List Mgmt. 2022 Trade, Draft, etc thread

[Scythe]

Dory_77 – might be worth pinning this? Gets updated after every move.

 

[The Dr]

yeah, but we're not in the premiership window with Brown as our forward so how long will we keep stalling and delaying picking up a key forward?

Brown has been our main key forward the past two years. We've won a flag and finished second (before a shit finals series). So we have (and still are) in the premiership window with him up forward.

So stop wetting your pants about brown. You don't rate him. We get it. Most of us would love him to be replaced too. Would an unproven, stick thin 18yo fix it? Unlikely.

Ideally JVR comes in and fires straight away and T Mac gets fit. And/or Petty plays forward.

Most importantly, as countless others have said, it's the delivery inside 50 and an improved attacking game plan that will be a key difference.


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[danster168]

Brown has been our main key forward the past two years. We've won a flag and finished second (before a s**t finals series). So we have (and still are) in the premiership window with him up forward.

So stop wetting your pants about brown. You don't rate him. We get it. Most of us would love him to be replaced too. Would an unproven, stick thin 18yo fix it? Unlikely.

Ideally JVR comes in and fires straight away and T Mac gets fit. And/or Petty plays forward.

Most importantly, as countless others have said, it's the delivery inside 50 and an improved attacking game plan that will be a key difference.


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All good points. But after 6-7 weeks when our game plan wasn't working, how come Goodwin did nothing about it? Another 17 weeks or doing the same dumb stuff until we eventually went out in straight sets. Does Goodwin have it in him to change the game plan if he didn't have the ability to change it (at all) mid year?

They're my big question marks. Why did it take him 6 months to trial Petty as a forward for 5 minutes? Goodwin is a big watch this year. A big watch.

 

[Dory_77]

well I would argue that basically any new draftee is better than Ben Brown but that's the story for another day. Yeah, it doesn't help our forward woes immediately but it helps our forward line list profile immediately. We literally have 2 key forwards on our list in JVR and Tom Mcdonald. Brown and Scache are too bad that they don't count. I'm all for going for best available, even if it isn't Jefferson, but what if there's no appropriate key forward in next years first round? Do we then delay it to 2024 before picking one up? I just think the urgency isn't where it needs to be at.

The fact that we haven't found a Brown replacement tells me that Goodwin simply doesn't get it.

We've got a great draft hand next year. Even if we don't hit the draft there is scope to do a trade or work something out.
Having a fantastic list profile also doesn't mean much in practice. 8 first rounders with amazing 'upside' doesn't help you win a flag in the next year or two.

 

[The Dr]

All good points. But after 6-7 weeks when our game plan wasn't working, how come Goodwin did nothing about it? Another 17 weeks or doing the same dumb stuff until we eventually went out in straight sets. Does Goodwin have it in him to change the game plan if he didn't have the ability to change it (at all) mid year?

They're my big question marks. Why did it take him 6 months to trial Petty as a forward for 5 minutes? Goodwin is a big watch this year. A big watch.

I have the same questions re Goodwin.

See, there can be rational discussion without ridiculous hyperbole! Im shocked to be sitting here.


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[danster168]

We've got a great draft hand next year. Even if we don't hit the draft there is scope to do a trade or work something out.
Having a fantastic list profile also doesn't mean much in practice. 8 first rounders with amazing 'upside' doesn't help you win a flag in the next year or two.

true. it'll be interesting to see what we do next year. Package up picks to get up super high or keep them.

 

[Tulip]

I guess it all comes down to if you think we're in the premiership window. Believe it or not Ben Brown and Tom Mcdonald are another year older so will be somehow even slower than last season. If you believe we're in the premiership window with this forward line then yeah it makes sense to pick someone who just may be able to help us.

Dan, if he's not rated as being any good for the next two years, during our Premiership window, then why pick him this year with a good pick?

If he's not rated as a massively good prospect once he puts size on, then why pick him at all?

Its great being in a Premiership window, especially having won one already, but that doesn't mean we don't have to worry about drafting for the future too.

 

[Tulip]

I have the same questions re Goodwin.

See, there can be rational discussion without ridiculous hyperbole! Im shocked to be sitting here.


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I have some, albeit not full, faith in Goodwin next year. He said after the season that he knew it wasn't working and he was trying to conduct running repairs that he also admitted didn't work. He was trying to recapture the lightning in a bottle from the last few weeks of 2021 and didn't have the stones to change course completely last year. Also a bad decision. But he's admitted that and he hasn't doubled down, so hopefully he'll turn words into action. He doesn't usually say much, so admitting he was wrong is a big deal IMO.

 

[danster168]

Dan, if he's not rated as being any good for the next two years, during our Premiership window, then why pick him this year with a good pick?

If he's not rated as a massively good prospect once he puts size on, then why pick him at all?

Its great being in a Premiership window, especially having won one already, but that doesn't mean we don't have to worry about drafting for the future too.

but I don't think we're in the premiership window so I think we need to draft for the future too.

