Prediction 2023 GWS Giants - Predicted best 22, breakout player(s), general player/team discussion & questions

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Bedford really blown me away this year, was hoping he could be pretty solid and hold things down well enough until Jones came into the picture but he's become really vital. He's pretty much the best pressure forward in the entire competition just absolutely relentless hunting to pressure opponents, does really well to push up the ground and link up with the mids, ball use is nice going inside 50 and runs really well with the ball in hand. Think it was only a third-rounder they gave up for him and it's worked out as better as I could've hoped for, plays a similar role to what Castanga did for the Tigs where he's entirely selfless to focus on pressure and understands that no one is really looking to target him inside 50 and he's entirely content with just living off whatever scraps he can find. Having a pressure duo of him and Daniels is really special with Jones to come as well, it's a super exciting group long term just have to hope they can all stay on the park.
 
Who are people vibing in the draft if we are wedded to pick 6? (no trading up to McKercher).
I feel like Sanders is almost perfect for us but likely to not be available.
I know people aren't too keen on Caddy but he looks like the best player after Sanders to me.
 
PaythePerryman said:
Who are people vibing in the draft if we are wedded to pick 6? (no trading up to McKercher).
I feel like Sanders is almost perfect for us but likely to not be available.
I know people aren't too keen on Caddy but he looks like the best player after Sanders to me.
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I really like Caddy, we don't really have a mid sized forward option long term, Lloyd is done this year and was never anything more than solid, beginning to lose faith in Stone, Caddy has been really productive has shown some ability to move into the midfield as well which would be some nice flexibility to have. Love Watson as well, we do have a few smalls atm but think he's so talented that just wouldn't pass him up. Couple years from now we're probably hoping the forward line would look something like:

Greene Hogan Daniels
Jones Cadman Gruzewski

Bedford as the 7th forward?

The list is in such a good shape moving forward of course not all these guys are going to turn out the way we hope and some are probably going to leave for opportunity elsewhere but it looks really good.
 

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Hendo_21 said:
I really like Caddy, we don't really have a mid sized forward option long term, Lloyd is done this year and was never anything more than solid, beginning to lose faith in Stone, Caddy has been really productive has shown some ability to move into the midfield as well which would be some nice flexibility to have. Love Watson as well, we do have a few smalls atm but think he's so talented that just wouldn't pass him up. Couple years from now we're probably hoping the forward line would look something like:

Greene Hogan Daniels
Jones Cadman Gruzewski

Bedford as the 7th forward?

The list is in such a good shape moving forward of course not all these guys are going to turn out the way we hope and some are probably going to leave for opportunity elsewhere but it looks really good.
Click to expand...
Yeah good assesment. Having Hogan/Riccardi allows us plenty of time to develop talls, just got to hope they don't bail coz they aren't getting games.

Caddy is probably my favourite ATM as a bit of a game breaker. Watson could definitely be that as well if he slides to us. I think those are the players to take with top 10 picks.

Our backline is so young and solid that I don't feel like we need to go after anything there...Fahey and Leek coming through.

Maybe a pure wing/mid and a tall forward.

I haven't given up on Stone just yet as I think he can take that Lloyd role next year. Just been very unlucky
 
PaythePerryman said:
Yeah good assesment. Having Hogan/Riccardi allows us plenty of time to develop talls, just got to hope they don't bail coz they aren't getting games.

Caddy is probably my favourite ATM as a bit of a game breaker. Watson could definitely be that as well if he slides to us. I think those are the players to take with top 10 picks.

Our backline is so young and solid that I don't feel like we need to go after anything there...Fahey and Leek coming through.

Maybe a pure wing/mid and a tall forward.

I haven't given up on Stone just yet as I think he can take that Lloyd role next year. Just been very unlucky
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I'm still not fully sold on Riccardi yet as key forward of the future, still feels like he doesn't impact games enough when he's not kicking goals, so many other good key forwards push up the ground to act as a marking target or distributors going back inside 50 after leading out. Just something about it I'm still not 100% in on him yet, don't think any of us are expecting him to be a superstar or a 50+ goal key forward but if he can put together another year of 30+ goals that'd be really encouraging, was a little bit surprised they gave him 3 years.
 
Hendo_21 said:
I'm still not fully sold on Riccardi yet as key forward of the future, still feels like he doesn't impact games enough when he's not kicking goals, so many other good key forwards push up the ground to act as a marking target or distributors going back inside 50 after leading out. Just something about it I'm still not 100% in on him yet, don't think any of us are expecting him to be a superstar or a 50+ goal key forward but if he can put together another year of 30+ goals that'd be really encouraging, was a little bit surprised they gave him 3 years.
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He's been pretty consistent lately with 2-3 goals a game. As a second forward I'm pretty happy with that. Helps having so much pace on the ball but that 3 year contract gives Cadman, Caddy and Gruz plenty of time to develop and if Ricca decides to leave after his next contract at 27yr we have those guys ready to go.

