List Mgmt. 2025 List Management Discussion - Part 3

[Hubnester]

2025 List Management Discussion - Part 3

Now that our season is over, and news is starting to break - it's time for a fresh thread.

This thread is to discuss all things list management - trades, draft, free agency, delistings and more.
As we are now officially in our off-season, we'll be wanting to keep this thread more strictly on-topic than the previous iterations.
Be respectful. You are allowed to disagree with someone - but play the ball, not the man. Repeat offenders will have their posting rights revoked.

Thanks to Lore once again for this incredibly useful spreadsheet.

2025 KEY DATES
Free Agency Period: Friday, October 3rd - Friday, October 10th
Trade Period: Monday, October 6th - Wednesday, October 15th
AFL Draft: Wednesday, November 19th - Thursday, November 20th

See Also:
2025 Year in Review Rumours & Confirmed Movements 2025 Draft Discussion
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[From 45]

That's the point. Half backs are easily to replace. Wingers can be replaced. Quality taggers aren't

Now go and find someone that can do all of those and tell me he's easily replaceable.

The top teams don’t utilise taggers. So I wouldn’t be advocating spending huge money to retain one

 

[stavro#4]

That didn't really answer my question at all.

Has it been reported anywhere what our money offer is to him other than when it was reported we offered two years at around 500k?

It would be nice to know if the money has gone up as well as the years. I don't think he's worth 850k, but I also think 500k is a slap in the face.

I think if we offered him a fair deal over four years and he still chose to take the big offers than that's just unlucky, but we seemed to be low balling him from the the start. I just hope we haven't continued to do that.

No. No reports on our money.

But you could make a fairly accurate assumption that it did.. otherwise why offer the 4 years when the issue was money?

 

[BrutThough]

Idiots!
They create a wave of inflation through allowing ridiculous offers to be publicised and then lowball decent players of our own.
Windhager would be rightly insulted to be ranked below Aleer.
The imbecile Misson strikes again, another Lovett/Ball scwnario!

Misson doesnt hand out contracts

 

[stavro#4]

Idiots!
They create a wave of inflation through allowing ridiculous offers to be publicised and then lowball decent players of our own.
Windhager would be rightly insulted to be ranked below Aleer.
The imbecile Misson strikes again, another Lovett/Ball scwnario!

If the belief is that we are overpaying players to attract them. Then wtf are other clubs doing?

 

[seasonedsainter]

It's also clear other clubs have decided to **** with us using our own tactics. The campaigners.

 

[gringo2011]

It's also clear other clubs have decided to **** with us using our own tactics. The campaigners.

He's a young player that is just about to start hitting his best most consistent footy. It's nothing that hasn't been a strategy for years. The only difference here is that we aren't as keen to keep him as they are to poach him.

 

[Cro19]

The top teams don’t utilise taggers. So I wouldn’t be advocating spending huge money to retain one

Did you watch Geelong on Friday night? However they aren't using players on big dollars to do the jobs.

 

[pluggeranddoc]

This is exactly my view. There is a limit at which we are willing to pay him and that's fine. if he can get more elsewhere, then I wish him the best of luck and dont blame him for maximising is value.

But there is a limit for every player and we have to stick to that. I'd rather lose him now than a Phillipou or a Wilson over the next few years.

What was the limit for Aleer?
Poor man's Dawson at best!

 

[bird_man]

No. No reports on our money.

But you could make a fairly accurate assumption that it did.. otherwise why offer the 4 years when the issue was money?

No idea, why offer him the two years at 500k to start with?

That to me seems like you are telling the guy to go and look at his options.

 

[The Again Redemption]

I’d argue that if anyone is throwing a 5 year 800k+ deal at him. That it’s fair to ask for a first round pick.

That’s the ball park apparently for both Cmac and Flanders. Why wouldn’t windy also get the same return? All these players have issues with their games.

With an increasing salary cap, 800k annualised in 2025 won’t be wort

I’d argue that if anyone is throwing a 5 year 800k+ deal at him. That it’s fair to ask for a first round pick.

That’s the ball park apparently for both Cmac and Flanders. Why wouldn’t windy also get the same return? All these players have issues with their games.

Fair point there

My logic is that 800k in 2027 becomes more normalised as the cap increases. That being stated, the trade will occur in 2025 so my logic is a little flawed.

 

[Diehard Saint]

That's the point. Half backs are easily to replace. Wingers can be replaced. Quality taggers aren't

Now go and find someone that can do all of those and tell me he's easily replaceable.

You think his ambition is to be a career tagger?

 

[g_TRAIN]

The top teams don’t utilise taggers. So I wouldn’t be advocating spending huge money to retain one

Do you really think he's just a tagger?

Mullin is a tagger, he plays for Geelong, he doesn't win any ball himself or provide anything other than locking down an opponent.

Windy even if we never play him in a tagging role again is still a really good player of value to us in his own right.

 

[gubby88]

whole lot of bed wetting going on this morning

 

[ThomasR]

windy has polled coaches votes 12 times. the only players younger than him who have done it more are horne-francis, will ashcroft and sheezel.

for context cmac has done it once, phillipou twice.

if he walks, all the culture-building rhetoric is just lip service. must find a way to keep him

 

[SaintsofSteel]

So now he wasn’t used properly?


And I stand by my Battle argument. Tauru looks absolutely elite. If the net outcome of that Battle scenario is Tauru and JSOS for Battle, how can you argue it’s a loss?



