AFL standard?

[ImperialPurple]

1. Webster - no
2. JCarr - just
3. Schammer - no
4. Hasleby - yes
5. Dunn - no
6. Solomon - yes
7. Peake - no
8. McManus - shit no
9. MCarr - shit no
10. Palmer - yes
11. Des - just
12. Brock - jury out
13. Pratt - ?
14. Grover - just
15. Crowley - getting there
16. Mundy - just
17. MaJ - not any more
18. McPharlin - yes
19. Hinkley - ?
20. Tarrant - yes
21. Black - just
22. Thornton - shit no
23. Mayne - will be soon enough
24. Campbell - no
25. Dodd - just
26. Kepler - just
27. Gilmore - no
28. Murphy - no
29. Pav - yes
30. Drum - getting there
31. Sandi - getting there
32. Bell - yes
33. Farmer - just
34. Warnock - no
35. Ibbotson - getting there
36. Browne - no
37. MiJ - just
38. Smith - ?
39. Mourish - ?
40. Foster - jury out
41. Duffield - no
42. Head - no
43. Hayden - yes
44. Connelly - ?


Yes
Hasleby
Solomon
Palmer
McPharlin
Tarrant
Pav
Bell
Hayden

Getting there
Crowley
Mayne
Sandi
Drum
Ibbotson

Jury out - (but probably getting there)
Foster
Brock
Warnock

Jury out cos they're too young yet
Hinkley
Pratt
Connelly
Mourish
Smith

Just
JCarr
Des
Grover
Mundy
Black
Dodd
Farmer
MiJ

Not anymore
MaJ

No
Webster
Schammer
Dunn
Peake
Kepler
Campbell
Gilmore
Murphy
Browne
Duffield
Head
McManus
MCarr
Thornton



8 AFL standard players is pretty poor. There are others who are "almost" or "getting there", but if we are brutally honest - there are 8 AFL standard players at our club. Some serious development is needed of the young players, some of the "Just" players need to step up and improve BIG TIME, and guys like Kep and Schammer could very well move up with the correct management and own personal efforts. IMO.

 

[Cheetah]

Sandi is well and truely AFL standard?

 

[Bradesmaen]

No offence Ip, but you are over reacting to the loss. There are many AFL standard players that you have unfairly labelled due to hearsay more than anything.

 

[dominguez]

11. Des - just
20. Tarrant - yes

How many games do you think those two players have had that have been very good or better since Tarrant arrived? I'd say Dessie is winning 2 to 1.

The rest looks pretty good IP.

 

[Kenny_01]

Headland and Sandilands are easily AFL standard.

 

[ImperialPurple]

No offence Ip, but you are over reacting to the loss. There are many AFL standard players that you have unfairly labelled due to hearsay more than anything.

Such as?


Of course it is all personal opinion, but I'm comfortable enough to change my POV on Headland and Sandilands - but who else?

The reason I said Headland "just" is because there is still an element of inconsistency in his games. His best is easily good enough - but I just think we don't see it often enough. Same with Sandilands - but that's why I said "getting there" because he is now starting to string good games together more regularly.

Maybe Tarrant could go to the "just" list if Des is there... like Des his best is easily good enough, he's just not always consistent. However, I do think he is a very hard worker, always presenting an option, even when he's off.

 

[Borry]

1. Webster - no
2. JCarr - just
3. Schammer - no
4. Hasleby - yes
5. Dunn - no
6. Solomon - yes
7. Peake - no
8. McManus - shit no
9. MCarr - shit no
10. Palmer - yes
11. Des - just
12. Brock - jury out
13. Pratt - ?
14. Grover - just
15. Crowley - getting there
16. Mundy - just
17. MaJ - not any more
18. McPharlin - yes
19. Hinkley - ?
20. Tarrant - yes
21. Black - just
22. Thornton - shit no
23. Mayne - will be soon enough
24. Campbell - no
25. Dodd - just
26. Kepler - just
27. Gilmore - no
28. Murphy - no
29. Pav - yes
30. Drum - getting there
31. Sandi - getting there
32. Bell - yes
33. Farmer - just
34. Warnock - no
35. Ibbotson - getting there
36. Browne - no
37. MiJ - just
38. Smith - ?
39. Mourish - ?
40. Foster - jury out
41. Duffield - no
42. Head - no
43. Hayden - yes
44. Connelly - ?


