Beyond the GF – Why the MCG Contract doesn’t pass the Stink Test

[greatwhiteshark]

There is no disadvantage at all on Grand Final day. The crowd is often 50-50, or close to it. The travelling team (if there is one) has arrived for a few days and has participated in the parade.

It's the biggest venue, that can accomodate the most people. It's clearly the most appropriate venue for the Grand Final.

Agree on it’s the right place for GF, it is never 50/50 crowd wise when a Vic side plays a non Vic side. 70/30 at very best.

 

[LoungeLizard]

Do you think it’s harder for. Vic side to win a flag or a non vic side? I am not talking making the GF I am talking winning the Flag. I think it’s very hard for all clubs but I honestly believe it’s a tad easier being a Victorian club than a non Vic club. The travel simply must take some toll?

I can only go on stats available to date and it seems to be 50/50, that may change over the years.

Talking of travel, WC supporters go to line was, "travel shortens careers, proof is we have no 300 gamers"

Don Pyke played for WC, he certainly would know about travel, yet he took Adelaide to Queensland for the weeks bye before finals.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

Such a terrible argument. Those decisions were made so long ago that close to half the people it affects wasn't even alive at the time.
We didn't choose to join anything.

What other traditions from the 80's should footy keep?

When the Eagles were formed in 1987 the oldest club in footy, the MFC had fielded a whole 4 indigenous players in their whole history and not a single indigenous player on its list in 1987.

Nah Eddie, it was like that in the 80's when your parents chose you to join the world. Keep banging your head!

A terrible argument is trying to equate the history and culture of a footy competition to systemic racism. Nice sook though.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

I can only go on stats available to date and it seems to be 50/50, that may change over the years.

Talking of travel, WC supporters go to line was, "travel shortens careers, proof is we have no 300 gamers"

Don Pyke played for WC, he certainly would know about travel, yet he took Adelaide to Queensland for the weeks bye before finals.

It’s not my line, I think 250 games which is 10-13 years is the magical figure and one to be extremely proud of. The very few that play 300 plus are freaks and have just got a bit lucky In my view.

 

[Demonic Ascent]

The first game of first-class cricket in Australia was played in Launceston, we don't see too many Test matches being played there. So I'm not sure that aspect of your argument holds much weight.

But, seeing as how Australian Football has been played in Tassie since the 1850s (according to Wiki at least) I'm happy to use your argument to put forward a case for the Grand Final being played there.

The point is, Australian Football has a rich history in all the states. This year saw the 140th anniversary of the first game being played on the SCG for instance - you know, in NSW, a state that isn't Victoria.

To put it bluntly, it's an Australian game, not a Victorian one. Self-entitled Victorians need to start accepting and/or realizing that.

It's an Australian game. That originated in Victoria. Not that hard to comprehend.

The competition has existed since 1897 and the Grand Final has been at the MCG for more than 100 of those 125 years. It will be there for at least another 38 years and probably long after that.

 

[Dan26]

Agree on it’s the right place for GF, it is never 50/50 crowd wise when a Vic side plays a non Vic side. 70/30 at very best.

30% is still not a disadvantage. No different to what the Victorian opponents of Collingwood and Essendon have when they play those two clubs in home and away games.

I've been to 29 Grand Finals, and I would argue the Crows has more supporters than the Kanagroos in 1998. Plenty of neutrals were supporting Brisbane in 2001-2-3.

Sydney had at least half the support, if not more people barracking for them in 2012 and 2014.

I would also argue Freo had more support in 2013 than Hawthorn. Certainly in the AFL members where I was sitting this was the case.

 

[Coolangatta]

Let's face it; it's going to be at the MCG from 2022-59 unless unforeseeable circumstances force more GFs to be moved from there. The focus needs to turn towards these corporate w***ers who the AFL let take away far too many seats from the fans of the teams who play in the GF.

 

[kaiserchief13]

There is no doubt the game is better when the grand final is moved across Australia,

every 10 years should be like this
MCG
Optus
MCG
Adelaide oval
MCG
Gabba
MCG
SCG
MCG
MCG

6 grand finals at the MCG, 4 others across other stadiums

I think this is spot on. The likes of the Superbowl is not played at the highest capacity stadium every year....to make up lost revenue from ticket sales also just increase ticket costs at smaller capacity stadiums

e.g. MCG avg ticket cost $500 x 100,000 capacity = $50,000,000,
Optus avg ticket cost $833.34 x 60,000 = $50,000,400,
SCG avg ticket cost $1,041.67 x 48,000 = $50,000,160

Same revenue, in fact AFL may make more profit as smaller stadiums have less food outlets, bars etc.

 

[Papa G]

There is no disadvantage at all on Grand Final day. The crowd is often 50-50, or close to it. The travelling team (if there is one) has arrived for a few days and has participated in the parade.

It's the biggest venue, that can accomodate the most people. It's clearly the most appropriate venue for the Grand Final.

