherson, Hamill, Schoenberg, Gollant, Berry, Cook etc

It's only part of the reason. Another part is the fact that we just didn't turn over enough of our list, making the absolute minimum number of draft selections on far too many occasions. This failure has played a large part in the Generation Gap that we now see.

Here's the number of National Draft selections we've used over the last decade, excluding rookie promotions:
2010 - 2
2011 - 4
2012 - 2
2013 - 2
2014 - 4
2015 - 2
2016 - 5
2017 - 2
2018 - 4
2019 - 5
2020 - 5

In order to have a healthy balanced list, clubs should be averaging at least 4 new national draftees every year. From 2010 to 2015 Adelaide only selected 16 players, an average of 2.7 per year. Only in the last 3 years have we selected a healthy number of draftees.

The need to make 4+ selections is driven by several factors:

• Culling the Dead Wood - Taking more draftees requires creating more positions on the senior list. This means culling the dead wood more quickly, rather than allowing players like Mitch Grigg, CEY and Brodie Martin to remain on our list until they achieve Free Agency. I'm sure all of us can agree that the club has a history of retaining dead wood players for far too long.
• Greater Development Opportunities for Youngsters - Culling the dead wood creates opportunities for young players to develop, by giving them faster access to more critical roles, rather than forcing them to stagnate in secondary roles for far too long. Once again - something Adelaide is clearly guilty of.
• Generation Gaps - If you fail to recruit enough replacements, over a long enough period of time, then you end up with a Generation Gap. This is exactly the situation we now face. We now have a huge gap in our list, with almost no players in the 25-150 game band, courtesy of failing to turnover enough of our list, and failure to draft/recruit enough players during that 6 year window from 2010-2015.
• Probabilities - The more players you draft (particularly in the later rounds, the greater your chances of finding that diamond in the rough. Think of it like a lottery - the more tickets you buy, the better your chances of winning (i.e. finding a gun player later in the draft). You have no chance of winning if you don't buy a ticket. Adelaide just didn't buy enough tickets in that 6-year window...

 

[BACCS]

It's only part of the reason. Another part is the fact that we just didn't turn over enough of our list, making the absolute minimum number of draft selections on far too many occasions. This failure has played a large part in the Generation Gap that we now see.

Here's the number of National Draft selections we've used over the last decade, excluding rookie promotions:
2010 - 2
2011 - 4
2012 - 2
2013 - 2
2014 - 4
2015 - 2
2016 - 5
2017 - 2
2018 - 4
2019 - 5
2020 - 5

In order to have a healthy balanced list, clubs should be averaging at least 4 new national draftees every year. From 2010 to 2015 Adelaide only selected 16 players, an average of 2.7 per year. Only in the last 3 years have we selected a healthy number of draftees.

The need to make 4+ selections is driven by several factors:

• Culling the Dead Wood - Taking more draftees requires creating more positions on the senior list. This means culling the dead wood more quickly, rather than allowing players like Mitch Grigg, CEY and Brodie Martin to remain on our list until they achieve Free Agency. I'm sure all of us can agree that the club has a history of retaining dead wood players for far too long.
• Greater Development Opportunities for Youngsters - Culling the dead wood creates opportunities for young players to develop, by giving them faster access to more critical roles, rather than forcing them to stagnate in secondary roles for far too long. Oonce again - something Adelaide is clearly guilty of.
• Generation Gaps - We're now facing a generation gap, where we have almost no players in the 25-150 game band. This is a direct result of failing to turnover enough of our list, and failure to draft/recruit enough players during that 6 year window from 2010-2015. Generation gaps like this don't (or shouldn't) happen if the list is being turned over properly.
• Probabilities - The more players you draft (particularly in the later rounds, the greater your chances of finding that diamond in the rough. Think of it like a lottery - the more tickets you buy, the better your chances of winning (i.e. finding a gun player later in the draft). You have no chance of winning if you don't buy a ticket. Adelaide just didn't buy enough tickets in that 6-year window...

All fair points and correct in hindsight, but the club were pushing hard for a flag in the 2015-2019 timeframe and got damn close. Would history look as bad if we won in 2017? I think the biggest issue was your first point, turning over a few of those types could’ve led to us being in a better position now without compromising our push for a flag.

 

[Vader]

All fair points and correct in hindsight, but the club were pushing hard for a flag in the 2015-2019 timeframe and got damn close. Would history look as bad if we won in 2017? I think the biggest issue was your first point, turning over a few of those types could’ve led to us being in a better position now without compromising our push for a flag.

I'm not suggesting that we should have pushed players like Walker & Sloane out the door... but hanging onto the dead wood meant we were playing a SANFL midfield consisting of Grigg, Thompson, and CEY. None of our younger midfielders, like Gooch & Dots, were able to get a look in - and their development stagnated as a result. OK... maybe it's not quite a causal relationship, but it was definitely a contributing factor.

We should have been culling players like these a lot sooner. Doing so would not have compromised our shot at the flag. We're now paying the price for our list management inertia over a prolonged period of time.

 

[Red mist]

The so called custodians of our game are destroying our game

Over the last couple of years, I have watched far less games than in the oast when I watched plenty.

I find the media vehicle and tv demographics resonates more with AFL house regarding decisions.
It’s a monopoly and if you don’t straighten up and fly right you get excluded from the discussion table pretty quickly.

 

[BACCS]

I'm not suggesting that we should have pushed players like Walker & Sloane out the door... but hanging onto the dead wood meant we were playing a SANFL midfield consisting of Grigg, Thompson, and CEY. None of our younger midfielders, like Gooch & Dots, were able to get a look in - and their development stagnated as a result. OK... maybe it's not quite a causal relationship, but it was definitely a contributing factor.

We should have been culling players like these a lot sooner. Doing so would not have compromised our shot at the flag. We're now paying the price for our list management inertia over a prolonged period of time.

Yep, agreed. Wouldn’t have probably then required the dramatic list cull we have now had to go through over the last two off seasons.

 

[BACCS]

 

[SuperBashBros]

Dont mind this, nothing worse than losing a player early to a head knock.

 

[Dudersaurus]

Dont mind this, nothing worse than losing a player early to a head knock.

More an issue with mandatory time off field for assessment imo, especially if already down a player or 2.

 

[Red mist]

Yay, vests are back.