Also Hogan has been quite robust this year but with his history it's probably good to have the options.
 
Who we take at #6 - or who's there to take - is going to come down to a couple of crucial AFL calls. FA compensation for Norths (presumably) losing McKay (although that seems mostly likely to be an absurd price for a moderately skilled KPD which will push it into band 1 compensation) and the Sanders gift to Norths. The final piece of the puzzle will be what Suns do with their #4 pick, although that's more a case of which draftee would that club prefer.

Reid, Curtin, McKercher, Duursma I think are certainties to be off the board by our pick. So, presuming Norths get given #3 for McKay, two more will be gone out of Watson, O'Sullivan, Caddy and if not gifted to Norths, Sanders.

I think that each of those offers something of value to GWS for the long term:
  • Watson - another x-factor, goal-scoring small forward (essentially will replace Toby Greene's role in 5 to 6 years)
  • O'Sullivan - KPD who can both lock-down and intercept, would add to the best tall defence in the comp in the long-run
  • Caddy - probably a third forward, but potentially a DeGoey or Stringer like option
  • Sanders - inside mid grunt, who would replace Cal Ward in the inside rotation and add to our clearance-winning stats
It will simply be a case of who's left for us, in which case who gets Suns' pick (as well as who Demons choose) will be critical.

If Bulldogs get it (as media is suggesting they're currently angling for) then they'd probably take Sanders (if there) and otherwise either Watson or O'Sullivan (they've got lots of talls, but seemingly no good tall defenders?). If McAdam gets to Melbourne, they probably don't need Watson, really do need another tall scoring option up front (so Caddy possibly), but also want to replace Steven May (so could take O'Sullivan). It's just too hard to tell at the moment.

Personally, given that Cadman is still being developed, and we haven't even tried Derksen and Gruzewski, Caddy would be my last choice. But we're actually well stocked in a number of areas, so there's a similar argument that could be made for each of the other three, except Sanders really - except he's the least likely of the three to be there IMHO.
 
I keep reading articles about Gold Coast trading 4 for points in this draft which seems crazy to me.
They will have a deficit if they trade 4 out, but not a huge amount, it will see there pick drop 3 or 4 spots, maybe 5 or 6 if GC run around the middle of the comp. Even that assumes that all 3 academy players go in the first round, otherwise it will more than likely be a second round pick that slides a long way. Who cares if that happens if you are able to draft 4 into next year for a second pick in 2024 first round, you end up with an extra pick, even if one is a little lower than it would have been.
There will be someone willing to trade 4 for a first round next year and a few late picks for points or even swaps.
We should try and do it. Possibly trade our existing picks into next year, someone will be looking to get in, and then trade a combination of what we end up with plus our own pick for 4. keeping one pick in the first round for next year. We'd probably have to do a few things with later picks to give the Suns a few extra points.
A lot of moving parts that may make it difficult to pull off.
 
GWS Goose said:
I keep reading articles about Gold Coast trading 4 for points in this draft which seems crazy to me.
They will have a deficit if they trade 4 out, but not a huge amount, it will see there pick drop 3 or 4 spots, maybe 5 or 6 if GC run around the middle of the comp. Even that assumes that all 3 academy players go in the first round, otherwise it will more than likely be a second round pick that slides a long way. Who cares if that happens if you are able to draft 4 into next year for a second pick in 2024 first round, you end up with an extra pick, even if one is a little lower than it would have been.
There will be someone willing to trade 4 for a first round next year and a few late picks for points or even swaps.
We should try and do it. Possibly trade our existing picks into next year, someone will be looking to get in, and then trade a combination of what we end up with plus our own pick for 4. keeping one pick in the first round for next year. We'd probably have to do a few things with later picks to give the Suns a few extra points.
A lot of moving parts that may make it difficult to pull off.
Click to expand...
Yes, it can be quite complex, depending on exactly what thoughts the Suns' management team has. I know that their posters on BF are a bit downcast to effectively "waste" another top 10 pick (conversely, they're getting 3 x top 10 picks for the cost of 1, so shouldn't be any tears).

Some would like to move up - trade with Norths to #2 or #3 to get ahead of any Walter bid. However, that would cost them #4 (which by then is #5) and some, which then drops down their available points in 2023, even though it would also reduce any points required to match for Walter (presuming that there will be a tacit agreement from Norths not to bid on him). The compounding problem is that then they'd have five top 10 talents added to their list ... and in a few years will end up in salary cap trouble.

So, I agree that them pushing #4/5 to next year keeps value but buys time. The problem would be that every team wants #4/5, but none will really want to trade their future first round pick, for fear that they'll regress, and end up handing over too high a price.

