Adelaide's decline

[The Casey Cat]

I'd be pissed at Roo if I was one of those players he mentioned how much they were being paid in a public forum. It's no ones ****ing business how much I'm paid!

Yep. Acting like a sour, unprofessional flog here. But that's totally unsurprising to most of us and part of the reason for where the Crows currently are.

 

[Jcpdragonx]

I don’t think you quite realise how much the media has attacked the Crows over the last 3 years (some of it has been warranted but definitely not all). We cleared out a bunch of players last year so we could begin a rebuild, but they then get included in an argument about our poor culture? I can see why he’s sick of shit getting slung at the club.

He can keep copping it from all angles until change.

 

[Stevi_Tigers]

Massive sook by roo though it does bring up the question just how much cash are they overpaying some blokes

 

[Freomaniac]

Interesting point made on AFL360 tonight;
Roo reeled off all the players that the Crows didn't want to retain because it would have cost the club too much money.
Yet, they've been paying at 100% of the cap, meaning there a number of spuds on the Adelaide list clearly getting overpaid at the moment based on recent performance, given they haven't played finals in 3 years.

I didnt watch the show, who were the players he mentioned?

 

[Stevi_Tigers]

Lever 800-850k

McGovern over 800k

Keath getting over double the cash at the dogs compared to his crows deal

And they had a full salary cap no wonder crouch thinks he’s worth a million Jesus Tex must be on 1.5

 

[Rod Stroker]

I didnt watch the show, who were the players he mentioned?

Lever, McGovern, Keath, Cameron, Jenkins were the ones I heard..

 

[Duckimus Prime]

McGovern wanted out during 2017, but that’s a nice attempt at goal shifting from the least trustworthy player manager since Nixon. Even Richmond supporters are defending the Crows on Twitter, Colin Young is a grub of a bloke and loves a cheap headline.

Gov signed for less on the proviso that if Lever left, his contract would be renegotiated up to whatever he’s on at Carlton now. His form and fitness tapered (does this sound familiar Carlton fans?) and so we pulled that offer. He cracked the shits and left.

So the Crows reneged on their deal and you're claiming the McGovern 'cracked the shits'?

 

[AmericanCrow]

My opinion is the team could withstand (and actually thrived) the departure of Danger. One man, even a star player wasn't going to send us in a death spiral. However, the accumulation of departures and the failure to get better returns started the decline. Add in the natural injuries, age, and misses on draft selections and it begins to accelerate as we saw the last two seasons.

Now it is a team caught with aging vets past their prime on their last legs, young players that are not ready for prime time (and some may never pan out) and a middle group consisting of good players and just another guy players.

This is a horrific combination (and as a Browns fan, trust me, I am an expert in this field) that quickly allows a culture of losing to grab hold and infiltrate every nook and crany of an organization.

The only way to head off the dark times that are most assuredly coming is to draft extraordinarily well, develop the kids they have well and hope to find a few out of contract guys with some mileage in them wanting to play at the Oval.

Otherwise it will not be a fun few years.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Lever 800-850k

McGovern over 800k

Keath getting over double the cash at the dogs compared to his crows deal

And they had a full salary cap no wonder crouch thinks he’s worth a million Jesus Tex must be on 1.5

He's probably just lying. There's nothing Crows fans on here love more than inflating the salary of a player who leaves the Crows (or who goes to Port, incidentally) by 100-200k, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if their fearless leader would do the same.

 

[The Casey Cat]

He's probably just lying. There's nothing Crows fans on here love more than inflating the salary of a player who leaves the Crows (or who goes to Port, incidentally) by 100-200k, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if their fearless leader would do the same.

Thing is even if they're right it just turns the question back on them of how bloody much are they paying certain players that remain? On the last two years output their respective contracts are just as unreasonably large as all these players who apparently wished to leave for more.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Yeah the whole 'we couldn't afford to keep them argument' falls right into a hole when you consider the Gibbs recruitment. Any one of those blokes on that list would've been a much better use of their money than Bryce.

 

[iameviljez]

whose long running Dan dynasty is almost over

Going off-topic slightly, but given that his victory in 2018 gave new meaning to the term, "electoral landslide", I don't think he's going away any time soon.

 

[Gavin Excell]

''Instead Mitch chose to stay with the Crows for half the contract dollars and half the length of the contract time instead of going home to Perth.”

"The reasons Mitch left the Crows was because of the camp and the Adelaide football department and that's it.”

