Past #22: Todd Goldstein - has advised NMFC he will seek opportunity at Essendon in '24 - 316 NM games/156 goals/'15 SBM/'15 AA/most hitouts in lge history

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ozzyoslo said:
Now if we took the route and used Hawthorn and Sydney philosophy where they use average non high salary paying ruckmen and used the extra coin on getting some decent quality midfielders and investing in our future forward structure we would not in this situation.
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Came for the thread title. Lol.

Sydney's #1 ruck is Tippett (when not injured) - what world do you live in where he's not considered high salary. Maybe he was at Adelaide (the portion of it they chose to list on the books anyway)
 
DarwinRoo said:
He hasn't been rubbish at all. Come back with facts or take a hike.
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That's the thing - as a ruckman he's going pretty well. You're absolutely right on that front.

His game performance and numbers are consistent with your average big lumbering ruckman with no mobility. Everyone craps on about Max Gawn but even his season best of 63 hit outs (against Goldy) was surpassed by Goldy's 65 against West Coast. That doesn't happen by accident. And he's certainly not to blame for our mids just letting their mids rove his taps and wander off with the footy as easy as you like.

Where he has dropped off across the board is away from the ruck contests - he's well down in the last 6 weeks on goals, marks, contested marks, marks inside 50, inside 50s, rebound 50s - basically all the things that elevated him above all the other ruckman because unlike them he could run and spread and get to both ends of the grounds and to ruck contests. It was this, on top of the great ruck work, that was making him the most dangerous player in the comp until he got hurt.

In 2015 and up to round 9, no matter what the scoreboard said we were always a chance at 3 quarter time because the oppo ruckman or ruckmen were completely rooted, and knew Goldy was about to work them over for 30 minutes. His last quarters have been huge. The best example of that was the round 1 game against Adelaide. No one in their wildest dreams could imagine him putting on a clinic like that at the moment.

Since round 9 - when he clearly got hurt against Carlton - the opposition has worked out that while he's got enough mobility to contest the ruck (ie bugger all) and win it most of the time because he's still the best ruckman out there, the injury he's carrying means he just can't get around the ground and can't work them over through his enormous work rate. In fact they've gradually worked out how to work him over - basically do a Goldy on him. That hurts us as a team because we put so many eggs in the Goldy basket.

All of which is fine if we adjust the way we set up to account for Goldy's limited mobility and play accordingly, like all the teams with s**t truck ruckmen do (or try to do). But we're not doing that, we're just going back to the pre-injury Goldy well and hoping he'll produce a miracle. Or we bite the bullet and don't play him until he's injury free (which might well be 2017). But we can't keep approaching him and his injured body the way we are currently cos it's not working and oppositions are exploiting it.
 
astrovic said:
That's the thing - as a ruckman he's going pretty well. You're absolutely right on that front.

His game performance and numbers are consistent with your average big lumbering ruckman with no mobility. Everyone craps on about Max Gawn but even his season best of 63 hit outs (against Goldy) was surpassed by Goldy's 65 against West Coast. That doesn't happen by accident. And he's certainly not to blame for our mids just letting their mids rove his taps and wander off with the footy as easy as you like.

Where he has dropped off across the board is away from the ruck contests - he's well down in the last 6 weeks on goals, marks, contested marks, marks inside 50, inside 50s, rebound 50s - basically all the things that elevated him above all the other ruckman because unlike them he could run and spread and get to both ends of the grounds and to ruck contests. It was this, on top of the great ruck work, that was making him the most dangerous player in the comp until he got hurt.

In 2015 and up to round 9, no matter what the scoreboard said we were always a chance at 3 quarter time because the oppo ruckman or ruckmen were completely rooted, and knew Goldy was about to work them over for 30 minutes. His last quarters have been huge. The best example of that was the round 1 game against Adelaide. No one in their wildest dreams could imagine him putting on a clinic like that at the moment.

Since round 9 - when he clearly got hurt against Carlton - the opposition has worked out that while he's got enough mobility to contest the ruck (ie bugger all) and win it most of the time because he's still the best ruckman out there, the injury he's carrying means he just can't get around the ground and can't work them over through his enormous work rate. In fact they've gradually worked out how to work him over - basically do a Goldy on him. That hurts us as a team because we put so many eggs in the Goldy basket.