Whilst this thread isn't about the actual Grand Final, more about the disgusting degraceful, corrupt MCG Contract, you are clearly off your nut if you think a grand final at the MCG between a Vic side and a non Vic side is anything close to 50/50.

How many "interstate" supporters are MCC members? How many "interstate" supporters are AFL Reserve members? Of the Corporates/Vic Govt tickets how many support a non Vic team? Do you know how corporates work? "Gary, the CFO of Key Account at Company X is a Richmond (2017/19 example) supporter isn't he? Let's invite him" Where do you reckon most of the "spare" or "I know where to get a ticket if your willing to pay a premium for it" are floating around?

Even the biggest non Vic sides like West Coast or Adelaide would be lucky to be 25% of the crowd at an MCG Grand Final against a Vic team.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

30% is still not a disadvantage. No different to what the Victorian opponents of Collingwood and Essendon have when they play those two clubs in home and away games.

I've been to 29 Grand Finals, and I would argue the Crows has more supporters than the Kanagroos in 1998. Plenty of neutrals were supporting Brisbane in 2001-2-3.

Sydney had at least half the support, if not more people barracking for them in 2012 and 2014.

I would also argue Freo had more support in 2013 than Hawthorn. Certainly in the AFL members where I was sitting this was the case.

I was not at those games you mentioned so I cannot comment. I have seen West Coast play Collingwood in 2018 and both clubs were given 16k tickets for their members. Neither club was really tipped to make GF so not many Woukd of purchased GF tickets months in advance Yet I was staggered just how many genuine Collingwood supporters were at the game, i actually asked myself how is this possible? Did 30-40k of them buy tickets off Richmond supporters 2 days before the game? Maybe they did? West Coast v Geelong early 90’s was no different.
It is what it is but I believe it’s an advantage, how much I don’t know. But it’s there.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Whilst this thread isn't about the actual Grand Final, more about the disgusting degraceful, corrupt MCG Contract, you are clearly off your nut if you think a grand final at the MCG between a Vic side and a non Vic side is anything close to 50/50.

How many "interstate" supporters are MCC members? How many "interstate" supporters are AFL Reserve members? Of the Corporates/Vic Govt tickets how many support a non Vic team? Do you know how corporates work? "Gary, the CFO of Key Account at Company X is a Richmond (2017/19 example) supporter isn't he? Let's invite him" Where do you reckon most of the "spare" or "I know where to get a ticket if your willing to pay a premium for it" are floating around?

Even the biggest non Vic sides like West Coast or Adelaide would be lucky to be 25% of the crowd at an MCG Grand Final against a Vic team.

The last two seasons will be the only seasons in the leagues history that the GF will be neutral.

 

[Coolangatta]

Playing it at the MCG every second year is a neat idea, but do you shift it if you get a derby GF at the SCG or a showdown at the Gabba or do you say, "**** it." and leave it where it is because you're willing to have a Carlton v Collingwood GF at Adelaide Oval?

 

[Linda Lovelace]

It is a shame that the blatant shadiness of a deal like this gets buried beneath a sh*tfight between a bunch of morons arguing about 'vicbias'.

The focus should be on the absurdity of the contract first, and the implications for the national competition second. Focus on the 'corrupt', not the 'unfair'.

 

[Dan26]

Whilst this thread isn't about the actual Grand Final, more about the disgusting degraceful, corrupt MCG Contract, you are clearly off your nut if you think a grand final at the MCG between a Vic side and a non Vic side is anything close to 50/50.

I don't think a H and A game is neutral. But a Grand Final is clearly neutral. We know this because the results show it. 8 out of 17 non-vic sides have won when playing a Viv opponent.

Travel isn't an issue, because the travelling team is here by the Thursday. How is that a disadvantage? Are they travel weary on the Saturday morning after their gruelling 1-3 hour flight on Thursday, 3 days earlier? lol

The crowd isn't an issue, because it is split close to 50-50. maybe not exactly 50-50, but close enough to not be an advantage for anyone.

How many "interstate" supporters are MCC members? How many "interstate" supporters are AFL Reserve members? Of the Corporates/Vic Govt tickets how many support a non Vic team?

Plenty of those people above support the non-Vic team on Grand Final day I'm one of them (usually barracking for the non-vic side), if you are implying those people will be supporting the Vic team giving that team an "unfair advantage."

Even the biggest non Vic sides like West Coast or Adelaide would be lucky to be 25% of the crowd at an MCG Grand Final against a Vic team.

Adelaide had a hell of a lot more than that in 1998.

Neutrals make up about half the crowd on grand Final day, and the non-Victorian side has very often been the sentimental favourite. I was amazed how many people were barracking for the Dockers in 2013.

 

[dean33]

Do you not think the Marquee Game status, the fact that it is promoted as the Dreamtime Game, brings in a bigger crowd than a say normal Essendon Richmond game later in the year when 1 or 2 of the teams are out of finals contention?

