List Mgmt. 2022 Trade Thread - Part II

[phantom13]

So what you are saying is that we have to pay the $850K salary dump to get pick 7... plus steaknifes Bowes and then pay his wage going forward.

Mmmm.. no wonder the club has pulled out.

Isnt he getting 500k a season over 2 years (so a million total)? I swear thats what i read.

Chump change if thats the number. Ive said a few times if we can do Long and 27 for Bowes and 7 it would be amazing.

 

[Joffaboy]

So what you are saying is that we have to pay the $850K salary dump to get pick 7... plus steaknifes Bowes and then pay his wage going forward.

Mmmm.. no wonder the club has pulled out.

Still reckon its not for Bowes and Pick 7 straight, something would have to be going back GC way

 

[BigMonty]

Of course pick 7 is the jewel. But the comments re Bowes as a player are ridiculous he is recovering from injury and played a lot of games in the VFL ahhh a Bytel equivalent is how he should be considered.

He will not get a game at Geelong with Henry and Bruhn coming in and be kicking dew off Kardinia Park for some time.

So why would he come to Geelong to get paid more than their Brownlow medallists the ridicule and uncomfortableness would be palpable especially if he doesn't perform.....someone needs to explain that to him.

Saints or an equivalent is a better fit even Ess or Haw as the expectations will be less as we are all trying to build to a flag tilt in a couple of years and there is a spot in the firsts that he could compete for and Pick 7 assists with the said flag tilt.

Good luck to him and hope he chooses wisely.

We have a front row seat in this process thanks to Ben Long

22

Ben Long

Age

28

Ht

186cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.9

3star

K

6.2

2star

HB

4.7

3star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.7

4star

G

0.7

4star

D

12.8

3star

K

6.7

3star

HB

6.2

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.3

3star

G

0.0

1star

D

13.4

4star

K

6.8

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

3.2

4star

T

3.2

5star

G

0.6

3star

.

Cannot imagine any player choosing a team he wants to go to when he is playing in the twos and a club taking him too seriously.

Irrespective of pick 7 he should choose a team where he gets the best chance at playing in the ones not because of lifestyle and he likes the jumper colours.




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[Joffaboy]

Isnt he getting 500k a season over 2 years (so a million total)? I swear thats what i read.

Chump change if thats the number. Ive said a few times if we can do Long and 27 for Bowes and 7 it would be amazing.

Many reports saying 850k x 2 with one saying 500 plus (whatever plus means). Whispers from the club that it would cost the club 2 mill for Bowes ( as per Master Strokeman who posted he rang the club so I am taking his post in good faith).

500k is chump change and I know that the club think Bowes is a decent player. Reading between the lines the 850k scared off the club looking at future committments and the SC going forward.

All speculation however until we hear from Gallagher tomorrow on SEN we really don't have the full picture.

 

[MordySaint]

Isnt he getting 500k a season over 2 years (so a million total)? I swear thats what i read.

Chump change if thats the number. Ive said a few times if we can do Long and 27 for Bowes and 7 it would be amazing.

I'm sick of all this the grass is always greener on the other side stuff.

How about we pay Long what he is worth, he's actually now in the peak of his career. He's getting better and better, you don't get rid of players when their trajectory is on the up.... you get rid of them when they are going down.

Reminds me of the Stanley trade, where we got rid of him after his best season for the club (go to AFL tables ... look at all his stats they were going up and up) and now he's a Premiership player.... PPPffftttt

 

[gubby88]

Were really not.

If its a player wanting to come to Melbs we need to pay overs cause were not a big club.

The Shiel example is exactly what you then talk against in the next sentence.

No I think the club has settled that we won't pry big name players out of clubs now so there is no point spending half the Cao trying

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[phantom13]

I'm sick of all this the grass is always greener on the other side stuff.

How about we pay Long what he is worth, he's actually now in the peak of his career. He's getting better and better, you don't get rid of players when their trajectory is on the up.... you get rid of them when they are going down.