So, bit of a conundrum for Suns.

Could GWS profit in some way? Sure, depending on what we're willing to do, or to give up.
 
When will we know about Sanders?
Surely they won't wait till after all the compo stuff on top of it?
I feel like both are kinda ridiculous McKay we know isn't worth pick 3....and Sanders is a top 6 pick...
I don't have an issue with the GC academy boys as they probably wouldn't be playing AFL without it. But North's list is in a great spot already...they just need to wait for them to progress rather than stack another 2 top 6 picks for them.
 
PaythePerryman said:
When will we know about Sanders?
Surely they won't wait till after all the compo stuff on top of it?
I feel like both are kinda ridiculous McKay we know isn't worth pick 3....and Sanders is a top 6 pick...
I don't have an issue with the GC academy boys as they probably wouldn't be playing AFL without it. But North's list is in a great spot already...they just need to wait for them to progress rather than stack another 2 top 6 picks for them.
Click to expand...
I think that the North assistance package will be basically them being allowed to match a bid on Sanders.

The compo will be as per the secret recipe, which is likely to be a first round selection.
 
GWS Goose said:
I think that the North assistance package will be basically them being allowed to match a bid on Sanders.

The compo will be as per the secret recipe, which is likely to be a first round selection.
Click to expand...
I guess then it depends on what they are able to match....would they have the capital to match a bid at 6? Surely that'd still take a fair few points.
I understand we have had a lot of picks come our way early days but this is feeling a little much.
 
PaythePerryman said:
I guess then it depends on what they are able to match....would they have the capital to match a bid at 6? Surely that'd still take a fair few points.
I understand we have had a lot of picks come our way early days but this is feeling a little much.
Click to expand...
yep, they'll match regardless.
 

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Jake Riccardi - another one of our key 2023 players responsible for our awesome recent winning form.

THERE are several players who are emblematic of the Giants' rise from a team in limbo at the midway point of the season to one fancied by many to reach a preliminary final with victory over Port Adelaide on Saturday night

Newly re-signed ruckman Kieren Briggs has been one of the best big men in the competition this season but was playing in the VFL until round 10.

Connor Idun wasn't garnering much attention until his barnstorming defensive performance in the round 11 win away to Geelong and hasn't missed a beat since.

Demons discard Toby Bedford was battling to solidify his place in the side to the halfway mark and is now arguably the best pressure forward in the competition.

And then there's Jake Riccardi.


www.afl.com.au

After living on the edge, Riccardi's living the dream

Jake Riccardi spent the first half of the season without a secure place in the side, and without a contract for 2024. Things have changed dramatically, as Daniel Garb discovers
www.afl.com.au www.afl.com.au
 
Not sure where everyone else is at but I think we could win the flag and not just in the sense of "oh yeah maybe if everything goes right we could win it" but we might very well be the best team. Still have got to sort this week out first and then obviously next week but just don't think there's another team playing as good of footy as us right now. We're fully healthy with everyone good to go (touch wood) and there isn't really a weakness this team has, we're great at stoppages, turnover and ball movement, and we're elite defensively only thing that gives me worry is the lack of rest compared to some of the other team. Could be crazy but think this team is playing on another level compared to everyone else, Collingwood's form has been questionable for a bit now, Carlton we've already beaten comfortably, Brisbane would make me nervous but think we're right there with them. Doesn't make us immune to bad games or laying an egg this week and that very well could happen but if we lose I don't think that's a reflection on this team not being good enough to win the flag because pretty much everything we've since this team turned it's season around has shown it is.
 
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Hendo_21 said:
Not sure where everyone else is at but I think we could win the flag and not just in the sense of "oh yeah maybe if everything goes right we could win it" but we might very well be the best team. Still have got to sort this week out first and then obviously next week but just don't think there's another team playing as good of footy as us right now. We're fully healthy with everyone good to go (touch wood) and there isn't really a weakness this team has, we're great at stoppages, turnover and ball movement, and we're elite defensively only thing that gives me worry is the lack of rest compared to some of the other team. Could be crazy but think this team is playing on another level compared to everyone else, Collingwood's form has been questionable for a bit now, Carlton we've already beaten comfortably, Brisbane would make me nervous but think we're right there with them. Doesn't make us immune to bad games or laying an egg this week and that very well could happen but if we lose I don't think that's a reflection on this team not being good enough to win the flag because pretty much everything we've since this team turned it's season around has shown it is.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I feel the same way overall - but things are reasonably balanced. We're in prelim for a reason. Pies finished top for a reason. We've got form and Pies have the runs on the board. Both teams are close enough to full strength. We're match hardened and have momentum. Pies are rested and have had time to address recent deficiencies.
I think they will come out with insane energy to try to blow us away early. We just need to match it and trust the game style. Either way, it's an exciting prospect.
 

