2023 AFL Draft General Discussion

[briztoon]

Who cares where their family resides? That’s clearly open for manipulation as it appears it already is…

I think there’s a little from column A, I.e the clubs are more than happy to facilitate the relationship given the development programs are a huge step up from their own.

Perfect situation for them.

And I don’t have a problem with them playing football in the APS.

I have a problem with them playing the majority of their football for a Victorian NAB League side, but still qualifying for a Northern academy.

I can kind of cop kids from Leeton boarding in Geelong and at places like Assumption and qualifying for GWS as they are literally the closest top flight boarding schools with football programs to their homes and they have very little other options.

Kids moving to Victorian Boarding schools from QLD in year 10 are no longer products of their academy by the completion of year 12. Id have the same opinion of Cyril Rioli under current recruiting laws.

Where a kid's family resides is a key pillar of academy eligibility.

Where is a kid boarding in Melbourne supposed to train and play outside of the private school system. It's not like a QLD kid boarding in Melbourne can jump on a plane for afternoon training with their academy mid week.

I understand what you're saying. But I believe you need to take those VFL blinkers off, and look at the bigger picture.

 

[Sphynx]

Where a kid's family resides is a key pillar of academy eligibility.

Where is a kid boarding in Melbourne supposed to train and play outside of the private school system. It's not like a QLD kid boarding in Melbourne can jump on a plane for afternoon training with their academy mid week.

I understand what you're saying. But I believe you need to take those VFL blinkers off, and look at the bigger picture.

It should be where the player resides is a key pillar of the system, not their parents.

The entire point of the Northern academy system is as a reward for the development of their players, that everyone reminds us is self funded by the clubs.

I don’t see a reason why northern clubs should be rewarded when they essentially outsource the key years of their players development to AFL VIC.

Are they going to compensate AFL VIC?

I mean it’s as simple as this, the Gold Coast Academy now plays in the NAB League, he won’t be a Gold Coast Academy player in the NAB League, he will be an Oakleigh Charger.

Pretty simple illustration I would have thought? When an “academy player” doesn’t even play for their academy in a competition the academy plays in.

 

[briztoon]

It should be where the player resides is a key pillar of the system, not their parents.

The entire point of the Northern academy system is as a reward for the development of their players, that everyone reminds us is self funded by the clubs.

I don’t see a reason why northern clubs should be rewarded when they essentially outsource the key years of their players development to AFL VIC.

Are they going to compensate AFL VIC?

I mean it’s as simple as this, the Gold Coast Academy now plays in the NAB League, he won’t be a Gold Coast Academy player in the NAB League, he will be an Oakleigh Charger.

Pretty simple illustration I would have thought? When an “academy player” doesn’t even play for their academy in a competition the academy plays in.

I'm sure the academy clubs have a real big say in where parents send their kids.

The academies were set up as a counterbalance to some of the natural advantages that the Vic clubs inherit.

Gold Coast is benefiting as they should.

 

[Sphynx]

I'm sure the academy clubs have a real big say in where parents send their kids.

The academies were set up as a counterbalance to some of the natural advantages that the Vic clubs inherit.

Gold Coast is benefiting as they should.

Of course the academy clubs don’t have a say.

But if the parents view the best opportunity for their kids to develop their football for 3 years is in the Victorian system, not the QLD system, where’s the discussion?

What are Brisbane or Gold Coast actually contributing to their development if they:

1. Never train with them.
2. Don’t play with them.
3. More than likely skip the Div 2 games and go straight to the Allies.

They ran a few clinics for them as a 14 year old so that gives them priority for the next 3-4 years?


This is only going to get worse and the biggest abuser of this system will likely be the inevitable Tasmanian Academy.

Ryley Sanders is doing it with Melbourne Grammar and Sandringham and Tasmanian boarders have been a traditional thing for longer than poaching QLD’rs.


If Academy kids want to take up sporting scholarships in Victoria they should still be required to play for their Academy side in the NAB League as a bare minimum, they play half of their games in Victoria anyway.

 

[Jordie_tackles]

Of course the academy clubs don’t have a say.

But if the parents view the best opportunity for their kids to develop their football for 3 years is in the Victorian system, not the QLD system, where’s the discussion?

What are Brisbane or Gold Coast actually contributing to their development if they:

1. Never train with them.
2. Don’t play with them.
3. More than likely skip the Div 2 games and go straight to the Allies.

They ran a few clinics for them as a 14 year old so that gives them priority for the next 3-4 years?


This is only going to get worse and the biggest abuser of this system will likely be the inevitable Tasmanian Academy.

Ryley Sanders is doing it with Melbourne Grammar and Sandringham and Tasmanian boarders have been a traditional thing for longer than poaching QLD’rs.


If Academy kids want to take up sporting scholarships in Victoria they should still be required to play for their Academy side in the NAB League as a bare minimum, they play half of their games in Victoria anyway.

How do they train? Just school football? Surely that is a bit tough on a kid to lose out on training with any NAB league team?

 

[Sphynx]

How do they train? Just school football? Surely that is a bit tough on a kid to lose out on training with any NAB league team?

Shouldn’t the Gold Coast be funding their training?