All of which is fine if we adjust the way we set up to account for Goldy's limited mobility and play accordingly, like all the teams with s**t truck ruckmen do (or try to do). But we're not doing that, we're just going back to the pre-injury Goldy well and hoping he'll produce a miracle. Or we bite the bullet and don't play him until he's injury free (which might well be 2017). But we can't keep approaching him and his injured body the way we are currently cos it's not working and oppositions are exploiting it.
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Maybe because brad keeps drumming it into the players/media that "Goldy is 100% fine"

Even the players are forced are to believe it
 

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sthmelb_dimmies said:
Came for the thread title. Lol.

Sydney's #1 ruck is Tippett (when not injured) - what world do you live in where he's not considered high salary. Maybe he was at Adelaide (the portion of it they chose to list on the books anyway)
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The world that Ozzy lives in is one of denial of Goldy's worth. Have a look at his sig and marvel at how a North supporter can keep that there for almost two years despite one of those being a Goldy AA year.
 
Horizons_00 said:
Maybe because brad keeps drumming it into the players/media that "Goldy is 100% fine"

Even the players are forced are to believe it
Click to expand...

I think that's a bit unlikely TBH. The relationship between what is said to the media and what is said behind closed doors is usually pretty slim.
 
sthmelb_dimmies said:
Came for the thread title. Lol.

Sydney's #1 ruck is Tippett (when not injured) - what world do you live in where he's not considered high salary. Maybe he was at Adelaide (the portion of it they chose to list on the books anyway)
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What world do you live in when he was draft to play your main forward until Buddy wanted to flee the Hawthorn nest ?? You forgot the trials the tribulation of Tippett trying to find a spot up forward until they used him as a last resort as your Ruck.......only because you needed to show you were getting value for your cola dollars.

You also forget that you lost a premium paid ruckman (Mumford) when prioritising a premium forward (Buddy).

Technically you're right with Tippet, but we all know here that due to the unusual events in Buddy coming to the Swans.........youre really wrong, when Tippet was drafted as a key forward who now plays majority minutes as a ruck. This is exactly what Hawthorn did when they drafted David Hale from us. And we paid half is salary for the majority of his time with them.

What I'm all about is not paying overs for your ruckman in relation to dealing with playing list. Majority of the budget should go to the spine of the club and a quality midfield. ( grunt and polish alike )
 
astrovic said:
I think that's a bit unlikely TBH. The relationship between what is said to the media and what is said behind closed doors is usually pretty slim.
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Good point. Why is North choosing to lie (too strong of a word maybe) or mislead the fans on our injuries this year

Is it to keep Saunders Job maybe? It's just all a bit too secretative. We will never know, but the likes of Goldy and cunners etc probably won't get better and might need surgery at the end of 2017 so it's eventually going to come out and questions will be asked of the fitness staff/coaches on "why" this was allowed to happen

And people that are questioning whether he's injured or not lol

North - gone to number one clearance team in the comp (flying)

Goldy gets injured and ever since

North - dropped to number 16th clearance team in the comp (can't win)

If that's not enough proof...
 
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ozzyoslo said:
What world do you live in when he was draft to play your main forward until Buddy wanted to flee the Hawthorn nest ?? You forgot the trials the tribulation of Tippett trying to find a spot up forward until they used him as a last resort as your Ruck.......only because you needed to show you were getting value for your cola dollars.

You also forget that you lost a premium paid ruckman (Mumford) when prioritising a premium forward (Buddy).

Technically you're right with Tippet, but we all know here that due to the unusual events in Buddy coming to the Swans.........youre really wrong, when Tippet was drafted as a key forward who now plays majority minutes as a ruck. This is exactly what Hawthorn did when they drafted David Hale from us. And we paid half is salary for the majority of his time with them.

What I'm all about is not paying overs for your ruckman in relation to dealing with playing list. Majority of the budget should go to the spine of the club and a quality midfield. ( grunt and polish alike )
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YIKES
 
LuvtheKangas said:
The world that Ozzy lives in is one of denial of Goldy's worth. Have a look at his sig and marvel at how a North supporter can keep that there for almost two years despite one of those being a Goldy AA year.
Click to expand...

