Past #26: Tarryn Thomas [Part II] - will honor his contract and play on at NMFC in 2024, so says the reality TV manager

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The Filth Wizard said:
Time to steer this thread back towards Thomas.
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Kimbo said:
I've seen many discussions about racism on BigFooty over the years and, while I hate 'thread derailments', unless you create a separate thread to discuss it specifically, it usually arises in a context. Sorry The Filth Wizard. In this case, the question of whether TT will be booed, then the link to Goodes and booing.

On the booing stuff... while I'm not a fan of booing, unless it's generally good-natured, if I was in attendance this weekend, I'd be sorely tempted to do so whenever JHF touches the ball. The perfect solution, of course, would be to deny someone like me that opportunity, by stopping him from touching the ball. If I did, however, I'd probably be in the 'herd mentality' category I suspect. Or being a Kangaroo supporter, the mob mentality. Sigh... I wouldn't do it.

On the racism stuff... I'm using your comments, Roosurgence, as a springboard to comment as I think they represent a prevalent perspective which I think fails to adequately understand racism. It's not my intention to 'argue'. I get that you are well intentioned and I'm not calling you a racist. I get that you're largely wanting to defend people who haven't had a personal role in historical atrocities. Although I did have an Aboriginal partner, who did suggest once upon a time, that I might be (unintentionally) racist which was incredibly challenging to my well intentioned soul ego. It was a wake up call and ever since I've felt obliged to 'pay it forward'.

My perspective, by the way, comes primarily from this ex-partner - whose father was Murri and mother a white 'Anglo' Aussie - who was incredibly good at 'code switching' (between cultures) and at educating white fellas, like me, about subjects as sensitive as racism. I also worked at the Native Title Tribunal and conducted a review of their mediation practices, I worked at an Aboriginal NGO, and in these roles and in a consulting role, I have worked with many Aboriginal people as managers, colleagues and clients, and also from having an Aboriginal sister and brother... from another mother. With sanction and support from Aboriginal Elders, I've had the good fortune to facilitate Talking Circles with significant/predominantly Indigenous work groups and, in this environment, to hear some profound and moving 'truth telling' which will make you cry one minute, and laugh the next. (Most Aboriginal people I've met, are good at shifting between 'taking it seriously' and 'taking the piss' - being able to laugh loudly and often, including at themselves.) I've been taught by, challenged by and supported by Aboriginal people. Some have been bitter, but most have been very generous in spirit towards me as 'a new (4th or 5th generation) Australian'. ;) None of this makes me an 'expert' nor a spokesperson, but I hope it has given me some useful insights that many don't have the opportunity to experience, which I'd like to share with the goal of bridging the divide.

The main points I'd make are:

1. The way the word 'racism' gets used isn't necessarily the same.

My experience is that when Aboriginal people refer to something being racist, they are referring to experiences or events that can range from; the extremes of genocide; to deliberate, race-based persecution or abuse; to unconscious systemic discrimination; to name-calling; to personal comments that are demeaning or hurtful, all based on a failure to fully understand, appreciate and respect their personal, historical or cultural perspective, story and values (or even existence). In my experience Aboriginal people tend to use the term racism more broadly than a narrow focus and definition of conscious, intentional prejudice or persecution based on a view that someone is inferior, based on their race, which I think is how most non-Indigenous people define racism. Hence, racism becomes a very loaded term, but it can help to accept one's part, individually, culturally and even historically, if one recognises the broader meaning it holds for Indigenous Australians. I also think it allows room to accept that one might be 'innocent' but also racist or at least part of a racist system or country, if that makes sense?

2. Racism, as much as it may confuse, bother or upset others, is defined by the victim - or, if you prefer, the person experiencing it.

While I think it was clumsy, I think it was what Peter Jess was trying to say, when referring to 'perpetrators'. I think he meant those who perpetrate an action of some kind, even unintentionally, versus the legal connotations of the word. That is, a perpretrator isn't an (alleged) criminal in this context, merely not the victim or offended. It's the same with sexism. The implication is that, at the very least, when someone says they've experienced racism, this needs to be respectfully listened to, with an attempt to understand why, even if intention was different to what was experienced. Kennett's jeans comment to Cyril's partner is a good example. While he may have intended it in the way of an uncle gently ribbing someone, if he fails to see how it can be taken very differently by an Aboriginal person, or fail to listen when it gets pointed out, then he's compounding the initial offence, however unintentional that may have been. I have had, by the way, situations when things I've said or done were construed as racist and took the opportunity to explore perspectives, with good will emerging on the other side.