Yes
Hasleby
Solomon
Palmer
McPharlin
Tarrant
Pav
Bell
Hayden

Getting there
Crowley
Mayne
Sandi
Drum
Ibbotson

Jury out - (but probably getting there)
Foster
Brock
Warnock

Jury out cos they're too young yet
Hinkley
Pratt
Connelly
Mourish
Smith

Just
JCarr
Des
Grover
Mundy
Black
Dodd
Farmer
MiJ
Headland
Kepler

Not anymore
MaJ

No
Webster
Schammer
Dunn
Peake
Campbell
Gilmore
Murphy
Browne
Duffield
Head
McManus
MCarr
Thornton



8 AFL standard players is pretty poor. There are others who are "almost" or "getting there", but if we are brutally honest - there are 8 AFL standard players at our club. Some serious development is needed of the young players, some of the "Just" players need to step up and improve BIG TIME, and guys like Kep and Schammer could very well move up with the correct management and own personal efforts. IMO.

Sandilands is AFL standard now. Otherwise Excellent assessment, have to hit home the truth.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Such as?


Of course it is all personal opinion, but I'm comfortable enough to change my POV on Headland and Sandilands - but who else?

The reason I said Headland "just" is because there is still an element of inconsistency in his games. His best is easily good enough - but I just think we don't see it often enough. Same with Sandilands - but that's why I said "getting there" because he is now starting to string good games together more regularly.

Maybe Tarrant could go to the "just" list if Des is there... like Des his best is easily good enough, he's just not always consistent. However, I do think he is a very hard worker, always presenting an option, even when he's off.

Mundy, Schammer, Dodd,Murphy.
You've put Mayne as "getting there" when at the moment for AFL standard I would put "no". Your list reaks of "we just got hammered"-itis. Something that seems typical in the majority of Freo supporters.. we take a bad loss and all of the sudden.. every head must roll. Disappointing loss yes... but we took some good steps today and people are forgetting that quite quickly.

 

[Chops_a_must]

You've put Mayne as "getting there" when at the moment for AFL standard I would put "no".

He's a first year player you tool.

 

[ImperialPurple]

Mundy, Schammer, Dodd,Murphy.
You've put Mayne as "getting there" when at the moment for AFL standard I would put "no". Your list reaks of "we just got hammered"-itis. Something that seems typical in the majority of Freo supporters.. we take a bad loss and all of the sudden.. every head must roll. Disappointing loss yes... but we took some good steps today and people are forgetting that quite quickly.

I don't disagree that I probably wouldn't have posted this if we won, but it is something I have been thinking of over the past month or so.

Seriously, we don't have more than 8-10 players who are true AFL standard.

Now I know a lot of water has gone under the bridge since 2002, but i remember hearing CC speak not far into the 2002 season, and at the time, his opinion was that we had 2 true AFL quality players on our list - Bell and Farmer.

He said then that there were others that were "getting there" or "close" (from memory he mentioned Pavlich and Hasleby, as well as JLo and Parker), but the harsh reality was that we had two AFL quality players playing at Freo.

So I got to thinking - who do we have now that is AFL quality; considering that we were looking better than 1-7 after 8 rounds back in 2002...

I reckon my list is pretty spot on if we are going to be brutally honest. Harsh, yes, but fair also. IMO of course.

There is no way Murphy is anywhere close to AFL standard - otherwise he'd be playing FF for freo instead of Sth Freo; Mundy is close but needs to improve certain aspects of his game, ditto Dodd, and Schammer does too many things wrong - although you can not fault the guys endeavour.

And you can't tell me that Chopper Mayne hasn't worked his way into best 22 contention after only 3 AFL games. He's definitely "getting there" - and quickly too I might add. It's a rare player indeed who is AFL quality in their first season - palmer is just a gem. One out of the box.

 

[dominguez]

Schammer has gone backwards. He looked a really good prospect in his first season but that was 5 years ago.

 

[Chops_a_must]

An easier question would be, "which of our players would get a game for most other teams?" Or even, which other clubs would have our players on their list?