Why not run training sessions in Melbourne for their APS scholarship kids.

That’s a regular occurrence for other Bushranger/Pioneer kids who are boarding at distance away from their country training venues.

 

[giantroo]

 

[pushintheback]

His highlights real is certainly eye catching. Still sits around the 12ish mark for me in next years draft. He'll need to put on a fair bit of weight to do the same things at AFL level.
I think Cal needs to brush up on his 2023 crop because there are moir players (hahaha) than the 3 or 4 he constantly mentions.

 

[RedmanWasHere]

His highlights real is certainly eye catching. Still sits around the 12ish mark for me in next years draft. He'll need to put on a fair bit of weight to do the same things at AFL level.
I think Cal needs to brush up on his 2023 crop because there are moir players (hahaha) than the 3 or 4 he constantly mentions.

Between you and me, I'd like to see a Torrent of names suddenly dropping from his mouth.

 

[eDPS]

I can’t get enough Watson talk honestly

 

[pushintheback]

I can’t get enough Watson talk honestly

I think what we saw from the futures game there are definitely some players that have some decent highlights that will get selected before Watson. But he's an excitement machine when he's on song, there is no question about that.

 

[Sphynx]

His highlights real is certainly eye catching. Still sits around the 12ish mark for me in next years draft. He'll need to put on a fair bit of weight to do the same things at AFL level.
I think Cal needs to brush up on his 2023 crop because there are moir players (hahaha) than the 3 or 4 he constantly mentions.

He has a few things in his favour.

He’s got top line speed, he has great work rate and despite being small, is really physical for his size.

I think he will translate perfectly to AFL.

I’d love if we managed to nab him with Ports first next year, which I think will be around the mark for him.

 

[anotherletdown]

Where a kid's family resides is a key pillar of academy eligibility.

Where is a kid boarding in Melbourne supposed to train and play outside of the private school system. It's not like a QLD kid boarding in Melbourne can jump on a plane for afternoon training with their academy mid week.

I understand what you're saying. But I believe you need to take those VFL blinkers off, and look at the bigger picture.

I'm not sure I go with that.

My take on the academies is that the underage pathways into AFL are so deficient in northern states compared to elsewhere. Therefore Sydney, GWS, Brisbane and GC have academies, they are in effect the only pathway because the local comps aren't up to it.
The end goal being more kids seeing a future in the AFL locally without the need to leave home. The ones who do make it - great, the ones who don't make it hopefully stay in the sport to help build up the local league playing depth, as well as improving the overall coaching, talent identification, training standards etc etc. that way the local clubs can start producing their own and AFL club specific academies aren't needed. It's primarily a tool to help grow and expand the game locally

So, for me if the player decides somewhere else has a better pathway then the purpose is somewhat lost and the AFL clubs miss out. Tough but fair.

It's also why the NGA is such a complete con job, especially for Vic clubs. The pathway is on their doorstep and the talent identification is there, those academies do not move the dial in the slightest... sob, sob, but mummy was born overseas so my school would never have noticed me even though AFL is effectively compulsory sport at my school and Dad played it for years. Give me fuc#ing break!

 

[briztoon]

I'm not sure I go with that.

My take on the academies is that the underage pathways into AFL are so deficient in northern states compared to elsewhere. Therefore Sydney, GWS, Brisbane and GC have academies, they are in effect the only pathway because the local comps aren't up to it.
The end goal being more kids seeing a future in the AFL locally without the need to leave home. The ones who do make it - great, the ones who don't make it hopefully stay in the sport to help build up the local league playing depth, as well as improving the overall coaching, talent identification, training standards etc etc. that way the local clubs can start producing their own and AFL club specific academies aren't needed. It's primarily a tool to help grow and expand the game locally

So, for me if the player decides somewhere else has a better pathway then the purpose is somewhat lost and the AFL clubs miss out. Tough but fair.

It's also why the NGA is such a complete con job, especially for Vic clubs. The pathway is on their doorstep and the talent identification is there, those academies do not move the dial in the slightest... sob, sob, but mummy was born overseas so my school would never have noticed me even though AFL is effectively compulsory sport at my school and Dad played it for years. Give me fuc#ing break!

Without knowing the families situation, my pure speculation is that the family has jumped at the exceptional educational scholarship on offer. If Nancarrow wasn't a genuine football talent, my guess is there wouldn't be a scholarship on offer.

 

[briztoon]

I'm not sure I go with that.

My take on the academies is that the underage pathways into AFL are so deficient in northern states compared to elsewhere. Therefore Sydney, GWS, Brisbane and GC have academies, they are in effect the only pathway because the local comps aren't up to it.

Just on the pathways discussion.

There has been an ongoing, circular discussion on the QAFL board about the value of the QLD academies.

The pathways in Brisbane and on the Gold Coast aren't deficient.

The main problem, and it exists all the way up to both academies representative teams, and even at QLD rep level, that the gap between the genuine draftable prospects and the rest of the kids in the team can be, and is, huge.

If you picked a QLD u18 team this year, there are what, 3 kids who "might" get drafted. Two from the Lions academy, and I couldn't even name a Gold Coast academy kid who is dratable this year.