I’ll answer these 2 in one.

A few weeks back I said the rumour was that Windy was asking for north of 850k to stay.

The next gettable Twomey said that Norths offer is something like 800/5.

It’s then been reported we came to the table and moved from 2 years to 4.

It’s also been reported that there are about 5-6 clubs all chasing Windhager. So not only is the player in demand, he has a massive offer in dollars and years.

If Flanders and Cmac are apparently first round picks. That’s the ball park I see Windys trade price being set at.

Blaming rumours and Twomey are just another way of hiding behind who you are paid by.

We wont attract both Flanders and/or CMac and I would still rather Windy over both those options. If the club think they are an upgrade they will be proven very wrong. In any event Flanders will be asking for the similiar money to come down, he wouldnt walk out on his GCS contract otherwise. I just dont see how losing Windy for Flanders or CMac as a list upgrade.

 

[pluggeranddoc]

Misson doesnt hand out contracts

No but the kitchen cabinet of he and Lyon make juudgements like Luke Ball couldn't play more than six minutes at a time and list management acts accordingly!

Misson doesnt hand out contracts

 

[JimmyR20]

windy has polled coaches votes 12 times. the only players younger than him who have done it more are horne-francis, will ashcroft and sheezel.

for context cmac has done it once, phillipou twice.

if he walks, all the culture-building rhetoric is just lip service. must find a way to keep him

Don't think anyone wants him to walk, including the club.

That said- if he does it doesn't say anything about the culture.

 

[pluggeranddoc]

No idea, why offer him the two years at 500k to start with?

That to me seems like you are telling the guy to go and look at his options.

Sounds very much like initial offer to Battle.

 

[joop]

Do you really think he's just a tagger?

Mullin is a tagger, he plays for Geelong, he doesn't win any ball himself or provide anything other than locking down and opponent.

Windy even if we never play him in a tagging role again is still a really good player of value to us in his own right.

Is Mullin on 800k a year?

 

[Anythings_sipposible]

I love Windy, but we've got a lot of similar types to him in our best 23 in Garcia, Boxshall, Macrae and Steele, and like those guys, he doesn't really have a solid secondary outside of defensive mid.
I think something has to give out of that lot, as realistically they should all be playing, but it makes our team too one paced. Many thought Steele would be the one to go, but maybe the club is willing to part with Windy.
If he turns into Flanders or CMac I think that is a net positive, as CMac is a bit different to the above guys (thought less exposed form that Windy so inherently more risky), and Flanders has shown to be able to play a second position to a very high standard

 

[LennyHayes77]

Yup
People can say what they like we missed one there
I genuinely loved his draft vids imagine him in our side right now ???

So did a dozen other clubs. Trav will be a good player, just a different one to Reid who is likely to be a star.

As for Windy, we need to keep him. He's a heart and soul type player that keeps the culture moving forward. Also you don't want to lose players coming into their prime for players who are coming out of their prime but that's just me.

 

[luca77]

If the club is content with letting players walk to the PSD, might the Windhager "deal" be left til the very end of trade period, so we know who else is coming in?

If we land a mid or two (Flanders/CMac or a young quality mid ready to play), that squeezes Hugo out of a lot of best 22s. So in that case Windy->Hugo isn't the end of the world. And we can farewell Marcus.

If we don't land anyone, we can up Windy's offer to roughly match whoever is after him, and he gets to stay with his mates at a club with a coach.

If he insists on leaving in the meantime, and we end up not landing any other mids, that would be the worst case scenario, but Hugo/Jpou/Fincher/Hall/Wilson/Boxshall would be given more chance to step up as mids, so oh well.

I would've thought his connection with Owens and Nas would've had him keen to stick around, but if not so be it.

 

[pluggeranddoc]

It's so $%&#ing annoying as well if he does leave because the media narrative will turn from destination club to St Kilda causes player unrest with case splash.

How could you argue against that narrative

 

[g_TRAIN]

Is Mullin on 800k a year?

I'm not debating his monetary worth just that he is a valuable player. More than just a tagger and potentially a gun in his own right. 800k may be close to the mark for someone like him but its probably 100-150k overs

But even so we don't know what the clubs offer to Windy is nor what he willing accept. We don't have a clue.

The Media were reporting we offered NAS 1.4m before he signed for 2m.

 

[stavro#4]

With an increasing salary cap, 800k annualised in 2025 won’t be wort

Fair point there

My logic is that 800k in 2027 becomes more normalised as the cap increases. That being stated, the trade will occur in 2025 so my logic is a little flawed.

Don’t you reckon they have told Windhager that from 2028 and onwards he could earn more if he takes his performances to another level?

Maybe I’m a nuffie. But would expect that’s the basis for any of these convos with him.

Blaming rumours and Twomey are just another way of hiding behind who you are paid by.

We wont attract both Flanders and/or CMac and I would still rather Windy over both those options. If the club think they are an upgrade they will be proven very wrong. In any event Flanders will be asking for the similiar money to come down, he wouldnt walk out on his GCS contract otherwise. I just dont see how losing Windy for Flanders or CMac as a list upgrade.

I know who I’m paid by and it’s not a sporting organisation

Would be a pretty cool gig to be paid by the saints to break some news under the guise of a rumour every month.

But if that’s your logic that underpins the rest of the stuff you are saying. Then I think you need to revisit what the actual issue is here.