The signature is a quote from a Wayne Carey article ( I challenge you to find it and say its not ) ........highlighting an opinion that he needed to do more on the park other than jumping and contesting ruck contests........and if you've listen to interviews in the past he has stated this. Its amazing that when he actually started to dominate around the park in taking marks he actually wins an All Australian accolade.

And now because he wins an AA you want me to take it down because it show lack of respect to the player??
May I suggest you to take another read on many peoples thoughts on Drew Petrie........in wishing him to retire asap. A 300 game player ffs !! a player who served the club after the mess this club was in after the Carey fiasco, the relocation talk years and was there for the rebuild after Laidley left.

Like i said before I don't frap over Goldstein like many do here.......on a forum it isn't a crime.
 
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ozzyoslo said:
The signature is a quote from a Wayne Carey article ( I challenge you to find it and say its not ) ........highlighting an opinion that he needed to do more on the park other than jumping and contesting ruck contests........and if you've listen to interviews in the past he has stated this. Its amazing that when he actually started to dominate around the park in taking marks he actually wins an All Australian accolade.

And now because he wins an AA you want me to take it down because it show lack of respect to the player??
May I suggest you to take another read on many peoples thoughts on Drew Petrie........in wishing him to retire asap. A 300 game player ffs !! a player who served the club after the mess this club was in after the Carey fiasco, the relocation talk years and was there for the rebuild after Laidley left.

Like i said before I don't frap over Goldstein like many do here.......on a forum it isn't a crime.
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Mate, you've explained the back-story before and I already knew where the quote came from.

I've already explained that's it's farcical that you retain it given how much has changed since.

In that spirit, I should change my sig to "Australia: winner of the Ashes". That also conveniently ignores 2015.
 

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hilly said:
lol at posters holding grudges at players.

I think Brad McKenzie won't make it. If he starts playing well, I will change my signature for the next ten years.
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I hope you're not thinking that I hold a grudge against the player........when he plays well, give the player the kudos he deserves. The signature sits there to piss off those who are offended to have the right to have an opinion on a forum website. Even though it goes against the grain of opinion.
 
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" - John Maynard Keynes
 
sthmelb_dimmies said:
Came for the thread title. Lol.
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It's quality work. Kudos to the author.

Oh, how the mighty appendages have fallen.

I even long for the days when he was packing a mere 6000.

 
astrovic said:
That's the thing - as a ruckman he's going pretty well. You're absolutely right on that front.

His game performance and numbers are consistent with your average big lumbering ruckman with no mobility. Everyone craps on about Max Gawn but even his season best of 63 hit outs (against Goldy) was surpassed by Goldy's 65 against West Coast. That doesn't happen by accident. And he's certainly not to blame for our mids just letting their mids rove his taps and wander off with the footy as easy as you like.

Where he has dropped off across the board is away from the ruck contests - he's well down in the last 6 weeks on goals, marks, contested marks, marks inside 50, inside 50s, rebound 50s - basically all the things that elevated him above all the other ruckman because unlike them he could run and spread and get to both ends of the grounds and to ruck contests. It was this, on top of the great ruck work, that was making him the most dangerous player in the comp until he got hurt.

In 2015 and up to round 9, no matter what the scoreboard said we were always a chance at 3 quarter time because the oppo ruckman or ruckmen were completely rooted, and knew Goldy was about to work them over for 30 minutes. His last quarters have been huge. The best example of that was the round 1 game against Adelaide. No one in their wildest dreams could imagine him putting on a clinic like that at the moment.

Since round 9 - when he clearly got hurt against Carlton - the opposition has worked out that while he's got enough mobility to contest the ruck (ie bugger all) and win it most of the time because he's still the best ruckman out there, the injury he's carrying means he just can't get around the ground and can't work them over through his enormous work rate. In fact they've gradually worked out how to work him over - basically do a Goldy on him. That hurts us as a team because we put so many eggs in the Goldy basket.

All of which is fine if we adjust the way we set up to account for Goldy's limited mobility and play accordingly, like all the teams with s**t truck ruckmen do (or try to do). But we're not doing that, we're just going back to the pre-injury Goldy well and hoping he'll produce a miracle. Or we bite the bullet and don't play him until he's injury free (which might well be 2017). But we can't keep approaching him and his injured body the way we are currently cos it's not working and oppositions are exploiting it.
Click to expand...