Reminds me of the Stanley trade, where we got rid of him after his best season for the club (go to AFL tables ... look at all his stats they were going up and up) and now he's a Premiership player.... PPPffftttt

Long wants to go so its not really an apt comparison.

I agree with the principle and think our trading history has been average at best but if Long is out the door wed be remiss not to try and get the best deal we can back for him.

 

[Highlander35]

 

[MordySaint]

Long wants to go so its not really an apt comparison.

I agree with the principle and think our trading history has been average at best but if Long is out the door wed be remiss not to try and get the best deal we can back for him.

Depends on why he wants to go?

If he's on 400K at the moment and someone has offered him 600K and security ... of course he is going.

If its something to do with other than money, then again its something we need to fix

 

[Joffaboy]

Of course pick 7 is the jewel. But the comments re Bowes as a player are ridiculous he is recovering from injury and played a lot of games in the VFL ahhh a Bytel equivalent is how he should be considered.

He will not get a game at Geelong with Henry and Bruhn coming in and be kicking dew off Kardinia Park for some time.

So why would he come to Geelong to get paid more than their Brownlow medallists the ridicule and uncomfortableness would be palpable especially if he doesn't perform.....someone needs to explain that to him.

Saints or an equivalent is a better fit even Ess or Haw as the expectations will be less as we are all trying to build to a flag tilt in a couple of years and there is a spot in the firsts that he could compete for and Pick 7 assists with the said flag tilt.

Good luck to him and hope he chooses wisely.

We have a front row seat in this process thanks to Ben Long.

Cannot imagine any player choosing a team he wants to go to when he is playing in the twos and a club taking him too seriously.

Irrespective of pick 7 he should choose a team where he gets the best chance at playing in the ones not because of lifestyle and he likes the jumper colours.




On SM-G977B using BigFooty.com mobile app

I agree with most of that and again speculation but your Ben Long point above made me think.(does happen occasionally)

Say Ben Long was on 400 to 450k a season and Bowes is on 850k, doesn't that mean in isolation we would only be paying Bowes 450 to 400k a year and get pick 7.
I know list management doesn't work like this however we would basically be doing a swap for Bowes and Long. We owe nothing to Long but would have offered what he was on (speculation 400k ish?) so it is 450k more to find, pick 7 gets 200k as a base salary so 650k difference for Bowes and pick 7.
A I said the list management needs to be looked at in entirety and over a number of years, but I have convinced myself we have a lot of cap space so the supposed explanation from the club (as per Mstr Strokeman) doesn't really hold up.

 

[MordySaint]

I agree with most of that and again speculation but your Ben Long point above made me think.(does happen occasionally)

Say Ben Long was on 400 to 450k a season and Bowes is on 850k, doesn't that mean in isolation we would only be paying Bowes 450 to 400k a year and get pick 7.
I know list management doesn't work like this however we would basically be doing a swap for Bowes and Long. We owe nothing to Long but would have offered what he was on (speculation 400k ish?) so it is 450k more to find, pick 7 gets 200k as a base salary so 650k difference for Bowes and pick 7.
A I said the list management needs to be looked at in entirety and over a number of years, but I have convinced myself we have a lot of cap space so the supposed explanation from the club (as per Mstr Strokeman) doesn't really hold up.

Where is the club going to pull 850K to backpay his salary?

Seen what interest rates are doing at the moment? We only owe 14 million to the bank.

 

[phantom13]

Depends on why he wants to go?

If he's on 400K at the moment and someone has offered him 600K and security ... of course he is going.

If its something to do with other than money, then again its something we need to fix

Yeh fair point but at this point hes made his mind up, could we have fixed the cash and other stuff earlier, maybe? Can we change his mind now with his bags already packed, probably not.

GC can offer cash and security above his market rate (which is usually true of any player who leaves). Hes not the type of player who warrants paying overs to retain (and i say that as a massive fan of his).

 

[Joffaboy]

Depends on why he wants to go?