Next year there might be 5 or 6 kids.



The biggest complaint from the Brisbane based QAFL clubs are that the academy kids play to many meaningless academy games, being pulled out of their colts teams for showcase games that don't mean anything, in the middle of colts finals.

The kids aren't getting any extra, or higher level, coaching at academy level, according to the QAFL clubs.

Most Brisbane QAFL clubs would prefer that there was just a QLD rep team, that plays in the National tournament, or Div 2 at National level, and then the top kids go on to the Allies for national champs.

 

[RedmanWasHere]

Most Brisbane QAFL clubs would prefer that there was just a QLD rep team, that plays in the National tournament, or Div 2 at National level, and then the top kids go on to the Allies for national champs.

Why do we need Allies anyway?

Surely it reverts to QLD, NSW/ACT, NT and Tasmania again.

 

[anotherletdown]

Why do we need Allies anyway?

Surely it reverts to QLD, NSW/ACT, NT and Tasmania again.

The allies are barely competitive now. Splitting them into 4 teams would be horrific

 

[briztoon]

The allies are barely competitive now. Splitting them into 4 teams would be horrific

We would be going back to the old division 2 competition. They wouldn’t be playing the likes of Vic or WA, etc.

 

[GC2015]

Who cares where their family resides? That’s clearly open for manipulation as it appears it already is…

As a boarder, the player's physical address is technically still where their parents live and in Nancarrow's case that is Cairns. It's important to point out that Will Ashcroft is an example of the opposite situation playing out where he was born and raised on the Gold Coast, was a member of the Suns academy for multiple years and moved to Melbourne with his parents in his 15th year. Last year the AFL ruled that Ashcroft was ineligible to be academy drafted by the Suns but if Marcus and his mother had remained on the Gold Coast while Will boarded at Brighton, then he would have remained academy eligible for the Suns.

The rule is pretty clear in that regard. Is it open for manipluation? Sure but we're seeing this play out with players from all over the country. Why did Tex Wanganeen, who had lived his whole life in Adelaide up until 2020, get a scholarship to attend Xavier College in his final two years of schooling when he wasn't considered a standout junior at the time? I don't think he even made the South Australian U16 team in 2019. Could it be that Essendon organised for him to attend to Xavier in order to increase his chances of selecting the Bombers as his father-son preference if he developed into a draftable talent?

The Victorian teams stand to gain a lot more from this "manipulation" as you put it than the non-Victorian teams do.

I think there’s a little from column A, I.e the clubs are more than happy to facilitate the relationship given the development programs are a huge step up from their own.

I think you'd find both Queensland teams would rather have their academy/father-son prospects remain in Queensland because having them move to Melbourne drastically increases the chances of them turning their back on us and going into the open draft. You saw it with Will Ashcroft this year where he genuinely considered going into the open draft this year because he had adjusted to the Melbourne footballing lifestyle and wasn't sure he wanted to leave. Conversely we saw Jaspa Fletcher, who is also father-son eligible for Brisbane this year, live almost his entire life in Brisbane and never for a second looked like turning down the opportunity to join the Lions. Even Marc Murphy back in the day had the opportunity to go father-son to Brisbane (who had just come off the back of four consecutive grand final appearances) but opted to enter the open draft instead because he knew he'd be staying in Melbourne. If you don't for a second think that Carlton were in Murphy's ear that year telling him to join their wooden spooner team instead of the mighty Lions then you're kidding yourself.

Word within the local footy circles up here is that the Spida Everitt's family will be returning to Melbourne next year for son Boston to attend an APS school and play NAB League footy down there. Once again, if you think St Kilda (who will have father-son access to Boston Everitt in 2024) haven't been involved in that movement in some way then you're kidding yourself. Boston has lived on the Gold Coast for essentially his whole life and has been in the Suns academy since he was 12 but St Kilda are clearly trying to swoop in right at the end of his junior footy development and convince him to join them instead of the Suns, just like Essendon did with Tex Wanganeen. That's definitely more a case of manipulation than Scotch offering Nancarrow a scholarship.

 

[RedmanWasHere]

Alright 2023 thread.
Time to take centre stage.

 

[RedmanWasHere]

Callum Twomey's just dropped his usual top 10 list.

Eye on the future: 10 draft prospects to watch in 2023

With the 2022 NAB AFL Draft done and dusted, Callum Twomey looks ahead to the best prospects heading into next season

www.afl.com.au

 

[Sphynx]

Callum Twomey's just dropped his usual top 10 list.

Eye on the future: 10 draft prospects to watch in 2023

With the 2022 NAB AFL Draft done and dusted, Callum Twomey looks ahead to the best prospects heading into next season

www.afl.com.au

No Archer Reid in his first list.

 

[pushintheback]

No Archer Reid in his first list.

12 months out. I think Archer Reid will be in the top 10 12hrs out from the 2023 draft.

 

[weltschmerz]

This time last year Jackson Broadbent was the next star ruck and Harry Lemmey was a pick 1 prospect

 

[eDPS]

This time last year Jackson Broadbent was the next star ruck

Barnett was always the one for me