 

[Pav for AA]

1. Webster - no
2. JCarr - just
3. Schammer - no
4. Hasleby - yes
5. Dunn - no
6. Solomon - yes
7. Peake - no
8. McManus - shit no
9. MCarr - shit no
10. Palmer - yes
11. Des - just
12. Brock - jury out
13. Pratt - ?
14. Grover - just
15. Crowley - getting there
16. Mundy - just
17. MaJ - not any more
18. McPharlin - yes
19. Hinkley - ?
20. Tarrant - yes
21. Black - just
22. Thornton - shit no
23. Mayne - will be soon enough
24. Campbell - no
25. Dodd - just
26. Kepler - just
27. Gilmore - no
28. Murphy - no
29. Pav - yes
30. Drum - getting there
31. Sandi - getting there
32. Bell - yes
33. Farmer - just
34. Warnock - no
35. Ibbotson - getting there
36. Browne - no
37. MiJ - just
38. Smith - ?
39. Mourish - ?
40. Foster - jury out
41. Duffield - no
42. Head - no
43. Hayden - yes
44. Connelly - ?


Yes
Hasleby
Solomon
Palmer
McPharlin
Tarrant
Pav
Bell
Hayden

Getting there
Crowley
Mayne
Sandi
Drum
Ibbotson

Jury out - (but probably getting there)
Foster
Brock
Warnock

Jury out cos they're too young yet
Hinkley
Pratt
Connelly
Mourish
Smith

Just
JCarr
Des
Grover
Mundy
Black
Dodd
Farmer
MiJ

Not anymore
MaJ

No
Webster
Schammer
Dunn
Peake
Kepler
Campbell
Gilmore
Murphy
Browne
Duffield
Head
McManus
MCarr
Thornton



8 AFL standard players is pretty poor. There are others who are "almost" or "getting there", but if we are brutally honest - there are 8 AFL standard players at our club. Some serious development is needed of the young players, some of the "Just" players need to step up and improve BIG TIME, and guys like Kep and Schammer could very well move up with the correct management and own personal efforts. IMO.

Brock Obrien is barely WAFL standard, ditto for Moursish.

Josh Head should be getting a game.

Mundy is an AFL player. A very good on at that.

I think you are underrating the best indigenous AFL foward of all time a touch too.

 

[dont bowl there]

I think Gilmore and Schammer have shown that they are "just" AFL standard. I still think Gilly would be a gun tall inside midfielder. Much like Lenny Hayes for St.Kilda, we have buggered Gilly around a fair bit this year.

 

[Bradesmaen]

I don't disagree that I probably wouldn't have posted this if we won, but it is something I have been thinking of over the past month or so.

Seriously, we don't have more than 8-10 players who are true AFL standard.

Now I know a lot of water has gone under the bridge since 2002, but i remember hearing CC speak not far into the 2002 seaosn, and at the time, his opinion was that we had 2 true AFL quality players on our list - Bell and Farmer.

He said then that there were others that were "getting there" or "close" (from memory he mentioned Pavlich and Hasleby, as well as JLo and Parker), but the harsh reality was that we had two AFL quality players playing at Freo.

So I got to thinking - who do we have now that is AFL quality; considering that we were looking better than 1-7 after 8 rounds back in 2002...

I reckon my list is pretty spot on if we are gpoing to be brutally honest. Harsh, yes, but fair also. IMO of course.

There is no way Murphy is anywhere close to AFL standard - otherwise he'd be playing FF for freo instead of Sth Freo; Mundy is close but needs to improve certain aspects of his game, ditto Dod;, and Schammer does too many things wrong - although you can not fault the guys endeavour.

And you can't tell me that Chopper Mayne hasn't worked his way into best 22 contention after only 3 AFL games. He's definitely "getting there" - and quickly too I might add. It's a rare player indeed who is AFL quality in their first season - palmer is just a gem. One out of the box.

I can tell you that. Quite easily. He doesnt have all this apparently "class" that everyone keeps saying he has. Class is Judd/Goodwin etc. Mayne does not ooze class. He oozes McManus.. who is apparently not wanted around here anymore.

Murphy is AFL standard. In a team that does not have a FF already (not Freo), he is quite clearly AFL standard and he proved that in 2006. He would work wonders are a team like the Western Bulldogs. A tall marking target. However his confidence is shattered by Freo's persistence to play him as the third marking tall who is rarely used.