Real reason stars ditched Crows: Manager pins Adelaide exodus on THAT camp

Real reason stars ditched Crows: Manager pins Adelaide exodus on THAT camp

www.foxsports.com.au

That's quite black and white isnt it

Some players will look elsewhere for monetary reasons, but equally a lot will stay at their club if they are content. Money isn't the sole factor usually.

 

[iameviljez]

Thing is even if they're right it just turns the question back on them of how bloody much are they paying certain players that remain? On the last two years output their respective contracts are just as unreasonably large as all these players who apparently wished to leave for more.

Yeah - and beyond that, the money thing is just a ridiculous excuse, because... put it this way, it's not as it's just Adelaide's promising young players who are targeted by other clubs with large paychecks.

Every decent young player in the country - particularly those playing away from their home state - is going to be tapped up at some point as to whether they are "gettable". Almost every club has lost a player or two they didn't want to lose - be it Franklin, Ablett, Mitchell, (soon to be) Daniher, etc. But Adelaide is the only side I can think of that has had such an exodus of talent that doesn't stem from consistent on-field wooden spoonage.

 

[FrankDrebin]

I don't mind someone from a club and giving a forthright opinion (although you have to be prepared for the inevitable backlash, and at this current moment you'd think crows would be better off just copping the criticism and keeping quiet). However if Roo is going to be so honest and forthright he may also want to bring up the Bryce Gibbs trade and contract and see if he is also very "comfortable" with that but of business.

 

[SaltPeter]

Not a bad draft haul in those 3 years. Crows made the Prelim in 2012. Yes they got done for the Kurt tippet scandal that cost them 1st and 2nd round picks in the 2012 and 2013 drafts. Did it hurt the crows? to a small extent. But it wasnt a devastaing blow when you look back at it. Those 18 and 19 year olds in 2007 draft like Dangerfield and Walker were 22-23 year olds in 2012. Crows narrowly missed out of finals in 2013-14 then had a finals run from 2015-7 including a grand final in 2017.

Interesting that you don't think that 2 first round picks and second round picks, who'd around 24 or 25 now, didn't/doesn't have much affect on the list. The club also got nothing for Tippett, who in reality at the time was probably worth a first and second round pick.

It also doesn't take into account trading Bernie Vince so we could get back into the draft, eventually taking Matt Crouch with that pick. Nor does it take into account picking up Greenwood and Keath as Cat B rookies, developing them for a number of years and then trading them last year for sfa, with the club unwilling to match their requests for contracts extensions for both length and payment.

Personally, I think this is a storm that's been brewing for the 8 or 9 years.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I realise we aren’t the first club to cop it, but when the media are piling in over minor things like the Barossa training breach then you can understand Roo getting to the end of his patience. Our club seems to be blamed for any off field issue these days even when it doesn’t involve us. He probably should’ve just kept his mouth shut, but I also don’t blame him for saying it.

The Barossa training breach got exactly the coverage it deserved. A couple of days press , correct observations about how the Crows seem to think they are above the law, and that was it. This relatively minor incident on its own is indicative of a larger issue at the Crows. They were lucky that Ben Hart was the only person punished for that.

 

[iameviljez]

Interesting that you don't think that 2 first round picks and second round picks, who'd around 24 or 25 now, didn't/doesn't have much affect on the list. The club also got nothing for Tippett, who in reality at the time was probably worth a first and second round pick.

It also doesn't take into account trading Bernie Vince so we could get back into the draft, eventually taking Matt Crouch with that pick. Nor does it take into account picking up Greenwood and Keath as Cat B rookies, developing them for a number of years and then trading them last year for sfa, with the club unwilling to match their requests for contracts extensions for both length and payment.

No club apart from GWS (given how loaded-up they were) could withstand the talent drain the likes of which Adelaide has experienced. It's a testament to the recruitment and coaching that they have stayed as competitive as they have.

Losing the 1st and 2nd round picks was devastating and may have cost the club a flag in 2017.

 

[iameviljez]

The Barossa training breach got exactly the coverage it deserved. A couple of days press , correct observations about how the Crows seem to think they are above the law, and that was it. This relatively minor incident on its own is indicative of a larger issue at the Crows. They were lucky that Ben Hart was the only person punished for that.

Every time I see your username I'm still reminded of my favourite Timmy from Thomastown quote: "And then Dad found some Essendon supporters. Them Essendon scarves burn real good, don't they, Mr Leonard?"

 

[TheKITC]

I don't understand why Adelaide gets so defensive. McLeod questions the culture so they come out on the public push back against it. There is some questioning of list management, and Roo comes out firing against it.