The Ultimate Forward: Ranking the Top 30 forwards in the AFL in 2023

A statistics based ratings system.
www.sen.com.au www.sen.com.au

We love a ratings system at SEN. Who doesn’t?

Across the course of the season, we have been putting together a statistics based ratings system in a bid to rank the best players in different positions. Earlier this year we floated the boat by providing our Top 20 forwards based on the weighted rankings, where we weight seven key categories for a forward and divide the total against the number of games played.

See the ranking system below:
• 6 points per goal
• 4 points per goal assist
• 3 points per mark inside 50
• 3 points per tackle inside 50
• 2 points per score involvement
• 1.5 points per inside 50
• 1.5 point per behind

The weighting points are based on what we believe to be the most important aspects of playing in the forward line. Now we have delivered the final rankings for the Ultimate Forward (which includes midfielders who push forward) for season 2023.

See the breakdown of the Top 10 below as well as the Top 30 list.

GWS captain Toby Greene is widely considered one of the league’s most damaging players and that is reflected with our top rating of 56.9. The Giants star and All-Australian skipper kicked the fourth most goals across the entire season while ranking inside the top four for goal assists and score involvements.

Adelaide veteran Taylor Walker rated second on 56.4 after kicking the second most goals while featuring in the top 10 for marks inside 50 and score involvements. It was a superb season from the former Crows captain.

Carlton’s Coleman Medallist Charlie Curnow ranked third with a rating of 54.9. He was sensational in kicking 78 goals in the home and away season. Curnow was not quite as effective in the finals which might have restricted him from finishing in the top two in this ratings system.

See the Top 30 below:

(GWS forward Jesse Hogan is #14)

Screen Shot 2023-10-05 at 12.58.45 pm
 
Phil Davis with another strong endorsement of Finn Callaghan.

Former captain Davis makes huge call on young Giant

A big call from Phil Davis.
www.sen.com.au www.sen.com.au

Former GWS captain Phil Davis expects young midfielder Finn Callaghan to blossom into a generational talent in the next few years. Taken with the Giants' first pick in the 2021 NAB AFL Draft, Callaghan has battled injury in his first two years in the system but enjoyed a terrific end to the 2023 season and finals series. The 20-year-old recovered from an Achillies injury that threatened to end his 2023 campaign, but the way he finished the year has left Giants fans excited about what’s to come next year and beyond.

It wasn’t until this year’s finals that Callaghan’s name was often spoken about amongst the football circles with his contested work having an impact on the GWS’ finals run. “I was really proud of him and he also missed about five weeks with one of those strange calf injuries that lingered for a bit longer,” Davis told AFL Trade Radio's The Late Trade. “He didn’t come in underdone but (he was) not in absolute cherry ripe condition, but his performance was awesome. The thing that I was probably most pleased with was I thought he tackled really well, he’s got a very rare combination of height, speed and endurance.”

But Davis says Callaghan was the most talented player he’s seen walk through the door since he joined the Giants all the way back in 2011. “He had a foot injury in his top age year, and slid to pick three because of that, I’ve been on record and this is coming in day one, I don’t remember a more talented player that we’ve brought through the door than Finn Callaghan,” Davis added. “I’m talking about when they rocked up Day 1 and I’ve watched them for six months, I can’t think off the top of my head a more talented player that’s walked through the door. That includes the Josh Kelly’s of the world, Stephen Coniglio, we’ve had a nice procession of high-end talent. Finn’s the one to me, give him a full pre-season and in a couple of years I think the world is his oyster.”
 
PaythePerryman said:
Let's go early

Buckley Taylor Himmelberg
Ash Whitfield Idun

Cogs Green Kelly
Briggs Callaghan Cumming

Daniels Greene Bedford
Riccardi Hogan E.Himmelberg*

Ward Fantasia* Perryman Cadman

I can see a world where XO or Rowston take Wards spot. Or XO/Darcy are ahead of Fantasia.

I think another preseason and Cadman will start to be damaging. All of a sudden every line looks very damaging.
I think a year of focusing on being a wing will do Cumming a world of good. He's probably a natural half back but Perryman is so diligent back there. I had to leave out Conor Stone but I really want him to have some luck.

Drop yours below.
Click to expand...
Idun Taylor Buckley
Ash HH Whitfield

Kelly Green Callaghan

Daniels TFG Bedford
Riccardi Hogan EH/Keefe*

Briggs Cogs Ward

Perryman Cumming XO Cadman

I think Haynes stays and could be sub a bit when not in the best 22.

*If we don't get EH, could see Derksen or Cadman taking this spot.

Rowston, Darcy, Gru, Stone, Angwin, Fahey, Preuss all to get games as the season progresses.

And I agree that Ward may or even should get passed/rested more as the year goes on, but will get to 300 easily.
 
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