So the fact the 2 clubs put the idea to the league and the league promoted the game and turned it into a success is bad? You have showdown games and WA have derby’s. What other “marquee” games are interstate teams going to be a part of besides derbies? Should the afl get behind north v Port at marvel each year in the “who gives a **** cup?”

 

[pineapple dee]

The "You joined our League" is the argument you make when you don't have an argument.

Corruption is not the Australian way.

Corruption is absolutely the Australian way. Just look at almost any government in Australia( especially Victoria)

 

[Linda Lovelace]

Corruption is absolutely the Australian way. Just look at almost any government in Australia( especially Victoria)

Deep.

 

[Astro35]

Simply put - the AFL/MCG wouldn't pass any commercial governance. The procurement procedure was abandoned to quickly lock in the deal. It's a corrupt deal.

 

[Freomaniac]

tasmania needs to be in the discussion

And the NT....

And Canberra. I assure you Canberra Pear would love a grand final in the capital city

 

[Freomaniac]

The Grand Final should always be at the MCG. I'm sure it will be great in Perth, but i doubt "McClown" will appreciate it. it will be a great day when it returns to its proper home.

nah....

I want a grand final occasionally outside of Victoria.


Hell Back when Swans made grand finals in 2005-2006 and swans hosting the occasional game at homebush. I always wondered what a grand final was like in homebush which holds 80,000 seats.

Hell Andrew Demitriou actually wanted a one off grand final in Homebush as a curiousity factor.

You vics are stubborn. You had a grand final in Waverly in 1991 which got 75,000 people there. I blame the AFL for having Angry Anderson invade the grand final with that Abomination known as the batmobile lol

 

[masai]

Capacity and population interest in the league.

More than 1 in 10 Melbournians hold an AFL club membership. That’s without consideration for AFL members or the MCC. (About 12%)

For the record, Perth is about 7%.
Adelaide is about 8.5%.

The reality is that Melbourne isn’t just the ground with the biggest capacity, it’s also the place with the most supporters of the code. Both in physical numbers and as a proportion of the population.

That fact isn’t going to change anytime soon.

There are 16 teams, 10 in Victoria.

Therefore by ratio’s, 5 out of 8 grand finals should be in Victoria. With rotation, you could play 2 in a row at the MCG, then the next one is “non Victorian”, then next 2 at MCG etc.

I accept that the MCG deal is set in concrete, but geez it could have been tendered / negotiated far better for the benefit of the AFL.

 

[Coolangatta]

There are 16 teams, 10 in Victoria.

Therefore by ratio’s, 5 out of 8 grand finals should be in Victoria. With rotation, you could play 2 in a row at the MCG, then the next one is “non Victorian”, then next 2 at MCG etc.

I accept that the MCG deal is set in concrete, but geez it could have been tendered / negotiated far better for the benefit of the AFL.

18 mate. Could have an 18-year contract:

Could go MCG-AO-MCG-SCG-MCG-GABBA-MCG-OPTUS-MCG-MCG-AO-MCG-SCG-MCG-GABBA-MCG-OPTUS-MCG

Then a new contract based on what teams are in the AFL.

Have 20 teams by then? 10 at the G, 10 interstate. 22? 23? Same principle.

With QLD, you could eventually have the Gold Coast and Brisbane share GFs every 8-10 years, but for 2036 you'd be using the Gabba since it'll be the christening of the post-Olympics rebuilt version, plus it gives GC time to grow and to re-develop their stadium.

 

[masai]

18 mate. Could have an 18-year contract:

Could go MCG-AO-MCG-SCG-MCG-GABBA-MCG-OPTUS-MCG-MCG-AO-MCG-SCG-MCG-GABBA-MCG-OPTUS-MCG

Then a new contract based on what teams are in the AFL.

Have 20 teams by then? 10 at the G, 10 interstate. 22? 23? Same principle.

With QLD, you could eventually have the Gold Coast and Brisbane share GFs every 8-10 years, but for 2036 you'd be using the Gabba since it'll be the christening of the post-Olympics rebuilt version, plus it gives GC time to grow and to re-develop their stadium.

Derr, 18 teams !!!.

Ok, 5 in 9 finals should be at MCG.

 

[PrisonBars4life]

It's such an unfair advantage to the Victorian clubs to have the grand final at the MCG

How did the inter state clubs fair last year when they had home ground advantages across the whole year?

Which clubs were they? Even Brisbane was forced to play half its games on the GC. I assume you will be happy to play home games in Geelong? Poor old Melbourne clubs staying in 5 star resorts after thinking they were going to be the ones advantaged with all the non-vics hubbing at the start of the season.

 

[Purple Suit]

There are 16 teams, 10 in Victoria.

Therefore by ratio’s, 5 out of 8 grand finals should be in Victoria. With rotation, you could play 2 in a row at the MCG, then the next one is “non Victorian”, then next 2 at MCG etc.

I accept that the MCG deal is set in concrete, but geez it could have been tendered / negotiated far better for the benefit of the AFL.

This can be done like it is now, just push the MCG contract out each year it is not there. In 100 years they can tender it properly.