Quality post :thumbsu:

I think him not being 100% is really hurting his confidence too. Watching him ruck on Saturday night, he looked downtrodden and got sucked into Ports plan of jumping late and roving his tap. Add the Port players targeting him before the first bounce (and none of his mates standing up for him) and you can't blame the poor bloke.

I'd like to see Daw come in this week, and play Goldie as a forward in place of Drew. Get Goldies hands on the ball, kick a couple of goals and chop out the ruck if Daw plays a stinker.

That way, we get some confidence into Goldie and he get's a bit of a rest, while getting a game into Daw.
 
astrovic said:
That's the thing - as a ruckman he's going pretty well. You're absolutely right on that front.

His game performance and numbers are consistent with your average big lumbering ruckman with no mobility. Everyone craps on about Max Gawn but even his season best of 63 hit outs (against Goldy) was surpassed by Goldy's 65 against West Coast. That doesn't happen by accident. And he's certainly not to blame for our mids just letting their mids rove his taps and wander off with the footy as easy as you like.

Where he has dropped off across the board is away from the ruck contests - he's well down in the last 6 weeks on goals, marks, contested marks, marks inside 50, inside 50s, rebound 50s - basically all the things that elevated him above all the other ruckman because unlike them he could run and spread and get to both ends of the grounds and to ruck contests. It was this, on top of the great ruck work, that was making him the most dangerous player in the comp until he got hurt.

In 2015 and up to round 9, no matter what the scoreboard said we were always a chance at 3 quarter time because the oppo ruckman or ruckmen were completely rooted, and knew Goldy was about to work them over for 30 minutes. His last quarters have been huge. The best example of that was the round 1 game against Adelaide. No one in their wildest dreams could imagine him putting on a clinic like that at the moment.

Since round 9 - when he clearly got hurt against Carlton - the opposition has worked out that while he's got enough mobility to contest the ruck (ie bugger all) and win it most of the time because he's still the best ruckman out there, the injury he's carrying means he just can't get around the ground and can't work them over through his enormous work rate. In fact they've gradually worked out how to work him over - basically do a Goldy on him. That hurts us as a team because we put so many eggs in the Goldy basket.

All of which is fine if we adjust the way we set up to account for Goldy's limited mobility and play accordingly, like all the teams with s**t truck ruckmen do (or try to do). But we're not doing that, we're just going back to the pre-injury Goldy well and hoping he'll produce a miracle. Or we bite the bullet and don't play him until he's injury free (which might well be 2017). But we can't keep approaching him and his injured body the way we are currently cos it's not working and oppositions are exploiting it.
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Damn straight.

Ruck it. Just open the Daw and give Goldy's many members a rest.
 
Goldy form reversal 'just around the corner'
Nick Bowen
July 20, 2016 12:48 PM

455663-tlsnewsportrait.jpg

Todd Goldstein's form has tapered off after a good start to the season

A RETURN to form from All Australian ruckman Todd Goldstein is "just around the corner", North Melbourne coach Brad Scott says.

Goldstein started 2016 in a similar vein of form to last season, when he was named the competition's best ruckman.

However, the big Roo has struggled for form since copping a knock to the knee against the Sydney Swans in round 10, and last round lowered his colours to fill-in Port Adelaide ruckman Jackson Trengove.

Scott told reporters on Wednesday he believed Goldstein would rediscover his best form quickly.

"He's an All Australian ruckman, isn't he? He's held to a higher account than most, as he should be," Scott said.

"No one is more disappointed with poor performances individually than Goldy, (but) look his best form is just around the corner.

"Our job as coaches and my job as senior coach is to help him with that. So that's my focus.

"It's probably everyone else in the footy community's job to judge players and critique them where necessary.

"My job is just to make sure that I provide the best circumstances for him to play well and I'm really confident we've done that this week."

Asked about Goldstein's fitness, Scott said the ruckman was "fine" and had been training fully.

The Roos coach said Daniel Wells (calf) and Jarrad Waite (hip) had pulled up well after returning from injury against Port Adelaide last Saturday, and would be fit to play in the crucial clash against Collingwood at Etihad Stadium on Friday night.