 

[Crimson Azure]

Great thread, would read again.

Blackadder for me thanks.

 

[Crimson Azure]

but I don't think we're in the premiership window so I think we need to draft for the future too.

Premiership door perhaps? Turnstile?

 

[dazzledavey36]

All good points. But after 6-7 weeks when our game plan wasn't working, how come Goodwin did nothing about it? Another 17 weeks or doing the same dumb stuff until we eventually went out in straight sets. Does Goodwin have it in him to change the game plan if he didn't have the ability to change it (at all) mid year?

They're my big question marks. Why did it take him 6 months to trial Petty as a forward for 5 minutes? Goodwin is a big watch this year. A big watch.

Send Goody an email and ask him.

 

[Daemon]

I have some, albeit not full, faith in Goodwin next year. He said after the season that he knew it wasn't working and he was trying to conduct running repairs that he also admitted didn't work. He was trying to recapture the lightning in a bottle from the last few weeks of 2021 and didn't have the stones to change course completely last year. Also a bad decision. But he's admitted that and he hasn't doubled down, so hopefully he'll turn words into action. He doesn't usually say much, so admitting he was wrong is a big deal IMO.

Totally agree. Goody's gameplan and selection let us down, good to see him admit his mistakes. I also think the players need to own this - I felt they were a little more selfish and arrogant at times this year.

 

[Simon_Says]

hope we pick up Oscar lovelock from Glenelg. fit in well with NIBs, petty ect

 

[00Stinger]

but I don't think we're in the premiership window so I think we need to draft for the future too.

We may not win the premiership but if you truely don't think we are in the premiership window then that is next level nuff nuff

In fact it may just be the dumbest thing you have ever posted.....

 

[Topkent]

We may not win the premiership but if you truely don't think we are in the premiership window then that is next level nuff nuff

In fact it may just be the dumbest thing you have ever posted.....

Wouldn't even be top 50

 

[danster168]

We may not win the premiership but if you truely don't think we are in the premiership window then that is next level nuff nuff

In fact it may just be the dumbest thing you have ever posted.....

well we came 6th, didn't win a final and didn't improve our weakest area of the field in the off season. So I don't think it's as nuff nuffy as you make it out to be.

 

[00Stinger]

well we came 6th, didn't win a final and didn't improve our weakest area of the field in the off season. So I don't think it's as nuff nuffy as you make it out to be.

Nope, that is 100% nuffy.

We didn't even make the finals in 2020 but won the premiership in 2021

Although now I think about it, you may be right. Time to clean the decks and rebuild I say!

 

[Headless]

well we came 6th, didn't win a final and didn't improve our weakest area of the field in the off season. So I don't think it's as nuff nuffy as you make it out to be.

How did we finish sixth?

 

[stEdy]

and drafting 6 KPFs in your mind will put us back in contention?

 

[danster168]

How did we finish sixth?

actually yeah you're right, we didn't. it was 5th. Geelong, Sydney, Collingwood and Brisbane came top 4. Then us in 5th and Freo in 6th.

 

[danster168]

and drafting 6 KPFs in your mind will put us back in contention?

if 2 of them hit yep.
I was being a little flippant saying 6 but we need 2 more good key forwards on the list so however many selections that takes. But with draft picks having a bust rate of 50% for the first round and even higher in the subsequent rounds, it's not a quick fix.

 

[stEdy]

if 2 of them hit yep.
I was being a little flippant saying 6 but we need 2 more good key forwards on the list so however many selections that takes. But with draft picks having a bust rate of 50% for the first round and even higher in the subsequent rounds, it's not a quick fix.

So with your newly calculated 50% hit rate figure we need to draft 4 key forwards this year (at a minimum) to ensure 2 "hit" and then we are back in our window?

 

[danster168]

So with your newly calculated 50% hit rate figure we need to draft 4 key forwards this year (at a minimum) to ensure 2 "hit" and then we are back in our window?

it's not newly calculated. If you did your research on at least 10 years of data, you'd find that at any selection in the first round, you're only going to hit about 50% of them. But anyway, maybe it's easier to think of it another way. We're not going anywhere with Ben Brown, Gawn/Grundy and Tom Mcdonald as our key forwards. Just imagine coming up against Geelong with De Koning, Stewart and Jack Henry. They would laugh at this forward line. Or Howe, Darcy Moore and Maynard.

Yes, if we had a forward line we are back in the window according to me as our midfield and defence is very strong.

 

[stEdy]

Just last year the same group of key forwards (Tmac, BBB, Gawn resting forward) put the Cats to the sword in the Prelim. Cats didn't have SDK playing firsts and Tom Stewart was injured, but they had Blicavz playing at FB.

BBB gave Blicavz a bath.

Your focus on key forwards is neurotic. We used our first last year on JVR who couldn't have looked more impressive as a first year player in the VFL.

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

Hurry up draft, this thread needs something decent to talk about.