3. There is a collective responsibility (and opportunity).

I believe it's the same at a national level, with respect to Indigenous experiences and stories. If, when stories of racism are told on the national stage, and if these stories are ignored or downplayed, it amounts to a denial of their existence and/or of their significance, then it adds a (racist) insult to a (racist) injury, if that makes sense. It can range from how we portray the history of our a country - for example, dismissing the frontier wars as a (politically motivated minority) "black arm band version of history" - to allowing name calling (or booing, if it is experienced as racism) at an AFL match to go unchecked.

With respect to calling Australia 'racist', to my mind, we have to ask 'what is a country?' I'd argue that a country is its history and its culture, amongst other things. A culture is made up of a myriad of things, but is contained in symbols, stories and sense of identity. It's not about every single person. Whatever you think Australia "is", I'm sure it won't hold true for 100% of people. But we might, willingly or not, ascribe to the general sense of it, and it changes over time as experiences and narratives evolve. What I like about the Aboriginal story in recent years, is that we are, I think, finally coming to recognise and embrace Aboriginal history culture and stories as part of what it means to be Australian, for good and for bad, and we can't accept the good without accepting the bad. Ironically, this is all back to front to me. Aboriginal people were forced to accept newcomers and usurpers to their traditional lands, and to accept an invisible or inferior place in the minds of those newcomers. (Terra nullius.) I call it the Anglo-centric view of the world. The increased prevalence of welcomes to country, and the education surrounding them, and conversations these spawn, is an example of how we are evolving our knowledge and sense of who we are.

So what?

When racism, as interpreted and experienced by an Aboriginal person is pointed out, it is so often met with confusion, surprise, indignation and/or defensiveness instead of "Okay, so please let me understand why you experience it this way?", even if the 'perpetrator' doesn't see it this way, or didn't intend it. I don't think this happens, however, as, for the most part, no-one likes having their actions being referred to as racist, and by implication, that they themselves are seen as such. It can happen at an individual level, and at a societal level. We don't want to be seen as racist, individually or as a nation. Yet, from the micro (my ex-partner being called a 'black c**t' for having the temerity to walk down a public street past a construction site) to the macro (certain reactions to The Voice, land rights and sovereignty or any other relevant national policy issue), examples abound of stories of racism. We may not like it, but until we acknowledge that racism is, and continues in many ways, to be part of what Australia is, as experienced by it's Indigenous people, it can't move on, heal and fully celebrate the wonderful contribution of Aboriginal history, culture and identity has, and can have, in the life of our nation

/speech
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That was a great read mate, thank you.
 
I only caught the second half but imo he looked like he was going through the motions in the 3rd rather than him just being rusty. Then turned it on in the last like he got a rocket at 3qrt time. It was a little disconcerting.
 
speedy said:
I only caught the second half but imo he looked like he was going through the motions in the 3rd rather than him just being rusty. Then turned it on in the last like he got a rocket at 3qrt time. It was a little disconcerting.
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Of what I saw I didn’t think it was going through the motions as such, might have been blowing up a bit
 
The Filth Wizard said:
To me he looked like a guy that hadn't played in months and then started feeling the rhythm of the game later.
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Definitely appeared that way to me on reflection. He started in the midfield in the third and he was still very scratchy (though the conditions didn't help). It was really the start of the fourth, when things dried up, that he looked like the TT of old.
 
Temper expectations on TT for now.

Got nowhere it in the first half. Call it nerves or cobwebs but he seemed off the pace throughout and only came to light in the last which I’m not taking major notice of.

Needs a solid month in the 2’s and then we can re-evaluate where he’s at.
 
We hadn't all day till you brought it up again.
 

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ferball said:
It wasn't just a spear. He also threw hand grenades and a bucket of skunk poo.
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What about the thermonuclear warhead that he launched into the Carton supporters? No wonder they were so upset. The sheer audacity! 🤣


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LuvtheKangas said:
What's weird is one person coming into the thread to snipe everyone else for something that was no longer happening.
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'Snipe everyone else' don't talk like you're a collective hivemind with no agency. You know if you were talking about that inane s**t or not, if you get so riled up jumping at shadows over a post where one page removed was spiels about something that hasn't even happened yet and you're calling me weird and coming at me en masse?

Honestly with all due respect, * off.
 
Billy Not Really said:
'Snipe everyone else' don't talk like you're a collective hivemind with no agency. You know if you were talking about that inane s**t or not, if you get so riled up jumping at shadows over a post where one page removed was spiels about something that hasn't even happened yet and you're calling me weird and coming at me en masse?

Honestly with all due respect, * off.
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LOL.
 
Caracas said:
What about the thermonuclear warhead that he launched into the Carton supporters? No wonder they were so upset. The sheer audacity! 🤣


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I know. ... The humanity...
 
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