Scott also quickly quashed any suggestion out-of-form spearhead Drew Petrie would be dropped for Friday night's game, declaring simply: "He'll play."

North has gone from two games clear on top of the ladder after its 9-0 start to the season to eighth after losing six of its past seven games, including the past five.

The Roos' spot in the finals is suddenly in some doubt after their loss to Port Adelaide last Saturday, a defeat that allowed the Power and St Kilda to climb within two wins of the top eight.

Scott said North had to address some areas of its game that had dropped off since its 9-0 start, including its kicking efficiency.

Scott did not go into any more detail about those problem areas, but said they were "completely within our control" and could be rectified soon.

"We've just got to be aware that in times in this really tough industry you come across some inclement weather, but the weather always clears and we've got to make sure that our response to that inclement weather is really solid and we stay the course," he said.

"Because the worst thing we could do now is panic and set ourselves off course, when I'm really confident we can get back on course."

:rolleyes::rolleyes:
 
Horizons_00 said:
Goldy form reversal 'just around the corner'
Nick Bowen
July 20, 2016 12:48 PM

455663-tlsnewsportrait.jpg

Todd Goldstein's form has tapered off after a good start to the season

A RETURN to form from All Australian ruckman Todd Goldstein is "just around the corner", North Melbourne coach Brad Scott says.

Goldstein started 2016 in a similar vein of form to last season, when he was named the competition's best ruckman.

However, the big Roo has struggled for form since copping a knock to the knee against the Sydney Swans in round 10, and last round lowered his colours to fill-in Port Adelaide ruckman Jackson Trengove.

Scott told reporters on Wednesday he believed Goldstein would rediscover his best form quickly.

"He's an All Australian ruckman, isn't he? He's held to a higher account than most, as he should be," Scott said.

"No one is more disappointed with poor performances individually than Goldy, (but) look his best form is just around the corner.

"Our job as coaches and my job as senior coach is to help him with that. So that's my focus.

"It's probably everyone else in the footy community's job to judge players and critique them where necessary.

"My job is just to make sure that I provide the best circumstances for him to play well and I'm really confident we've done that this week."

Asked about Goldstein's fitness, Scott said the ruckman was "fine" and had been training fully.

The Roos coach said Daniel Wells (calf) and Jarrad Waite (hip) had pulled up well after returning from injury against Port Adelaide last Saturday, and would be fit to play in the crucial clash against Collingwood at Etihad Stadium on Friday night.

Scott also quickly quashed any suggestion out-of-form spearhead Drew Petrie would be dropped for Friday night's game, declaring simply: "He'll play."

North has gone from two games clear on top of the ladder after its 9-0 start to the season to eighth after losing six of its past seven games, including the past five.

The Roos' spot in the finals is suddenly in some doubt after their loss to Port Adelaide last Saturday, a defeat that allowed the Power and St Kilda to climb within two wins of the top eight.

Scott said North had to address some areas of its game that had dropped off since its 9-0 start, including its kicking efficiency.

Scott did not go into any more detail about those problem areas, but said they were "completely within our control" and could be rectified soon.

"We've just got to be aware that in times in this really tough industry you come across some inclement weather, but the weather always clears and we've got to make sure that our response to that inclement weather is really solid and we stay the course," he said.

"Because the worst thing we could do now is panic and set ourselves off course, when I'm really confident we can get back on course."

:rolleyes::rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Wishful thinking of the highest order
 
Horizons_00 said:
Goldy form reversal 'just around the corner'
Nick Bowen
July 20, 2016 12:48 PM

455663-tlsnewsportrait.jpg

Todd Goldstein's form has tapered off after a good start to the season

A RETURN to form from All Australian ruckman Todd Goldstein is "just around the corner", North Melbourne coach Brad Scott says.

Goldstein started 2016 in a similar vein of form to last season, when he was named the competition's best ruckman.

However, the big Roo has struggled for form since copping a knock to the knee against the Sydney Swans in round 10, and last round lowered his colours to fill-in Port Adelaide ruckman Jackson Trengove.

Scott told reporters on Wednesday he believed Goldstein would rediscover his best form quickly.

"He's an All Australian ruckman, isn't he? He's held to a higher account than most, as he should be," Scott said.