Mundy needs improvement, the entire list needs improvement apart from one or two. However, he is definitely AFL standard. All you have to do is look for the threads from last week after his name was mentioned as a wantaway. Club fans were saying "what would we give for him" and almost all clubs (Geelong and Hawthorn the exceptions) wanted him badly. Yet over here at "Yoyo Supporter" HQ, the majority of people think he is not worthy of a WAFL spot let alone a spot in the Freo team, yet he is one of the more consistent players who rarely misses a target with his kick and despite the rumours, does actually go in hard for contests.

Schammer is still suffering from low confidence. Had he started in a team like Adelaide this year, I have no doubt that he would be one of their top palyers, simply because they are winning.

I honestly don't know why I bother coming back to this forum sometimes when I see threads like this, or the sack harvey thread, or any thread that constantly degrades the Fremantle Existance simply because supporters can't take it anymore. Its a sport, sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Take a leaf from Boston Red Sox fans and still support your team without mass Riots. 80 odd years of torment for them ended, it will end for us, without the constant torching of our own squad.

 

[ImperialPurple]

Brock Obrien is barely WAFL standard, ditto for Moursish.

Josh Head should be getting a game.

Mundy is an AFL player. A very good on at that.

I think you are underrating the best indigenous AFL foward of all time a touch too.

Head may be should be getitng a game, but is that because he is AFL standard or everyone else above him is shit?

O'Brien - how can you make that judgement when the guyb has played 2 AFL games and plays in a crap WAFL side that is consistently hammered? He may yet come good - he showed enough in his debut game to suggest he may one day make it.. hence "jury out".

I've made no judgement on Mourish - and I've said my bit about Mundy. He's "just" there - but he could be so much more - he has the skill and the ability.

And Jeffrey - I love him to bits, and I would love to think he still has "it", but sadly I think Father Time is catching up with him, as it does all players eventually, and his best is behind him. He's lost some of his spark, but he's hanging in there - that's why he's a "just".

 

[ImperialPurple]

I can tell you that. Quite easily. He doesnt have all this apparently "class" that everyone keeps saying he has. Class is Judd/Goodwin etc. Mayne does not ooze class. He oozes McManus.. who is apparently not wanted around here anymore.

Murphy is AFL standard. In a team that does not have a FF already (not Freo), he is quite clearly AFL standard and he proved that in 2006. He would work wonders are a team like the Western Bulldogs. A tall marking target. However his confidence is shattered by Freo's persistence to play him as the third marking tall who is rarely used.

Mundy needs improvement, the entire list needs improvement apart from one or two. However, he is definitely AFL standard. All you have to do is look for the threads from last week after his name was mentioned as a wantaway. Club fans were saying "what would we give for him" and almost all clubs (Geelong and Hawthorn the exceptions) wanted him badly. Yet over here at "Yoyo Supporter" HQ, the majority of people think he is not worthy of a WAFL spot let alone a spot in the Freo team, yet he is one of the more consistent players who rarely misses a target with his kick and despite the rumours, does actually go in hard for contests.

Schammer is still suffering from low confidence. Had he started in a team like Adelaide this year, I have no doubt that he would be one of their top palyers, simply because they are winning.

I honestly don't know why I bother coming back to this forum sometimes when I see threads like this, or the sack harvey thread, or any thread that constantly degrades the Fremantle Existance simply because supporters can't take it anymore. Its a sport, sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Take a leaf from Boston Red Sox fans and still support your team without mass Riots. 80 odd years of torment for them ended, it will end for us, without the constant torching of our own squad.

Yeah, yeah whatever... Look I'm not going to argue with you cos it will quickly turn into a merry-go-round...

But this is a discussion forum, and I'll be buggered if I'm going to stop "discussing" just cos you don't like it.

Simple.

 

[Chops_a_must]

I can tell you that. Quite easily. He doesnt have all this apparently "class" that everyone keeps saying he has. Class is Judd/Goodwin etc. Mayne does not ooze class. He oozes McManus.. who is apparently not wanted around here anymore.

I honestly don't know why I bother coming back to this forum sometimes when I see threads like this, or the sack harvey thread, or any thread that constantly degrades the Fremantle Existance simply because supporters can't take it anymore. Its a sport, sometimes you win, sometimes you lose. Take a leaf from Boston Red Sox fans and still support your team without mass Riots. 80 odd years of torment for them ended, it will end for us, without the constant torching of our own squad.