It's ok to not be a successful club all the time and Adelaide isn't the first club to fall after a senior team got close to a flag. If they're going to come out firing every time anyone criticises them, they're going to get in an endless back and forth for no benefit.

Riccuito making the comments he did is absolute amateur hour at it's finest and another in a loooong line of these from Adelaide FC. It is so unprofessional it's almost beyond laughable and reeks of sour grapes/sooking. It's right up there with the bizarre and poorly thought out presser that Pyke and Burton did; what the hell is even the point? Just makes the club look so bad.

Riccuito seems like the kind of guy who thinks whacking back at every negative thing said about the Crows makes them come across as 'winners', a bit like posters on BF who won't let an argument go because they don't want to be seen to be 'losing'. It makes them look stupid, plain and simple.

The Crows 100% did not need this from an optics and media image POV. They have a horrid track record in the media and their public image is almost 0 at this point. Roo needs to go, don't see what value he is providing the club... at all.

I don’t think you quite realise how much the media has attacked the Crows over the last 3 years (some of it has been warranted but definitely not all). We cleared out a bunch of players last year so we could begin a rebuild, but they then get included in an argument about our poor culture? I can see why he’s sick of shit getting slung at the club.

Which players were used in that argument that you 'cleared out'? I see a lot of Crows supporters use this as 'nah we wanted them out, was our choice' as a way of exonerating the club from a culture point of view. Genuinely asking, not having a dig about which players fit into this category?

Lever - Required player, they would have wanted to keep
McGovern - Required player, they would have wanted to keep
Dangerfield - Required player, they would have wanted to keep
Gunston - Required player, they would have wanted to keep
Cameron - Required player, they would have wanted to keep
Keath - Required player, they would have wanted to keep
Betts - Debatable, but there is no doubt in anyone's mind that he wanted out...Because it might fit in with their sudden rebuild doesn't excuse culture issues
Jacobs - Debatable, he's been pretty quiet and may have wanted out more for opportunity factors
Greenwood - Debatable, he's been pretty quiet and may have wanted out more for opportunity/money factors. Was best 25 easily.
edit: Ellis-Yolman - Seemed required (25 games in two seasons) albeit fringe-ish and injury prone, 100% wanted out and criticised the club on the way out in terms of culture

When you look at players they actually did clear out like Henderson and Lyons (big mistakes), it paints a pretty bleak picture.

His form in discussing players contracts and form is simply unacceptable, there's no way around that for mine. Trying to use the 'more money' line actually paints Adelaide in a far worse light than he probably thinks; especially when you look at the players they have kept and using Walker as an example of someone who would have had to leave as if it's some glowing proof they did the right thing is just embarrassing. Roo is totally deluded and has a few mates at the club I reckon...

I don't think Adelaide have copped a raw deal at all from a criticism POV. They have had a diabolical past few years which was made even worse by all the attempted cover ups, denials and flat out lies. I'd be interested to hear what subjects you think that have got a raw deal on given the above...

 

[theyellowsash]

the team has been losing very high quality players almost yearly for a decade now. he blames it on being unable to fit them under the salary cap because theyre at the top of the ladder, but none of geelong, hawthorn, west coast, collingwood, stkilda, sydney, richmond have lost similarly high quality players so frequently. plus, the team has only been good for 2 of those years.

the issue unique to adelaide across the last decade has been cultural problems. matt rendell, kurt tippetts dodgy contract, the training camp, frequent outbursts at current and past players by captains and board members etc. even further back, the thing between mccloud and edwards was surely toxic, which makes his comments the other week strange.

even the most one eyed supporter must admit that the crows have had cultural issues.

 

[SaltPeter]

even the most one eyed supporter must admit that the crows have had cultural issues.

Looks like you've never spent much time on the Adelaide board

 

[FrankDrebin]

The club also got nothing for Tippett, who in reality at the time was probably worth a first and second round pick.

Not exactly. Crows used the money Tippett freed up to attract Eddie Betts, so that actually worked out quite well in the end (besides the draft pick penalty of course).

 

[SaltPeter]

Not exactly. Crows used the money Tippett freed up to attract Eddie Betts, so that actually worked out quite well in the end (besides the draft pick penalty of course).

Not sure Adelaide would've chased Betts if they had've received fair compensation for Tippett. Seriously, at that point in time Tippett was offered a long term deal at an estimated $800K. He was a good contested mark, could kick a goal and was competitive in the ruck.

Surely he was worth at least a first and second.

 

[1970crow]

They should be favorites for the spoon. Still the same old slow team from last year, now with significantly worse depth.

Our depth is fine, it’s the 22 that suck.