"No one is more disappointed with poor performances individually than Goldy, (but) look his best form is just around the corner.

"Our job as coaches and my job as senior coach is to help him with that. So that's my focus.

"It's probably everyone else in the footy community's job to judge players and critique them where necessary.

"My job is just to make sure that I provide the best circumstances for him to play well and I'm really confident we've done that this week."

Asked about Goldstein's fitness, Scott said the ruckman was "fine" and had been training fully.

The Roos coach said Daniel Wells (calf) and Jarrad Waite (hip) had pulled up well after returning from injury against Port Adelaide last Saturday, and would be fit to play in the crucial clash against Collingwood at Etihad Stadium on Friday night.

Scott also quickly quashed any suggestion out-of-form spearhead Drew Petrie would be dropped for Friday night's game, declaring simply: "He'll play."

North has gone from two games clear on top of the ladder after its 9-0 start to the season to eighth after losing six of its past seven games, including the past five.

The Roos' spot in the finals is suddenly in some doubt after their loss to Port Adelaide last Saturday, a defeat that allowed the Power and St Kilda to climb within two wins of the top eight.

Scott said North had to address some areas of its game that had dropped off since its 9-0 start, including its kicking efficiency.

Scott did not go into any more detail about those problem areas, but said they were "completely within our control" and could be rectified soon.

"We've just got to be aware that in times in this really tough industry you come across some inclement weather, but the weather always clears and we've got to make sure that our response to that inclement weather is really solid and we stay the course," he said.

"Because the worst thing we could do now is panic and set ourselves off course, when I'm really confident we can get back on course."

:rolleyes::rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Deny Rinse Repeat. Can't stand the bloke any more.
If we get rolled by same set up, lack of imagination, tripe we've been serving up, the HUGE black mark against his name. Won't be at North next year.
 
Horizons_00 said:
Goldy form reversal 'just around the corner'
Nick Bowen
July 20, 2016 12:48 PM

455663-tlsnewsportrait.jpg

Todd Goldstein's form has tapered off after a good start to the season

A RETURN to form from All Australian ruckman Todd Goldstein is "just around the corner", North Melbourne coach Brad Scott says.

Goldstein started 2016 in a similar vein of form to last season, when he was named the competition's best ruckman.

However, the big Roo has struggled for form since copping a knock to the knee against the Sydney Swans in round 10, and last round lowered his colours to fill-in Port Adelaide ruckman Jackson Trengove.

Scott told reporters on Wednesday he believed Goldstein would rediscover his best form quickly.

"He's an All Australian ruckman, isn't he? He's held to a higher account than most, as he should be," Scott said.

"No one is more disappointed with poor performances individually than Goldy, (but) look his best form is just around the corner.

"Our job as coaches and my job as senior coach is to help him with that. So that's my focus.

"It's probably everyone else in the footy community's job to judge players and critique them where necessary.

"My job is just to make sure that I provide the best circumstances for him to play well and I'm really confident we've done that this week."

Asked about Goldstein's fitness, Scott said the ruckman was "fine" and had been training fully.

The Roos coach said Daniel Wells (calf) and Jarrad Waite (hip) had pulled up well after returning from injury against Port Adelaide last Saturday, and would be fit to play in the crucial clash against Collingwood at Etihad Stadium on Friday night.

Scott also quickly quashed any suggestion out-of-form spearhead Drew Petrie would be dropped for Friday night's game, declaring simply: "He'll play."

North has gone from two games clear on top of the ladder after its 9-0 start to the season to eighth after losing six of its past seven games, including the past five.

The Roos' spot in the finals is suddenly in some doubt after their loss to Port Adelaide last Saturday, a defeat that allowed the Power and St Kilda to climb within two wins of the top eight.

Scott said North had to address some areas of its game that had dropped off since its 9-0 start, including its kicking efficiency.

Scott did not go into any more detail about those problem areas, but said they were "completely within our control" and could be rectified soon.

"We've just got to be aware that in times in this really tough industry you come across some inclement weather, but the weather always clears and we've got to make sure that our response to that inclement weather is really solid and we stay the course," he said.

"Because the worst thing we could do now is panic and set ourselves off course, when I'm really confident we can get back on course."

:rolleyes::rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Starting to sound a lot like Hardwick
 
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