But you're prepared to torch a player half way into his first season?

For one, he shouldn't be compared to Judd and Goodwin. He is a forward! He is in the top couple in our squad, in terms of speed! He has a great pair of hands, and a good kick on goal.

The only similarity is the hair.

You are an absolute flog.

 

[Lach72]

I can tell you that. Quite easily. He doesnt have all this apparently "class" that everyone keeps saying he has. Class is Judd/Goodwin etc. Mayne does not ooze class. He oozes McManus.. who is apparently not wanted around here anymore.

Murphy is AFL standard. In a team that does not have a FF already (not Freo), he is quite clearly AFL standard and he proved that in 2006. He would work wonders are a team like the Western Bulldogs. A tall marking target. However his confidence is shattered by Freo's persistence to play him as the third marking tall who is rarely used.

Schammer is still suffering from low confidence. Had he started in a team like Adelaide this year, I have no doubt that he would be one of their top palyers, simply because they are winning.

See, this is why you can't play with the big kids.

 

[Bradesmaen]

But you're prepared to torch a player half way into his first season?

For one, he shouldn't be compared to Judd and Goodwin. He is a forward! He is in the top couple in our squad, in terms of speed! He has a great pair of hands, and a good kick on goal.

The only similarity is the hair.

You are an absolute flog.

Oh grow up you silly little man.

I never said he should be like Goodwin or Judd. I was simply stating the fact that that is what Class is. So grow up and stop stalking me through threads you weak excuse for a supporter.

 

[Chops_a_must]

Oh grow up you silly little man.

I never said he should be like Goodwin or Judd. I was simply stating the fact that that is what Class is. So grow up and stop stalking me through threads you weak excuse for a supporter.

So what are you basing your analysis on?

You live in Adelaide, have you even seen him play live? Seen him in the WAFL?

If a weak supporter stands up for two of our best recruits... then I guess I'm a weak supporter...

 

[Pav for AA]

Head may be should be getitng a game, but is that because he is AFL standard or everyone else above him is shit?

O'Brien - how can you make that judgement when the guyb has played 2 AFL games and plays in a crap WAFL side that is consistently hammered? He may yet come good - he showed enough in his debut game to suggest he may one day make it.. hence "jury out".

I've made no judgement on Mourish - and I've said my bit about Mundy. He's "just" there - but he could be so much more - he has the skill and the ability.

And Jeffrey - I love him to bits, and I would love to think he still has "it", but sadly I think Father Time is catching up with him, as it does all players eventually, and his best is behind him. He's lost some of his spark, but he's hanging in there - that's why he's a "just".

Peel have had their best start to the season. Brock has had nothing to do with it. He trains with an AFL squad and rarely stands out at WAFL level.

I honestly dont understand how Head cannot get a game. He is the best player in the WAFL atm.

 

[Bradesmaen]

Yeah, yeah whatever... Look I'm not going to argue with you cos it will quickly turn into a merry-go-round...

But this is a discussion forum, and I'll be buggered if I'm going to stop "discussing" just cos you don't like it.

Simple.

And when did I ever say you couldn't discuss it? When did I say I didn't like it? Quite simply put, I was arguing with your list and putting forth my opinion on it. If you want to back away with your tail between your legs, then fine, be my guest. Just typical of the culture of supporters really.

 

[ImperialPurple]

Peel have had their best start to the season. Brock has had nothing to do with it. He trains with an AFL squad and rarely stands out at WAFL level.

I honestly dont understand how Head cannot get a game. He is the best player in the WAFL atm.

Head is a shoe-in to win the "Best WAFL Player" Award later in the year...

He has had a couple of quiet weeks - should have got the call up the week that Thornton did. I was at that game - Head was BOG by a country mile, while Thornton just played well.

O'Brien - yeah well, I'm not prepared to write him off just yet.

 

[Pav for AA]

Head is a shoe-in to win the "Best WAFL Player" Award later in the year...

He has had a couple of quiet weeks - should have got the call up the week that Thornton did. I was at that game - Head was BOG by a country mile, while Thornton just played well.

O'Brien - yeah well, I'm not prepared to write him off just yet.

Yeah I dont understand how Thornton get so much love. Maybe they're just trying to get his vitamin D levels up.