If he's on 400K at the moment and someone has offered him 600K and security ... of course he is going.

If its something to do with other than money, then again its something we need to fix

Got a four year offer, Saints not willing to give him four. This is only a personal opinion, but I don't think the coach is that enamored with him.

Gold Coast may also suit Bens lifestyle.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

Where is the club going to pull 850K to backpay his salary?

Seen what interest rates are doing at the moment? We only owe 14 million to the bank.

Ever heard of Afterpay??

 

[phantom13]

Ever heard of Afterpay??

Only on the news for people getting in 20k debt to it.

Still cant figure out how when they give you a pretty hard cap to start with, a mystery of life i suppose

 

[lewdogs]

I'd be shocked if we didn't look at him. It's a glaring area of weakness.

 

[The_Steadier]

You talk some s**t. We offered dusty, fyfe, Kelly and Shiel well above market value and all of them stayed bar Shiel.
Shiel also knocked back offers from Carlton and North that were up there with ours and settled for essendon which was the lowest...

This is called good management, the fact that we realised that we offered far too much for the unicorn and now we are offering what they are worth.

We are the same as any other team in trade week....

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In hindsight all those guys bar dusty wouldn't have been worth the circa 1.2mill a year we were prepared to pay them.

All copped big, long term injuries except for shiel who was simply found out to be the relatively ineffective butcher many suspected he always was.

Dusty's kidney injury came later, so he was able to produce more years of top footy.

But sheesh, we were saved from ourselves in hindsight.

 

[BrutThough]

Saints have a bizarre approach to trading IMO. We are always happy to pay massive overs for spuds, or beaten up blokes like Hanners, yet when it comes to the real big fish like Fyfe, Dusty or De Goey we limp in with slight overs or something similar to market rate.

No star will come to Saints without massive overs. We don't have the balls to be aggressive in attracting a star, but are always happy to overpay average players.

We are not getting De Goey. In fact this trade period, I suspect all that will happen is that we lose Clark for SFA, top up with more B graders nobody else wants, pay them too much, and worse of all be stuck with Hill's monster contract when he clearly doesn't want to be here.

Hasn't giving out inflated contracts been a huge complaint of the supporter base for years? Yet now we appear to not be offering ridiculous amounts to players who don't warrant it, and that's also an issue?

Should we be happy we aren't making the same mistakes from the past?

 

[mighty_sainters]

I'd be shocked if we didn't look at him. It's a glaring area of weakness.

Absolutely agree, if he doesn’t cost too much surely we take a punt.

I would argue a second key forward should be number one on our list to fill.

 

[BrutThough]

Would be a great fit for us, especially after adding some ruck to his game this year in the VFL.

 

[Joffaboy]

Where is the club going to pull 850K to backpay his salary?

Seen what interest rates are doing at the moment? We only owe 14 million to the bank.

The debt has nothing to do with operating cashflow, mainly it is capital and quasi 'debt' owed to the AFL.

The issue is TPP and staying under the SC. There are reasons we are not chasing Bowes that we are not privy to.

Can you imaging the one who are screaming to get him melting down next year when Jack Steele (for example) gets an offer that we can't match because we maxed out the credit card on a guy who can't get out of Sandringham.

 

[phantom13]

I'd be shocked if we didn't look at him. It's a glaring area of weakness.

He couldnt unseat Ben Brown and Tom McDonald...

If hes willing to chop and swap with Roma and he comes relatively cheap it could be worth a look.

 

[stavro#4]

Ah….

 

[MordySaint]

All speculation however until we hear from Gallagher tomorrow on SEN we really don't have the full picture.

Gags and Lethers have been there for 4 and 5 years respectively now, wouldn't listen to anything that they say. They don't have the runs on the board and have delivered us a playing list no better than when they took over.

At least you knew where Finnis stood, all about culture and respect to people and that is what he delivered.

 

[heynow85]

Some in the media (eg Twomey) are still saying Saints are interested in Bowes. Why would that be?